Guess which SPECIALTY has the most # of SMARTEST MEDICAL STUDENTS??

[p53]

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GUESS WHICH SPECIALTY HAD THE MOST AOAS that matched?

GUESS WHICH SPECIALTY HAD THE MOST NUMBER of people with STEP 1 scores above 240?

Based on the ERAS MATCH data the specialties with the highest Step 1 averages are Plastic Surgery, Dermatology, ENT, Radiology, and Rad Onc.

Plastic Surgery's Step 1 is 241, Dermatology 238, ENT 237, Radiology 235, and Rad Onc is 235.

This seems to imply that Plastic Surgery has the most number of the brightest medical students. Well this is a false assumption.

Believe it or not, Radiology is #1. IT has the most number of the smartest medical students.

FURTHERMORE, there is a much higher number of Alpha Omega Alpha (AOAs) that matched into radiology than any other field.

Consider that fact there are over 1,000 radiology positions in the match. Which means that the average of 1,000 matched radiology applicants have an average of 235. Just consider all of the people in the 220's that brought this average down to a 235. Now imagine if there were only 300 radiology spots. This is analogous to taking the 300 highest Step 1 averages out of the 1000+ people that matched into radiology. What do you think the Step 1 average would be then?

In fact the competition to match at a TOP TWENTY radiology program (which has about 200 positions) is EXTREMELY competitive. Matching into a top twenty radiology program is just as competitive as matching into Plastics and Derm.




BOTTOMLINE:

RADIOLOGY HAS THE MOST NUMBER OF THE SMARTEST STUDENTS IN MEDICAL SCHOOL.

Now consider why?

There is a reason this specialty attracts the most number of the brightest students!

 

[Pinkertinkle]

It's ophthalmology

 

[ZagDoc]

BOTTOMLINE:

RADIOLOGY HAS THE MOST NUMBER OF THE SMARTEST STUDENTS IN MEDICAL SCHOOL.

Now consider why?

Somewhat protected for the insurance corner-cutting. Imaging diagnosis is an essential aspect of medical care.

Great hours.

Above average reimbursement.

No crazy patients/crazy staff/crazy etc.

Meaningful work.

Great hours.

 

[BozoSparky]

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GUESS WHICH SPECIALTY HAD THE MOST AOAS that matched?

GUESS WHICH SPECIALTY HAD THE MOST NUMBER of people with STEP 1 scores above 240?

Based on the ERAS MATCH data the specialties with the highest Step 1 averages are Plastic Surgery, Dermatology, ENT, Radiology, and Rad Onc.

Plastic Surgery's Step 1 is 241, Dermatology 238, ENT 237, Radiology 235, and Rad Onc is 235.

This seems to imply that Plastic Surgery has the most number of the brightest medical students. Well this is a false assumption.

Believe it or not, Radiology is #1. IT has the most number of the smartest medical students.

FURTHERMORE, there is a much higher number of Alpha Omega Alpha (AOAs) that matched into radiology than any other field.

Consider that fact there are over 1,000 radiology positions in the match. Which means that the average of 1,000 matched radiology applicants have an average of 235. Just consider all of the people in the 220's that brought this average down to a 235. Now imagine if there were only 300 radiology spots. This is analogous to taking the 300 highest Step 1 averages out of the 1000+ people that matched into radiology. What do you think the Step 1 average would be then?

In fact the competition to match at a TOP TWENTY radiology program (which has about 200 positions) is EXTREMELY competitive. Matching into a top twenty radiology program is just as competitive as matching into Plastics and Derm.




BOTTOMLINE:

RADIOLOGY HAS THE MOST NUMBER OF THE SMARTEST STUDENTS IN MEDICAL SCHOOL.

Now consider why?

There is a reason this specialty attracts the most number of the brightest students!

kinda sucks if you have to explain why you are smart

 

[VoiceofReason]

aren't radiology's hours extremely variable? And isn't the tentative prediction that the hours will get worse on average as imaging becomes more and more advanced (and thus pervasive)?

