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[68PGunner]

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I was originally planning to apply for the 2015-2016 cycle. However, I'm going to give the 2014-2015 cycle a shot.

Here're some info about me:

1) Graduated from an Ivy w/ a cpga of around 3.25 (2008)
2) Worked as an English teacher in Japan for 2.5 years (2009-2012)
3) Enlisted in the US Army after coming back from Japan (2012)
4) Was trained as an x-ray tech at Ft Sam and Ft Benning (2013). I worked at Martin Army Community Hospital as an x-ray tech for about 7 months. I was cross trained into CT and portable x-ray for the OR there.
5) Am being cross-trained as a dental tech for the brigade dentist at JBLM right now (2014). The dentist and I do a lot of procedures including oral surgeries, basic restoratives for cavities, root canals, and crowning. In the next 4-5 months, I'll be shadowing the brigade surgeon, who's a family practice doc from USUHS, for his LOR.

My LORs will be: 3 from my science teachers, 1 from my dentist, and 1 from the family practice doc from USUHS.

For the past 5 months, I have been finishing up my pre-med prerequisites.
For AMCAS (MDs):
Projected cgpa: ~3.3
Projected sgpa: ~3.5-3.6

For AACOMAS (DOs):
Projected cgpa: ~3.3
Projected sgpa: ~3.7-3.8

I'm married and a father of two boys. I'm a resident of Illinois, despite living and working in Washington State.

I'm planning to take the MCAT on OCT of 2014 once I'm done with my Organic Chem I class in 4 weeks.

So, what are the MD and DO schools that I should be looking at given the projected four categories for my MCAT scores?

1) MCAT score: 28-29
2) MCAT score: 30-33
3) MCAT score: 34-36
4) MCAT score: above 36

I would appreciate if you could give me some reaches, targets, and safeties. Thank you.

 

[Zelda840]

Not trying to rain on your parade or anything, but you will be VERY late in the cycle once you get your mcat scores back in November. 🙁

 

[68PGunner]

Not trying to rain on your parade or anything, but you will be VERY late in the cycle once you get your mcat scores back in November. 🙁

Yes, I realize this. But, I'm not interested in looking at what I can't do but rather what I can do given my bio and timelines.

 

[DrMidlife]

What you CAN do is get a great MCAT score and apply in 2015. Don't waste your time and money, and your family's emotions, on a wasted app cycle.

 

[68PGunner]

What you CAN do is get a great MCAT score and apply in 2015. Don't waste your time and money, and your family's emotions, on a wasted app cycle.

I appreciate the concern. But, there are plenty of applicants getting their applications reviewed in Dec and interviewing in Jan. I'm hoping to be in this category. Given this premise, what are the schools that I should be looking at?

 

[DrMidlife]

...there are plenty of applicants getting their applications reviewed in Dec and interviewing in Jan...

You should visit the reapplicant forum for abundant counter-anecdotes.

 

[dyspareunia]

I appreciate the concern. But, there are plenty of applicants getting their applications reviewed in Dec and interviewing in Jan. I'm hoping to be in this category. Given this premise, what are the schools that I should be looking at?

Schools not in the United States.

 

[68PGunner]

You should visit the reapplicant forum for abundant counter-anecdotes.

It's a chance that I'm willing to take. Given my premise, what steps do I need to take in order to put my best step forward? 2015-2016 application cycle isn't an option. It will be a possibility that I will visit if it comes to that.

 

[68PGunner]

Is it better for me to take the Sept MCAT instead?

 

[AkGrown84]

Ok, I'll bite. With an MCAT of at least a 28 (your lowest "category"), you should be fine for any DO schools that do not have significant regional bias. PNWU is also worth a shot (even though they're very heavy regionally biased) since you live in Washington right now, and that may get some brownie points. The DO cycle tends to be a little longer than the MD cycle, so that's a bit better with your timeline (although, you'll still be quite late).

Here's the problem with your timeline in general: Taking an October MCAT means you won't get your score back until sometime in November. Assuming you have your application completed, you can hit enter as soon as you get your score (so you know where to apply to), and then you get to wait 4-6 weeks for verification. We're looking at sometime in December until you're verified. Add in the holidays, and you won't be submitting secondaries until January-ish. This equals mainly February and March interviews (if schools are not already incredibly bogged down with the thousands of applications they have).

