How competitive are SMP programs?

[DNARNAPROTEIN]

I'm considering doing an SMP program and was wondering how competitve it is to get accepted to one of these programs. On the Georgetown website, it states that the entering class profile had a GPA of 3.3 and MCAT of 33, but no info on admission percentages. I was hoping some of you who are either in a program now or researching one for the future may have some information on this. Thank you.

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[Vihsadas]

I'm considering doing an SMP program and was wondering how competitve it is to get accepted to one of these programs. On the Georgetown website, it states that the entering class profile had a GPA of 3.3 and MCAT of 33, but no info on admission percentages. I was hoping some of you who are either in a program now or researching one for the future may have some information on this. Thank you.

One of my friends just completed the georgetown SMP. I was planning on attending the SMP for 2008, however my friend tells me that because of my MCAT I may have a hard time getting accepted (too high!). The SMP program tries to target students who they feel are 'borderline' or dont' have a very high chance of gaining an acceptance. On the other hand, they want to choose students that definitely have some potential. With your GPA and MCAT, you should DEFINITELY apply to some SMP programs. You have a very, very good chance of being accepted. Just be wary that the georgetown SMP deadline is dec. 1st this year I believe, and admissions is rolling, and they do get a TON of applications.

Also, the program itself is highly competitive, and more difficult to do well in than actual medical school (because the grading curve is so much harsher). The class is graded against the medical school average, and thus to get an 'A' in a course is very difficult. For instance, if the georgetown med program averages 82 on a med exam, the SMP will need a 90 or 91 to get an 'A' in that course. Additionally, competitive SMP GPAs from georgetown tend to be on the VERY high side. 3.7+ is competitive for the SMP, and 3.7 is borderline. If you are going to an SMP, MAKE SURE that you are going with the most stalwart of determination to get A's in EVERY course you take. Literally aim for a 3.9 or 4.0, everything else is suspect.

good luck, and if I don't get an acceptance this year, maybe I'll see you there in 2008!

 

[nabeel76]

Vihsadas - are you sure about that? I too was looking at the G-town SMP program and had much of the same concerns. Basically, that it would be a lot harder to get A's in a class full of med students and that it could possibly backfire and keep me from ever getting into med school. I then started to research and subsequently spoke with several of their advisors on the physios site and found out the following info (feel free to correct me if you have any conflicting info as I am still considering this SMP program):

1) Yes, it is a very intense year and that you should expect and will be working your ass off - that is an understatement. And yes you will be graded on the medical school curve but however you are not directly competing against them. For example, as far as I know you get graded based on the numerical curve that the class sets but thats were it stops. I don't believe the curve gets scaled to meet an expected grade distribution or percentage. Every physio can get an A.

2) In addition the grading scale is set up to take in to account that you are competing with medical students in a more competetive environment than your traditional undergraduate courses and that succeding in this environment does not necessarily mean getting all A's. I don't remember off hand, but if you score within the average of the med student class your grade I believe would be a B or so. A score within the High pass was in the A- range - I believe, and a score in the Honors range is an A.

3) I was also informed that scoring in the average in the med school courses, B's, is competetive - they are not expecting you to outperform the medical students. I doubt the success rate for matriculation into med school would be as high as it is for SMP students if you needed to score in the honors range for the majority of your courses. I also hear that of the 11 or so courses that only 6 of them are medical school courses, I believe the other 5 or so are graduate courses. That also contributes to bring up your overall GPA up at the end of the year.

That is just the info I had obtained, if you have heard anything contrary to that or have any direct experience about the process, do share, as I am considering the program myself and do not want to jeopradize my chances at getting into medical school by placing myself in overly competetive environment thus possibly blowing any chance that I might have at med school when I can just as easily take some undergrad post bacc courses and at least get in somewhere.

 

[Vihsadas]

Vihsadas - are you sure about that? I too was looking at the G-town SMP program and had much of the same concerns. Basically, that it would be a lot harder to get A's in a class full of med students and that it could possibly backfire and keep me from ever getting into med school. I then started to research and subsequently spoke with several of their advisors on the physios site and found out the following info (feel free to correct me if you have any conflicting info as I am still considering this SMP program):

1) Yes, it is a very intense year and that you should expect and will be working your ass off - that is an understatement. And yes you will be graded on the medical school curve but however you are not directly competing against them. For example, as far as I know you get graded based on the numerical curve that the class sets but thats were it stops. I don't believe the curve gets scaled to meet an expected grade distribution or percentage. Every physio can get an A.