 

[DoctaJay]

kinda sucks if you have to explain why you are smart

ha, took the words out of my mouth

 

[Droopy Snoopy]

Don't feed the troll guys.

 

[MOHS_01]

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GUESS WHICH SPECIALTY HAD THE MOST AOAS that matched?

GUESS WHICH SPECIALTY HAD THE MOST NUMBER of people with STEP 1 scores above 240?

Based on the ERAS MATCH data the specialties with the highest Step 1 averages are Plastic Surgery, Dermatology, ENT, Radiology, and Rad Onc.

Plastic Surgery's Step 1 is 241, Dermatology 238, ENT 237, Radiology 235, and Rad Onc is 235.

This seems to imply that Plastic Surgery has the most number of the brightest medical students. Well this is a false assumption.

Believe it or not, Radiology is #1. IT has the most number of the smartest medical students.

FURTHERMORE, there is a much higher number of Alpha Omega Alpha (AOAs) that matched into radiology than any other field.

Consider that fact there are over 1,000 radiology positions in the match. Which means that the average of 1,000 matched radiology applicants have an average of 235. Just consider all of the people in the 220's that brought this average down to a 235. Now imagine if there were only 300 radiology spots. This is analogous to taking the 300 highest Step 1 averages out of the 1000+ people that matched into radiology. What do you think the Step 1 average would be then?

In fact the competition to match at a TOP TWENTY radiology program (which has about 200 positions) is EXTREMELY competitive. Matching into a top twenty radiology program is just as competitive as matching into Plastics and Derm.




BOTTOMLINE:

RADIOLOGY HAS THE MOST NUMBER OF THE SMARTEST STUDENTS IN MEDICAL SCHOOL.

Now consider why?

There is a reason this specialty attracts the most number of the brightest students!

Well, there are lies, damn lies, and then there's statistics.....

Radiology has a higher number of AOA due to the fact that they have many more spots and match a much higher number of residents. A much better measure would the relative percentage of AOA. My money is on plastics...

The relative competitiveness of respective specialties is cyclical in nature -- 20 or 30 years ago dermatology was not competitive at all. "Competitiveness" is a reflection of the medical landscape over the past several years, and, unfortunately for medical students, it suffers a lag time measured in years when referenced to current market forces.

Every specialty faces its own risks and perils facing foward, be it encroachment from other specialties, mid-level providers, changing technologies, the hostile private party reimbursement market, Medicare's seemingly inevitable insolvency. Radiology, as good as it has been for the past 15+ years, faces some unique and potentially game changing problems.

Let us first assume that radiologists will continue with their current Mom & Pop status (something that I am very skeptical will be the case). Everyone needs to be aware of the changes that are occurring behind semi- closed doors; case in point is the push to tease apart the current conversion factor from one solitary number to multiple conversion factors based upon the nature of the service provided. This is not good news for radiologists (me either for that matter) as the largest increases in expenditures are from imaging, minor procedures, and in-office testing and drug administration. Imaging will be flying solo, so they will take the greatest hit.

To address one more problem that is rather unique to radiology (currently) is their at-risk status of outsourcing, perhaps not to overseas as some would suggest, but more likely to larger, more efficient domestic groups who are willing to work for less. This is already happening; it happened at the private hospital chain in the town where I trained (a group out of Chicago essentially took over). It also happened here in the town where I practice (the hospital radiology group's contract was not renewed and was awarded to an outside group).

The house of medicine faces perils and assaults from governmental, private institutions, and, most concerning, from within. I encourage every student, resident, and practicing physician in America to attempt to pry an hour out of their already too busy schedule every week in an effort to more effectively understand the struggles that we face.

 

[dilated]

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In fact the competition to match at a TOP TWENTY radiology program (which has about 200 positions) is EXTREMELY competitive. Matching into a top twenty radiology program is just as competitive as matching into Plastics and Derm.

Matching into a top 20 IM program is just as competitive as matching into radiology. Ergo, internal medicine has the MOST # OF SMARTEST MEDICAL STUDENTS (sic).