It is clear that you refuse to hear what people are saying, but I really feel that because your stats and EC's are not incredibly unique or amazing (I mean, darn near every applicant's EC's are "unique" and "amazing" when you compare them to the general population.....but you are no longer comparing yourself to everyone else. Your application goes into a stack of all those other people who are "unique" and "amazing"), you shouldn't waste your family's time (the application process is very stressful and time consuming) or money this year. Wait a year and apply June 1st, 2015. Applying late (I'd say anything after late-August) puts you at an incredible disadvantage that is very tough to reconcile without a near flawless application (4.0, 35+, cured cancer, etc). There are always those who succeed with this plan....please pay attention to how many do, and how many other don't. Do you want to gamble several thousand dollars and hours and hours of time hoping you're one of those outliers?!

 

[AkGrown84]

Also, I forgot to add potential MD schools....obviously cut out any of the super-elite/top20/etc schools. Your GPA simply won't fly with those (this is not a jab at you...I am very non-trad as well, and my GPA is 3.5ish...just being realistic here). Forget any of the public "state" schools unless you have strong ties to the area. This applies to everyone, with almost any stats. Again, outliers do exist, but don't count on them. So you're left with "your" state school and private schools. Spend the $20 (or whatever it is now) to get the MSAR, and compare your stats to each school you're interested in.

This was my strategy in choosing schools: 1. Apply to my state school....because tuition is so much cheaper (and it's a Top 10, so who wouldn't?!). 2.Cut out every other state school unless I really, really wanted there specifically (for me, this was U. of Kansas and U. of Arizona). 3. Cut out every school that was in an area that the cost of living wasn't realistic for my situation. I have four children, and NYC, San Fran, etc are just not going to happen. 5. Cut out every school with a tuition over $60,000/year. There are so many schools, that you shouldn't need to pay an extra $30k-$50k over the bulk of the med schools. 4. Check out MSAR, and spend hours figuring out which schools would fit me best, where my family would like to live, etc. This includes looking at their stats and ranges and comparing yourself to their averages and their 10%-90%.

Good luck.

 

[68PGunner]

Here's the problem with your timeline in general: Taking an October MCAT means you won't get your score back until sometime in November. Assuming you have your application completed, you can hit enter as soon as you get your score (so you know where to apply to), and then you get to wait 4-6 weeks for verification. We're looking at sometime in December until you're verified. Add in the holidays, and you won't be submitting secondaries until January-ish. This equals mainly February and March interviews (if schools are not already incredibly bogged down with the thousands of applications they have).

Can you get verified and secondaries without a MCAT score?

 

[AkGrown84]

You can apply and be verified without an MCAT score, but most likely will not receive secondaries. Besides that, you will want to tailor your school list, at least partially, towards whatever MCAT score you receive. In your case, if you're dead set on it (I don't recommend it), Submit your application to one school (maybe your state school?!) that you will apply to no matter what your score. You can then be verified, and then when you receive your score back, you can go back in and add the rest of the schools. This still means secondaries rolling in in late November/Early December, which is sub-optimal. When exactly is your MCAT date in October? Obviously, the earlier, the better.

 

[68PGunner]

What do I need to do in order to have everything before the school adcom by the time that I get my MCAT score back? That will realistically put my file in review in Nov and hopefully an II by late Dec or Jan.

 

[68PGunner]

In your case, if you're dead set on it (I don't recommend it), Submit your application to one school (maybe your state school?!) that you will apply to no matter what your score. You can then be verified, and then when you receive your score back, you can go back in and add the rest of the schools. This still means secondaries rolling in in late November/Early December, which is sub-optimal. When exactly is your MCAT date in October? Obviously, the earlier, the better.

Does this mean that I should apply to one MD and one DO first?

Are there schools that give out secondaries without having a MCAT first?

 

[AkGrown84]

Does this mean that I should apply to one MD and one DO first?

