Hospitals refusing to let me shadow :(

[junkct]

Basically I'm trying to get some shadowing experiences under my belt. I've worked/volunteered at two hospitals for about a year now, and when I went to the volunteer services to ask them if they knew of any good doctors to shadow or any way an undergrad could get some shadowing experiences, they literally told me that "shadowing is discouraged and that there are many other ways of learning about the medical field without intruding on patients' privacy". No joke. Those were the exact words from pretty much both of them.

Now I thought that shadowing is supposed to be one of the BEST ways to go about learning more about the medical field, and that hospitals and volunteer services (who work with a lot of pre-meds) should be encouraging shadowing (you know, so that they can foster students' interests, help students sort out their career goals, give more medical experience to students, help put strong students into medical school, make better doctors, etc.). Based on other people's experiences here, they've pretty much been able to easily get shadowing experiences, but I feel like the people who I talked to at the hospital really didn't understand how vital such an experience can be.

I'm a little confused. Did I do something wrong? Should I have talked to someone else? I honestly didn't expect to get flat-out refused like that, especially from people who claim to be "helping pre-meds' interests".

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[Quix]

It may depend on who you talk to, but if the hospital is concerned about essentially unaffiliated people having access to otherwise confidential information, then they are well within their rights.

As a work-around, I'd suggest either approaching clinicians with whom you feel you have a rapport, or talking with faculty at your college to see if they have any clinical contacts.

 

[disarticulate]

I had the same problem a few years ago, except I hadn't even had volunteer experience yet. My girlfriend helped me put together 10 packets. The packets included a cover letter, photo, CV, and transcript all paperclipped to a file folder, then sealed in a large mailing envelope. I went and dropped the packets off at the counter of some local orthopod offices. Got a call back 3 days afterwards from Dr. O'Neill and it worked out great!

The key here for me is that my girlfriend helped me out. It really kept my motivation up as well as my confidence, which is necessary when a sophomore undergrad tries to slither his way into ortho shadowing. Maybe it will work for you, too!

 

[disarticulate]

Also, if there is a teaching hospital / medical school near by that you could drop a packet off to it would most likely be just as successful. Most teaching hospital have all sorts of students doing all sorts of crazy things to patients that would be questionable at a private hospital, haha. Med Students, Nursing Students, EMT Students, etc...

 

[RySerr21]

Its easier to shadow at a private practice or clinic, IMO. Hospitals have all these regulations and there is all this paperwork, HIPPA, etc. so its not surprising that they dont want to do it.

This program is really useful for finding doctors to shadow. They have already agreed to have students shadow them, so you wont be rejected. The only thing you should search for is City and State, becuase if you add any other criteria it will limit the number of doctors that match. Best to search broadely and the pick from the ones that show up. This is best if you live in a big city as there will be more docs to choose from. If you are from a small rural town, not likely you will find anything via this program. Hope it helps, and good luck.

 

[beyondbethany]

I agree with some of the other posts, I always found it easier to shadow at physician clinics. A physician has a little more autonomy in their own clinic and can decide for themselves how to handle privacy issues.

As for shadowing in hospitals, you may find it easier to work backwards - from the doc to administration. Ask docs you know if you can shadow them and if they can give you a little help with some of the administrative hoops.

While I was collecting shadowing experiences, I didn't know too many physicians personally. I used every contact and connection I could find - family friends, friends of friends, my premed advisor and university alumni. Throw out a wide net and hopfeully you will come back with some great shadowing experiences. Also look for premed intership programs if they are available through hospitals in your area.

 

[disarticulate]

"It's the brick walls in life that show you how badly you want something."
-Dr. Randy Pausch

 

[justdoit31]

I had that problem but was fortunate enough to have a physician willing to fight to get me in... she spent a good 6 months pushing through paperwork and red tape and I was able to get a 2 week shadowing pass (basically could be at the hospital as much as I wanted for 2 weeks but none after that)... it went great and all the physicians in the department were amazing!

I would suggest talking to physicians when you volunteer and seeing if they can help you with the hospital bureaucracy.