 

[UnderdogMD]

🙄


p53

What is your opinion on the future of Radiology (hours, outsourcing, etc) and where you think the field is heading.

 

[yaah]

Somewhat protected for the insurance corner-cutting.

For now.... I don't know why people don't assume that cost-cutting methods will be applied to scans and films just as they have been applied to every other part of medicine too. Radiology is in a current cash cow position, but no doubt loopholes will get closed. Why, if they want to save $$ on health care costs, wouldn't the government cut (relatively higher) radiology fees before they cut more from somewhere else?

 

[PeepshowJohnny]

"No crazy patients/crazy staff/crazy etc."

Nah, techs and nurses who run the radiology section of your hospital can be just a crazy. You just don't have as much interaction with them.

For those don't know...p53 is a...colorful individual who's been on SDN for a few years before matching into radiology.

And I'm waiting for Bigfrank to show up in this thread...

 

[ACSurgeon]

🙄


p53

What is your opinion on the future of Radiology (hours, outsourcing, etc) and where you think the field is heading.

China

 

[p53]

The highest AOA % for a specialty are Dermatology (49%), Plastic Surgery (31%), Orthopedic Surgery (31%), Radiology (25%), and Transitional year (24%).

Notables that have low number of AOA include Anesthesiology 7%, ER 9%. Medicine is 15%.


Now consider there are about 300 spots for Derm, less than 100 spots for Plastics, and about 600 spots for Ortho.

This means .49(300) = 150 AOAs in Derm.
In radiology .25(1000)= 250 AOAs

As for Optho, don't make me laugh the Step 1 average for Optho is 231. It is not competitive at all. Compared to Anesthesiology yes!


Radiology has the 3rd highest SALARY OF ALL SPECIALTIES. Look up physician salaries on GOOGLE.

Now consider how much outpatient based Dermatology and Optho make. They make about 60% of what a radiologist makes.

This is why Radiology has the most number of smartest students using AOA and Step 1 scores as the barometer.

Actually, even if you received an radiology residency in a small community hospital with a Step 1 average of a 220, you would STILL bank afterwards.

GUYS, we all have STUDENT LOANS. Wouldn't you want to get rid of it as quick as possible?

Plus what other career allows you to work from home? Or in Paris? Or in Vegas? Or from Milan? Or in the future a yacht in the Carribean?

 

[MOHS_01]

Perhaps the long hours in the dark alone has clouded your judgment -- radiology has had a good run, but they are square in the sights of payers, both public and private. Within the next few years radiology is quite likely to get f****ed every bit as royally as ophtho and anesthesiology in the 90's and, more recently, the MOHS community where profit margins were cut by 40% or greater for this year.

I guess that I was wrong regarding plastics vs derm -- we win... which also means that you are twice as likely to run across an AOA member when meeting a zit popper vs a basement dweller 😉

FWIW, I do not place near as much credence in AOA as others do.

 

[OHMAN0125]

The highest AOA % for a specialty are Dermatology (49%), Plastic Surgery (31%), Orthopedic Surgery (31%), Radiology (25%), and Transitional year (24%).

Notables that have low number of AOA include Anesthesiology 7%, ER 9%. Medicine is 15%.


Now consider there are about 300 spots for Derm, less than 100 spots for Plastics, and about 600 spots for Ortho.

This means .49(300) = 150 AOAs in Derm.
In radiology .25(1000)= 250 AOAs

As for Optho, don't make me laugh the Step 1 average for Optho is 231. It is not competitive at all. Compared to Anesthesiology yes!


Radiology has the 3rd highest SALARY OF ALL SPECIALTIES. Look up physician salaries on GOOGLE.

Now consider how much outpatient based Dermatology and Optho make. They make about 60% of what a radiologist makes.

This is why Radiology has the most number of smartest students using AOA and Step 1 scores as the barometer.

Actually, even if you received an radiology residency in a small community hospital with a Step 1 average of a 220, you would STILL bank afterwards.

GUYS, we all have STUDENT LOANS. Wouldn't you want to get rid of it as quick as possible?

