Harvard vs. VCU

[Baseball12]

I was accepted to Harvard and VCU and was wondering what people's thoughts were. VCU is a great school with very good clinical and is my state school, so it's cheaper.

On the other hand, Harvard is a pretty crazy opportunity and I'm sure I could make up for any lack of clinical skills with a good GPR.

What do people think?

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[sparky450r]

Wow. Now this is a hard decision. Even with the added cost, it would be hard for me to give up a seat at Harvard...not sure how long you will be saying that once loan repayment begins though.

I would say....go to Harvard.

 

[MBlue16]

It's going to be your identity in the future. Go Harvard! 🙂

 

[ushaseos]

The whole clinical skills thing is not as big of a deal imo. Harvard is a good school and their training will be sufficient.

Honestly I'd say VCU if you know 100% that you won't specialize as the lower cost and better clinical skills will suit your needs. If you know you're going to specialize, go to Harvard. This is a really simple decision imo...congrats on getting into both the schools!

 

[jmukid]

1. Congratulations on both acceptances.
2. I hate you (joking)
3. Go to Harvard. It's not everyday you get the opportunity to go to such a prestigious school such as Harvard.

 

[UCSFx2017]

If you want to become a GP, go to VCU. If you have any other plans, go to Harvard. Like you said, VCU is a great clinical school with a homely atmosphere. You'll also save a fortune by going to VCU. You're obviously very smart so I don't think you'll need a piece of paper as an external validation of your intelligence.

A cheaper alternative to attending a certain school for prestige alone is devaluing the importance of prestige and making up your own value system. This is dentistry. You don't need an Ivy league name to throw around. We're ultimately going to be self-employed.

 

[MBlue16]

That's true..., but IMHO, higher prestige= better alumni association= better future.

Also, I don't know how big of a difference the tuition is, but what is extra 100k compared to 400k that you have to pay anyway? just saying.. 🙂

 

[UCSFx2017]

That's true..., but IMHO, higher prestige= better alumni association= better future.

Also, I don't know how big of a difference the tuition is, but what is extra 100k compared to 400k that you have to pay anyway? just saying.. 🙂

Okay...What is one million dollars compared to a hundred million dollars? It's only 1% but it's still $1,000,000.00! That comparison might have worked if we were talking about gas prices at two different gas stations that differ by five cents but we're not talking about a few dollars saved.
Go ahead and convert $100,000 to units of days worked. Convert those days or years worked to a percentage of your lifetime paying off accrued interest to lending companies. Think of that time worked as time uninvested and evaporated.

 

[NDPitch]

Okay...What is one million dollars compared to a hundred million dollars? It's only 1% but it's still $1,000,000.00! That comparison might have worked if we were talking about gas prices at two different gas stations that differ by five cents but we're not talking about a few dollars saved.
Go ahead and convert $100,000 to units of days worked. Convert those days or years worked to a percentage of your lifetime paying off accrued interest to lending companies. Think of that time worked as time uninvested and evaporated.

👍

 

[jmukid]

Okay...What is one million dollars compared to a hundred million dollars? It's only 1% but it's still $1,000,000.00! That comparison might have worked if we were talking about gas prices at two different gas stations that differ by five cents but we're not talking about a few dollars saved.
Go ahead and convert $100,000 to units of days worked. Convert those days or years worked to a percentage of your lifetime paying off accrued interest to lending companies. Think of that time worked as time uninvested and evaporated.

Personally i agree that an extra 100K is a lot of money but as others have pointed out if the OP is interested in specializing than Harvard is the better choice. I know quite a few people that had planned on doing general dentistry but once they started dental school they changed their mind and wanted to specialize.

 

[Baseball12]

Well I'm thinking GP right now but I'm not sure the route I want to take to get there. The money definitely is a huge factor, but I guess I'm also wondering what people think of the two schools if they were (theoretically) the same price.

 

[UCSFx2017]

Here I did the math.
$100,000 x Units of Hours / (average hourly wage of $77.76) = 1,286 hours.

http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes291021.htm

 

[UCSFx2017]

Well I'm thinking GP right now but I'm not sure the route I want to take to get there. The money definitely is a huge factor, but I guess I'm also wondering what people think of the two schools if they were (theoretically) the same price.

