Harvard vs top 20

[moomoo1]

Here's a hypothetical question: if you got into a top 20 school that would give you full tuition and got into Harvard, how much would you be willing to pay for a Harvard education (i.e. would you go to Harvard even if they gave you no financial aid? if they gave you 20% of tuition? 50%?)? Is a Harvard education worth giving up $150,000 from another school?

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[psychedoc2b]

Here's a hypothetical question: if you got into a top 20 school that would give you full tuition and got into Harvard, how much would you be willing to pay for a Harvard education (i.e. would you go to Harvard even if they gave you no financial aid? if they gave you 20% of tuition? 50%?)? Is a Harvard education worth giving up $150,000 from another school?

Nope, unless your daddy can offer you a better deal. I would encourage to go to the school that is offering you full tuition. There is nothing more burdensome than realizing that you owe over 100 grand or more in loans. It changes your perspective about what specialty you will choose and your standard of living later.

Harvard is number one but if you do well at the top 20 school, you probably would do just as well as someone who graduated from Harvard. However, if you plan on going into academia, I would choose Harvard because it will open doors for you.

Best wishes,
psychedoc2b

 

[Zoom-Zoom]

Top 20 is good. Depending on the school, I would definitely consider a top 20 that was completely paid for. However, pretty much any other school I would turn down for Harvard even if I had to pay for it...

 

[TheMightyAngus]

It is not uncommon for people to choose prestige over value. To many the perks of being in the old boys club makes up for the price of admission. It really depends on whats important to you.

 

[Messerschmitts]

Top 20 is good. Depending on the school, I would definitely consider a top 20 that was completely paid for. However, pretty much any other school I would turn down for Harvard even if I had to pay for it...

I completely agree. I'm willing to go to most top 20 schools over Harvard if given sufficient financial incentive, since the difference in prestige will be acceptably small. However, for most schools under the top 20 I would pay any amount of money to attend HMS.

 

[p00psicleSTICK]

Top 20 w/ full tuition over Harvard anyday. Sorry, there's more things important to me in life than gloating over being an ivy leaguer.

 

[dilated]

I'd pay... nothing? I mean, it's pretty cool to say "I go to HMS", but then once you graduate nobody really cares where you went so it's useless. Also, I didn't like Boston very much, so that's another issue. Logically it's hard for me to make a case in favor of paying extra for HMS with the absence of tangible benefits. Every time I ate ramen noodles I'd hate myself.

 

[Law2Doc]

Here's a hypothetical question: if you got into a top 20 school that would give you full tuition and got into Harvard, how much would you be willing to pay for a Harvard education (i.e. would you go to Harvard even if they gave you no financial aid? if they gave you 20% of tuition? 50%?)? Is a Harvard education worth giving up $150,000 from another school?

You can do well coming from any of those schools, so unless you were going to be able to do med school without debt, I would take the full tuition. However top 20 isn't the same as top 10, and if it was #19 or 20, I would have some concern that it wouldn't still be top 20 by the time I graduated -- these rankings are not fixed in stone, and move about by a few ranks. So if prestige is at all important, I would limit my sights to top 15 or so.

 

[ExtraCrispy]

Go to the top 20!! Go to the top 20!!

I can tell you from my residency interviews, where you go HELPS, but what's much more important is how well you perform at your respective school. If you're talking about a third tier school vs. Harvard, I'd say Harvard - but a top 20 school will open doors for you no matter what, and as long as you put your nose to the grindstone and do well, top 20 vs. Harvard will be splitting hairs when it comes time to apply for residency.

You pile up so much debt in med school - it's a burden that you'll carry for years (residents don't make great salaries, and for many residency & fellowship are LONG roads), so if you can alleviate that burden at all and still receive great traiining, go for it.

 

[Mutt]

Go to Harvard.

You only live once, and the Harvard name will not be surpassed in our lifetimes. It is the top of the top and everyone knows it. Obviously, the top 20 school will give you a great education, but the Harvard prestige will certainly surpass the $150,000 investment over your lifetime in many different ways.

Sometimes, it's not all about the money.....

