Goljan rapid review pathology: level of knowledge

[tony montana]

Hey everyone

I think Goljan RR pathology is really great for pathology.

FOr those that have taken the exam though, how much of this dense book is "must know" for step I?

Is this one of those you must know it ALL, down to every single detail in it, or will a lesser level of knowledge help you get an SDN type score 😉

Thanks

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[tony montana]

 

[UCLAstudent]

It's a lot more dense than what you need to know. BRS Pathology suited me just fine.

 

[tony montana]

It's a lot more dense than what you need to know. BRS Pathology suited me just fine.

UCLAstudent thanks,

Now UCLA, you were a stellar student during preclinical years. I have been more of an average one. Do you think things can get confounded and perhaps your performance in USMLE path was more due to your preclinical work and not so much due to BRS path? you get what I am trying to say?

So that if you are more of an average [below average] student perhaps you do need "ALL" the density of goljan RR? or despite that you think the density of Goljan RR is too much for most students and BRS path will be enough?

I know all those questions can sound confusing, but I think you can get my drift. Thanks.

 

[blz]

Try to learn as much of it as possible. I only read through it once fully and then I skimmed it one last time before I took the exam. Obviously, there was no way I knew every little detail in it (and I thought the path on the boards was a joke). Just remember though, if you want an "sdn type score", you gotta put in that much effort to know it better than everyone else, since you are scored relative to other students.

 

[RunwayModel]

Try to learn as much of it as possible. I only read through it once fully and then I skimmed it one last time before I took the exam. Obviously, there was no way I knew every little detail in it (and I thought the path on the boards was a joke). Just remember though, if you want an "sdn type score", you gotta put in that much effort to know it better than everyone else, since you are scored relative to other students.

I couldn't agree more with blz. What's great about RR Pathology is that when you're done, you understand things more from a pathophysiologic/mechanistic standpoint than with BRS Pathology, which tends to be structured as an outline of disease and then blurb of facts.

If your Pathology/Pathophysiology is very strong, BRS should be fine. However, if you are average or lower and want to get an "SDN type score", then you probably need to build a good foundation with RR Pathology.

 

[Terpskins99]

Hey everyone

I think Goljan RR pathology is really great for pathology.

FOr those that have taken the exam though, how much of this dense book is "must know" for step I?

Is this one of those you must know it ALL, down to every single detail in it, or will a lesser level of knowledge help you get an SDN type score 😉

Thanks

Sigh, there is no secret or shortcut to getting a good score on boards.

1. Study your butt off
2. Do as many questions as you can
3. Study your butt off

What is "must know"? Well, what is your "must score"? I know several people that read through all of Robbins, all of Lippincott pharm and biochem. They did well. Do I think its necessary... well, they too were aiming for an SDN score. And they got it. If you want an SDN type of score, you're going to have to put in a ton of work... not to mention a little lucky.

If you're already a superior student, then you won't need to put in as much effort into preparation. If you're more of an average to below average student... you better buckle down for a long couple of months.

 

[SeventhSon]

i don't know about the boards, but i cream myself whenever I read some of the mechanisms it explains that everyone else just asks you to memorize

 

[tony montana]

Cool,

I'll go hit it like an atomic bomb

 

[tony montana]

I remembered this post I made a while back and while I got some good replies, I guess today I just wanted some reassurance

Look at this table:'

For those who replied before, or anyone who has taken the beast, you mean to say we have to learn like every little detail from that classification?

 

[UCLAstudent]

I remembered this post I made a while back and while I got some good replies, I guess today I just wanted some reassurance

Look at this table:'

For those who replied before, or anyone who has taken the beast, you mean to say we have to learn like every little detail from that classification?

Maybe not everything, but it's really not that much to memorize. It just looks like a lot because they mention the presence/absence of Auer rods under most of the categories. Know everything about M3. Know that AML subtypes other than M3 can have Auer rods. Know about M7 and Down syndrome.

 

[HIJay]

also seen a q on m5 on the gum infiltration

 

[oreosandsake]

also seen a q on m5 on the gum infiltration

picture attached.

