HELP! post bac through army?

[waveringhorizon]

hello fellow nontrads,



just wondering if anyone has any insights on doing a post bac, or redoing the prereqs altogether since i don't know which is better in improving my undergrad gpa and ultimately the chance of being admitted to med schools. without further ado, here's a rundown of my credentials.


undergrad gpa 3.0 (already obtained B.S. in biology)
mcat 30 (1st time)
2 years of research in a lab for credits
very little other extracurriculars/clinical exposure/ volunteer work

I am looking to be enlisted in the coming half year and was just wondering if anyone has been in my shoes and could give me some suggestions. getting enlisted serves me by paying off my undergrad loan through the GI bill and possibly getting some patient exposure since I am expected to secure a clinial posisition in the army hospital in accordance to my ASVAB score of 92. meanwhile I heard that the Tuition Assistance program offered
by the military can give me money and send me to night college when i'm off duty (army gets off very early everyday), so i wanted to capitalize on that time while my aspiration of becoming a doctor still holds valid by studying at a college near my station.

I am however confused as to the mechanics of doing this (if this is doable at all): if i were to apply to a post bac program (or a second degree in a different school), how do i go about applying to one and getting enlisted at the same time? since the location of my workplace is not a matter of personal preference. does this mean that I should apply after I get enlisted and in case of admission work out a schedule that does not conflict with my army work time? One of the recruiters told me through web that there is almost alwyas a station where i can work at any given location in the country. but even if that is true, I don't think those formal post-bac/SMP program would allow physically for me to be doing somehting else full time. so if that is the case does it mean that appying to a formal postbac program is just infeasible given the rigor and intensity of the post-bacs and the nature of my army job? and would retaking classses at a college help me improve my chances (restudying and retaking the MCAT is also part of the plan), assuming that i do well in these classes (btw what should i take besdies the prereqs?)?

it does sound like i should've asked my recruiter about this, but I asked several recruiters in my neighborhood and none of them is at all knowledgable about this, especially the pre-med aspect of it. If anyone has done this, or knows information regarding my situation, has comments about my plan of pursuing med school (or in another way, redeeming myself of wasting a perfectly good opportunity as an undergrad which i so relentlessly squandered), please help, i really appreciate it!

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[rofd41]

If you are enlisting and not going for a comission, then I've got some helpful information for you. You need to find out exactly what type of medical job you're signing up for. Because, as an Army medic you can get assigned to any type of field unit (Infantry,Cav Scout,Mortar,etc.). That means that what ever they do, you do. If they spend 30 days in the field then so do you. Make sure you enlist for a specialty like med surg or something other than health care specialist. You will not have enough free time to attend school like you'd want. Especially not a post.bacc. program. If you want to take classes your best bet is to take them online, or wait and see what type of steady work schedule you'll have and when your unit is going to deploy. Then if all works out try and sign up for a class using TA, but understand that things always change and you volunteered for the military. Your military job always comes first and even if you loose tuition money the military doesn't care. Hope this is a little insight for you on what the Army is like. GL

 

[waveringhorizon]

thank you for your input, I noticed that you are located at fort worth, tx i think one of the recruiters did mention this place for placing me with the 68K position (health care laboratory specialist), since i told them that i did one year of microbiology/ immunology lab research and wanted to expand my experience in that. but i later found out that this job only entails testing samples such as blood and urine, the only possible positive thing i get out of it is perhaps working alongside a healthcare team, and not having to be redeployed/reassigned to other places. so as far as job selection, why is health care specialist not preferred? thanks again for your help!

i was also wondering what your pre med path is with the military, if you dont mind sharing. thank you!

 

[Narnian]

I think the reason why Healthcare Specialist is not preferred is because your goal is possible, but it is however not as likely if you go that route. I was a healthcare specialist for 4 years. I did take some college, but do to field deployments and combat deployments, I was not able to complete anywhere near what I wanted. I took 15 credits in 4 years. I was with the infantry, and like rofd41 said, I went with them wherever they went. If you go 68W (healthcare specialist) there is no way you can be guranteed that you wont be with a field unit, or that even if you are in a hospital they could pull you and put you in a field unit, based on army needs. If you get it in writing in your contract that you will ONLY be in a hospital and that you will not be pulled to a field unit then I say its likely. I do not think they can give you that in a contract. Even if you pick a job that is strictly in a hospital, some of the jobs require you do the combat medic training first and then your hospital specialty is an add on school. You could still be pulled to a field unit. It is less likely though if you are a hospital based specialty.