Plus what other career allows you to work from home? Or in Paris? Or in Vegas? Or from Milan? Or in the future a yacht in the Carribean?

Wow... ur too funny man. I love radiology but dude, there's no way its more competitive than Derm or Plastics. Just a thought...I've seen multiple IMGs and DOs in radiology programs. Yes they prolly scored >240s and only matched at middle of the road or community programs, but can u find any IMGs or DOs in allopathic Derm or Plastics? I'd say very rarely. In fact u have to look at the NRMP Step 1 distribution, not just the avg Step 1. If u look most ppl that got interviews between 210-220 matched Rads. Now look at distribution for Derm, Plastics, and even Ortho. Hmmm....the truth isnt all about just an average. Even in Ortho, sig less ppl match per Step 1 range.

 

[OHMAN0125]

Perhaps the long hours in the dark alone has clouded your judgment -- radiology has had a good run, but they are square in the sights of payers, both public and private. Within the next few years radiology is quite likely to get f****ed every bit as royally as ophtho and anesthesiology in the 90's and, more recently, the MOHS community where profit margins were cut by 40% or greater for this year.

I guess that I was wrong regarding plastics vs derm -- we win... which also means that you are twice as likely to run across an AOA member when meeting a zit popper vs a basement dweller 😉

FWIW, I do not place near as much credence in AOA as others do.

Are u saying MOHS surgery got cut 40%? Are u sure that's accurate and not exageration? Seems kinda crazy

 

[MOHS_01]

The highest AOA % for a specialty are Dermatology (49%), Plastic Surgery (31%), Orthopedic Surgery (31%), Radiology (25%), and Transitional year (24%).

Notables that have low number of AOA include Anesthesiology 7%, ER 9%. Medicine is 15%.


Now consider there are about 300 spots for Derm, less than 100 spots for Plastics, and about 600 spots for Ortho.

This means .49(300) = 150 AOAs in Derm.
In radiology .25(1000)= 250 AOAs

As for Optho, don't make me laugh the Step 1 average for Optho is 231. It is not competitive at all. Compared to Anesthesiology yes!


Radiology has the 3rd highest SALARY OF ALL SPECIALTIES. Look up physician salaries on GOOGLE.

Now consider how much outpatient based Dermatology and Optho make. They make about 60% of what a radiologist makes.

This is why Radiology has the most number of smartest students using AOA and Step 1 scores as the barometer.

Actually, even if you received an radiology residency in a small community hospital with a Step 1 average of a 220, you would STILL bank afterwards.

GUYS, we all have STUDENT LOANS. Wouldn't you want to get rid of it as quick as possible?

Plus what other career allows you to work from home? Or in Paris? Or in Vegas? Or from Milan? Or in the future a yacht in the Carribean?

This "perk" also places the specialty at great risk.

 

[yaah]

Are u saying MOHS surgery got cut 40%? Are u sure that's accurate and not exageration? Seems kinda crazy

It's probably not an exaggeration. Reimbursement for a lot of things in pathology as well has been drastically cut - in particular what gets cut are professional (i.e., physician) fees. As an example, the professional fee reimbursement for interpreting the most common pathlogy biopsy specimen, an 88305 (includes GI endoscopic biopsies, prostate biopsies, skin biopsies, etc) has been cut from about $50 10 years ago to just over $30 these days. That's about 40%. This is not indexed to inflation, it's in actual dollars if I interpret things correctly.

Technical fees (such as equipment use and purchase) are, for now, relatively more protected. Physician incomes and fees are easy targets for cuts for congress and other policymakers.

 

[MOHS_01]

Are u saying MOHS surgery got cut 40%? Are u sure that's accurate and not exageration? Seems kinda crazy

Unfortunately, no exaggeration friend. MOHS has, since its inception, been exempt from the multiple surgery exemption (and rightly so). The removal of the tumor and the reconstruction of the resultant defect are completely separate and identifiable operative sessions and procedures, with little to no overlap of the work involved (sans the introduction of self and staff). Likewise, the majority of the work involved in the MOHS codes is technical (lab) and pathology services, which are exempt from multiple procedure reduction. To make matters worse, the multiple surgery reduction was already applied as second and subsequent stages were already reduced when compared to first stage.

