Help us rank the DO schools!

[Lee]

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After years of being asked the question, "which osteopathic medical school is the best?" We're going to let you help settle this debate.

Go to the temporary directory: http://studentdoctor.net/links/pages/Gregorys_Osteopathic_Links/Medical_Schools/ and put your ranking 1-10 for each school.

Although clearly the rankings are subjective, please make them rationally (i.e., just because you go to the school don't rank it a perfect 10, unless you believe it is!).

The system is updated on a regular basis, so you'll see the updated rankings in 2-24 hours.

Thanks for your help!

 

[ADRIANSHOE]

Lee, What specific criteria are we using to rank these schools and what wieghting should we give to each? Not to be too inflammatory, but isn't this just as bad as having a flame forum? Without specific criteria we have little basis for discussion and a lot of basis for conflict, all without really settling or adding anything to the picture. Why don't we instead all agree to send 1000 dollars to a research agency, give them criteria to evaluate, send them to each individual school, present data and research to back up each ranking in the subcategories and then post the results. Then we may have something other than a nonsense poll. What if a school has fifteen disgruntled webgeeks compared to another school with only four disgruntled webgeeks? the poll becomes biased due to the relative number of webgeeks not due to the true opinions of the student population.

 

[Lee]

Adrianshoe, I think you're stretching when comparing an opinion poll to the flame forum -- a fantastic goof.

Perhaps it was such a memorable flop, now everything at SDN will now be compared to the flame forum?

I thought about the sampling error problem. I figure that the rank list will initially be biased based on who has the most 'webgeeks.' However, with time the sample size will increase and eventually it will become balanced and reflective of the student community?s opinions.

It's certainly silly to compare this rank list to a rank list based on some objective statistical criteria -- this is meant to be a subjective opinion poll. Although subjective, I think general opinion polls are useful. It will be interesting to see how our community regards each school.

 

[J143]

hey,

just wondering about the person who rated TUCOM a 1.00. can you explain why?

 

[Test Boy]

It was probably a mistake. He probably meant to "rank" it instead of "rating" it. I know I made that mistake when I read the topic title and automatically ranked my school. Infortunately, it doesn't allow you to change it.

 

[Lee]

Sorry: rate the schools!

Also, if you'd like to see a ranking based on some objective criteria, see: http://www.amsa.org/programs/pcscore5.html

Of course, you'll find the numbers to be totally worthless -- AMSA's information came from the AOA, which only tracks students that went through the AOA match. Even CCOM, which is listed as the #1 osteopathic school for primary care thinks the ranking is totally wrong and doesn't plan to use it.

 

[Jkeum22985]

I believe instead of ranking schools, why don't you guys rank the achievement of their alumni. And, the extracurricular activity of student body...that will tell me more about the quality of school...

In addition, school ranking is not really based on the educational value of school per se. It is more on the amount of research conducted and dollar amount on grants.

Let's grow up little and learn to appreciate
the greater picture of Osteopathic medicine in action...

Sincerely,

Jacob Keum
4th year NYCOM

 

[Doctor TRuth]

Lee,

From what I understand the salary one earns as a DO should be equivalent to an MD. Is that correct?

Is there a sight where you can find out the average salaries of a DO.

 

[ADRIANSHOE]

Originally posted by Lee A Burnett:
Adrianshoe, I think you're stretching when comparing an opinion poll to the flame forum -- a fantastic goof.

Perhaps it was such a memorable flop, now everything at SDN will now be compared to the flame forum?

I thought about the sampling error problem. I figure that the rank list will initially be biased based on who has the most 'webgeeks.' However, with time the sample size will increase and eventually it will become balanced and reflective of the student community?s opinions.

It's certainly silly to compare this rank list to a rank list based on some objective statistical criteria -- this is meant to be a subjective opinion poll. Although subjective, I think general opinion polls are useful. It will be interesting to see how our community regards each school.

lee, no goof on my part, not this time anyway, i merely suggested that the postive aspects of a worthless poll are not enough to offset the negative potential for this worthless polling degrading into a flame war, see the difference? I am not SAYING the poll is equivalent to the forum I am SAYING that since it is a useless poll, it brings nothing of positive benefit and opens the door for negative outcome. that's all, sorry you misunderstood where i was coming from, hope this clears it up.

so, lets discuss the usefulness of this poll as professionals, since you think that despite its subjectiveness it has some usefulness (correct me if I am misquoting, i apologize in advance if this is the case), WHAT uses are there to a poll that is inherently flawed in concept?

 

[ADRIANSHOE]

By the way, how do you get your smiley face to stick it's tongue out? thats hilarious!

 

[Lee]

Adrianshoe-

The secret to the smilies is hidden in the "smilies legend" link which is available on the left of the "Your Reply" text field when posting a reply.

Or, just click here: http://www.studentdoctor.net/bbs/smilies.html

Regarding the main discussion, perhaps we should have an opinion poll on the usefulness of opinion polls?

 

[rtk]

I'm confused about what we're ranking on this site... It appears that this site lists the web sites for each Osteopathic College and ask the reader to rate the usefulness of the particular web site (not to rank the school itself). I may not be looking in the incorrect place, please correct me if I'm wrong...

 

[capt.freedom]

I think this polling is a valuable thing!

I certainly voted and I hope my voice is heard!!!

[This message has been edited by capt.freedom (edited 04-20-2000).]