2) In addition the grading scale is set up to take in to account that you are competing with medical students in a more competetive environment than your traditional undergraduate courses and that succeding in this environment does not necessarily mean getting all A's. I don't remember off hand, but if you score within the average of the med student class your grade I believe would be a B or so. A score within the High pass was in the A- range - I believe, and a score in the Honors range is an A.

3) I was also informed that scoring in the average in the med school courses, B's, is competetive - they are not expecting you to outperform the medical students. I doubt the success rate for matriculation into med school would be as high as it is for SMP students if you needed to score in the honors range for the majority of your courses. I also hear that of the 11 or so courses that only 6 of them are medical school courses, I believe the other 5 or so are graduate courses. That also contributes to bring up your overall GPA up at the end of the year.

That is just the info I had obtained, if you have heard anything contrary to that or have any direct experience about the process, do share, as I am considering the program myself and do not want to jeopradize my chances at getting into medical school by placing myself in overly competetive environment thus possibly blowing any chance that I might have at med school when I can just as easily take some undergrad post bacc courses and at least get in somewhere.

Number 1) is 100% true!! That's one of the beautiful things about the SMP program, you are not competing with EACH OTHER, you're only competing against the med students. This is a great way to run a program like this because it breeds cooperation among the SMP students.

Number 2) I'm not really sure what they told you on the phone, but my friend has specifically told me that to get A's in the SMP program you should ALWAYS be shooting for 90+. Alot of the time, the grading curve is very narrow. Something like: 89.2 - 90.1 = A, 88.4 - 89.1 = A-, 86.8 - 88.3 = B+
etc...I made the exact number up, but I have seen the grading curve for the important classes (like physiology), and I'm sure about the narrowness of the curve. I remember in one course he said that he missed the A by one question, ended up with an 88 instead of an 89 or something crazy like that.

Number 3) No! This is absolutely false. A 3.0 in an SMP is NOT COMPETITIVE At all! I am sure, from multiple, multiple accounts from my friend, that a 3.5 in the SMP program is not good enough. Directly from a professors mouth: A 3.7 in the SMP is 'middle of the pack' when compared to your peers. B's are not competitive. You should be aiming for a 4.0.

As a case example (which I know isn't proof), there are pleny of people with 3.7~something (little higher) in the SMP, great ECs, good interview skills and a 30+ MCATs that did not get into any school...you must have above a 3.7 in my opinion to have a very solid shot (even at georgetown).

 

[nabeel76]

I had an example breakdown of the grading curve provided to me at some point but can't seem to locate that email at the moment, but it was pretty much in line with what is posted on their site.

http://www8.georgetown.edu/departments/physiology/physios/courseinfo.htm

Just scroll down to the grading section.

So basically the top 25 - 30 percent of the class is in the Honors (A) to High Pass (A- to B+) range. The majority of the class is in the Pass range and that equates to a B. Now if you can find anything out there that contradicts this please pass that info my way, but realistically speaking, let's take a step back and ask our selves what the intent of the program is in the first place. Now I am going to go out on a limb here and propose that the principle intent of the program is to prove that the SMP student can successfully handle the rigors of medical school. Would you agree with me here? I am also going to propose that you do not necessarily need to score in the top 20 percent of the class to prove this. After all, they do specifically state that the majority of the medical class scores within the Pass (B) range. Now if I were an adcom evaluating an SMP student that is scoring in this Pass (B) range alongside the majority of the accepted med students, I would think that this student has successfully shown that he CAN handle the rigors of medical school – wouldn't you? In addition this particular SMP program boasts an 85+ % acceptance rate into medical school for the SMP students, now taking this into consideration, in addition to the fact that the majority of accepted Georgetown medical students cannot themselves score within the top 15 percent of the class (A to A- ; 4.0 – 3.7 GPA) would it be realistic to expect SMP students to achieve this? And if so, would you say that 85 percent of SMP applicants will achieve what 80 to 85 percent of the actual med students do not? This rationale is all in line with what I was specifically told and I will try and locate that info and pass it on.