 

[Fermata]

Honestly, the top 20 is the better choice but deep down all of us would at least flirt with the want to be able to drop the H bomb.

 

[SoCuteMD]

I didn't like Boston very much

You are, quite possibly, the only person (besides Yankees fans) who have ever uttered those words.

 

[Chinorean]

You owe it to your kids to go to Harvard. Then they can get in there too. And you will spend the rest of your life paying Harvard tuition! Muahahahaha...

But seriously, $150,000 is a lot of money now, but as a doctor paying off loans it isn't too bad. If you have a "dream school" (not just Harvard) and you get in, don't let money get in your way of going there...if you can afford to, I mean.

 

[bigdan]

I just had a very similar discussion with a classmate recently. He'd do whatever he could to have the best name on his diploma; I would rather have a near free education.

My thought is that if you know you want to do community medicine and NOT be in the ivory towers of academic medicine, it might really NOT be that important to be at Harvard or Wash U or wherever.

I'd be at a top 100 for free over a top 10 for full tuition. (Easy for me to say)

dc

 

[infiniti]

I will say this again! Harvard is not the dominant name in medicine. I can think of at least 3 schools that can claim to be the top. To the OP, please don't confuse Harvard reputation in undergraduate education with that of its medical school. Simply speaking, no institution in the world except for Oxford has the impact Harvard has in undergrad. The story however changes as soon as you get into medical education. Surely, Harvard is a great medical school, but there are other schools as good and even better (coming from one of Harvard residency directors) for medical education. Like Law2doc said, I would definitely choose a top 15 school with a large scholarship over Harvard. Your future debt (regardless of what people say on here) will determine your happiness and the sort of residency you look for. In retrospect, a lot of students end up going into residencies with large income not because they really desire it, but because they need a large salary to pay off their loans. People keep telling you that $150,000 in debt doesn't mean much. Consider the fact that you will get marrried, have medical insurance, pay for other neccessities and so on. By the time you pay those bills, believe me, $150,000 will make a difference. A word is enough for the wise.

 

[infiniti]

and.....give more weight to things like student body, weight, and curriculum. As long as you are in the top 15, I wouldn't worry about reputation too much. Think about the fact that Harvard graduates have certain favorites for residency. I can't think about all of them but I know one for sure (read princeton review and Usnews section on Harvard). UCSF! This school is a favorite among Harvard graduates, sure most of them will not be able to get in. Say, you are a California resident who desires to practice in California. It would be stupid to turn down (UCLA, UCSF) for Harvard (assuming they don't give you a scholarship) because in the end, as a UC graduate, your chances of practicing in California is much higher than that of an Harvard grad. What am I trying to say? All I am saying is that you should take a look further than the four years in med school . Ask yourself, where do I want to end up? Of course, if you are from another state and want to end up in California, Harvard (and other top schools) might be better than your local state school. Even if you go to Harvard, the fact that a lot of your classmates are dying for the same residencies can turn out to be a bad thing. In the end only a few are chosen. The question will be.... Are you one of the chosen ones?

 

[gujuDoc]

Top 20 w/ full tuition over Harvard anyday. Sorry, there's more things important to me in life than gloating over being an ivy leaguer.

For me I think I'd look at the program as a whole in terms of the curricula and atmosphere and see which one I think I would fit best in, if this were my choice. Then based on both financial aid and general feel, I'd make my decision.

 

[yodel]

I will say this again! Harvard is not the dominant name in medicine. I can think of at least 3 schools that can claim to be the top. To the OP, please don't confuse Harvard reputation in undergraduate education with that of its medical school. Simply speaking, no institution in the world except for Oxford has the impact Harvard has in undergrad.

i've always felt that harvard is more reputable for its professional schools (medicine, law, business) than its undergrad.

 

[45408]

Geez, a lot of you guys are hooked on Harvard. Obviously, if you're able to get accepted into HMS, you'll do great no matter where you go.

 

[golftrippy]

i've always felt that harvard is more reputable for its professional schools (medicine, law, business) than its undergrad.