If you have the slightest interest of specializing or research/academics, go to Harvard.

 

[jmukid]

Well I'm thinking GP right now but I'm not sure the route I want to take to get there. The money definitely is a huge factor, but I guess I'm also wondering what people think of the two schools if they were (theoretically) the same price.

If they were theoretically the same price then Harvard for sure.

 

[MBlue16]

LoL.. I know it's a lot of money... we can get a small house with that kind of money!! 1,286 hours of work is about 6 months of working time (8 working hours per day). We can expect to work for 35 years before we retire. So, if you think about it... it's not that bad. (idk.. maybe it's just me)

But, again.. if I were OP, I would go to Harvard, no matter how much it'll cost, specially with that chance of getting interested in specializing 🙂.You only go to dental school once in your lifetime; might as well make it big!

Whatever the decision will be, good luck OP! ^__^

 

[NDPitch]

LoL.. I know it's a lot of money... we can get a small house with that kind of money!! 1,286 hours of work is about 6 months of working time (8 working hours per day). We can expect to work for 35 years before we retire. So, if you think about it... it's not that bad. (idk.. maybe it's just me)

No no no no!

Haha. First of all, taxes weren't taken into account. It's 1,286 hours of average salary pre-tax. Then, it assumes that 100% of that earning is going towards the 100k you borrowed at 0% interest. The payments on that balance, which would probably be over 300k, are mostly interest, and the principle will decrease pretty slowly. So thinking of an extra 100k on a loan as only 6 months worth of extra work, is very very far from the truth.

I'm not saying don't go to Harvard - I just want everyone to understand these loans more.

 

[MBlue16]

No no no no!

Haha. First of all, taxes weren't taken into account. It's 1,286 hours of average salary pre-tax. Then, it assumes that 100% of that earning is going towards the 100k you borrowed at 0% interest. The payments on that balance, which would probably be over 300k, are mostly interest, and the principle will decrease pretty slowly. So thinking of an extra 100k on a loan as only 6 months worth of extra work, is very very far from the truth.

I'm not saying don't go to Harvard - I just want everyone to understand these loans more.

Thanks for the explanation. I appreciate it.

I was just thinking about it roughly... don't wanna get too technical. What I'm trying to say is that, at least to me, if you're going to spend a lot of your money, might as well get the best that you can get. That's it.

 

[ushaseos]

If you have the slightest interest of specializing or research/academics, go to Harvard.

+1

Like I said, and UCSFX2017 did above, if you want to specialize Harvard is the best place to go. They have the reputation and the connections to get you placed wherever you want. I got rejected from Harvard so I have no reason to praise them needlessly and plenty of reasons to resent HSDM, but I'll readily admit this fact because it is true. After learning a thing or two about matching in medicine, I know just how important it is to know the right people and go to the most reputed institution to progress further along the chain.

If you know you're absolutely not interested in specialization or academic positions, VCU is your best choice. The amount of money you'll save and arguably better clinical training will better satisfy the needs of your career choice.

EDIT - MBlue is right in the spend a little more to get the best argument, but know that spending a little more entails more than you may expect. It may prove to have value beyond what you pay but take everything into consideration.

 

[UltimateHombre]

Please, please, please read this thread before you make a decision...

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=970137

My vote is VCU

 

[missdiana]

I go to VCU undergrad.
I live in Richmond and I am working at VCU school of Dentistry

VCU school of dentistry is nice. friendly and professors are really nice (I am getting treatment from there as well by 4th year student)

I volunteered at howard as well, and compare to Howard, VCU has nice facility and there are A LOT of patients. I see patients from 2 hours away from the school because VCU is the only dental school in Va and it is cheaper than regular private dentistry.
The waiting room is always packed. Also finance is really well done. Patients can't pay, then VCU finds way to cut off some stuff (such as x-ray things) and gives them good price.)

My 4th year dental student never have problem with getting a chair..the only problem would be that his schedule doesn't fit mine well -_- but I dont think he has any getting-chair problem.
He just schedule and assign my chair for the next appointment right away.