However, I also do realize that the SMP student needs to prove their worth, even more so than the average medical student, so obviously any body that is seriously undertaking this challenge needs to consistently work and aspire to get within the top 30 percent of the class (B+ to A-, A range). But do realize that a 3.7 (top 15 percent of class, A- , 3.7 average) is unlikely for most students. Especially for SMP students that had trouble excelling in the sciences or the MCAT as undergrads. Hard work can only get you so far! Once again scoring alongside the majority of medical students (Pass, B range) is still an accomplishment in my book, and at Georgetown you are hanging with some of the best students in the country.

But I do agree with you, a cumulative 3.0 GPA would not be that competitive, in fact that is the minimum GPA requirement to even graduate; however, what you have to realize is that only 6 of the 11 classes you take are actual medical school courses. And from what I hear the 5 non-medical courses, although work intense, have highly generous curves. I have heard that the majority of students can achieve A's and A-‘s in these courses. So achieving A's in these courses is imperative to your success and perfectly within reach. Now taking that into consideration and for the sake of argument, assume that all courses are 3 credits for a total of 33 total credits (11 courses), if a student scores a Pass (B) in all medical courses and A's in all of the other courses they will end up graduating with approximately a 3.5 GPA, which is very competitive in my opinion. Now if you strive and can manage a couple A's, A-‘s or B+'s, in your med school courses you will even be in better shape and possibly turn some of the adcoms heads.

So Vihsades, maybe you were referring to a cumulative 3.0 GPA as not being competitive, which is absolutely correct, but a 3.0 in just the med school courses, while not doing much to distinguish you for Georgetown or top programs, will still however give you a good shot at getting in somewhere. That is why there is such a high acceptance rate into med school out of this program. Once again as I had previously mentioned I too am looking at this program and if you have any documented information that proves contrary to this please do share, I am not trying to needlessly put myself in a position where I am going to be expected to consistently outperform nearly 90 percent of a class filled with the best students in the country.

 

[Vihsadas]

I had an example breakdown of the grading curve provided to me at some point but can’t seem to locate that email at the moment, but it was pretty much in line with what is posted on their site.

http://www8.georgetown.edu/departments/physiology/physios/courseinfo.htm

Just scroll down to the grading section.

So basically the top 25 - 30 percent of the class is in the Honors (A) to High Pass (A- to B+) range. The majority of the class is in the Pass range and that equates to a B. Now if you can find anything out there that contradicts this please pass that info my way, but realistically speaking, let’s take a step back and ask our selves what the intent of the program is in the first place. Now I am going to go out on a limb here and propose that the principle intent of the program is to prove that the SMP student can successfully handle the rigors of medical school. Would you agree with me here? I am also going to propose that you do not necessarily need to score in the top 20 percent of the class to prove this. After all, they do specifically state that the majority of the medical class scores within the Pass (B) range. Now if I were an adcom evaluating an SMP student that is scoring in this Pass (B) range alongside the majority of the accepted med students, I would think that this student has successfully shown that he CAN handle the rigors of medical school – wouldn’t you? In addition this particular SMP program boasts an 85+ % acceptance rate into medical school for the SMP students, now taking this into consideration, in addition to the fact that the majority of accepted Georgetown medical students cannot themselves score within the top 15 percent of the class (A to A- ; 4.0 – 3.7 GPA) would it be realistic to expect SMP students to achieve this? And if so, would you say that 85 percent of SMP applicants will achieve what 80 to 85 percent of the actual med students do not? This rationale is all in line with what I was specifically told and I will try and locate that info and pass it on.

I've talked in detail with the administration at the SMP, and I've read all of the info on their website. My application to the program is already filled out. I know all the information that you are citing...however, what I said previously, I still 100% support.

I do agree that the intent of the program is to prove that student can handle the rigors of medical school.
I further (personal opinion) agree that scoring above the medical school average (3.0ish and higher) proves this.

However, what yours or my 'personal opinion' states, or what 'seems logical' doesn't matter in the slightest. The fact of the matter is, everything that I've heard from actual students of the SMP who are trying to get into medical school contradicts this. Adcoms do not think in this way...They want to see that you completely wrecked the SMP. Anything less is suspect, regardless of what is 'officially' posted on the georgetown site.

