Graduating Undergrad- NEEDS ADVICE!

[DolceVitaa]

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Hello, I'm graduating from UC Irvine in Dec 2010, and would like to know how I can improve my chances of getting into a DO school?

Overall GPA = 2.65
Lower-Division GPA = 2.0
Upper-Division GPA = 3.22-3.66 (upward trend in last 84 units)


Chem A w/ Lab = 1) D/D, 2) B-/B+ (repeated)
Chem B w/ Lab = 1) C/B
Chem C w/ Lab = 1) F/ C, 2) C (repeated)
Calc A = 1) C+
Calc B = 1) D-, 2) B- (repeated)
Stat = 1) F, 2) B (repeated)
Bio A = 1) F
OChem A = 1) F, 2) F (repeated)

*I have not taken the rest of the pre-med requirements


Although personal issues are not excuse for low grades, these following life experiences have given me the drive to pursue a DO in Psychiatry.

During my fourth year at UC Irvine I experienced significant personal issues:

-3 close deaths -> two were due to suicide & one to ovarian cancer
-I had a live-in boyfriend who was an abusive-drug addict
- I spent a year in Rehab & have been sober since ( 3 years 🙂 )
- first generation / first in my family to graduate college
- educationally advantaged

*I have 400+ hours voluteering for an in-hospital internship.
*I have a public health internship

WHAT ARE MY OPTIONS?

??? HOW DO I RAISE MY cGPA, sGPA, overall GPA IF I ATTEND DIFFERENT UNIVERSITIES ???

1. Should I stay at UC Irvine and pursue a second-bach through UC Extension in order to increase my cGPA?

2. Should I go for a post-bac program like SF State?

3. Should I pursue Nursing to gain more in-hospital experience then apply to a SMP later?

I am 25 years old. I do not mind spending the time to pursue a second-4 year-bach through UC Extension, but the money required is the issue. I would like to min. the amount of student loans. 😀

 

[mspeedwagon]

You probably don't need me to tell you this, but your outlook is pretty poor and you can write-off US MD programs (and you are a pretty poor candidate for US DO programs).

Let me address, the different university question first. Taking university classes at different colleges doesn't really matter. Med schools look at all college classes ever taken to calculate your overall GPA (and science GPA). DO schools practice grade replacement and MD schoo do not.

Since you have a few re-takes, your GPA will be higher going the DO route. Even with that, your overall GPA is likely too low to apply (it needs to be at least 3.0 in my opinion).

So, what is your plan of action? I would consider either a) continuing to take/re-take classes to bring the overall GPA to above 3.0, at which point you can consider an SMP or apply to DO schools (along with an MCAT in the 30s) OR consider the Caribbean (if you complete the pre-reqs, and have an MCAT in the mid-20s, Ross is likely to take you).

I see a HUGE problem below though. You re-took o-chem I and received an F on the re-take. This obviously looks really bad. Make sure you address why you did poorly before you re-take. You need to understand o-chem (for the MCAT). I've addressed the questions specifically below. Another huge problem is that it has only been 3 years since rehab, and while I applaud you for being sober, this could be another red flag.

I almost NEVER recommend the Caribbean, but I think it's an apporpriate route for you. Just realize it's a last chance and the schools are known for their high attrition. You still need to complete the pre-reqs before embarking on this route.

*I have not taken the rest of the pre-med requirements

WHAT ARE MY OPTIONS?

??? HOW DO I RAISE MY cGPA, sGPA, overall GPA IF I ATTEND DIFFERENT UNIVERSITIES ???
- Attending different unversities does not matter. US med schools calculate GPA based on all universities ever attended. You will have to provide all transcripts when you apply.

1. Should I stay at UC Irvine and pursue a second-bach through UC Extension in order to increase my cGPA?
- You need to take the remaining pre-reqs. Honestly, I'd start from scratch and make sure to get as many As as possible in the pre-reqs.

2. Should I go for a post-bac program like SF State?
- If you can get in, go for it. You are unlikely to get into the post-bac program at SF State (they have a GPA cut-off if I remember correctly).

3. Should I pursue Nursing to gain more in-hospital experience then apply to a SMP later?
- If medicine is your goal, don't pursue nursing unless this is a career you want to have in order to make money. Nurses are actually less likely to get into medical school, so definitely do not do it for the in-hospital experience. You are better off volunteering/shadowing. That said, I wouldn't worry about either until you are getting As in the pre-reqs.