 

[CarlATHF]

Also try shadowing a specialty in which it is not so invasive (i.e. you should try to shadow an ENT doc or an opthalmologist, not an OB-GYN or Urologist).

 

[junkct]

If you are near an academic teaching hospital, you might get more luck then at a private hospital. I have never had trouble finding shadowing becaue USF docs and KCOM docs at the MD and DO hospitals have been more then happy to help out students get opportunities so long as they've had a volunteer orientationa and background check first. Also, family friends who are docs were helpful to some friends of mine.

yes, I'm at a (big) teaching hospital... which is really why this surprised me

Overall, I understand all the regulations/bureacracy and whatnot, and I totally agree that such regulations should be in place, but I figured that hospitals (especially medical teaching hospitals) would be more willing to at least try to WORK with me to make a shadowing experience possible, even moreso after knowing my intentions (call me immature, but I figured that teaching hospitals have some sort of an obligation to give undergrads a taste of the medical field, especially since it's such a vital component of a successful medical school application).

Furthermore, it's not like I walked up to the front desk and demanded that they give me a doctor to shadow..
I went to the volunteer services, who (A) I have a 1-2 year history with, and (B) claim to help their volunteers/students get all the experience they want/need to learn more about the field.
And once again, I didn't really ask them to do any work for me; I just asked about the procedure and if they knew of any good doctors to shadow. I was willing to go out and find my own doctor to shadow in the hospital... all I really wanted was to get approval to do that.

I dunno, maybe I'll attempt to contact doctors on my own and work backwards as someone else suggested. But honestly, if it's this difficult at each hospital, then how the heck are people here getting hundreds of hours with like 15 physicians!??!

 

[RySerr21]

yes, I'm at a (big) teaching hospital... which is really why this surprised me

Overall, I understand all the regulations/bureacracy and whatnot, and I totally agree that such regulations should be in place, but I figured that hospitals (especially medical teaching hospitals) would be more willing to at least try to WORK with me to make a shadowing experience possible, even moreso after knowing my intentions (call me immature, but I figured that teaching hospitals have some sort of an obligation to give undergrads a taste of the medical field, especially since it's such a vital component of a successful medical school application).

Furthermore, it's not like I walked up to the front desk and demanded that they give me a doctor to shadow..
I went to the volunteer services, who (A) I have a 1-2 year history with, and (B) claim to help their volunteers/students get all the experience they want/need to learn more about the field.
And once again, I didn't really ask them to do any work for me; I just asked about the procedure and if they knew of any good doctors to shadow. I was willing to go out and find my own doctor to shadow in the hospital... all I really wanted was to get approval to do that.

I dunno, maybe I'll attempt to contact doctors on my own and work backwards as someone else suggested. But honestly, if it's this difficult at each hospital, then how the heck are people here getting hundreds of hours with like 15 physicians!??!

did you bypass the posts that said its a billion times easier to shadow a doctor who is at his/her own clinic/private practice?

 

[turkeyjerky]

It may depend on who you talk to, but if the hospital is concerned about essentially unaffiliated people having access to otherwise confidential information, then they are well within their rights.

As a work-around, I'd suggest either approaching clinicians with whom you feel you have a rapport, or talking with faculty at your college to see if they have any clinical contacts.

No, it's not within the hospital's rights to keep a student from shadowing a physician. It's within the rights of the patient to either allow or disallow the student to accompany the doctor during their visits, and it's up to the doctor's discretion whether or not to allow the student to shadow at all.

The hospital's administration really has nothing to do with it whatsoever, so ask the doctor you want to shadow directly. If they're anything at all like pretty much every doctor I've ever met, they'll be happy to let you follow them around for a few days.

 

[Lukkie]

follow them whether they like it or not

 

[135892]

Also try shadowing a specialty in which it is not so invasive (i.e. you should try to shadow an ENT doc or an opthalmologist, not an OB-GYN or Urologist).

Haha, yeah this is true. When I shadowed in radiology, even interventional, all they had me do was sign one form and that was it. But to shadow a surgeon (in the same hospital), I had to go through this entire process...