I've never seen this on a test q, so I googled it. FYI

 

[dutchcarter]

i understand that people are talking about glojan and the brs... but i was thinkin about either usign the mini pocket sized robbins or path made ridic simple.....know one uses these guys?

 

[zedx]

I remembered this post I made a while back and while I got some good replies, I guess today I just wanted some reassurance

Look at this table:'

For those who replied before, or anyone who has taken the beast, you mean to say we have to learn like every little detail from that classification?

For what its worth, when I took my exam they had something similar, but on the staging system for Hodgkin's Lymphoma.

 

[Terpskins99]

i understand that people are talking about glojan and the brs... but i was thinkin about either usign the mini pocket sized robbins or path made ridic simple.....know one uses these guys?

I think little robbins is ok (its pretty dense, as I recall). I wouldn't trust Path made ridiculously simple. Somehow, that book is over 150 pages shorter than MMRS. How does that make any sense?

Stick with the proven formula: Goljan or BRS.

 

[ertugrul]

Rapid review 2 (I don't have first edition) is really a good book, but it's exactly not a pathology book; it's more likely a pathology book plus this and plus that which makes it dense.

 

[riverie]

love your smiley. it's adorable.

i thought RR path was great for understanding pathophys and tying multiple subjects together. however as far as 'need-to-know' details, i don't think everything in there needs to be memorized. there's just too much. use it as a overview in the beginning of your review and then you can always pick up more high-yield factoids to memorize from FA. on the other hand, i guess you could focus on his margin notes as high yield factoids.

 

[dutchcarter]

I think little robbins is ok (its pretty dense, as I recall). I wouldn't trust Path made ridiculously simple. Somehow, that book is over 150 pages shorter than MMRS. How does that make any sense?

Stick with the proven formula: Goljan or BRS.

i agree. thanc for the advice. its no point in re inventing the wheel.

 

[Blesbok]

I remembered this post I made a while back and while I got some good replies, I guess today I just wanted some reassurance

Look at this table:'

For those who replied before, or anyone who has taken the beast, you mean to say we have to learn like every little detail from that classification?

Auer rod = AML
Auer rod = myeloperoxidase

AML M3 = PML = t(15;17) = treated with retinoic acid
AML M3 = DIC

AML M7 and ALL = increased risk in down's syndrome

That is probably all you really need to know about that.

 

[Blesbok]

I think little robbins is ok (its pretty dense, as I recall). I wouldn't trust Path made ridiculously simple. Somehow, that book is over 150 pages shorter than MMRS. How does that make any sense?

Stick with the proven formula: Goljan or BRS.

Little robbins is a decent book for less important areas that aren't worth reading anything but the blue boxes in big robbins during the class year, but IMO it isn't a very good book for review study. Goljan and BRS are much better for recovering things.

 

[eulbedoc]

In searching for Rapid Review Pathology by Goljan, I notice there is one that is 768 pgs (with student consult online access) and another that is 384. Besides this online access, what's the difference between the two books and which one is the version people refer to when mentioning RR Pathology by Goljan?

 

[pseudoknot]

In searching for Rapid Review Pathology by Goljan, I notice there is one that is 768 pgs (with student consult online access) and another that is 384. Besides this online access, what's the difference between the two books and which one is the version people refer to when mentioning RR Pathology by Goljan?

1st vs 2nd eds., both

 

[ASUAZCOM]

I just had a Kaplan Qbank question on this table.

I remembered this post I made a while back and while I got some good replies, I guess today I just wanted some reassurance

Look at this table:'

For those who replied before, or anyone who has taken the beast, you mean to say we have to learn like every little detail from that classification?

 

[Powel6016]

I just looked at first aid 2007 under the Pathology review books, and RR Pathology is rated "B", what?!?! Everyone on the forum worships this book, and its rated just a "B".....

 

[Mediculous]

I noticed that, too. FA does say there has been limited student feedback, nevertheless, I still think they're on the smack.

 

[BobBarker]

Dr. Goljan said the other day in class that RR Path 2 has sold over 20K copies. Faster than any other book Elsevier has ever published. That just goes to show that the book is popular because it works!