 

[scottyT]

... getting enlisted serves me by paying off my undergrad loan through the GI bill ...

I don't have much advice about the other stuff you asked but wanted to comment on this part. Make sure you know what you are getting out of the deal. There are certain loan repayment programs which, if taken, make you ineligible for the GI Bill later on (unless you wind up re-enlisting). The value of the GI Bill vastly outweighs what can be repaid on most undergrad loans.

I don't know if this is your situation. Just make sure to check into it.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

hello fellow nontrads,



just wondering if anyone has any insights on doing a post bac, or redoing the prereqs altogether since i don't know which is better in improving my undergrad gpa and ultimately the chance of being admitted to med schools. without further ado, here's a rundown of my credentials.


undergrad gpa 3.0 (already obtained B.S. in biology)
mcat 30 (1st time)
2 years of research in a lab for credits
very little other extracurriculars/clinical exposure/ volunteer work

I am looking to be enlisted in the coming half year and was just wondering if anyone has been in my shoes and could give me some suggestions. getting enlisted serves me by paying off my undergrad loan through the GI bill and possibly getting some patient exposure since I am expected to secure a clinial posisition in the army hospital in accordance to my ASVAB score of 92. meanwhile I heard that the Tuition Assistance program offered
by the military can give me money and send me to night college when i'm off duty (army gets off very early everyday), so i wanted to capitalize on that time while my aspiration of becoming a doctor still holds valid by studying at a college near my station.

I am however confused as to the mechanics of doing this (if this is doable at all): if i were to apply to a post bac program (or a second degree in a different school), how do i go about applying to one and getting enlisted at the same time? since the location of my workplace is not a matter of personal preference. does this mean that I should apply after I get enlisted and in case of admission work out a schedule that does not conflict with my army work time? One of the recruiters told me through web that there is almost alwyas a station where i can work at any given location in the country. but even if that is true, I don't think those formal post-bac/SMP program would allow physically for me to be doing somehting else full time. so if that is the case does it mean that appying to a formal postbac program is just infeasible given the rigor and intensity of the post-bacs and the nature of my army job? and would retaking classses at a college help me improve my chances (restudying and retaking the MCAT is also part of the plan), assuming that i do well in these classes (btw what should i take besdies the prereqs?)?

it does sound like i should've asked my recruiter about this, but I asked several recruiters in my neighborhood and none of them is at all knowledgable about this, especially the pre-med aspect of it. If anyone has done this, or knows information regarding my situation, has comments about my plan of pursuing med school (or in another way, redeeming myself of wasting a perfectly good opportunity as an undergrad which i so relentlessly squandered), please help, i really appreciate it!

Can you not do OCS and get GI reimbursement?

 

[waveringhorizon]

arkansasranger, i have no idea what OCS is and after a little research i still do not know if it applies to me (i am just as surprised my recruiter did not say anything about it) will you elaborate a little on your question? sorry about this, and thanks for your input

 

[waveringhorizon]

I think the reason why Healthcare Specialist is not preferred is because your goal is possible, but it is however not as likely if you go that route. I was a healthcare specialist for 4 years. I did take some college, but do to field deployments and combat deployments, I was not able to complete anywhere near what I wanted. I took 15 credits in 4 years. I was with the infantry, and like rofd41 said, I went with them wherever they went. If you go 68W (healthcare specialist) there is no way you can be guranteed that you wont be with a field unit, or that even if you are in a hospital they could pull you and put you in a field unit, based on army needs. If you get it in writing in your contract that you will ONLY be in a hospital and that you will not be pulled to a field unit then I say its likely. I do not think they can give you that in a contract. Even if you pick a job that is strictly in a hospital, some of the jobs require you do the combat medic training first and then your hospital specialty is an add on school. You could still be pulled to a field unit. It is less likely though if you are a hospital based specialty.

thank you Narnian for sharing your experience, was wondering if you'd know which jobs are more hospital based? my recruiter apparently doesn't know a whole bunch on this topic. will the 68K position require me be constantly transferred to a field and such? I don't know what I should be looking for when selecting a job. thank you

 

[waveringhorizon]

I don't have much advice about the other stuff you asked but wanted to comment on this part. Make sure you know what you are getting out of the deal. There are certain loan repayment programs which, if taken, make you ineligible for the GI Bill later on (unless you wind up re-enlisting). The value of the GI Bill vastly outweighs what can be repaid on most undergrad loans.