I heard requirements are doable and everyone seems happy.

the only problem with VCU would be safety.

I live in richmond...and I get text message at night about robbery and gun shots from VCU police and you will hear several fire trucks and cops passing down your street (not kidding)
Also, you will find few radical people against VCU school of dentistry and medical school...
There was a man who had a gun and stand outside of VCU school of dentistry one morning (actually while I was working there)...and blocking people from getting into school.
the man was arrested in 5 minutes but everyone in the building got text message saying no patients can leave the building for now and all.

The city is not safe..
VCU website write richmond as really nice place with historical beauty and all..
NO. it is not...there are only handful of place you can go without getting shot or stab (which is pretty much around VCU campus..because there are cops EVERYWHERE)
People will say "are you mad? you wanna die" if you say you want to go outside after 9pm.

oh..if you have a car, you better find a apartment with secure parking lot.
a lot of car thieves...(I actually saw a man breaking into a car at 4am outside of my dorm)

so...it is not safe...
Boston is bigger and not safe as well..BUT!

I would go to Havard because I would rather be dangerous in Boston than Richmond..-_-


but VCU is nice school.

 

[aznboi89x]

i like how the guy above says how VCU is not safe then says its good school. LOL

 

[UCSFx2017]

I go to VCU undergrad.
I live in Richmond and I am working at VCU school of Dentistry

VCU school of dentistry is nice. friendly and professors are really nice (I am getting treatment from there as well by 4th year student)

I volunteered at howard as well, and compare to Howard, VCU has nice facility and there are A LOT of patients. I see patients from 2 hours away from the school because VCU is the only dental school in Va and it is cheaper than regular private dentistry.
The waiting room is always packed. Also finance is really well done. Patients can't pay, then VCU finds way to cut off some stuff (such as x-ray things) and gives them good price.)

My 4th year dental student never have problem with getting a chair..the only problem would be that his schedule doesn't fit mine well -_- but I dont think he has any getting-chair problem.
He just schedule and assign my chair for the next appointment right away.

I heard requirements are doable and everyone seems happy.

the only problem with VCU would be safety.

I live in richmond...and I get text message at night about robbery and gun shots from VCU police and you will hear several fire trucks and cops passing down your street (not kidding)
Also, you will find few radical people against VCU school of dentistry and medical school...
There was a man who had a gun and stand outside of VCU school of dentistry one morning (actually while I was working there)...and blocking people from getting into school.
the man was arrested in 5 minutes but everyone in the building got text message saying no patients can leave the building for now and all.

The city is not safe..
VCU website write richmond as really nice place with historical beauty and all..
NO. it is not...there are only handful of place you can go without getting shot or stab (which is pretty much around VCU campus..because there are cops EVERYWHERE)
People will say "are you mad? you wanna die" if you say you want to go outside after 9pm.

oh..if you have a car, you better find a apartment with secure parking lot.
a lot of car thieves...(I actually saw a man breaking into a car at 4am outside of my dorm)

so...it is not safe...
Boston is bigger and not safe as well..BUT!

I would go to Havard because I would rather be dangerous in Boston than Richmond..-_-


but VCU is nice school.

You make it sound like a bullet-proof vest needs to be added into the student's cost-of-attendance.

 

[missdiana]

You make it sound like a buller prof vest needs to be added into the student's cost-of-attendance.

Lol well I dont go outside after it is dark..my friends stays at library if it is after 2am.
There are a lot of crimes going on. Since VCU is right in the heart of the city (and the only school in the center of the city) a lot of crimes happen to VCU students (well...most college students have smart phones and laptops-good sourse of quick cash)

I picked VCU for my undergrad. because of cheap tuition and good pre-dent program.
Now I hate living here although I do enjoy the school.
It is not fun living in a city and you fear of crime and danger all the time.
It is not new york or boston or even Washington DC(I am from 1h away from DC)where places are amazing enough to risk your life to go outside at night with your friend.