My best and closest friend has given me his perspective; the perspective of student who has graduated from the SMP, and did not get into medical school yet. I have also heard many experiences from others in his class (2007 class).

The reasoning you use in your post is definitely 'logical', but the bottom line is that what is logical, is not necessarily what is practical. Adcoms are not going to look at your application and say 'Oh he got a 3.5 in the SMP, that means that he did better than the average of med students, and that means that he is academically prepared'.
It doesn't work that way, no matter how 'logical' it sounds. Afterall, the medical school admissions process is often far from logical.

Let me reiterate that I 100% agree that it SHOULD work that way...from the students of the SMP I have heard about that DID get into medical school, they are often at the top of the class. I really believe that the SMP is better preparation for medical school than an undergraduate degree. While we both agree that it should work the way that you stated, I urge you to be as skeptical as possible that you will be treated as such.

However, I also do realize that the SMP student needs to prove their worth, even more so than the average medical student, so obviously any body that is seriously undertaking this challenge needs to consistently work and aspire to get within the top 30 percent of the class (B+ to A-, A range). But do realize that a 3.7 (top 15 percent of class, A- , 3.7 average) is unlikely for most students. Especially for SMP students that had trouble excelling in the sciences or the MCAT as undergrads. Hard work can only get you so far! Once again scoring alongside the majority of medical students (Pass, B range) is still an accomplishment in my book, and at Georgetown you are hanging with some of the best students in the country.

But I do agree with you, a cumulative 3.0 GPA would not be that competitive, in fact that is the minimum GPA requirement to even graduate; however, what you have to realize is that only 6 of the 11 classes you take are actual medical school courses. And from what I hear the 5 non-medical courses, although work intense, have highly generous curves. I have heard that the majority of students can achieve A’s and A-‘s in these courses. So achieving A’s in these courses is imperative to your success and perfectly within reach. Now taking that into consideration and for the sake of argument, assume that all courses are 3 credits for a total of 33 total credits (11 courses), if a student scores a Pass (B) in all medical courses and A’s in all of the other courses they will end up graduating with approximately a 3.5 GPA, which is very competitive in my opinion. Now if you strive and can manage a couple A’s, A-‘s or B+’s, in your med school courses you will even be in better shape and possibly turn some of the adcoms heads.

So Vihsades, maybe you were referring to a cumulative 3.0 GPA as not being competitive, which is absolutely correct, but a 3.0 in just the med school courses, while not doing much to distinguish you for Georgetown or top programs, will still however give you a good shot at getting in somewhere. That is why there is such a high acceptance rate into med school out of this program. Once again as I had previously mentioned I too am looking at this program and if you have any documented information that proves contrary to this please do share, I am not trying to needlessly put myself in a position where I am going to be expected to consistently outperform nearly 90 percent of a class filled with the best students in the country.

No I do not have any documented info, and of course you should do your own research. However, I really do believe from everything that I've been exposed to that an 85% acceptance rate is extremely inflated. What is posted on Georgetown's website does not correspond with what I've heard from students who have been trying to get into medical school from the SMP, and have not yet.

The SMP program is a great program. If you know that you can succeed, then the only thing that is stopping you, is you. This is because the curve is not based on your classmates. Therefore, it is possible for everyone to get an 'A'. If you get in the higher GPA ranges in the SMPs you have a very good chance at getting into medical school. But do not be disillusioned that most schools will accept your SMP GPA over your undergraduate GPA. This is simply not true (except at Georgetown itself, NYMC, and few other schools). Further do not be disillusioned that a GPA that is anything below stellar will weigh heavily in favor of your application. I simply do not believe this is the case after what I have heard. And remember, I am looking at this program too! Just stay realistic.

Think about georgetown's motivations. It is in their best interest to make the program as appealing as possible. Take the information they show you on their website with a grain of salt.

From real-world experiences I have heard of I believe that 3.7 is competitive. Anything lower you are risking your chances. This program is a LAST chance attempt at medical school. Therefore you do not just have to perform as good as medical students, you MUST perform superior to them. If you are going to an SMP, be prepared to aim for the highest possible GPAs, and be very scared if you get anything below a 3.7 and you don't have a stellar MCAT...