I don't know if this is your situation. Just make sure to check into it.

thank your ScottyT for commenting and your suggestion, would you care to tell me the difference between a loan repayment program and a GI bill? to my earlier understanding, I thought the army would pay off my UG loans regardless of my future plan. are you saying if I get subsidy from the Tuition Assistance program to take classes during army will require me not already having an UG loan debt? thank you

 

[ArkansasRanger]

arkansasranger, i have no idea what OCS is and after a little research i still do not know if it applies to me (i am just as surprised my recruiter did not say anything about it) will you elaborate a little on your question? sorry about this, and thanks for your input

I don't know, dude. I'm not a soldier. However, I do know that if you're in the right age range and you have a bachelor's degree then you can go to thru officer candidate school and be a commissioned officer rather than an enlisted man. It's more pay and better work experience. There are other requirements that go along with it, but my original question was if the GI bill would cover you after that as well. It probably would. Do your homework.

 

[waveringhorizon]

I don't know, dude. I'm not a soldier. However, I do know that if you're in the right age range and you have a bachelor's degree then you can go to thru officer candidate school and be a commissioned officer rather than an enlisted man. It's more pay and better work experience. There are other requirements that go along with it, but my original question was if the GI bill would cover you after that as well. It probably would. Do your homework.

yeah it probably would i am sitting down with one of the medical station recruiters here in NY tomorrow.. hopefully it gets all cleared up. thanks

 

[scottyT]

thank your ScottyT for commenting and your suggestion, would you care to tell me the difference between a loan repayment program and a GI bill? to my earlier understanding, I thought the army would pay off my UG loans regardless of my future plan. are you saying if I get subsidy from the Tuition Assistance program to take classes during army will require me not already having an UG loan debt? thank you

It looks like you have some homework to do before you enlist.

Often times they will offer loan repayment as an incentive to get you through the door. Under this program, the army (or whatever branch) will help re-pay a portion of your existing student debt. Depending on the specific program they are signing you up for, it may nullify your eligibility to receive the GI Bill.

The GI Bill is a program in which you can get money to attend college after honorable service. Right now it is set up so that if you serve your contract through and get an honorable discharge then you can receive a full tuition scholarship and a living stipend for 36 months of college (it also works for grad school or med school, but the tuition is capped at whatever it would have cost to attend undergrad).

I was trying to point out that the GI Bill is generally worth more than the loan repayment option if it is an either/or circumstance. I don't know what type of loan repayment they are offering you so you need to check with your recruiter that it will not nullify your eligibility for the GI Bill.

Lastly, you should look into going through officer candidate school and becoming commissioned into the army rather than enlisting. If you already have a degree there is little reason why you should enlist. It is a hard life, and you have no control over anything--even your own leisure time. Officers are treated much better, have some small modicum of control over their environment, and are paid much more.

I managed to complete 56 hours of college in my four year enlistment; however, I was a shiftworker for much of it. I am the exception, not the rule. Do not enter into the military with the idea that you will be able to complete an informal postbacc as most of the classes you need for such an endeavor are either not offered in the evening or not offered near bases.

 

[scottyT]

are you saying if I get subsidy from the Tuition Assistance program to take classes during army will require me not already having an UG loan debt? thank you

PS,

To add to what I said above and further explain: tuition assistance is totally outside of either loan repayment or the GI Bill. You are only eligible for tuition assistance while you are active duty. When I was in (it may have changed), you could get T/A regardless of whatever other educational perks you are eligible for ... as long as you were enrolled in classes. I do not know if they now require you to have time left on contract/whatever. You will have to ask your recruiter. Do not confuse T/A with the GI Bill or loan repayment, it is a separate program.

 

[Narnian]

Hey go to this link and it will give you all the medical specialties for enlisted, and a description of them.

http://www.goarmy.com/JobCatDetail.do?id=9


Hospital based jobs are ones like X-ray technician, or psych technician, op tech you know things you would associate only with a large hospital or clinic.