Starting this Jan CMS accepted the AMA's RUC's recommendation to removed MOHS from the reduction exemption list. This translates into a 25-30% (or more, depending upon individual practice policy variations) reduction in revenue for like work when compared year over year.

Practice costs (overhead) typically ran anywhere from 40-50%. For the sake of easy math, consider the following scenario:

2007 -- Practice collects 1 million; overhead 40-50% (4-500k), doc makes 5-600K before taxes, retirement, etc

2008 -- Practice now collects 750K, costs still come to 4-500K, doc now profits 250-350K

Reasonable, realistic numbers. Still a good income, but an inappropriate reduction.

Year in and year out we all see our services get devalued. It blows.

 

[p53]

I heard VERBAL reasoning scores have gone down in recent years but didn't think much of it until now.

I am not saying radiology is more competitive than derm or plastics. I am saying there are more people with Step 1 scores above 240 in Radiology than Derm and Plastics. Plus there are more AOAs that go into Radiology than Derm and Plastics.

Take a look at the length of the contiguous rank list. Name another applicant that goes on as many interviews as a radiology applicant. Going on 12+ interview is the norm for radiology unlike other specialities.

Derm make 60% of a radiologist and plastics make 70% of a radiologist. Plus, radiology is a portable profession. You can work anywhere. One last thing, try to figure out the number of vacation weeks in radiology vs Derm and Plastics. It is not even close. Look this up on google. Rads get More money and much more vacation than Derm and Plastics...hmmmm.

Just keep in mind guys, imaging is a 16 billion dollar yearly industry. We have physicians such as ER docs that automatically get CTs for chest pain and abdominal pain. Plus, PET scans are going to become more mainstream which means RVUs are going to go higher and higher for new imaging modalities.

Plus, don't forget about MRIs. We have only scratched the potential for it. PET MRIs are on the horizon. These will have extremely high income potential.

Yes, imaging cuts have affected radiology but the VOLUME is increasing at a tremenous rate.

WhY?

Because primary care docs want the most possible information.

As for the argument of the outsourcing to foreign countries. Check out nighthawk on google. These are AMERICAN graduates working there. Lastly, radiologists will ALWAYS be affiliated with hospitals.

WhY?

Radiologists do a TON of procedures. Sure, if you don't want to do procedures you won't have to do it. However, radiologists always get the toughest procedures in the hospital because image guidance. Therefore Radiologists will ALWAYS be hospital based.

Wow... ur too funny man. I love radiology but dude, there's no way its more competitive than Derm or Plastics. Just a thought...I've seen multiple IMGs and DOs in radiology programs. Yes they prolly scored >240s and only matched at middle of the road or community programs, but can u find any IMGs or DOs in allopathic Derm or Plastics? I'd say very rarely. In fact u have to look at the NRMP Step 1 distribution, not just the avg Step 1. If u look most ppl that got interviews between 210-220 matched Rads. Now look at distribution for Derm, Plastics, and even Ortho. Hmmm....the truth isnt all about just an average. Even in Ortho, sig less ppl match per Step 1 range.

 

[p53]

As technology improves, radiology will be the specialty that stays at the forefront of this. Unlike Pathology, Anesthesiology, or Opthalamology. Research is booming in Radiology.

Consider new uses for 256 slice CTs or molecular imaging. What about future screening for LUNG cancer using CTs. Who do you think will make money reading molecular imaging in the future?

Plus, PET scans are in its infancy and is about to explode. PETS use glucose anaologs but think of all of the other elements or molecules that could be used for physiologic imaging?

Technology continues to improve, that is a fact of life. Radiologists are the ones that use newest technology in medicine.

 

[SugarDaddy]

wow never seen that much passion out of a basement dweller.
Are you sure you do not require clinical correlation before deciding which specialty has the smartest residents?

 

[p53]

Typical medical student response. Reciprocates a comment while knowing little about it.