Yodel, right you are. Don't know where you get your info infiniti, but Harvard's graduate schools are generally considered superior; however, its undergrad is considered only one of many that have an equal education.

 

[The Madden Bus]

Here's a hypothetical question: if you got into a top 20 school that would give you full tuition and got into Harvard, how much would you be willing to pay for a Harvard education (i.e. would you go to Harvard even if they gave you no financial aid? if they gave you 20% of tuition? 50%?)? Is a Harvard education worth giving up $150,000 from another school?

If you switch Harvard with Johns Hopkins then I'd say yes, I'd take Johns Hopkins over Harvard and any other medical school pretty much. I know Harvard is ranked #1, but why do you all hold it in such high regard? Is it because Harvard doctors are like a cult and will only recommend other Harvard doctors to their patients? Or because they have more than double the funding than the next closest medical school (which happens to be Johns Hopkins, ranked #2 overall). To me, Hopkins just seems like they produce better doctors. It seems like they have produced more breakthrough medical achievements and life-saving techniques and devices than any other medical school including Harvard. But maybe that's just my 2 cents. But I would like to know why so many people here are willing to give up full rides at other top 20 medical schools just to go to Harvard.

 

[golftrippy]

If you switch Harvard with Johns Hopkins then I'd say yes, I'd take Johns Hopkins over Harvard and any other medical school pretty much. I know Harvard is ranked #1, but why do you all hold it in such high regard? Is it because Harvard doctors are like a cult and will only recommend other Harvard doctors to their patients? Or because they have more than double the funding than the next closest medical school (which happens to be Johns Hopkins, ranked #2 overall). To me, Hopkins just seems like they produce better doctors. It seems like they have produced more breakthrough medical achievements and life-saving techniques and devices than any other medical school including Harvard. But maybe that's just my 2 cents. But I would like to know why so many people here are willing to give up full rides at other top 20 medical schools just to go to Harvard.

Lets all be honest with ourselves and say we'd rather go to Harvard

 

[gujuDoc]

Lets all be honest with ourselves and say we'd rather go to Harvard

That is not truth for all people. I know, if I liked another school's program, I wouldn't choose HMS over it just for the name because my primary goal is to be a clinician not an academic research physician. now if research was my interest, then yes I'd be all up for HMS. However, as I have no interest in research, going to a school which requires a research component would not be my first choice.

 

[golftrippy]

That is not truth for all people. I know, if I liked another school's program, I wouldn't choose HMS over it just for the name because my primary goal is to be a clinician not an academic research physician. now if research was my interest, then yes I'd be all up for HMS. However, as I have no interest in research, going to a school which requires a research component would not be my first choice.

I know I'm just antagonizing...hence the

 

[SailCrazy]

Harvard would definitely have to give me a better offer than my in-state tuition at Michigan for me to go there. Nothing against Harvard or Boston, but for me it simply isn't worth it.

 

[owenmichael]

Harvard would definitely have to give me a better offer than my in-state tuition at Michigan for me to go there. Nothing against Harvard or Boston, but for me it simply isn't worth it.

*

 

[Gut Shot]

Here's a hypothetical question: if you got into a top 20 school that would give you full tuition and got into Harvard, how much would you be willing to pay for a Harvard education (i.e. would you go to Harvard even if they gave you no financial aid? if they gave you 20% of tuition? 50%?)? Is a Harvard education worth giving up $150,000 from another school?

This predicament was actually faced by the chair of my graduate school department back in the 1960's. He got into HMS, but Vanderbilt offered him a scholarship (not sure how much). His choice was Vandy - after going to Harvard for residency, he said "I finally got to see what I'd been missing."

That last part was a little sarcastic, in case anyone is wondering.

 

[whosit]

If you switch Harvard with Johns Hopkins then I'd say yes, I'd take Johns Hopkins over Harvard and any other medical school pretty much. I know Harvard is ranked #1, but why do you all hold it in such high regard? Is it because Harvard doctors are like a cult and will only recommend other Harvard doctors to their patients? Or because they have more than double the funding than the next closest medical school (which happens to be Johns Hopkins, ranked #2 overall). To me, Hopkins just seems like they produce better doctors. It seems like they have produced more breakthrough medical achievements and life-saving techniques and devices than any other medical school including Harvard. But maybe that's just my 2 cents. But I would like to know why so many people here are willing to give up full rides at other top 20 medical schools just to go to Harvard.