 

[Rainingstairs]

follow them whether they like it or not

lol, um ok STALKER

 

[dr zaius]

No, it's not within the hospital's rights to keep a student from shadowing a physician. It's within the rights of the patient to either allow or disallow the student to accompany the doctor during their visits, and it's up to the doctor's discretion whether or not to allow the student to shadow at all.

The hospital's administration really has nothing to do with it whatsoever, so ask the doctor you want to shadow directly. If they're anything at all like pretty much every doctor I've ever met, they'll be happy to let you follow them around for a few days.

I second this. I've never had a doctor turn me down, but I volunteer at an amazing hospital. The patient population is primarily uninsured and are usually completely fine with me watching anything including checking for anal fissures (not as exciting as you'd think). A few times when an ER patient would require surgery I'd hang out near the area like a lost puppy/find any excuse to get something for the doctor (betadine, sterile gauze, anything!) so I could strike up a conversation before the patient was transferred to the surgical ward, and on multiple occasions I was asked if I'd like to scrub in and watch the surgery. I was even allowed to cut some sutures, hold a retractor, etc a few times. I thought it was one of the most exciting things I had ever been allowed to do. I feel like this could only happen at an underfunded, struggling, county hospital, though.

 

[sunny1]

If you know any of the docs, you need to ask them directly if you can shadow them. Volunteer services isn't the way to do it.

 

[locus000]

Look in to shadowing at Walk-In Clinic and Free Clinic. The doctors there are nice (from my experiences) and they are usually the "Topdog" so there aren't any admin or red tape. They even let you do alot of stuff that a normal hospital wont even dare let a student do.

One tip about contacting the doctor... Be very friendly and nice to their secretaries. Usually the doctors are too busy to call you back and the secretary will determine when and where you can shadow. So if you know the secretary, they can get you in 🙂

 

[doctorobvious]

I think shadowing is a lot like finding a job: connections help a LOT. Try asking your friends or family if they know a doctor that you could shadow. My only shadowing experience was with an anesthesiologist that one of my friends had shadowed before. I just emailed her and said "I'm a friend of X. I would really like to shadow you and learn more about anesthesiology." The next week I was in scrubs watching surgeries. The hospital administration didn't know a thing about it, and I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have liked it.

 

[Premed Worrier]

As already mentioned private clinics are great as they are run by the doctors that you shadow. I just cold-called until I found somewhere. Another thought is around here we have a free clinic. I volunteer at ours and as part of that 'agreement' the director said that I could shadow physicians when they are willing to put up with me. You can shadow at a free clinic probably much easier than either a hospital or a private practice. Then possibly make some contacts and go from there. Good Luck.

 

[Disinence2]

I hear ya.. I missed out on some shadowing experiences as an undergrad because of hospital policy.

Even as a medical student I've run into some issues. Patient privacy is a very serious issue nowadays, like the above poster said academic medical centers are usually more familiar with the process. If you can find some way to be a volunteer or get a badge then your usually set. You can try offering to take the hospitals HIPPA training if you really want to work with a specific doctor.

 

[ShaneK]

In my town the hospital does not allow shadowing either but the clinics do. Also I know this is a DO program but it could be of use to you. You go to Mentor Exchange> Find Mentor, fill out the appropriate fields (the less you fill out the more results you will get) and then it will show doctors who have agreed to be shadowed and gives you the info needed to contact them.

http://www.osteopathic.org/YOM/Mentor_main.htm

 

[njbmd]

Contact the local medical society who can likely put you in contact with individual physicians. Some hospitals will do this through their volunteer programs but most don't. The local medical society (especially in cities like DC) can bypass the hospital and make the direct link for you. What the physician does in his/her practice what you want to observe anyway. The hospital is just a small part of this for most physicians.

