Help locating a supervising physician (psychiatrist) in Minneapolis/St. Paul

[Mjane29]

I am a masters (MA counseling psychology) and dual bachelors (BS nursing, BA psychology) degree holder. I am also a registered nurse (RN) currently enrolled in the final semester of the MS psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner (PMHNP) program at Virginia Commonwealth University (VCU). I am on track to graduate in May and am planning on moving back to the Twin Cities metro to practice.
I am looking for some advice regarding locating a supervising physician. Unfortunately, many of the places where I have interviewed have made offers that are contingent on my ability to find a supervising physician. This is proving to be a challenging endeavor, as I have been living in Virginia for the past four years and all of my physician contacts are here in Richmond. I am reaching out in hopes that someone out there can point me in the direction of a physician(s) that I could approach that might be willing to take me on. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

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[Ironspy]

I am a masters (MA counseling psychology) and dual bachelors degree holder (BS nursing, BA psychology) currently enrolled in the final semester of the MS Psychiatric Mental Health Nurse Practitioner (PMHNP) program at Virginia Commonwealth University (VCU). I am on track to graduate in May and am planning on moving back to the Twin Cities metro to practice.
I am looking for some advice regarding locating a collaborating physician. Unfortunately, many of the places where I have interviewed have made offers that are contingent on my ability to find a collaborating physician. This is proving to be a challenging endeavor, as I have been living in Virginia for the past four years and all of my physician contacts are here in Richmond. I am reaching out in hopes that someone out there can point me in the direction of a physician(s) that I could approach that might be willing to take me on. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

I'm not in MN but changing your wording from collaborating physician to supervising physician might help.

 

[Merely]

I am a masters (MA counseling psychology) and dual bachelors degree holder (BS nursing, BA psychology) currently enrolled in the final semester of the MS Psychiatric Mental Health Nurse Practitioner (PMHNP) program at Virginia Commonwealth University (VCU). I am on track to graduate in May and am planning on moving back to the Twin Cities metro to practice.
I am looking for some advice regarding locating a collaborating physician. Unfortunately, many of the places where I have interviewed have made offers that are contingent on my ability to find a collaborating physician. This is proving to be a challenging endeavor, as I have been living in Virginia for the past four years and all of my physician contacts are here in Richmond. I am reaching out in hopes that someone out there can point me in the direction of a physician(s) that I could approach that might be willing to take me on. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

There’s as much collaboration between you and a doc as there is between a teacher and student

 

[FlowRate]

The worst thing NP schools did was to stop requiring prior nursing degree/experience. Anyone who's worked with new grad nurses knows how much they learn after spending a few years on a med/surg floor, which would at least give them a respect for medical issues and knowledge gaps. It's legitimately terrifying to think of people with no prior physical healthcare experience prescribing psychiatric medications with absolutely no reference/experience for their patients' non-psychiatric medications and diagnoses.

But, alas $$

 

[birchswing]

Am I to understand that psych NPs need to be under the supervision of a doctor in some states?

I'm in the OP's state, and we have psych NPs with their own practices. They're in enough demand that they set up shop and don't even take insurance. They don't seem to work under doctors from what I can tell. And they seem to make a good business of it. As far as I know here, only PAs need a physician and they don't even need to be geographically nearby (or perhaps they're not practicing up to code—I'm basing this on an urgent care that often only has PAs and says it's OK because they can call a doctor if they need to).

 

[Mjane29]

Am I to understand that psych NPs need to be under the supervision of a doctor in some states?

I'm in the OP's state, and we have psych NPs with their own practices. They're in enough demand that they set up shop and don't even take insurance. They don't seem to work under doctors from what I can tell. And they seem to make a good business of it. As far as I know here, only PAs need a physician and they don't even need to be geographically nearby (or perhaps they're not practicing up to code—I'm basing this on an urgent care that often only has PAs and says it's OK because they can call a doctor if they need to).