- Finally, if you are worried about loans, the best route to go is to get a part-time job and take one or two courses at a time. This will give you an income flow and also allow you to really focus on doing well in one or two classes at a time.

 

[Druggernaut]

It doesn't really matter where you decide to go to school to boost your GPA, just make sure you do very well. You do need to assess why your grades are not better, and be sure that you can and will make the changes necessary to turn them around. If not, you may end up digging a deeper hole for yourself. If you aren't ready to make the changes needed, consider taking some time off.

I wouldn't go to nursing school, as clinicals are time consuming, and you're taking a spot away from someone who will actually work as a nurse (I assume that this isn't your backup plan. If you'd be happy doing that work if medical school doesn't work out, it might not be a bad way to go).

 

[TriagePreMed]

Honestly, if I were you with the pre-reqs done, I'd focus on a high MCAT and then apply to the Caribbean. Getting into Psychiatry is really easy with a Caribbean degree. I've seen St. George graduates at Harvard, USC, UMiami, and UCLA. People from Ross at Duke, and even someone from SABA at Yale.

You'll be spending about 3 years trying to recover that GPA to maybe have a DO shot, but you could spend that time in the Caribbean doing good and end up still being a psychiatrist.

I want to be a psychiatrist too (or Neurologist). Hooray for us 🙂

1. Should I stay at UC Irvine and pursue a second-bach through UC Extension in order to increase my cGPA?

2. Should I go for a post-bac program like SF State?

3. Should I pursue Nursing to gain more in-hospital experience then apply to a SMP later?

I am 25 years old. I do not mind spending the time to pursue a second-4 year-bach through UC Extension, but the money required is the issue. I would like to min. the amount of student loans. 😀

Don't apply to SF State. I applied and they messed up my GPA completely and didn't read my application (e.g. told me I should try finding a job in a clinical setting, but I do have one and made that the main point of one of the seven essays).

Don't do nursing. Nursing will hurt your chances to get into Med School.

If you want a post-bacc with that GPA, try Notre Dame De Namur University. They accept 2.5+, but again, I'd go Caribbean if I were you.

 

[DolceVitaa]

Thank you to everyone for your advice.

My plan is to go abroad for two-three years & do ALOT of summer school to raise my cGPA to 3.3/3.4

Then re-take/finish the medical pre-reqs at UC Berkeley with hopes of applying to a SMP program. I would like to do an SMP program so that I gain admission to a DO School in California.

If I follow through with this plan, it will take me about five years to apply to a SMP program ( 2 years abroad & 3 years premedical post-bac work & $100K ).

Does anyone have a shorter & cheaper alternative?

Do you think it's more realistic to try to go the Caribbean instead of pursuing an SMP then a DO school in CA?

So, if I want to go to the Caribbean for Medical School are the requirements the same?

 

[DolceVitaa]

Thank you to everyone for your advice.

My plan is to go abroad for two-three years & do ALOT of summer school to raise my cGPA to 3.3/3.4

Then re-take/finish the medical pre-reqs at UC Berkeley with hopes of applying to a SMP program. I would like to do an SMP program so that I gain admission to a DO School in California.

If I follow through with this plan, it will take me about five years to apply to a SMP program ( 2 years abroad & 3 years premedical post-bac work & $100K ).

Does anyone have a shorter & cheaper alternative?

Do you think it's more realistic to try to go the Caribbean instead of pursuing an SMP & then a DO school in CA?

So, if I want to go to the Caribbean for Medical School what are the requirements?

 

[mspeedwagon]

If you look through my post history you'll notice that I almost never recommend the Caribbean. However, in your case, you should focus on the MCAT and the Caribbean. It is going to cost you a fortune to do a DO or SMP. It's much more realistic for you to go to Saba/AUC/Ross (and I'd recommend this route strongly).

T
Do you think it's more realistic to try to go the Caribbean instead of pursuing an SMP & then a DO school in CA?

So, if I want to go to the Caribbean for Medical School what are the requirements?

 

[n3xa]

Don't apply to SF State. I applied and they messed up my GPA completely...

How did SF State mess up your GPA? I'm confused.

 

[TriagePreMed]

How did SF State mess up your GPA? I'm confused.