But vcu has good program..and cheap..
But if I were you, I would go to Harvard...because I would be happier

 

[nikkisorous]

Lol well I dont go outside after it is dark..my friends stays at library if it is after 2am.
There are a lot of crimes going on. Since VCU is right in the heart of the city (and the only school in the center of the city) a lot of crimes happen to VCU students (well...most college students have smart phones and laptops-good sourse of quick cash)

I picked VCU for my undergrad. because of cheap tuition and good pre-dent program.
Now I hate living here although I do enjoy the school.
It is not fun living in a city and you fear of crime and danger all the time.
It is not new york or boston or even Washington DC(I am from 1h away from DC)where places are amazing enough to risk your life to go outside at night with your friend.


But vcu has good program..and cheap..
But if I were you, I would go to Harvard...because I would be happier

I also go to VCU.

In regards to safety it's important to note that the MCV campus is much safer than the Monroe park campus. Over 85% of the reported crimes occur on the Monroe park campus.

Now in terms of which school to pick, if you plan to stay in Virginia (even specializing) i would choose vcu, doctor Perkinson has contributed much to the school and has given it a wonderful name. However, if you ever plan to leave Virginia, I would definitely choose Harvard.

 

[CMistry]

If you want to become a GP, go to VCU. If you have any other plans, go to Harvard. Like you said, VCU is a great clinical school with a homely atmosphere. You'll also save a fortune by going to VCU. You're obviously very smart so I don't think you'll need a piece of paper as an external validation of your intelligence.

A cheaper alternative to attending a certain school for prestige alone is devaluing the importance of prestige and making up your own value system. This is dentistry. You don't need an Ivy league name to throw around. We're ultimately going to be self-employed.

He got it right.

 

[dantemac]

In this case I'd say go to Harvard. It'll open doors being in Boston/in the Ivy league that maybe you wouldn't have in Richmond, VA.

 

[resplendence]

I was in the same predicament and honestly I don't think asking bunch of anonymous online pre-dents are the best way to decide this life-changing decision

In any case, I chose my state school over HSDM. After talking to dentists, not ONE of them said going to Harvard would benefit me. Not financially, not clinically, not even reputation-wise. I'm not sure if they said this to you, but they even told me at Harvard, if we're good enough to get in we are obviously competitive/hardworking enough to succeed at any dental school so specializing later on shouldn't be a problem.

In short, I think if you're in love with the ivy name and have extra $$$ hanging around go to HSDM 😛

 

[wcombs]

The snob in me says Harvard but the broke college student in me says VCU. If I told my mom I was choosing Harvard over a cheaper school she would probably tell me to go **** myself and cut me off entirely.

Which is why I would tell her Harvard was my only acceptance and enjoy a lifetime of ego stroking and horrifying debt!

 

[vlaura0214]

The snob in me says Harvard but the broke college student in me says VCU. If I told my mom I was choosing Harvard over a cheaper school she would probably tell me to go **** myself and cut me off entirely.

Which is why I would tell her Harvard was my only acceptance and enjoy a lifetime of ego stroking and horrifying debt!

That last part gave me a good laugh haha!

I would say seriously consider your career goals. If you are going to specialize and aren't worried about money, pick Harvard, but if you're going to be a GP and want to own a practice asap, then it would be a very difficult endeavor with Harvard's loan debts burdening you. I'm sure even if you specialized, that amount of debt is still ridiculous, and it would still take you a lot of time to pay it off and to get a practice. But it just depends on how soon you want these events to occur. Some people want to own a practice asap, others are okay with taking their time.

If it were me, I'd choose the cheaper school though. If you really wanted to specialize, you could from any dental school if you worked at it. Congrats on your acceptances and good luck!

 

[predent12]

Well if you got into Harvard, I'm going to go ahead and say that you'll most likely get into your specialty program no matter where you go for dental school. (If you want to specialize.)

BUT... (and that's a pretty big "but,") if you don't... Let's say you have to go into general dentistry instead and make $150K a year, but actually wanted to specialize in Ortho but didn't get in, and you would've been making $250K a year... well. There's your $100K back, plus many many years to come.

Just something to consider !

 

[DoWork91]

OP, congrats on getting into harvard! what were your stats if you don't mind me asking?