Hey birchswing,

I am not sure about the legal requirements pertaining to PA practice in Minnesota, but NPs are required to work for 2,080 hours under a physician and must have a verbal collaborative agreement. I am surprised that there are psych NPs who have opened their own practices and do not accept insurance. It seems to me that this would severely limit the client base. Personally, I am interested in joining a small outpatient group practice made up of psychiatrists, psychiatric NPs/PAs, psychologists, and masters level counselors.

 

[Mjane29]

I'm not in MN but changing your wording from collaborating physician to supervising physician might help.

Thank you, point taken.

 

[Mad Jack]

No clue how you're going to find it outside of working for something like a community mental health center that is hard up for staff, as most physicians aren't willing to risk the liability of overseeing a new NP out of the goodness of their hearts. It's very risky and the amount of oversight they can provide is often very limited which essentially provides you with free reign. Looking for less-than-ideal places to work for a year that would guarantee oversight is probably your best bet if all of the better jobs refuse to provide you with a collaborator.

 

[Mjane29]

The worst thing NP schools did was to stop requiring prior nursing degree/experience. Anyone who's worked with new grad nurses knows how much they learn after spending a few years on a med/surg floor, which would at least give them a respect for medical issues and knowledge gaps. It's legitimately terrifying to think of people with no prior physical healthcare experience prescribing psychiatric medications with absolutely no reference/experience for their patients' non-psychiatric medications and diagnoses.

But, alas $$

I am going to go ahead and assume that this comment is not directed at me since it is not applicable. For the record, I agree. However, just because a school does not require inpatient med/surg experience does not mean that every student in the program lacks it. Maybe I’m just abnormal.

 

[FlowRate]

I am going to go ahead and assume that this comment is not directed at me since it is not applicable. For the record, I agree. However, just because a school does not require inpatient med/surg experience does not mean that every student in the program lacks it. Maybe I’m just abnormal.

I'll admit that in this case I somehow managed to miss the multiple times you mentioned that you are a BSN/RN. I think my point stands generally but you're obviously right that it doesn't apply here. My bad.

 

[Stagg737]

Hey birchswing,

I am not sure about the legal requirements pertaining to PA practice in Minnesota, but NPs are required to work for 2,080 hours under a physician and must have a verbal collaborative agreement. I am surprised that there are psych NPs who have opened their own practices and do not accept insurance. It seems to me that this would severely limit the client base. Personally, I am interested in joining a small outpatient group practice made up of psychiatrists, psychiatric NPs/PAs, psychologists, and masters level counselors.

What is your goal for what you'd be doing? Do you want to do mostly med management? Mostly therapy with med management sprinkled in? A little of everything? Do you want to try and see new patients or are you fine with the simple follow up cases? I think that's important to know when looking for these jobs as some physicians may be alright with giving you some responsibilities and not others.

 

[Mjane29]

What is your goal for what you'd be doing? Do you want to do mostly med management? Mostly therapy with med management sprinkled in? A little of everything? Do you want to try and see new patients or are you fine with the simple follow up cases? I think that's important to know when looking for these jobs as some physicians may be alright with giving you some responsibilities and not others.

Hey Stagg737,
You make a great point. While I want to provide medication management services, ideally, I would like to be able to schedule 4-5 combination medication management and psychotherapy appointments throughout the day as well. I also really enjoy conducting initial diagnostic interviews, so I would certainly miss that aspect if only allowed simple follow-up cases. All important things to consider. Thank you.

 

[Mjane29]

I'll admit that in this case I somehow managed to miss the multiple times you mentioned that you are a BSN/RN. I think my point stands generally but you're obviously right that it doesn't apply here. My bad.

I appreciate that FlowRate. Rest assured, your general argument is well-founded.

 

[Splenda88]

I'm not in MN but changing your wording from collaborating physician to supervising physician might help.

It's not her fault that she is using the word "collaboration" instead of "supervision." It's taught in NP school that NP are equal to docs.