 

[waveringhorizon]

PS,

To add to what I said above and further explain: tuition assistance is totally outside of either loan repayment or the GI Bill. You are only eligible for tuition assistance while you are active duty. When I was in (it may have changed), you could get T/A regardless of whatever other educational perks you are eligible for ... as long as you were enrolled in classes. I do not know if they now require you to have time left on contract/whatever. You will have to ask your recruiter. Do not confuse T/A with the GI Bill or loan repayment, it is a separate program.

that cleared it up really well. thank you for your time, I am not eligible for going officer right off the bat because I do not have an US citizenship , been a green card holder for 5 years and they said I should get the whole process of obtaining citizenship done really fast once I get enlisted. and at that point I can apply to OCS in becoming an officer (but i do not know how getting released from an enlisted status to officer is going to work, considering the fact that i signed a contract for enlisting, assuming I get citizenship before the enlistment contract ends). in light of that I really wish I'd have the citizenship before entering army because from what I gathered the weight requirements for going officer , esp. commissioned ones, are less stringent, and I am 10lbs overweight for going enlisted as of now (was 20lbs overweight 2 weeks ago), so i hope the progress stays on the positive side.

 

[waveringhorizon]

Hey go to this link and it will give you all the medical specialties for enlisted, and a description of them.

http://www.goarmy.com/JobCatDetail.do?id=9


Hospital based jobs are ones like X-ray technician, or psych technician, op tech you know things you would associate only with a large hospital or clinic.

that was helpful thank you

 

[rofd41]

Hey waveringhorizon, to answer your questions: My home is Ft Worth but I'm stuck in NY for 10mos and I'm taking what online classes I can until I get out of the Army (10mos). There is no way with my Army career field that I can do anymore than online classes. So my premed path is almost nill until I'm out and using the GI bill.

 

[waveringhorizon]

Hey waveringhorizon, to answer your questions: My home is Ft Worth but I'm stuck in NY for 10mos and I'm taking what online classes I can until I get out of the Army (10mos). There is no way with my Army career field that I can do anymore than online classes. So my premed path is almost nill until I'm out and using the GI bill.

ahh. thanks for the info. I apparently can only hope to get a hospital job where transferring is minimally frequent.

 

[mmcnamara]

hello fellow nontrads,



just wondering if anyone has any insights on doing a post bac, or redoing the prereqs altogether since i don't know which is better in improving my undergrad gpa and ultimately the chance of being admitted to med schools. without further ado, here's a rundown of my credentials.


undergrad gpa 3.0 (already obtained B.S. in biology)
mcat 30 (1st time)
2 years of research in a lab for credits
very little other extracurriculars/clinical exposure/ volunteer work

I am looking to be enlisted in the coming half year and was just wondering if anyone has been in my shoes and could give me some suggestions. getting enlisted serves me by paying off my undergrad loan through the GI bill and possibly getting some patient exposure since I am expected to secure a clinial posisition in the army hospital in accordance to my ASVAB score of 92. meanwhile I heard that the Tuition Assistance program offered
by the military can give me money and send me to night college when i'm off duty (army gets off very early everyday), so i wanted to capitalize on that time while my aspiration of becoming a doctor still holds valid by studying at a college near my station.

I am however confused as to the mechanics of doing this (if this is doable at all): if i were to apply to a post bac program (or a second degree in a different school), how do i go about applying to one and getting enlisted at the same time? since the location of my workplace is not a matter of personal preference. does this mean that I should apply after I get enlisted and in case of admission work out a schedule that does not conflict with my army work time? One of the recruiters told me through web that there is almost alwyas a station where i can work at any given location in the country. but even if that is true, I don't think those formal post-bac/SMP program would allow physically for me to be doing somehting else full time. so if that is the case does it mean that appying to a formal postbac program is just infeasible given the rigor and intensity of the post-bacs and the nature of my army job? and would retaking classses at a college help me improve my chances (restudying and retaking the MCAT is also part of the plan), assuming that i do well in these classes (btw what should i take besdies the prereqs?)?

it does sound like i should've asked my recruiter about this, but I asked several recruiters in my neighborhood and none of them is at all knowledgable about this, especially the pre-med aspect of it. If anyone has done this, or knows information regarding my situation, has comments about my plan of pursuing med school (or in another way, redeeming myself of wasting a perfectly good opportunity as an undergrad which i so relentlessly squandered), please help, i really appreciate it!