If people actually TYPED out the clinical correlation or called the radiologist to give a bullet history than it would not be placed in the dictation.

Classic example: I get an xray of the pelvis and hip. The comment on the requisition: Pain.

What kind of pain? Hip pain, pelvis pain, sharp pain etc.

All it takes is a couple minutes to type this into the requesition. All we want is a bullet history of the chief complain with associated symptoms. Is that too much to ask for?

Another example: Chest X ray. Hx: Patient has chest pain.

Pleurtic pain? Sharp radiating pain?


This information is in the H&P so why don't you let the radiologist know? If you truly want the best diagnostic information it is the PHYSICIANS job to provide the tools to help the radiologist as much as possible.

If the primary referring physicians DID THEIR JOB, we would NEVER HAVE TO SAY CLINICAL CORRELATION.

 

[OHMAN0125]

Typical medical student response. Reciprocates a comment while knowing little about it.

If people actually TYPED out the clinical correlation or called the radiologist to give a bullet history than it would not be placed in the dictation.

Classic example: I get an xray of the pelvis and hip. The comment on the requisition: Pain.

What kind of pain? Hip pain, pelvis pain, sharp pain etc.

All it takes is a couple minutes to type this into the requesition. All we want is a bullet history of the chief complain with associated symptoms. Is that too much to ask for?

Another example: Chest X ray. Hx: Patient has chest pain.

Pleurtic pain? Sharp radiating pain?


This information is in the H&P so why don't you let the radiologist know? If you truly want the best diagnostic information it is the PHYSICIANS job to provide the tools to help the radiologist as much as possible.

If the primary referring physicians DID THEIR JOB, we would NEVER HAVE TO SAY CLINICAL CORRELATION.

Chill out man...ur way to cocky

 

[elwademd]

Typical medical student response. Reciprocates a comment while knowing little about it.

If people actually TYPED out the clinical correlation or called the radiologist to give a bullet history than it would not be placed in the dictation.

Classic example: I get an xray of the pelvis and hip. The comment on the requisition: Pain.

What kind of pain? Hip pain, pelvis pain, sharp pain etc.

All it takes is a couple minutes to type this into the requesition. All we want is a bullet history of the chief complain with associated symptoms. Is that too much to ask for?

Another example: Chest X ray. Hx: Patient has chest pain.

Pleurtic pain? Sharp radiating pain?


This information is in the H&P so why don't you let the radiologist know? If you truly want the best diagnostic information it is the PHYSICIANS job to provide the tools to help the radiologist as much as possible.

If the primary referring physicians DID THEIR JOB, we would NEVER HAVE TO SAY CLINICAL CORRELATION.

communication is a two way street. one could argue that other consultants pick up the chart, why should it be any different for a radiologist who is acting as a consultant.

also, what's to stop the radiologist from picking up the phone and calling/paging the person who ordered the test?

we're all busy. again, communication goes both ways. other services need to improve, as does radiology.

I am saying there are more people with Step 1 scores above 240 in Radiology than Derm and Plastics. Plus there are more AOAs that go into Radiology than Derm and Plastics.

the raw number and the percentage are different. from your own numbers:

The highest AOA % for a specialty are Dermatology (49%), Plastic Surgery (31%), Orthopedic Surgery (31%), Radiology (25%), and Transitional year (24%).

Notables that have low number of AOA include Anesthesiology 7%, ER 9%. Medicine is 15%.

using your logic, internal medicine has the highest number of aoa

.15 (4858) = 728

so, either use percentage of matched seniors who are/were aoa, and its derm (49%); or use the absolute/actual number of matched seniors who are/were aoa, and its internal medicine (728).

in the end, as mohs_01 pointed out, there's not much credence in being aoa.

 

[Droopy Snoopy]

Typical medical student response. Reciprocates a comment while knowing little about it.

If people actually TYPED out the clinical correlation or called the radiologist to give a bullet history than it would not be placed in the dictation.

Classic example: I get an xray of the pelvis and hip. The comment on the requisition: Pain.