I have the GPA from 1 community college and from the UC I transfered to. They only looked at the GPA of 1 transcript and e-mailed me saying the rejection from the program was because of my overall GPA (they cited it precisely but it was the GPA of just one transcript). When I told them to account for both GPA like they were supposed to, they admitted the error but said they wouldn't reconsider the application even though we're talking about a big change.

 

[TriagePreMed]

If I follow through with this plan, it will take me about five years to apply to a SMP program ( 2 years abroad & 3 years premedical post-bac work & $100K ).

Does anyone have a shorter & cheaper alternative?

Do you think it's more realistic to try to go the Caribbean instead of pursuing an SMP & then a DO school in CA?

So, if I want to go to the Caribbean for Medical School what are the requirements?

YES, focus on the Caribbean. I'm sorry to say it this way, but your other plan is absolutely reckless. You would be spending (according to your numbers) $100,000 on pre-med work and then another $50,000 on an SMP (living costs included), while the most expensive Caribbean education is $200,000 for all 4 years. You would also be losing 6 years of your life. You could easily be in residency in 4 years if you start med school soon. Psychiatry is one of the least competitive fields, and like I said, you'll find Caribbean graduates in residencies at Harvard, Yale, Duke, and UCLA.

Take your pre-req courses at a community college. The Caribbean doesn't care.

Go here: http://www.valuemd.com/ this website contains all the requirements. Usually it is 1 year of OChem, 1 year of general Chem, 1 year of bio, 1 year of physics, and 1 semester of math. In your case, I'd advice against applying to St. George's University because your GPA and repeats are poor. Even AUC and Ross may be out of your league but you should apply. Your best bet would be to make it into Saba University.

Oh, and even thought it is a wonderful accomplishment to be drug/alcohol-free for 3 years, you should avoid mentioning rehab to schools.

 

[MexicanDr]

Don't do nursing. Nursing will hurt your chances to get into Med School.

This is not true at all. 4 of my friends, who decided to pursue nursing as their undergrad degree are in med school, 3 of them at UCs and 1 at UofMichigan.

When they were asked why nursing? Nursing is an undergrad major just like Bio, chem, English. They were interested in it and that's why they chose it.

3 of them had no work experience, 1 did work for a year while applying.

On a side note, I have read of several people getting into med school who are RN's, so really I don't know where that statement is coming from.

 

[mspeedwagon]

This depends... a first degree in nursing (BSN as an undergrad) will likely NOT hurt your chances. A second degree in nursing probably will (it shows that after considering your options after graduating you decided to pursue nursing and not medicine).

Although I too know a few nurses that got into med school, they have among the lowest acceptance percentages to med school (you can speculate what the reasons are, I'm not sure... just going with what's published).

This is not true at all. 4 of my friends, who decided to pursue nursing as their undergrad degree are in med school, 3 of them at UCs and 1 at UofMichigan.

When they were asked why nursing? Nursing is an undergrad major just like Bio, chem, English. They were interested in it and that's why they chose it.

3 of them had no work experience, 1 did work for a year while applying.

On a side note, I have read of several people getting into med school who are RN's, so really I don't know where that statement is coming from.

 

[DolceVitaa]

Thank you so much your advice & I am researching Caribbean Schools.

I am hestitant to go to a foreign medical school BC I'm concerned about the quality of training/residency.

I understand I need to raise my overall GPA, rock the MCAT, and increase my science GPA.....

But would a DO school in CA be unobtainable even IF I re-took most the pre-req at UC Berkeley and got a 4.0 GPA in all post-bac work?

I thouht DO schools did grade replacement?

At this point, I know that beggers cannot be choosers, but I would prefer to stay in CA. I do appreciate all your advice and will pursue foreign medical schools as well.

THANKS AGAIN!!!


Are there any foriegn medical schools in France?

 

[MiniMoo]

To mspeedwagon -- I'm not 100% clear on why you're pushing so hard for Caribbean rather than DO in the OP's case? You mention more than once that you almost never recommend the Caribbean, but never explain exactly why you're making an exception here. Is it because you doubt whether the OP really has the academic chops to repeat classes and do well (in which case, it's probably better for the OP to consider another career rather than try to squeak into an off-shore school and fail out, IMO)? Or due to the OP's past with substance abuse (which he/she has no obligation to disclose)?

To answer the OP's questions -- if you can actually repeat classes and DO WELL, then you could raise your GPA relatively quickly. DO schools do utilize grade replacement, meaning that they use the most recent grade in their GPA calculations (regardless of whether it is the 'higher' grade or not).