 

[ASUAZCOM]

In the 2008 First Aid, RR Pathology is given an "A". I guess they received more student feedback.

I just looked at first aid 2007 under the Pathology review books, and RR Pathology is rated "B", what?!?! Everyone on the forum worships this book, and its rated just a "B".....

 

[polyposis]

Using it right now while listening to his audio lectures--every now and then he'll say "and a student of mine got this question on the exam" and I'll see that point addressed specifically in his outline--that's the added benefit, to me, knowing that his book was written with actual questions in mind.

 

[Powel6016]

Dr. Goljan said the other day in class that RR Path 2 has sold over 20K copies. Faster than any other book Elsevier has ever published. That just goes to show that the book is popular because it works!

Wow, u have him as a teacher and he's making loads of money on that book, Mad props!!

How about u record his lectures and post them on the internet?

 

[BobBarker]

He would string me up by the balls if I did that. Nothing pisses him off more than his stuff getting out. He hates, no HATES, the bootleg audios and material that is going around. We aren't allowed to record his lectures, in fact he doesn't allow us to have our laptop's open during lecture. All of the material that he allows us to print is copyright protected to only allow printing for a small amount of time, after that amount of time is up the files will automatically shred themselves. He's hardcore about not letting his stuff get out for free ever again.

Some fun Goljan stuff: He refers to himself as "Poppie" and prefers if students call him that. He is also a competitive arm wrestler. Someone in another post mentioned wanting a Goljan qbank. He provides one for us. It is paper only, but is very thorough. When we had Cardio path, the cardio qbank (which he calls quizzes) was over 160Q's. He also provides an image bank over each section and our tests are 25% content from the images. He'll show, a picture of CREST syndrome lady, and then ask what antibody will be associated with it. If you go to Oklahoma State College of Osteopathic Medicine, you will have Goljan for your instructor more often than any other instructor.

 

[medhacker]

He would string me up by the balls if I did that. Nothing pisses him off more than his stuff getting out. He hates, no HATES, the bootleg audios and material that is going around. We aren't allowed to record his lectures, in fact he doesn't allow us to have our laptop's open during lecture. All of the material that he allows us to print is copyright protected to only allow printing for a small amount of time, after that amount of time is up the files will automatically shred themselves. He's hardcore about not letting his stuff get out for free ever again.

You would think he would have grasped by now that what actually made his Path RR book a bestseller were the bootleg audios... 🙄


Oh well, some people just never learn! 🙂

 

[Powel6016]

So print that stuff out, scan it and post it 🙂🙂

 

[Blesbok]

He would string me up by the balls if I did that. Nothing pisses him off more than his stuff getting out. He hates, no HATES, the bootleg audios and material that is going around. We aren't allowed to record his lectures, in fact he doesn't allow us to have our laptop's open during lecture. All of the material that he allows us to print is copyright protected to only allow printing for a small amount of time, after that amount of time is up the files will automatically shred themselves. He's hardcore about not letting his stuff get out for free ever again.

Some fun Goljan stuff: He refers to himself as "Poppie" and prefers if students call him that. He is also a competitive arm wrestler. Someone in another post mentioned wanting a Goljan qbank. He provides one for us. It is paper only, but is very thorough. When we had Cardio path, the cardio qbank (which he calls quizzes) was over 160Q's. He also provides an image bank over each section and our tests are 25% content from the images. He'll show, a picture of CREST syndrome lady, and then ask what antibody will be associated with it. If you go to Oklahoma State College of Osteopathic Medicine, you will have Goljan for your instructor more often than any other instructor.

I don't want to offend you or anyone else here, but have you ever asked him why he chooses to stay there as opposed to going to one of the big name allopathic schools? I am sure he has offers from all over the country.

P.S. I am jealous of you and your goljan. His sayings are hilarious, I am pretty sure most of my class knows more of his sayings than famous movie quotes.

 

[BobBarker]

So print that stuff out, scan it and post it 🙂🙂

Not gonna happen...

