horrible first day in clinic

Started by OD07
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OD07

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I had my first day in clinic this week as a new 3rd year. It was horrible. I know it could have gone worse, since I know of some people who were told by their supervisors to get out of the exam room in the middle of their exams -- "You're done with this patient, I'm taking over now." 😱 But I thought the experience was really terrible. I still feel pretty traumatized, and I'm dreading my next session.

I don't know how it is done at other schools, but where I am they expect us to see 2 patients per session -- starting the 2nd patient while your first one is dilating in the waiting room (which is not at all unreasonable, I realize, if you know what you are doing!), and to use a "problem-based approach" in your exams, which means that even if you are doing a "full exam" on a patient you should decide which elements of that exam are the most important ones to do based on that particular patient's chief complaint, and skip the less important ones if you are short on time. (This is, of course, assuming that you are a mind-reader and know which things your supervisor thinks you should skip, which is an important skill because if you are wrong you fail your patient encounter.) Also, I'm apparently supposed to be able to do exams in Spanish. I don't speak Spanish, but that didn't stop my supervisor from asking me to "speed things up".

It's the "short on time" problem that made so much of my day so terrible. Our entire group of students was brand new to the clinic, and they *still* scheduled a very full load of patients. My supervisor was rushing me all day, and because she had other students to supervise, all her time with me was spent helping me with the computer system (which none of us have used before in actual exam situations), telling me to go faster, and very little was spent with the actual patient, even though they were all there for well over an hour (including dilating time) each. I don't feel like any of them got good exams. They were rushed out, told to return for "follow-ups" that were things we could have done right there if we had more time, and I seriously think the spec rxs they got were probably sub-par.

I know that my timing will improve, I will learn the computer system, and I will eventually learn which "shortcuts" to use to optimize my exams, but to have that expectation of me on my first day in clinic was horrible. I feel like we're being taught the process of billing patients for procedures rather than getting to practice those procedures. And how can I learn from my supervisors if I am afraid that one stupid question or comment will affect my grade for that encounter? Other students have told me to act like I know what I'm doing in front of the supervisors at all times. What kind of learning experience is that?

Sorry for the long post. I just feel so shell-shocked after my first day. I knew it would be stressful, but I didn't expect it to leave me feeling like I never want to go back.

🙁
 
ODO7,

Wow, what a first day for you! I just started clinic as a 3rd year in June. My first day was a lot like yours. It's kind of like a baptism by fire, isn't it?? I just wanted to crawl into my bed and never get up again afterwards. My timing was pretty poor (even though I can do 45 minutes to dilation standing on my head in clinic prelab), and by the end of two and a half hours my attending came in and took over because the patient was hungry. I felt like an idiot. It's quite a difference with real patients, isn't it? Things go wrong that you wouldn't even expect. (Once I couldn't get my slit lamp to emit light, and it was because I was in between magnifications. I felt really stupid that time when the attending came in, clicked the mag over, glared at me, and walked away). You're doing the best you can, I imagine, but I'm sure the attendings are all over you anyway.

IT WILL GET BETTER. You know more than you think you do. The best advice I can give is to try not to be intimidated by your attendings. I have two this term and each of them have given me the business a couple of times--and sometimes I didn't feel that I deserved it. However, I try to respect their opinions, (I know they're both trying to help me learn, they're both great docs) and ask questions no matter whether they are going to answer me as if I 'm a real idiot or not. Because I'd rather ask the questions now than in winter term when they expect me to know what I'm doing. I try to act with confidence even though I don't feel it because I think they respect that more than having to run to them about every little thing.

I hope it goes better for you🙂

Eyegirl.
 
Eyegirl2k7 said:
IT WILL GET BETTER.
No truer words were ever spoken. It may not seem like it now, but before you know it you will be capable of seeing 15 full exams a day plus 10 shorter exams (CL checks, IOP checks, etc.) with your eyes closed. I doubt your first day experience is any different than those same attendings that gave you a hard time. The important thing is to not let the attendings get to you. Grades are not as important as learning to be a great clinican, and that takes time. No one expects you to jump right in and be as proficient as someone with years of experience (or even as proficient as the current 4th years).