 

[alexcc_ms]

I think school 'A' is better because they have pingpong tables in the student lounge. Why do people fuss over which school is best? Which school is the worst?
My doc graduated last in his class from the worst medical school and he's only almost killed me a few times.

Seriously, the only criteria I care about is BOARD SCORES. 'Nuff said.

Well almost enough... US NEWS & W R would save us alot of hassle if they would rank past 50, true?

 

[rhillstr]

I disagree with USN&WR. They rank on what? Anyone? Research and the dollars generated by it. I think that a rating system is only useful by subject.
I.E.
Rate clinicals
Rate basic science courses and faculty
Then maybe a secondary source to supply ave board scores and match stats.
What do you like best? Come on, we only attend one school and maybe interview at a couple others. What can we honestly say about other schools?
Just a thought...

 

[jet li]

HOW RUDE!!! I posted on this board praising the merits of this survey and you (administrators, moderators, or whatever the heck you are) deleted my post for no apparent reason!!! Is my opinion not a valid one?!! YOU CANNOT JUST DELETE POSTS FROM PEOPLE SHARING DIFFERING OPINIONS FROM YOURS!!!!! WHAT THE H@LL IS GOING ON WITH ALL THIS CENSORSHIP!!!

[This message has been edited by jet li (edited 04-21-2000).]

 

[curious cat]

You go, girl!! Stand up for your rights!! I happen to like this voting. I just voted!!

 

[ADRIANSHOE]

dear jet, perhaps it wasn't your opinion that the administrators were censoring? perhaps you went beyond their standards of behavior and decorum and stepped into what they consider to be unprofessional behavior which they do not allow upon this forum, sadly we will never know, but i doubt anyone deleted anything you said that was regarding your opinion about a poll, unless it was impossible to weed out the opinion from the ancillary unacceptable (to them) commentary.
while i wholeheartedly disagree with you about the utility of this poll (although next year when my school gets ranks number one and yours gets ranks 120 i will flip flop as will you), I wholeheartedly agree with you regarding not being censored, but recognizing that this is NOT a public site it is a private site, there is NO legal requirement that the administrators allow you to speak at all, in fact, if the censorship were as bad as you are claiming they would have DELETED YOUR REBUTTAL. Having said that, recognizing that the administrators have the right to lock out certain subjects without apparent reason or comment (nova? etc..) while leaving other subjects intact, raises the issue of how reliable or slanted is anything you read here? That is their credibility problem to deal with, so i don't care. I have to for the moment assume that this forum allows a large degree of latitude of opinion since I have taken extreme positions in several arenas without having my comments censored.

 

[mt]

Lee,

Your ranking of DO schools does not seem to be a good idea. Most of the schools to date have received an average score equating to a BAD rating. I find it hard to believe that all of the DO schools are so bad. I think that many of the ratings may be skewed by other students voting without adequate info on the schools. Many premeds come to your site to learn about osteopathic medicine. Many of these people may be turned off from looking at DO schools if they see such a bad ratings. I think this would be very unfortunate. I don't believe that this poll is adding anything to your site and may in fact be jeopardizing the reputation of DO schools.

[This message has been edited by mt (edited 04-26-2000).]

 

[mj]

Not to mention that the instructions once you get there tell you to rate the schools web site not the school. Kind of confusing I think.
mj

 

[Vegeta]

Lee A. Burnett: find upperclassmen at Osteopathic Medical Schools that have visited other schools of the same genre and/or AOA Staff and Osteopathic Faculty (including Deans) that have taught at several D.O. Schools to contribute their poll results based on their objective comparison of schools. Take into consideration criteria such as available clinical Rotation settings, Residency placements (also, percent matching into first three choices--whether AOA or ACGME), students continuing into Specialty and Primary Care areas, cost of attendance, housing and location, campus comfort and educational facilities, capacity of the Faculty to teach and train, Financial Aid, ETC. I think such a ranking would be extremely helpful to Osteopathic Pre-Medical students so if you're unable to gather objective, experienced voters, then try to do the ranking yourself.

The highest rating as of 04/26/00 is 3.45 at NYCOM (I'll be attending NYCOM in August, so I'm pleased with that, at least)!! Every single school is ranked below "4." That's just ridiculous. I'm shocked that I gave three or four schools that I've become relatively familiar with much higher ratings only to have many other voters degrade every school with horrid ratings. Of course you're going to be able to assemble a list within 2 months based on listing the numerical values, but that ranking is subjective, biased, inconclusive and therefore useless (and I'm sure you'll hurt some feelings).

 

[MODEERF NIATPAC]

Unfortunately, by some twist of fate, NYCOM is now (still 4/26/00) at 3.07. The experts have spoken, and it saddens me to report the drop in NYCOM's rating.

More good news to come....
!!!MMOODDEEERRRRFFFFFF

 

[Lee]

Capt. Freedom (a.k.a. Jet Li) is responsible for the poor ratings that you see at Gregory's Osteopathic Links.

Fortunately, GOL is still being beta tested and we're working out the bugs -- one bug is clearly the need to block multiple votes from the same person. When the final site goes online, we'll clear the current ratings and also add the ability for guests to explain their rating for each resource.

Regarding the confusion of rating websites vs. schools -- that's something that will be clarified in the final version. Thank you for pointing this out!

Also, one more time -- this is an opinion poll. I agree with everyone that feels that it's not scientific -- it's not meant to be. However, others are working on an objective ranking of the schools. This article will be published later this year on the site.

Thanks to everyone that has helped us develop the ratings system at GOL!