What kind of pain? Hip pain, pelvis pain, sharp pain etc.

All it takes is a couple minutes to type this into the requesition. All we want is a bullet history of the chief complain with associated symptoms. Is that too much to ask for?

Another example: Chest X ray. Hx: Patient has chest pain.

Pleurtic pain? Sharp radiating pain?


This information is in the H&P so why don't you let the radiologist know? If you truly want the best diagnostic information it is the PHYSICIANS job to provide the tools to help the radiologist as much as possible.

If the primary referring physicians DID THEIR JOB, we would NEVER HAVE TO SAY CLINICAL CORRELATION.

At my school the referring physician can write a beautiful history on the order, but it's the rads desk clerk that translates this into what the radiologist sees in PACS. Look troll, no one needs convincing that rads is a pretty sweet field. Is it the most superest smarty competitiveness field? What the **** does it matter? Nobody asked you to come over here to proclaim your greatness, so go find another place to take out your insecurities before you get banned.

 

[Tired]

If the primary referring physicians DID THEIR JOB, we would NEVER HAVE TO SAY CLINICAL CORRELATION.

Dunno about primary care, but I can tell you why Ortho doesn't put clinical history into 90% of their requests.

We don't care about your read. Never even look at it.

In fact, there are more than a few private practice 'pods who have taken Radiology entirely out of the mix, and bill directly for their read of the films.

I think it's funny that people are worried about Radiology reimbursements going to India. Because at least from this side, they're really headed towards the pockets of the surgeons.

 

[p53]

Your exclamation remark speaks VOLUMES. There is no reason for your disproptionate response. Until you step back and realize that it really isn't about me.

It is about your current mind state.

The response below is known as DISPLACEMENT for those studying for the USMLEs. Don't worry medical school isn't that bad. Just wait until you hit internship. If you get this response NOW I would hate to be anyone that knows you during INTERNSHIP. You clearly cannot handle stress well

Hang in there. If you need any help just send me a PM. I am one of the senior members on SDN and have always taken wounded medical students under my wing.

At my school the referring physician can write a beautiful history on the order, but it's the rads desk clerk that translates this into what the radiologist sees in PACS. Look troll, no one needs convincing that rads is a pretty sweet field. Is it the most superest smarty competitiveness field? What the **** does it matter? Nobody asked you to come over here to proclaim your greatness, so go find another place to take out your insecurities before you get banned.

 

[p53]

A fourth year medical student can read plain films of bones too. Isn't it interesting extermely bright students go into ortho but 4-5 years later everyone in the hospital comments about the lack of medical knowledge of them.

One of the general surgeons once told me that the Orthopedic departments across the country takes the smartest, brightest surgical candidates and makes them the dumbest physicians during their residency. I wonder why. Ask any internal medicine doc or any other primary care physician and they will tell you that ortho has reputation of having the dumbest physicians.

Going back to original assertion. Any orthopedic surgeon that is willing to read MRI of the Shoulder and Knee and bypass a muscularskeletal radiologist needs to get his head examined. An orthopedic surgeon is a SURGEON. They spend most of their time in the OR. An MSK radiologist spends 100x more time reading MRIs.

Here's a secret you will find out. Behind every successful orthopedic surgeon is a Muscularskeletal Radiologist that diagnoses the diseases. You are only good at what you have been trained to do during residency. An orthopedic surgeon is NOT stupid enough to invest the enormous amount of time to master the intricacies of MRI imaging.

Dunno about primary care, but I can tell you why Ortho doesn't put clinical history into 90% of their requests.

We don't care about your read. Never even look at it.

In fact, there are more than a few private practice 'pods who have taken Radiology entirely out of the mix, and bill directly for their read of the films.

I think it's funny that people are worried about Radiology reimbursements going to India. Because at least from this side, they're really headed towards the pockets of the surgeons.

 

[Random Anesthesiologist]

Who Cares?!?!?!!!!!!!

 

[p53]

Well here is evidence in quotations below that you do!

Who Cares?!?!?!!!!!!!