If you look at per faculty member NIH funding, Hopkins actually has MORE than Harvard. I don't know how exactly US News totals the overall funding, but the Harvard network is HUGE and they have a lot of interdepartmental and inter-institutional professors besides the insane number of hospitals they're already connected with.

 

[The Madden Bus]

If you look at per faculty member NIH funding, Hopkins actually has MORE than Harvard. I don't know how exactly US News totals the overall funding, but the Harvard network is HUGE and they have a lot of interdepartmental and inter-institutional professors besides the insane number of hospitals they're already connected with.

Not even Bill Gates can beat the funding Harvard has. According to NIH grants per faculty member yes Hopkins is greater than Harvard. But according to USN&WR NIH research grants (in total), Harvard has the most with $1,167.6 Million. More than double the next closest (which is Univ of Washington at $506.2 Million, not Johns Hopkins, my mistake). I'm trying to figure out what's so amazing about Harvard? It's a great name no doubt, but name doesn't make everything in life, and certainly not in medicine. I'm trying to understand why so many people want Harvard so bad that they give up free tuition at other schools just to go there.

 

[Wahoos]

There was a first year student in UVA that was offered a full scholarship to both Harvard and John Hopkins, she turned down both schools to come to UVA because she had a better "feel" for our school. Essentially, our admissions committee had to scamble up 4 years of full tutition from the alumni fund to match the previous 2 offers to get her to come to UVA. Harvard has a great name and when you apply to residency, the doors will be wide open for you. However, if you are a superb applicant, you will get multiple accepetances, in the end, you should choose a school that will be the best "fit" for you, in terms of the type of people, location, how the classes are structured, etc, etc. The worst thing is going to a place for the name and end up hating your life for the next 4 years. This has definitely happened to people before. If you do well in school, you will match to a great residency whether you come from a top 20 medical school or Harvard. One of my best friends who was applying to Orthopedics last year, could have gone to Wash Univ for Orthopedics residency (which has a huge name in the Ortho world), but decided to rank another program of lesser name higher (and matched there) because he did not feel a "fit" with the people at Wash U. His reasoning was that, 5 yrs of working at a place that I will hate or not enjoy is NOT worth the name.

At the same time, it is hard to get a feel for the medical program just by a single day of interview. I guess you will have to go with a "gut" feeling. I decided to go to UVA over U of Michigan and another top 10 medical school, but looking back, I am 100% happy with my decision. In the end, you will get a great education no matter where you go to medical school. A lot of the learning in medical school and after, is self directed.

 

[slickb12]

There was a first year student in UVA that was offered a full scholarship to both Harvard and John Hopkins, she turned down both schools to come to UVA because she had a better "feel" for our school. Essentially, our admissions committee had to scamble up 4 years of full tutition from the alumni fund to match the previous 2 offers to get her to come to UVA. Harvard has a great name and when you apply to residency, the doors will be wide open for you. However, if you are a superb applicant, you will get multiple accepetances, in the end, you should choose a school that will be the best "fit" for you, in terms of the type of people, location, how the classes are structured, etc, etc. The worst thing is going to a place for the name and end up hating your life for the next 4 years. This has definitely happened to people before. If you do well in school, you will match to a great residency whether you come from a top 20 medical school or Harvard. One of my best friends who was applying to Orthopedics last year, could have gone to Wash Univ for Orthopedics residency (which has a huge name in the Ortho world), but decided to rank another program of lesser name higher (and matched there) because he did not feel a "fit" with the people at Wash U. His reasoning was that, 5 yrs of working at a place that I will hate or not enjoy is NOT worth the name.