 

[TriagePreMed]

This is not true at all. 4 of my friends, who decided to pursue nursing as their undergrad degree are in med school, 3 of them at UCs and 1 at UofMichigan.

When they were asked why nursing? Nursing is an undergrad major just like Bio, chem, English. They were interested in it and that's why they chose it.

3 of them had no work experience, 1 did work for a year while applying.

On a side note, I have read of several people getting into med school who are RN's, so really I don't know where that statement is coming from.

It is fantastic that your friends got into medical school with a nursing degree, but the truth is that some exceptions don't make the rule. Would you recommend someone to get a 3.0 instead a 3.5 because some people went to medical school with a 3.0?

Anyway, the issue with the nursing degree is that it is seen as a "backup" degree for medical school, and since there is currently a shortage of nurses, it is somewhat seen negatively to take the spot of someone that would have liked to be a nurse to use it as a stepping stone to medicine.

 

[mspeedwagon]

In short, you're right MiniMoo. It concerns me greatly that I see repeated grades of B, B-, C, F. Even more concerning is that there are virtually no As, even in repeated classes. D.O. school replace grades (but when it's the third or fourth time you are repeating most of your classes, that looks really bad). This tells me that the OP is not likely to all of a sudden get As in every class taken from now on without drastic changes (read: "time and money").

Next, let's consider cost. The OP is going to easily need to spend tens of thousands of dollars re-taking courses. From a cost persepctive the D.O. approach is really expensive. And this is before the OP even begins medical school. It's going to take at least two years to bring the GPA up to a 3.0 (at which point it is still not that competitive for DO schools).

Finally, and most importantly, even with high grades (a huge assumption), the OP is fighting an uphill battle given his/her background, which includes the OPs past with substance abuse. While it's commendable, the OP would need to do everything perfectly for two years to have an ok shot at a DO program.

While, I agree that considering another career in health care maybe the way to go, I do believe that the Caribbean is a great LAST chance to become a doctor (if it's one's dream). There is a chance that the OP will fail out and end up in some debt (the risk is similar to SMP programs), but there is hope for the OP to become a doctor. I think the OP would be great for the MERP program at Ross (to adjust to the transition to medical school). If the OP were to fail out, it would likely be by the first year (and then the debt is equal to the amount of money that would have been spent re-taking classes).

Is it because you doubt whether the OP really has the academic chops to repeat classes and do well (in which case, it's probably better for the OP to consider another career rather than try to squeak into an off-shore school and fail out, IMO)? Or due to the OP's past with substance abuse (which he/she has no obligation to disclose)?

 

[TriagePreMed]

mspeedwagon -

You'd be surprised that it's not really that easy to get into MERP at Ross. GPA for that ranges at 2.8-3.2. It's mostly for those that did really poorly on the MCAT. The true best bet for the OP is to land the pre-med program at St. George's University (even if it takes them 1 or 2 extra years on the island).

If you really think the OP won't make it, the best thing for the OP would be not to go to Med School. The Caribbean isn't "easier" and the USMLE is the same one the Harvard kids take.

 

[mspeedwagon]

The hestitation of going to a foreign medical school is understandable. It's a hard decision to make.

You might need to raise your GPA (or have a high MCAT) in order to make it into a foreign medical school. If you decide to take this route, make sure that medical school you are interested in is approved in California.

While you might become a mildly competitive applicant for DO schools with re-taking classes and getting a 4.0 in all classes from now on, I don't think that's realistic (I took 3 classes at UC - Berkeley Ext and got an A-, A- and an A). You're not likely to all of a sudden become a 4.0 student.

Even assuming a 4.0, your not a strong candidate for DO programs (unless you have a stunning MCAT score as well). The DO programs in CA are among the hardest to get into in the country (you would have a better shot at Rocky Vista or William Carey).

Here is a list of foreign schools to look into (SGU (probably the best if you can get in), Ross, Saba, AUC, Poznan, Jagiellonian, Charles, U of Queensland , Sackler, Trinity, Royal College of Surgeons.

Note: Not all of the schools above are in the same league. Schools like Sackler are forgiving of low GPA with a high MCAT. In your case though I would focus on the Caribbean. This gives you the greatest hope at being out of the country for only two years.

I am hestitant to go to a foreign medical school BC I'm concerned about the quality of training/residency.

I understand I need to raise my overall GPA, rock the MCAT, and increase my science GPA.....