We have all gone through this. I remember my 3rd year thinking how hard it was to see two patients before lunch and two more before the end of day lecture. Now (8 years into practice), I get upset when I don't have 4 patients to see within the first 30 minutes of the day.

Ben Chudner
UCBSO Class of '97
 
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Thank you for telling me about your experience, Eyegirl, it gives me hope! 🙂
 
Ben Chudner said:
We have all gone through this. I remember my 3rd year thinking how hard it was to see two patients before lunch and two more before the end of day lecture.
Thanks for your thoughts, too, Ben. I know those ahead of me had to go through the same thing, but it's so nice to actually *hear* it from some of you! 🙂
 
it does get better.. UHCO has you bring in friends to be your first patient as a second year. They schedule you only one patient and you get THREE HOURS !! I laugh now when I think about it.

Yes, you're slow at first.. you forget what comes next.. and you usually look mildly incompetent in front of your patient. It all comes with time.

There are times I still get flustered even now. Like yesterday when I had to examine a poor gentleman with parksinsons and intense blepharospasm. Trying to get views was fuuuuun !

Just remember those attendings were just like you a few short years ago. It's hard not to let them get to you. Feel free to vent on us any time ( it's what we're here for!)

Best wishes !!
CPW
 
OD,

You also have to remember that last month your attendings were dealing with the current fourth years, who by then had been through their entire third year. So they had a much better idea of what they're doing, just as you will next year.

I know if I was attending, I'd be a little frustrated at having to go from third years who finally figured out what they're doing to brand new third years. Attendings are people too. They're not just frustrated at you.

By the way, soon problem focused exams will be a blessing. It's highly annoying to sit there doing vergence ranges on 72 year old cataract patient.

And don't worry about making your patients wait. Don't even worry if they get hungry (unless they're diabetic 😀). When you go to a school for your exam, you'd better be cognizant of the fact that students are examining you and it will take a while.

Tom Stickel
Indiana U. 2001
 
Tom_Stickel said:
By the way, soon problem focused exams will be a blessing. It's highly annoying to sit there doing vergence ranges on 72 year old cataract patient.

ah yes.. those days weren't too long ago :laugh: (especially if you were in family practice with a PEDS attending) 🙄
 
One of my patients go so hungry she took a break from my exam, went to popeye's chicken, came back and ate a huge thing of chicken in front of me! It was crazy for the half hour we were trying to figure out where she went. She told me she had to use the restroom. Apparently, the restroom at popeye's.

Patients are funny🙂

T-4 hours until ocular disease final . Off to study.

Eyegirl.
 
Eyegirl2k7 said:
One of my patients go so hungry she took a break from my exam, went to popeye's chicken, came back and ate a huge thing of chicken in front of me! It was crazy for the half hour we were trying to figure out where she went. She told me she had to use the restroom. Apparently, the restroom at popeye's.

Patients are funny🙂

T-4 hours until ocular disease final . Off to study.

Eyegirl.

where's the closest popeye's to ico? (please don't say ashland)
 
Scraders,
I'm really not sure. I don't really eat there. Probably 35th. I don't really walk around the neighborhood either (I like just my original holes, thanks.)

Eyegirl🙂
 
Thanks for sharing your experience. I think everyone remember how that first patient went, but it'll get better like many have said.

Best of Luck to you
 
Eyegirl2k7 said:
One of my patients go so hungry she took a break from my exam, went to popeye's chicken, came back and ate a huge thing of chicken in front of me! It was crazy for the half hour we were trying to figure out where she went. She told me she had to use the restroom. Apparently, the restroom at popeye's.

Patients are funny🙂

T-4 hours until ocular disease final . Off to study.

Eyegirl.

How come I never get patients like this. lol I would have asked for a piece of chicken also. Just kidding.
 
Eyegirl2k7 said:
Scraders,
I'm really not sure. I don't really eat there. Probably 35th. I don't really walk around the neighborhood either (I like just my original holes, thanks.)

Eyegirl🙂

haha, you're right...there is one on 35th street. i drove around the neighborhood just to see what types of restaurants were in the area.

"love that chicken from popeyes!"
 
I feel like we're constantly being rushed in clinic, it's not at all what I expected it to be like. Our supervisors are always yelling at us to go faster, faster, faster, and I don't feel like I'm doing a truly adequate exam on any of the patients I've been seeing.