 

[Monica Lewinsky]

p53, you have always been my idol. Please teach us more.👍

 

[Law2Doc]

Plus, PET scans are in its infancy and is about to explode. PETS use glucose anaologs but think of all of the other elements or molecules that could be used for physiologic imaging?

Nuclear medicine is its own specialty distinct from radiology at many places.

Bottom line, anyone who uses grammatically atrocious language like "most number" is certainly not among the ranks of the smartest medical students. How you speak and write counts in this world at least as much as your board scores.

 

[OHMAN0125]

Well here is evidence in quotations below that you do!

p53, ur a perfect example of why specialties hate each other and of why turf wars exist.

 

[RooRoo1]

I think it is funny that this whole thread was started on the flawed premise that radiology has the MOST "smart" students when it appears that internal medicine has the MOST.

 

[newbie1kenobi]

Well here is evidence in quotations below that you do!

Since you brought this topic up, why do you care?

 

[Pinkertinkle]

As for Optho, don't make me laugh the Step 1 average for Optho is 231. It is not competitive at all. Compared to Anesthesiology yes!

Nah you're wrong. Avg step I score means nothing. Ophthalmology rules. The sum of the number of H's and L's in a specialy's name directly correlates with how awesome it is.

 

[Tired]

A fourth year medical student can read plain films of bones too. Isn't it interesting extermely bright students go into ortho but 4-5 years later everyone in the hospital comments about the lack of medical knowledge of them.

That's how we get Medicine to take all our patients.

One of the general surgeons once told me that the Orthopedic departments across the country takes the smartest, brightest surgical candidates and makes them the dumbest physicians during their residency. I wonder why.

Lot of bitterness among those who couldn't hack it in our field. It's okay, we don't mind.

Ask any internal medicine doc or any other primary care physician and they will tell you that ortho has reputation of having the dumbest physicians.

We don't ask them anything. We just pawn off our patients and giggle all the way to the bank.

Going back to original assertion. Any orthopedic surgeon that is willing to read MRI of the Shoulder and Knee and bypass a muscularskeletal radiologist needs to get his head examined.

I like the MSK guys. They're good to have around when you have a question. But if you think we're operating based on the MSK read, and not our own, you've clearly overestimated their value to us.

An orthopedic surgeon is a SURGEON. They spend most of their time in the OR. An MSK radiologist spends 100x more time reading MRIs.

True. But they're reads are based off books. Our reads are based on years of experience correlating what we see on MRI vs what we see on arthroscopy. Even the best MSK radiologist, unless they are in a good academic facility, simply doesn't have the benefit of this experience.

Here's a secret you will find out. Behind every successful orthopedic surgeon is a Muscularskeletal Radiologist that diagnoses the diseases.

And here's a secret you will find out: it's spelled "Musculoskeletal".

Impressive that you managed to misspell it twice in one post, makes me highly doubt that you are anywhere close to Radiology.

So when will you be taking the MCAT?

 

[Corker]

This thread was outstanding to read!!! Who needs the comedy channel when we've got SDN?!!!! What a crack up!

Thanks, guys. Really fun (though a bit ridiculous) banter.

 

[IHeartNerds]

you remind me of that dental guy who came in here and announces why he was the king of allo.

except you're less funny.

 

[Random Anesthesiologist]

Well here is evidence in quotations below that you do!

You may end up being good at what you do - this is a message board and I don't know you personally.

However, on this message board, you contribute nothing of value to anyone but yourself, and for that, you get the privilege of being on my ignore list.

👎

 

[8744]

At my school the referring physician can write a beautiful history on the order, but it's the rads desk clerk that translates this into what the radiologist sees in PACS. Look troll, no one needs convincing that rads is a pretty sweet field. Is it the most superest smarty competitiveness field? What the **** does it matter? Nobody asked you to come over here to proclaim your greatness, so go find another place to take out your insecurities before you get banned.

Radiology is cool because if you want, you never have to see, smell, or touch a patient.

 

[njbmd]

As others have said, "Don't feed the trolls". Closing so they they can starve.