But would a DO school in CA be unobtainable even IF I re-took most the pre-req at UC Berkeley and got a 4.0 GPA in all post-bac work?

I thouht DO schools did grade replacement?

At this point, I know that beggers cannot be choosers, but I would prefer to stay in CA. I do appreciate all your advice and will pursue foreign medical schools as well.

THANKS AGAIN!!!


Are there any foriegn medical schools in France?

 

[mspeedwagon]

MERP in theory was created for lower GPA/ lower MCAT students to prove themselves. Granted a 2.8, while low, is above the OPs current stats. I think any of these programs would be great if the OP can get into them (you're probably right that the SGU one is better).

The OP should ONLY consider this route if he or she can't see his or herself doing anything except medicine. There are many more challenges to graduating from the Caribbean than there are from graduating from a school like Harvard.

mspeedwagon -

You'd be surprised that it's not really that easy to get into MERP at Ross. GPA for that ranges at 2.8-3.2. It's mostly for those that did really poorly on the MCAT. The true best bet for the OP is to land the pre-med program at St. George's University (even if it takes them 1 or 2 extra years on the island).

If you really think the OP won't make it, the best thing for the OP would be not to go to Med School. The Caribbean isn't "easier" and the USMLE is the same one the Harvard kids take.

 

[MiniMoo]

However, the biggest concern here has to do with time. Why should the OP spend the next 6 years trying to enter medical school when their alternative will get them out of medical school in 5 years and has very good residency outcomes for the specialty they want to pursue?

How is the DO timeline 6 years? The OP wouldn't need to completely redo a bachelor's degree. I think 2 years would be enough, assuming the OP takes classes full-time and performs well.

In short, you're right MiniMoo. It concerns me greatly that I see repeated grades of B, B-, C, F. Even more concerning is that there are virtually no As, even in repeated classes. D.O. school replace grades (but when it's the third or fourth time you are repeating most of your classes, that looks really bad). This tells me that the OP is not likely to all of a sudden get As in every class taken from now on without drastic changes (read: "time and money").

Next, let's consider cost. The OP is going to easily need to spend tens of thousands of dollars re-taking courses. From a cost persepctive the D.O. approach is really expensive. And this is before the OP even begins medical school. It's going to take at least two years to bring the GPA up to a 3.0 (at which point it is still not that competitive for DO schools).

Finally, and most importantly, even with high grades (a huge assumption), the OP is fighting an uphill battle given his/her background, which includes the OPs past with substance abuse. While it's commendable, the OP would need to do everything perfectly for two years to have an ok shot at a DO program.

While, I agree that considering another career in health care maybe the way to go, I do believe that the Caribbean is a great LAST chance to become a doctor (if it's one's dream). There is a chance that the OP will fail out and end up in some debt (the risk is similar to SMP programs), but there is hope for the OP to becoe a doctor. I think the OP would be great for the MERP program at Ross (to adjust to the transition to medical school). If the OP were to fail out, it would likely be by the first year (and then the debt is equal to the amount of money that would have been spent re-taking classes).

I understand your reasoning. However, I think it's a wiser course of action for the OP to test his/her academic mettle in undergraduate courses first. And, all things considered, ten thousand dollars is a drop in the bucket if you're looking at actually getting into med school. If the OP ends up failing or unable to achieve an adequate GPA to apply for DO school, then perhaps a different career path should be considered. On the other hand, if the OP heads off to the Caribbean now without first figuring out how to succeed academically in what is a comparatively 'easy' environment (undergrad <<< med school), then the likelihood of failing out is THAT much greater. There have been SDN accounts of individuals heading off to the Caribbean, failing first year, repeating first year, only to fail Step I not once but twice. They end up leaving with no medical degree, and over a hundred thousand dollars in debt. I'm not saying the Caribbean isn't a legitimate place to become a doctor, because it is. But I would say one HAS to be able to cut it academically there moreso than anywhere else, because there is very little guidance and hand holding. I picture the Caribbean like Survivor -- you're stranded on the island with hundreds of others and it's every man/woman for themselves. 😛 Given the OP's academic performance thus far, do you think he/she really has a chance of being the small % that remains alive and standing at the end?

 

[mspeedwagon]

I think we all agree that the OP needs some time to transition (this is where my suggestion of MERP and TriagePreMeds suggestion of SGUs pre-med program fit in). I think those give the OP a much better shot of being able to get into a medical school upon completion of such programs (and if he/she is able to complete them then there is a good chance that the OP will cut it in med school).