I've only been in clinic for a month for a few hours a week, so I'm still very new at this. I know that the only way we're going to get more efficient at our exams is if we are pushed, but I don't understand why that is the very first thing to be stressed with us. Aren't we there to learn how to do the procedures correctly and well first, and secondly to learn to do everything faster? The clinic is a business, but it is a school first.

I am very frustrated by my experience in clinic so far. It has definitely gotten better since my first day (see the first post in this thread), but I feel like I'm learning how to rush through patients instead of actually learning anything.

🙁
 
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OD07 said:
I feel like we're constantly being rushed in clinic, it's not at all what I expected it to be like. Our supervisors are always yelling at us to go faster, faster, faster, and I don't feel like I'm doing a truly adequate exam on any of the patients I've been seeing.

I've only been in clinic for a month for a few hours a week, so I'm still very new at this. I know that the only way we're going to get more efficient at our exams is if we are pushed, but I don't understand why that is the very first thing to be stressed with us. Aren't we there to learn how to do the procedures correctly and well first, and secondly to learn to do everything faster? The clinic is a business, but it is a school first.

I am very frustrated by my experience in clinic so far. It has definitely gotten better since my first day (see the first post in this thread), but I feel like I'm learning how to rush through patients instead of actually learning anything.

🙁

i dont agree with supervisors yelling at students because it only makes them more nervous in front of the patient... i know of doctors who always yell... and i never understand that.... others can portray what they feel in a kind way, and also let you know that you need to hurry without making you feel like crap... that's what i like...
 
OD07 said:
I feel like we're constantly being rushed in clinic, it's not at all what I expected it to be like. Our supervisors are always yelling at us to go faster, faster, faster, and I don't feel like I'm doing a truly adequate exam on any of the patients I've been seeing.

I've only been in clinic for a month for a few hours a week, so I'm still very new at this. I know that the only way we're going to get more efficient at our exams is if we are pushed, but I don't understand why that is the very first thing to be stressed with us. Aren't we there to learn how to do the procedures correctly and well first, and secondly to learn to do everything faster? The clinic is a business, but it is a school first.

I am very frustrated by my experience in clinic so far. It has definitely gotten better since my first day (see the first post in this thread), but I feel like I'm learning how to rush through patients instead of actually learning anything.

🙁

Make sure your review your charts at the end of clinic. Note what you did and why. What was the cheif complaint? What findings led to your diagnosis? What tests gave no useful information? What could you do differently next time? You are only going to learn if you put forth the effort. The attendings are worried about you getting through the patients and learning your "finger" skills. You need to learn the skills but at the same time learn from the patients. Nobody said you can't learn from them after they are already gone.

Edit: I should note that this is from someone who has been on both sides of the desk - student and attending doctor.
 
xmattODx said:
Make sure your review your charts at the end of clinic. Note what you did and why. What was the cheif complaint? What findings led to your diagnosis? What tests gave no useful information? What could you do differently next time? You are only going to learn if you put forth the effort. The attendings are worried about you getting through the patients and learning your "finger" skills. You need to learn the skills but at the same time learn from the patients. Nobody said you can't learn from them after they are already gone.

Edit: I should note that this is from someone who has been on both sides of the desk - student and attending doctor.
I agree with what you're saying about getting out what you put into the experience. I think it's not right to rush students through their exams, though. It's not teaching the student anything except how to take shortcuts (which there is definitely a place for, but not until you know what you're doing!), and it's not doing anything for the patient, either.

As a supervisor, what impressed you about the students you supervised? What were they doing differently from the other students that made them do well?
 
r_salis said:
I agree with what you're saying about getting out what you put into the experience. I think it's not right to rush students through their exams, though. It's not teaching the student anything except how to take shortcuts (which there is definitely a place for, but not until you know what you're doing!), and it's not doing anything for the patient, either.

As a supervisor, what impressed you about the students you supervised? What were they doing differently from the other students that made them do well?

i notice there are doctors who are very laid back - and will never rush you at all, and there are those who rush like there's no tommorow...

in a way, the attendings should all agree to some standarization in a sense... so that you dont feel like you're doing nothing one day, and then rushed like heck the next day...