At the same time, it is hard to get a feel for the medical program just by a single day of interview. I guess you will have to go with a "gut" feeling. I decided to go to UVA over U of Michigan and another top 10 medical school, but looking back, I am 100% happy with my decision. In the end, you will get a great education no matter where you go to medical school. A lot of the learning in medical school and after, is self directed.

harvard doesn't offer any sort of scholarship. only financial aid.

 

[Wahoos]

If you call it financial aid, that is fine. What ever the source of money, this particular applicant was getting a full tutition paid for by Harvard and Hopkins. We wanted her to come UVA very much and she expressed a lot of interest in our school, but she was not going to come to UVA over Harvard if our school did not offer her the same as Harvard. So we had to come up with a way to finance this applicant's education, and we did, via the alumni funds. She decided to come. I know this because I was part of the admission's committee at UVA when I was a 4th year student. Believe it or not, but med schools go to length to get you to come, if you were a "superstar", someone that just stands out besides a high MCAT and high GPA. I seen plenty of people with over 35 MCAT and over 3.9 GPA during the interview season. But this particular applicant "really" stood out to us, and I guess to Harvard and Hopkins as well. You can check out the latest UVA medical school alumni magazine, because it mentions her...... then it asked me to donate money to the school

 

[LizzyM]

If you want to go into academic medicine, choose the free ride -- academics doesn't pay very well.

I made the Ivy League choice over a free ride at a State school and it took decades to pay off the loans. It was a great education and the "old boy" network is great but if I were faced with the decision again, and knowing what I know now, I don't know which I would choose ....

 

[ChocolateKiss]

If you want to go into academic medicine, choose the free ride -- academics doesn't pay very well.

Really? I thought physicians were well compensated in academics. How much lower are the salaries for academic physicians as compared to those in private practice?

 

[infiniti]

I said Harvard is not the dominant name in medicine because unlike undergraduat e education, there is very (say this again) little difference in quality of graduate education (particularly medicine). Undergraduate education at Harvard is superior to a lot of other programs, but in medicine, Harvard is not (neccessarily) known for producing the best physicians and scientists. Look at the rankings by residency directors (and check the number of recent nobel prize winners. Harvard has a lot of noble prize winners from other schools. They didn't neccesarily get the noble prize at Harvard. A lot of these prizes are decades old. A few schools have higher number of "recent" winners. This to me is a better measure of current success. OF course, this is just an example, as Nobel prize is not really a good judge of educational quality) and tell me what you think. In terms of funding, I think some of you guys are getting confused. Harvard is a huge institution with a lot of other smaller institutions attached. Its, so to speak, large funding becomes relatively small when divided between these institutions. There are other much smaller schools in the U.S getting tons of money given their relatively smaller size. Also, you might want to check the size of Harvard's Faculty. Good luck.

 

[gary5]

I'd take Stanford or Yale with full tuition over Harvard at full price. Not sure about the rest.

 

[Mateodaspy]

If you call it financial aid, that is fine. What ever the source of money, this particular applicant was getting a full tutition paid for by Harvard and Hopkins. We wanted her to come UVA very much and she expressed a lot of interest in our school, but she was not going to come to UVA over Harvard if our school did not offer her the same as Harvard. So we had to come up with a way to finance this applicant's education, and we did, via the alumni funds. She decided to come. I know this because I was part of the admission's committee at UVA when I was a 4th year student. Believe it or not, but med schools go to length to get you to come, if you were a "superstar", someone that just stands out besides a high MCAT and high GPA. I seen plenty of people with over 35 MCAT and over 3.9 GPA during the interview season. But this particular applicant "really" stood out to us, and I guess to Harvard and Hopkins as well. You can check out the latest UVA medical school alumni magazine, because it mentions her...... then it asked me to donate money to the school

HMS offers no merit-based scholarships.... and, in terms of financial aid, the best offer HMS will give is a base 25k unit loan and ~30k in scholarship.