 

[BobBarker]

I don't want to offend you or anyone else here, but have you ever asked him why he chooses to stay there as opposed to going to one of the big name allopathic schools? I am sure he has offers from all over the country.

P.S. I am jealous of you and your goljan. His sayings are hilarious, I am pretty sure most of my class knows more of his sayings than famous movie quotes.

He's a very religious person and he came to Tulsa to teach at ORU's med school in the early 80's. Part of it is that he just plain likes Tulsa. Also, I think the school pretty much lets him do what he wants with his time. I know what his salary is, and it is much less than what a practicing pathologist would make. He also has 3 grandsons that he is very close to that live in Tulsa. He takes pride in the schools great rep for producing good "clinicians" as he should because he is responsible for most of our coursework during 2nd year. And yes, he is hilarious. The things he can say with a small class size (we only have 80) probably wouldn't fly at a place where the students are a little more full of themselves..

 

[indo]

Big name allopathic schools don't want teachers...they want researchers.

 

[Blesbok]

He's a very religious person and he came to Tulsa to teach at ORU's med school in the early 80's. Part of it is that he just plain likes Tulsa. Also, I think the school pretty much lets him do what he wants with his time. I know what his salary is, and it is much less than what a practicing pathologist would make. He also has 3 grandsons that he is very close to that live in Tulsa. He takes pride in the schools great rep for producing good "clinicians" as he should because he is responsible for most of our coursework during 2nd year. And yes, he is hilarious. The things he can say with a small class size (we only have 80) probably wouldn't fly at a place where the students are a little more full of themselves..

👍 I knew there had to be a reason. And I am sure after his recent success, he isn't hurting for money even with a low salary. 😉

 

[Blesbok]

Big name allopathic schools don't want teachers...they want researchers.

Yes, but if you get someone like him you get better board scores which equals better rankings.

 

[indo]

Yes, but if you get someone like him you get better board scores which equals better rankings.

...and a more pleasant med school experience.

 

[underthebridge]

I actually was never a fan of Goljan, his book is filled with UNNECESSARY tables and BUSY pages. I tried to read it but ended up wasting my time because I could not retain a thing (I'm the kind of person that studies short material really well). And did I mention that his book is very unreadable? You're basically paying for an outline and tables....
And the integrations! Ugh - just get the point, please stop trying to be the be all end all board review book! There's a time and place for biochem...

BRS ALL the way!! seriously. It's so much clearer, easier to understand, high yields are bolded, retainable, the list goes on...

(this is just my opinion, i know there's goljan fanboys out there who will beg to differ)

 

[pseudoknot]

Yes, but if you get someone like him you get better board scores which equals better rankings.

I'm not aware of any rankings which take board scores into account, which is consistent with the fact that those results aren't generally available for many schools. US News rankings are primarily based on research funding and subjective prestige (and have nothing to do with quality of education, but I digress).

 

[hj0517]

About the BRS / Goljan thing - I doubt that there are 'fanboys' on this forum,

If you are unsure about which book just go to a book store and have a quick flick through both!. Surely it doesn't matter how either text is arranged - if it works for you it works for you!

 

[lankysudanese]

Yes, but if you get someone like him you get better board scores which equals better rankings.

not necessarily, the average board scores at the top allopathic schools are already sky high. i don't think that recruiting goljan would improve upon the 235+ averages that we hear about.

 

[mtDNA]

Big name allopathic schools don't want teachers...they want researchers.

Unfortunately for students, this is true. It is also true at the not big name allopathic schools, including the one that I go to. The teachers are horrible and most of the curriculum is just aweful as far as boards prep is concerned. I mean AWFUL.

 

[Blesbok]

In the 2008 First Aid, RR Pathology is given an "A". I guess they received more student feedback.

When the 2007 edition came out, the goljan version of the book wasn't out yet. It only came out last january.

 

[Powel6016]

Unfortunately for students, this is true. It is also true at the not big name allopathic schools, including the one that I go to. The teachers are horrible and most of the curriculum is just aweful as far as boards prep is concerned. I mean AWFUL.

Glad I'm not alone..... I feel ya