Are there schools that give out secondaries without having a MCAT first?

If you are confident that your MCAT score will be upper-20's or better, apply to all the DO schools that you want from the get-go. The rest of your stats are fine for any DO school, and your MCAT score won't matter (unless it falls below mid-20's). I mean, obviously your MCAT score will matter, but it won't have any bearing on where you apply DO.

MD, on the other hand, may change according to your MCAT, so only apply to one MD first until you get your score back. It literally takes only a couple days for AMCAS to send your application to the schools you add after receiving your MCAT.

I am not aware of any schools that will give a secondary to anyone without an MCAT score, but it doesn't mean there aren't any who will. Actually, USUHS sends out their secondary when you submit (before you're verified), so they wouldn't know if you have a score or not. They're the only one I know of that will send one out without an MCAT.

 

[68PGunner]

If you are confident that your MCAT score will be upper-20's or better, apply to all the DO schools that you want from the get-go. The rest of your stats are fine for any DO school, and your MCAT score won't matter (unless it falls below mid-20's). I mean, obviously your MCAT score will matter, but it won't have any bearing on where you apply DO.

MD, on the other hand, may change according to your MCAT, so only apply to one MD first until you get your score back. It literally takes only a couple days for AMCAS to send your application to the schools you add after receiving your MCAT.ests.

I am not aware of any schools that will give a secondary to anyone without an MCAT score, but it doesn't mean there aren't any who will. Actually, USUHS sends out their secondary when you submit (before you're verified), so they wouldn't know if you have a score or not. They're the only one I know of that will send one out without an MCAT.

Thanks a lot for your help. I'm going to try for the AUG MCAT. I'll know whether I can do it by the end of this month. I think I just need about 3 months of preparation. I'm very confident in my ability when it comes to standardized tests.

 

[AkGrown84]

August would definitely be better. If you were waiting to finish your OChem 2 course, I found that the OChem on the MCAT was fairly elementary, and I most likely only utilized my knowledge from OChem 1.

Have you taken any full length practice tests? These are the best predictor of how you'll do on the real one.

 

[68PGunner]

August would definitely be better. If you were waiting to finish your OChem 2 course, I found that the OChem on the MCAT was fairly elementary, and I most likely only utilized my knowledge from OChem 1.

Have you taken any full length practice tests? These are the best predictor of how you'll do on the real one.

I haven't yet. But, from my past successes, I have never had issues with tests.

I'm taking the UNE ORGO Chem 1 class right now. I just started it at the beginning of April while taking Physics I and Stats. With Stats out of the way, I'm ramming up my study schedule. My work schedule is a little bit weird right now. Despite me taking Orgo I from UNE right now, I'm hoping to take at least two Orgo classes from a CC so that I can qualify for most MDs, including USUHS.

I'm going to give this cycle my best shot. We'll see how it goes. I honestly don't care if I go to a MD or a DO. I firmly believe that with the right work ethic I will be able to get the residency that's most suitable to my intelligence and personality.

 

[AkGrown84]

Just as a head's up.....the MCAT is a completely different beast than any other standardized test. I speak from experience, crushing my SAT's in HS, as well as several different sections of the Praxis to be qualified in several sections of teaching Jr/ High/High School (I did better than 94% of others). The MCAT killed me. I have never had issues with tests, and yet this one threw me for a loop. Just a friendly warning now 🙂 Take a full length just to see where you stand currently, and you'll know how much work you need to do (or NOT?!) to be ready to take the actual one!

 

[Zelda840]

You can take AAMC practice test 3 online for free. It's a good way to see where you're sitting before studying.

 

[Darth Doc]

Yes, I realize this. But, I'm not interested in looking at what I can't do but rather what I can do given my bio and timelines.

It is clear that you refuse to hear what people are saying, but I really feel that because your stats and EC's are not incredibly unique or amazing (I mean, darn near every applicant's EC's are "unique" and "amazing" when you compare them to the general population.....but you are no longer comparing yourself to everyone else. Your application goes into a stack of all those other people who are "unique" and "amazing"), you shouldn't waste your family's time (the application process is very stressful and time consuming) or money this year. Wait a year and apply June 1st, 2015. Applying late (I'd say anything after late-August) puts you at an incredible disadvantage that is very tough to reconcile without a near flawless application (4.0, 35+, cured cancer, etc). There are always those who succeed with this plan....please pay attention to how many do, and how many other don't. Do you want to gamble several thousand dollars and hours and hours of time hoping you're one of those outliers?!