Don't get me wrong, there are GREAT risks to going to the Caribbean and that is why I almost never recommend that Caribbean (this case being an exception). I do think without first taking some transition classes, the OP will go to the Caribbean and fail out and be in a much worse situation. I too would recommend considering other health care professions in the US as well.

Edit: I'd also recommend that the OP taking a handful of undergrad courses for a semester and get As in them before heading to the Caribbean (mostly to build confidence and see how realistic it is to succeed).

How is the DO timeline 6 years? The OP wouldn't need to completely redo a bachelor's degree. I think 2 years would be enough, assuming the OP takes classes full-time and performs well.



I understand your reasoning. However, I think it's a wiser course of action for the OP to test his/her academic mettle in undergraduate courses first. And, all things considered, ten thousand dollars is a drop in the bucket if you're looking at actually getting into med school. If the OP ends up failing or unable to achieve an adequate GPA to apply for DO school, then perhaps a different career path should be considered. On the other hand, if the OP heads off to the Caribbean now without first figuring out how to succeed academically in what is a comparatively 'easy' environment (undergrad <<< med school), then the likelihood of failing out is THAT much greater. There have been SDN accounts of individuals heading off to the Caribbean, failing first year, repeating first year, only to fail Step I not once but twice. They end up leaving with no medical degree, and over a hundred thousand dollars in debt. I'm not saying the Caribbean isn't a legitimate place to become a doctor, because it is. But I would say one HAS to be able to cut it academically there moreso than anywhere else, because there is very little guidance and hand holding. I picture the Caribbean like Survivor -- you're stranded on the island with hundreds of others and it's every man/woman for themselves. 😛 Given the OP's academic performance thus far, do you think he/she really has a chance of being the small % that remains alive and standing at the end?

 

[MiniMoo]

I think we all agree that the OP needs some time to transition (this is where my suggestion of MERP and TriagePreMeds suggestion of SGUs pre-med program fit in). I think those give the OP a much better shot of being able to get into a medical school upon completion of such programs (and if he/she is able to complete them then there is a good chance that the OP will cut it in med school).

I've actually never heard of MERP or SGU's Pre-med program. From a quick google search, MERP is a one-semester trial run for individuals who have already completed med school pre-reqs, is that correct? And upon successful completion, individuals are shuttled directly into Ross' MD degree program? On the other hand the SGU Pre-Med program is a one to three year program (depending on the individual's academic background) where students can take med school pre-reqs? And then upon successful completion of that and passing an exam, one can enter SGU's MD program?

 

[mspeedwagon]

You have the general gist. Bascially they are both trial programs to figure out if you are going to be able to succeed in the Caribbean. SGU is more pre-med focused whereas MERP is more med school like classes. Supposedly (as reported by schools in the Caribbean, so take it with a grain of salt) students out of these programs are more likely to succeed. These would serve as a good bridge program for the OP to find out if he/she is likely to do well in the Caribbean. Obviously since the OP hasn't finished all the pre-reqs the pre-med SGU program would be a better fit than the MERP program would be.

I've actually never heard of MERP or SGU's Pre-med program. From a quick google search, MERP is a one-semester trial run for individuals who have already completed med school pre-reqs, is that correct? And upon successful completion, individuals are shuttled directly into Ross' MD degree program? On the other hand the SGU Pre-Med program is a one to three year program (depending on the individual's academic background) where students can take med school pre-reqs? And then upon successful completion of that and passing an exam, one can enter SGU's MD program?

 

[TriagePreMed]

How is the DO timeline 6 years? The OP wouldn't need to completely redo a bachelor's degree. I think 2 years would be enough, assuming the OP takes classes full-time and performs well.

Per the OP's timeline, she said she'd take 5 years for pre-med and 1 year for an SMP. If she were serious about this, she could bring the GPA to 3.0 within 3 semesters and a summer.

You have the general gist. Bascially they are both trial programs to figure out if you are going to be able to succeed in the Caribbean. SGU is more pre-med focused whereas MERP is more med school like classes. Supposedly (as reported by schools in the Caribbean, so take it with a grain of salt) students out of these programs are more likely to succeed. These would serve as a good bridge program for the OP to find out if he/she is likely to do well in the Caribbean. Obviously since the OP hasn't finished all the pre-reqs the pre-med SGU program would be a better fit than the MERP program would be.