 

[gujuDoc]

There was a first year student in UVA that was offered a full scholarship to both Harvard and John Hopkins, she turned down both schools to come to UVA because she had a better "feel" for our school. Essentially, our admissions committee had to scamble up 4 years of full tutition from the alumni fund to match the previous 2 offers to get her to come to UVA. Harvard has a great name and when you apply to residency, the doors will be wide open for you. However, if you are a superb applicant, you will get multiple accepetances, in the end, you should choose a school that will be the best "fit" for you, in terms of the type of people, location, how the classes are structured, etc, etc. The worst thing is going to a place for the name and end up hating your life for the next 4 years. This has definitely happened to people before. If you do well in school, you will match to a great residency whether you come from a top 20 medical school or Harvard. One of my best friends who was applying to Orthopedics last year, could have gone to Wash Univ for Orthopedics residency (which has a huge name in the Ortho world), but decided to rank another program of lesser name higher (and matched there) because he did not feel a "fit" with the people at Wash U. His reasoning was that, 5 yrs of working at a place that I will hate or not enjoy is NOT worth the name.

At the same time, it is hard to get a feel for the medical program just by a single day of interview. I guess you will have to go with a "gut" feeling. I decided to go to UVA over U of Michigan and another top 10 medical school, but looking back, I am 100% happy with my decision. In the end, you will get a great education no matter where you go to medical school. A lot of the learning in medical school and after, is self directed.

I just wanted to say this is another great post by you. Thanks for taking the time to write this.

Essentially, this is what it comes down to. For instance, in Florida, the only school to be on the top 50 list is UF. On the other hand, USF or Miami are not on the top 50 list, although Miami used to be on it.

Yet, I know people who have chosen their programs over UF because of differences in curricula, people, atmosphere, etc. Differences in clinical diversity also was a big determining factor, along with location.

I think you have to look beyond the rankings and truly look at what it is you want to do within medicine and what program would be the best for you in terms of achieving those goals, while also fitting with your personality.

Just this past year, a friend of mine turned down an offer to go to Columbia School of Physicians and Surgeons, which is a top 10 school, because she preferred to stay close to home where she would have family nearby and a much cheaper tuition rate by staying in state.

Likewise, I had another friend who also chose to not apply to out of state top ten schools despite great MCAT scores, great GPA from Northwestern and summer classes at Harvard, who had done several different ECs that would have been top 10 school worthy kinda stuff, like research which got published and presented in Japan......however, this said person also chose to stay in state to be closer to family and have cheaper tuition alongside other reasons.

I think going to a school that fits your personality and goals is more important then going to a school solely because of its name. Where ever you go, you will come out an MD. How you do depends on the work you put in and your own strengths and weaknesses.

 

[LizzyM]

Really? I thought physicians were well compensated in academics. How much lower are the salaries for academic physicians as compared to those in private practice?

It varies by specialty. Full time facutly are on salary (but their malpractice insurance is covered). In some instances, a portion of the salary is tied to the federal wage system (if part of your salary support comes from a VA Medical Center) or may be capped due to salary support from federal grants (NIH, etc). On the other hand, private practice doc have no ceiling on wages although they hustle far more than in years past due to the declining level of reimbursement by third party payers. And they pay rent, office staff salaries, malpractice insurance, etc out of their gross.

Some physicians have it both ways by being private practice physicians within a medical school affiliated hospital. This does require some "teaching", usually at the bedside (or during procedures). Typically, these physicians are not compensated by the medical school but teach in exchange for the right to admit patients to the academic medical center.

 

[ChocolateKiss]

I'd take Stanford or Yale with full tuition over Harvard at full price. Not sure about the rest.

Hey- Those are my top 3 choices too! We must have similar school tastes...

 

[LadyJubilee8_18]

If you want to go into academic medicine, choose the free ride -- academics doesn't pay very well.

I made the Ivy League choice over a free ride at a State school and it took decades to pay off the loans. It was a great education and the "old boy" network is great but if I were faced with the decision again, and knowing what I know now, I don't know which I would choose ....

Yeah, I got in at Baylor and I found out last night that I have an interview at Harvard. Not only is Baylor much cheaper than Harvard to begin with, I have reason to believe I could get significant financial aid from Baylor. I also have lots of friends there, I already know the administration, it's closer to family, and the weather is better. I am still going to interview at Harvard, but I doubt I'll end up there since I don't have a million, bajillion, fafillion dollars. Besides, can black women be too involved with the "old boys" club?