@68PGunner I agree with AkGrown84 about waiting until next cycle, but it isn't as if you have no chance... you're just reducing your chance of success significantly, increasing your stress level, and if you don't make it the first time you will have a harder time getting looked at during your second try (based on what I've seen on SDN.)

I got everything into AMCAS by mid-late June except the MCAT which I took in September. I applied to a limited number of local schools. I got accepted to what is generally accepted to be a "lower tier" MD school. However, I have exceptional EC's since I graduated from PA school 15 years ago.

To improve your chances:
-get all of your info into AMCAS and/or AACOMAS as early as possible
-take the MCAT as early as you think you can to get the best score (yes, September is MUCH better than October)
- go to AMCAS and purchase the MSAR https://www.aamc.org/students/applying/requirements/msar/ to get the info on what schools are specifically looking for. Apply to the ones that fit best what you can offer them.

 

[Jewels86]

Hi 68PGunner!

I'm sorta in the same boat as you and wanted to take the January MCAT and "give it a shot" since I should only a handful of remaining premeds left. BUT...I just can't take another headache. So I'm going to have to continue with my cruddy 15 hour work/commute overnight shifts for another year and apply next year. Does it suck, absolutely!! But I really want get on with my life and get in.

I do hope you get in for next year!! But FWIW, next app cycle is just fine too 🙂

 

[Goro]

For MCAT of 28 and higher, any DO school. That was simple!
For MD schools, your state school and all the low-tiers.

1) MCAT score: 28-29

Low-tiers and maybe a mid-tier or two. MSAR Online is your friend

2) MCAT score: 30-33

Mix of lowand mid tiers, and a few reach schools
3) MCAT score: 34-36

Sky's the limit!
4) MCAT score: above 36

Many thanks for your service to our country.

 

[68PGunner]

Thanks for a lot of feedbacks guys. I really appreciate it. I'm ramming my study schedule right now. Orgo Chem I from UNE has 15 modules. I'm at module 7 with an average of 100%. I'm hoping to get 4 modules done this week and 4 modules done next week. It's stressful as hell right now for me. If I can get this class done by the end of this month, I'm going to prepare for the MCAT starting in June. On top of Orgo I, I'm also taking Physics I and Stats. I'm planning to take Physics II over the sumer while studying for the MCAT. Physics really don't consume much of my time beside lab and then its report.

I'm give it a few weeks of studying the MCAT to know what kind of student I am when it comes to this beast. I'm the type of person that can buy a review book and go through a semester of materials in 2-3 weeks. This will be on top of my work and family obligation. It's a very high stressed environment. My wife is very supportive of me right now. I'm crossing my fingers hoping for the best.

I'm going to push myself to the limit aiming for that late August test date. In the worst case scenario, I can always take the OCT one and hope for the best from the adcoms.

 

[68PGunner]

@68PGunner
To improve your chances:
-get all of your info into AMCAS and/or AACOMAS as early as possible
-take the MCAT as early as you think you can to get the best score (yes, September is MUCH better than October)
- go to AMCAS and purchase the MSAR https://www.aamc.org/students/applying/requirements/msar/ to get the info on what schools are specifically looking for. Apply to the ones that fit best what you can offer them.

I wish I could take it in Sept. I would be less stressed out by the situation. But, in September, we are scheduled to have a field training exercise where we play soldiers in the mountain for 4 weeks. It's not happening.

 

[CajunMedic]

Lots of good advice so far. As far as a specific school- consider LMU-DCOM in Harrogate, TN. From the feedback I got on here, plus what I experienced during the interview, they are very open to non-trads with healthcare experience, plus they are pro-military (one of the interviewers the day I was there was ex-101st. he had the miniature Screaming Eagle pin and miniature Air Assault wings on his coat).