There is actually a MERP like program for SGU too, but it is hard to get into. They usually just leave it for the people they would normally admit to the school but now the seats are pretty much full. SGU also offers to get an MPH on the island first and then they graduate them into MD.

 

[MiniMoo]

Per the OP's timeline, she said she'd take 5 years for pre-med and 1 year for an SMP. If she were serious about this, she could bring the GPA to 3.0 within 3 semesters and a summer.

Oi. Somehow I missed that post. The OP's plan for 2-3 years of taking undergrad classes abroad 😕 to get to a 3.3 GPA, then SMP to get into a DO school is totally off. But I think he/she realized that later on.

You have the general gist. Bascially they are both trial programs to figure out if you are going to be able to succeed in the Caribbean. SGU is more pre-med focused whereas MERP is more med school like classes. Supposedly (as reported by schools in the Caribbean, so take it with a grain of salt) students out of these programs are more likely to succeed. These would serve as a good bridge program for the OP to find out if he/she is likely to do well in the Caribbean. Obviously since the OP hasn't finished all the pre-reqs the pre-med SGU program would be a better fit than the MERP program would be.

Okay in that case, the Caribbean route would definitely be faster and cheaper. But riskier. OP, I would carefully consider pros and cons when making your decision. Do as much research as you can on "Caribbean vs. DO". There's a lot of information here on SDN and most of it is very anti-Caribbean. I would try to talk to current and past students of both DO and Caribbean programs if possible.

 

[DolceVitaa]

Correction-

I was planning on doing 5 YEARS post-bac work ( 2 years abroad for personal enrichment + 3 years of pre-med at UCB) to raise my cGPA to 3.4 - 3.5. Then a SMP program in hopes of applying to a DO school, preferably in CA, but I would go anywhere in the US.

I never considered going to the Caribbean before, but realisitically it may be my only option. However, I am not one to give-up easily. IF I do well after my first year at UCB, then I will consider the DO route. The odds are against me in either route I go - Carribbean / DO.

Since I still need to finish OChem, Gen, Bio, Physics, Human Ant, Physiol.... I will take some of these classes at UCB to see how much I can improve.

I will def. look into the pre-med SGU / MERP programs in the Caribbean. I will also continue to investigate other foreign medical schools that have ties to US Med Schools.

Where can I find the best information about the pre-med program at SGU and MERP programs in the Carribben?

Are there any threads on foreign medical schools that are helpful?

Does anyone know anything about medical schools in the Philippines?

THANKS AGAIN!!!!

 

[MiniMoo]

I was planning on doing 5 YEARS post-bac work ( 2 years abroad for personal enrichment + 3 years of pre-med at UCB) to raise my cGPA to 3.4 - 3.5. Then a SMP program in hopes of applying to a DO school, preferably in CA, but I would go anywhere in the US.

My main point was that you wouldn't need an SMP for DO programs if you were able to raise your GPA to 3.4-3.5. But anyhow, your main obstacle would be the time and cost required to retake your classes when considering the DO route. I don't know how many classes you've taken in total thus far, but perhaps you can figure out how many you would need to retake with a grade of at least a B+/A- in order to raise your GPA to where it needs to be.

I never considered going to the Caribbean before, but realisitically it may be my only option. However, I am not one to give-up easily. IF I do well after my first year at UCB, then I will consider the DO route. The odds are against me in either route I go - Carribbean / DO.

Good luck. I truly hope you'll find success with whatever you decide to do - DO or Caribbean.

 

[TriagePreMed]

Correction-

I was planning on doing 5 YEARS post-bac work ( 2 years abroad for personal enrichment + 3 years of pre-med at UCB) to raise my cGPA to 3.4 - 3.5. Then a SMP program in hopes of applying to a DO school, preferably in CA, but I would go anywhere in the US.

I never considered going to the Caribbean before, but realisitically it may be my only option. However, I am not one to give-up easily. IF I do well after my first year at UCB, then I will consider the DO route. The odds are against me in either route I go - Carribbean / DO.

Since I still need to finish OChem, Gen, Bio, Physics, Human Ant, Physiol.... I will take some of these classes at UCB to see how much I can improve.

I will def. look into the pre-med SGU / MERP programs in the Caribbean. I will also continue to investigate other foreign medical schools that have ties to US Med Schools.

Where can I find the best information about the pre-med program at SGU and MERP programs in the Carribben?