 

[RUc10]

It will probably be a bit easier if you contact a hospital that is affiliated with a medical school. Teaching hospitals understand shadowing a lot more than others IMO and will probably be more likely to let you shadow a physician. That being said, I've never had a problem and I've shadowed 4 physicians already. All were actually in the clinical setting but the most recent whom I'm still shadowing lets me go into the OR with him and on occasion the surgeries are actually at a hospital instead of the surgical suite he has. Normally whoever the director is will question me about who I am, why I want to be there, and what my future prospects are but after I answer all the questions well they're normally seem pretty cool about letting me in. It seems like the process is a lot smoother if you know the doctor first and go in with him as opposed to contacting a hospital and asking for a doctor to shadow.

 

[junkct]

woah, I totally forgot about this thread from November. I guess a little update might be worth it. I ended up bypassing the volunteer services and contacted the doctor directly. He was very responsive and contacted me within 2 days and wanted to set up a meeting with me. I shadowed him for 3 full (8 hour) shifts and it was awesome! I told about how volunteer services discouraged me from shadowing and he said that they often do that and it was good I came straight to him. He has since referrred me to other specialists in other fields I'm interested in. this all happened at a LARGE teaching hospital, so that might be important to note. I guess it's a lesson to be learned; go straight to the doctors. The worst they can do is say no. but at least you tried.

 

[ANF1986]

woah, I totally forgot about this thread from November. I guess a little update might be worth it. I ended up bypassing the volunteer services and contacted the doctor directly. He was very responsive and contacted me within 2 days and wanted to set up a meeting with me. I shadowed him for 3 full (8 hour) shifts and it was awesome! I told about how volunteer services discouraged me from shadowing and he said that they often do that and it was good I came straight to him. He has since referrred me to other specialists in other fields I'm interested in. this all happened at a LARGE teaching hospital, so that might be important to note. I guess it's a lesson to be learned; go straight to the doctors. The worst they can do is say no. but at least you tried.

Volunteer services did the same BS to me. I did exactly what you did and it worked fine. The docs will often ask you to wear scrubs or a lab coat, and I was always introduced to patients ambiguously as a "student"...Now whenever I want to shadow this particular doc he just tells me to text him the night before, so its a good arrangement.

 

[aeob52388]

I had an incredible experience shadowing a couple surgeons at the hospital where i work (with their permission, of course). unfortunately, one of the higher ups in the nursing department heard about it from the nurses, who seemingly didn't like their unit secretary coming in in scrubs on the weekend to shadow. she sent a nasty email to the doctors involved, saying that too much time was being spent on teaching me instead of patient care, and that it was a violation of privacy since when i was in the hospital outside of work hours, i was considered a visitor.

obviously i respect patient privacy, as it's a critical aspect of my job. the same information i heard/saw on rounds on a given Sunday while shadowing was the same that i'd see or hear the next day while I was officially working. additionally, this is one of the nation's top teaching hospitals, you'd think that they would be a little more accepting of helping aspiring future healthcare workers learn. i don't really think it was an issue of patient care and privacy. it was more of an issue of people being catty and feeling threatened by what i was doing. if i wasn't doing most of the shadowing on the floor where i work, i have a strong feeling this would not have been an issue. 6 months later, i am still bitter about it. despite this, i still got a handful of days in, and it was absolutely incredible. i found another institution, outside of the hospital where i work, to do clinical volunteer work and outreach...just fingersticks and BPs and general health education stuff, but still a really good learning experience about how to interact with people.

my advice is to make absolutely certain that you get appropriate permission/clearance from the necessary people in order to avoid any hassles. even if you get permission from the physician you'll be shadowing, you still may need additional permission from the particular department, and from the institution itself. and someone else's idea about shadowing in a clinic or a doctor's own practice is also wise. the less people with red tape to get through, the better.

 

[BlitzSleep]

If you know any of the docs, you need to ask them directly if you can shadow them. Volunteer services isn't the way to do it.

Exactly. It's all about who you know.

 

[Doubleme]

If you are near an academic teaching hospital, you might get more luck then at a private hospital. I have never had trouble finding shadowing becaue USF docs and KCOM docs at the MD and DO hospitals have been more then happy to help out students get opportunities so long as they've had a volunteer orientationa and background check first. Also, family friends who are docs were helpful to some friends of mine.

Hi I go to USF and I need help finding a Doctor to shadow...May you help me please?

Thank you!