My boyfriend applied to Harvard grad school and he said he knows he can't go. The financial aid packet asked questions like, "How much money do you have in Stocks? Trust funds? CDs?" He wanted to respond, "Well I don't know about stocks or trust funds, but I have some old CDs I can sell on eBay. Not much but I bet I could pull down about $300." Harvard is obviously for really rich people.

 

[DeadorAlive]

My boyfriend applied to Harvard grad school and he said he knows he can't go. The financial aid packet asked questions like, "How much money do you have in Stocks? Trust funds? CDs?" He wanted to respond, "Well I don't know about stocks or trust funds, but I have some old CDs I can sell on eBay. Not much but I bet I could pull down about $300." Harvard is obviously for really rich people.

I just couldn't let this go by (and I know you're mostly kidding) but please WAIT until you get a financial aid offer to decide things like this! The widespread impression that private/ivy universities are only for the rich makes me nuts. They are, indeed, quite expensive. They also have a ton more financial aid, and often great policies about grant rather than loan. I know of many folks firsthand who got enormous help from ivy league institutions, to the tune of coming out better off financially than had they attended their state institutions!

It does sound like the fin.aid form at Harvard might be off-putting, but they're just trying to cover all of their bases. Think of it this way: asking folks to be truthful about other accounts actually ensures that those who really need the funds, not those whose families have established trusts to lessen their tax base, get them. Your boyfriend should be happy that this question was asked!

That said, however, Harvard in particular has a bad reputation for MEDICAL school financial aid. It does not compare to their undergraduate efforts and I've heard of students with reduced offers in their second and subsequent years. Still the message remains with medical school finances and deciding where to go: WAIT until you have YOUR financial aid package in hand! Also, if you still need help, TALK to the financial aid officers at that school and see if something can't be worked out for you.

 

[politik]

I just couldn't let this go by (and I know you're mostly kidding) but please WAIT until you get a financial aid offer to decide things like this! The widespread impression that private/ivy universities are only for the rich makes me nuts. They are, indeed, quite expensive. They also have a ton more financial aid, and often great policies about grant rather than loan. I know of many folks firsthand who got enormous help from ivy league institutions, to the tune of coming out better off financially than had they attended their state institutions!

Deador, I will back you up on this one. My parents are very very far from rich (recent immigrants who are each 70 years old) and I currently attend ivy undergrad. My fin. aid package reflects my pooresness (is that a word? if not then it's a new one). I strongly believe that in US expensive education can be afforded by rich people who can pay or poor people like me who get financial aid. But it doesn't matter whether it's Ivy or not--same fafsa. I also think that top schools have more funding in general and can offer more money than state schools.

On a side note, I would chose Yale, Columbia, or Stanford with 50% off tuition over Harvard in a heartbeat.

 

[LadyJubilee8_18]

Deador, I will back you up on this one. My parents are very very far from rich (recent immigrants who are each 70 years old) and I currently attend ivy undergrad. My fin. aid package reflects my pooresness (is that a word? if not then it's a new one). I strongly believe that in US expensive education can be afforded by rich people who can pay or poor people like me who get financial aid. But it doesn't matter whether it's Ivy or not--same fafsa. I also think that top schools have more funding in general and can offer more money than state schools.

On a side note, I would chose Yale, Columbia, or Stanford with 50% off tuition over Harvard in a heartbeat.

Right but that's for undergrad. Ivy schools aren't as generous with their professional programs. Most of the top schools are notorious for giving very little fin. aid. From what I hear, it is very hard to get much money from Harvard med.

 

[Jon Davis]

I'm gonna take a small detour from this thread, if you all don't mind.

I don't understand all this worry about debt after medical school. This debt out of the many kinds of debt is considered GOOD! Don't forget, you can claim this on your tax returns (as far as I know). Don't blow this worry into a huge thing. Use this debt to your advantage, it will help you out more than hurt you. By the way, the top 1% of Americans are defined as those making $300,000 a year. Most physicians can make $125,000 which puts you at about the top 5%. You all will easily make more than $1 million in your lifetime, remember that.