Are there any threads on foreign medical schools that are helpful?

Does anyone know anything about medical schools in the Philippines?

THANKS AGAIN!!!!

I don't want to discourage you, but you should calculate how many units it will take you to get a 3.5. In my case, with a higher GPA than yours, it would take me an entirely new bachelors and a half degree (over 180 semester units) with a 4.0 average to get a 3.5.

You don't need anatomy and physiology. At this point you only need OChem, Bio, and Physics and are good to go. This can easily be completed in 2 semesters at a community college and then hope for the MERP program. As far as I know, you can't apply for it. You have to be offered it upon rejection. You can, however, apply for the pre-med sgu.

Try going to valuemd.com like I told you. They can answer your Caribbean/foreign needs better than here.

 

[mspeedwagon]

I think the 5 year timeframe is unreasonable for enrichment/post-bac work UNLESS you are already independently wealthy. If you have the money to do this, go for it. Otherwise, this is a very costly and not very effective plan. At the end of 5 yrs all you have done is taken the pre-med requirements (some accelerated programs allow you to this in a year... two semesters and a summer).

I agree with MiniMoo that if you can get your GPA up to 3.4/3.5 it is realistic for you to get into a D.O. program without an SMP program. However, getting your GPA to move substantially is not that easy. I've struggled (and still am struggling) to bring mine from a 3.5 to 3.7. Granted, I'm not using grade replacement (though even with that tool it's not very easy, albeit it is somewhat easier).

The odds are much more against you in the Caribbean. D.O. programs have a low attrition rate and you are very likely not to encounter any problems going the D.O. route. D.O. >>>>> Caribbean. However, I don't think it's worth the several years it would take you to become a legitimate candidate for D.O. schools.

MERP is NOT an option for you since you need to have completed all your pre-med requirements. Also, you can't apply to MERP. When you apply to Ross, they suggest a subset of their applicants go thru MERP (it's sort of a conditional acceptance). The SGU pre-med program is a better fit. There is information on their website.

If you go to the international forums here (bottom right there is a link), there is information about all foreign schools. I know nothing about the Philippines. I would caution you strongly against it though since the schools in the Philippines do NOT teach to the USMLE. The advantage of the Caribbean and the other English schools I mentioned above is that they do teach to the USMLE. You are unlikely to ever be able to practice medicine with an MD degree from the Philippines.

Finally, and I can't state or re-state this strongly enough. The Caribbean is a last resort. Take a lot of what you read about the Caribbean with a grain of salt (there is a lot that is falsely positive and falsely negative). The best resource is students that have gone through it. There is a good chance that at the end of it you will be worse of than now are (in debt with nothing to show for it). Make sure to strongly consider the risks, as well as the benefits. It is a legitimate way to become a doctor and there are many that do it successfully every year.

Correction-

I was planning on doing 5 YEARS post-bac work ( 2 years abroad for personal enrichment + 3 years of pre-med at UCB) to raise my cGPA to 3.4 - 3.5. Then a SMP program in hopes of applying to a DO school, preferably in CA, but I would go anywhere in the US.

I never considered going to the Caribbean before, but realisitically it may be my only option. However, I am not one to give-up easily. IF I do well after my first year at UCB, then I will consider the DO route. The odds are against me in either route I go - Carribbean / DO.

Since I still need to finish OChem, Gen, Bio, Physics, Human Ant, Physiol.... I will take some of these classes at UCB to see how much I can improve.

I will def. look into the pre-med SGU / MERP programs in the Caribbean. I will also continue to investigate other foreign medical schools that have ties to US Med Schools.

Where can I find the best information about the pre-med program at SGU and MERP programs in the Carribben?

Are there any threads on foreign medical schools that are helpful?

Does anyone know anything about medical schools in the Philippines?

THANKS AGAIN!!!!

 

[TriagePreMed]

Finally, and I can't state or re-state this strongly enough. The Caribbean is a last resort. Take a lot of what you read about the Caribbean with a grain of salt (there is a lot that is falsely positive and falsely negative). The best resource is students that have gone through it. There is a good chance that at the end of it you will be worse of than now are (in debt with nothing to show for it). Make sure to strongly consider the risks, as well as the benefits. It is a legitimate way to become a doctor and there are many that do it successfully every year.

I haven't tried it out, but I think SDN actually sells a book about the Caribbean experience and "all you need to know" through its website. Might be worth checking out.