I agree with rofd41. Being formerly enlisted, your responsibilities will be entirely contingent upon what job you have. If you are working in the lab, great. You have a greater chance of having regular work hours. If you are a pharm tech, it's the same. If you are a medic, you may be screwed. You could end up attached to the 101st airborne division (Army), jumping out of planes 2 weeks out of every month. You could get deployed to Iraq for six months out of every 18 months. If you go Navy, you could end up on a carrier for a year. The air force would probably be more compatible with your goals, but there are still no guarantees. Regardless of branch, if you are actually working in a hospital every day, you might be doing the swing shift or the midnight shift. NEVER think that the military is a 40 hour per week job. It is NOT, army, navy, or air force. It is closer to 60 hours per week because of additional responsibilities like training in map reading and communications and doing drills, all of which usually occur before your official work day begins at the clinic/hospital. And don't forget about the running and push ups and sit ups. Medical corp people do not have to do it every day, but if you never do it, you will fail the PT test. If you get promoted to noncommissioned officer, as I was, your days just get longer.

I always tell people that the military is a great experience. I am grateful for my years as an enlisted member of the Army. They are offering great bonuses and benefits now. But beware of the slick recruiters who will never see you after you have signed the dotted line. They will lie to you; they will mislead you; they will say anything to get you in. They lied to me, and I've known a few of them personally as friends who have confirmed this.

 

[mmcnamara]

Oh, by the way, you will hardly have time for school, and you will definitely not be able to participate in a post-bac program.

 

[mmcnamara]

that cleared it up really well. thank you for your time, I am not eligible for going officer right off the bat because I do not have an US citizenship , been a green card holder for 5 years and they said I should get the whole process of obtaining citizenship done really fast once I get enlisted. and at that point I can apply to OCS in becoming an officer (but i do not know how getting released from an enlisted status to officer is going to work, considering the fact that i signed a contract for enlisting, assuming I get citizenship before the enlistment contract ends). in light of that I really wish I'd have the citizenship before entering army because from what I gathered the weight requirements for going officer , esp. commissioned ones, are less stringent, and I am 10lbs overweight for going enlisted as of now (was 20lbs overweight 2 weeks ago), so i hope the progress stays on the positive side.

The likelihood of you being able to go to OCS after enlisting and before fulfilling your obligation is almost, but not quite, zero. I knew at least a dozen people who applied for OCS after many years of distinguished enlisted service who were denied OCS repeatedly with no explanation. They had completed their bachelor's degrees mostly through online courses during their enlistments/re-enlistments. I think that your best bet is to get the GI bill and see if they have any student loan repayment (which I think that they do and that you can get in addition to the GI bill). While in the military, you will have an easier time getting citizenship, which will make it easier to get into med school. As I said earlier, you will have little time for classes while in, and you will definitely not be able to participate in a post-bac program, as those are also full time.

 

[20minutes]

I was in your exact shoes. 8 years ago. And I'm finally about to enter med school. You need to research this as much as possible, if your recruiter can't answer a question find another one (and be wary of what the recruiters tell you anyway, they'll say anything to boost their numbers). I spent 5 years as a health care specialist and there is no way I could have completed any college work (but I was in a frequently deployed infantry unit). Even if you do find a cush hospital job, they still deploy (we pulled 5 hospital medics for my last deployment because we were short). Even if that happens to fall one week prior to your finals. IMO if you're in a bind and need to enlist (or even just want to) leave all expectations at the door. Take a long term view, finish any classes you can while in the military, get out, and use the GI Bill. It's a fantastic program. And you'll be much better for the experience (hopefully). Completely forget about planning on enlisting and post-bac program simultaneously (if it does work out, cool. But it probably won't). I wouldn't recommend this path for everyone, but it definitely worked out for me.

 

[Old Grunt]

The IRR alone would make me avoid going trying to get to medical school via the Army like the plaque.

What is the IRR you ask? An excellent question. Type it into google and start reading.

BTW, I have a classmate who is active reserve who is in Afghanistan right now. The Army could have cared less that they were in medical school since they weren't in the HPSP.