 

[moomoo1]

Deador, I will back you up on this one. My parents are very very far from rich (recent immigrants who are each 70 years old) and I currently attend ivy undergrad. My fin. aid package reflects my pooresness (is that a word? if not then it's a new one). I strongly believe that in US expensive education can be afforded by rich people who can pay or poor people like me who get financial aid. But it doesn't matter whether it's Ivy or not--same fafsa. I also think that top schools have more funding in general and can offer more money than state schools.

On a side note, I would chose Yale, Columbia, or Stanford with 50% off tuition over Harvard in a heartbeat.

What are the features of those schools that would make you choose them over Harvard?

 

[LizzyM]

I'm gonna take a small detour from this thread, if you all don't mind.
This debt out of the many kinds of debt is considered GOOD! Don't forget, you can claim this on your tax returns (as far as I know).

No, you can't claim educational debt on your taxes (law changes ages ago). Only morgage interest can be written off now. Believe me, I was one of the people who borrowed under the old tax laws & paid pack under the new tax laws.

 

[Law2Doc]

I'm gonna take a small detour from this thread, if you all don't mind.

I don't understand all this worry about debt after medical school. This debt out of the many kinds of debt is considered GOOD! Don't forget, you can claim this on your tax returns (as far as I know). Don't blow this worry into a huge thing. Use this debt to your advantage, it will help you out more than hurt you. By the way, the top 1% of Americans are defined as those making $300,000 a year. Most physicians can make $125,000 which puts you at about the top 5%. You all will easily make more than $1 million in your lifetime, remember that.

Unless they changed the rules, you can get a relatively small tax deduction on interest paid on certain student loan debt, but only if your salary is very low. I wouldn't make tax savings much of a factor in considering this. There are worse investments you can make than investing student debt in yourself. However one thing you shouldn't do is count on any specific salary as a given -- there are too many variables. Also a million over the course of a lifetime is only a good amount if you live a very short time.

 

[SailCrazy]

...On a side note, I would chose Yale, Columbia, or Stanford with 50% off tuition over Harvard in a heartbeat.

What are the features of those schools that would make you choose them over Harvard?

I think the point that many are making here is that Harvard is great, but not so great that you'd drop everything else to go there. It seems that for many/most applicants a significant difference in cost between Harvard and any other "top" school would be enough to sway the choice one way or another.

 

[gujuDoc]

What are the features of those schools that would make you choose them over Harvard?

I don't know about Columbia, but a friend of mine said they'd choose Yale over HMS because all 4 years are Pass/Fail rather then A-F grades. This makes the environment more friendly rather then gunnerism galore existing. The curricula is set up a little different too.

Also, the atmosphere of Boston vs. New Haven is quite different in some respects, even though both are in the Northeast.

I'd say the biggest difference though is the difference in grading scheme and curricula. Personally, if I was of the uber brilliant class that had that choice, I'd probably choose Yale as well. I'm not so sure, I'd choose Columbia over HMS, though, cuz HMS is a little bit more modern in its curricula then Columbia from my understanding.

Nonetheless, unless you are hard core into research and academic medicine, or want to go into this uber uber uber competitive residency, I don't think name matters that much as long as you are at a US MD school.

Which brings me to a point someone else said....

Someone made the comment that if you want the cheapest school, why not go to Carribbean. That comment is a bit misleading.

It doesn't matter where you go WITHIN THE UNITED STATES. Because the percentages of those matching is high at all schools. It is however more difficult coming from the Carribean back to the U.S.

Those are two different beasts and not even a fair basis of comparison. Plus island schools tend to weed out students from their programs, which is why they are able to have so many students whereas US schools do everything to see to it that you get through the program.

I'd say where you go depends more on your career goals and best fit for you. You can't look at cost alone, but you can't look at location alone or rankings alone. You have to look at all points equally before making such a big decision as this one.