 

[nabeel76]

Can I ask you what GPA your friends that have not got into med school yet have recieved from this program? Also are they applying while in the program? The 85 percent matriculation rate they advertise is for students that have already graduated and are applying the year after the completion of the program. I believe its only 40-50 percent for applicants applying during the program, and I suspect in these cases those applicants already had decent stats, they just needed that little extra, in which an above average grade as you and your friends have stated provides them. Also, you need to be somewhat competitive to even get into G-towns SMP, I guess its for applicants that are borderline competitive for med school already. So if you are somewhat competitive in the first place why risk the SMP? Can I ask why you just wouldn't enroll in a local 4 year as a non-degree student and just start taking a crap load of undergraduate science courses to raise your GPA?

I personally am not the gambling type and having graduated from a top undergraduate university am way too familiar with how tuff it can be to stay at the top. I can only imagine how tuff it will be to stay at the top at a competitive medical school. If what you are saying is true I would just start taking classes at a local university. Actually, I am currently taking some courses at the local university by my house, GMU in Fairfax, Virginia. If you are in the DC area, I want to let you know that I am finding this school WAY easier then my undergrad school. I am barely studying and acing everything? The courses are all upper level science courses too, I am quite baffled at how much of a difference there is here as opposed to where I went for my undergrad. Anyways I am starting to consider taking classes here to boost my GPA a little before applying. I was oringinally looking at the SMP cause I thought it would be cool to get a Masters and thought that if I could do well in the program that it would make me competitive for the top tiers. But if what you are saying is true, than I don't see why it is worth the risk? It's sort of gambling? Anyways keep me informed on any stats that you might happen to run across. I have already been leaning towards the idea of just random post bacc work at Mason since I started taking courses here this semester and have been finding them very easy. I might just do that after all.

I've talked in detail with the administration at the SMP, and I've read all of the info on their website. My application to the program is already filled out. I know all the information that you are citing...however, what I said previously, I still 100% support.

I do agree that the intent of the program is to prove that student can handle the rigors of medical school.
I further (personal opinion) agree that scoring above the medical school average (3.0ish and higher) proves this.

However, what yours or my 'personal opinion' states, or what 'seems logical' doesn't matter in the slightest. The fact of the matter is, everything that I've heard from actual students of the SMP who are trying to get into medical school contradicts this. Adcoms do not think in this way...They want to see that you completely wrecked the SMP. Anything less is suspect, regardless of what is 'officially' posted on the georgetown site.

My best and closest friend has given me his perspective; the perspective of student who has graduated from the SMP, and did not get into medical school yet. I have also heard many experiences from others in his class (2007 class).

The reasoning you use in your post is definitely 'logical', but the bottom line is that what is logical, is not necessarily what is practical. Adcoms are not going to look at your application and say 'Oh he got a 3.5 in the SMP, that means that he did better than the average of med students, and that means that he is academically prepared'.
It doesn't work that way, no matter how 'logical' it sounds. Afterall, the medical school admissions process is often far from logical.

Let me reiterate that I 100% agree that it SHOULD work that way...from the students of the SMP I have heard about that DID get into medical school, they are often at the top of the class. I really believe that the SMP is better preparation for medical school than an undergraduate degree. While we both agree that it should work the way that you stated, I urge you to be as skeptical as possible that you will be treated as such.



No I do not have any documented info, and of course you should do your own research. However, I really do believe from everything that I've been exposed to that an 85% acceptance rate is extremely inflated. What is posted on Georgetown's website does not correspond with what I've heard from students who have been trying to get into medical school from the SMP, and have not yet.

The SMP program is a great program. If you know that you can succeed, then the only thing that is stopping you, is you. This is because the curve is not based on your classmates. Therefore, it is possible for everyone to get an 'A'. If you get in the higher GPA ranges in the SMPs you have a very good chance at getting into medical school. But do not be disillusioned that most schools will accept your SMP GPA over your undergraduate GPA. This is simply not true (except at Georgetown itself, NYMC, and few other schools). Further do not be disillusioned that a GPA that is anything below stellar will weigh heavily in favor of your application. I simply do not believe this is the case after what I have heard. And remember, I am looking at this program too! Just stay realistic.

Think about georgetown's motivations. It is in their best interest to make the program as appealing as possible. Take the information they show you on their website with a grain of salt.

From real-world experiences I have heard of I believe that 3.7 is competitive. Anything lower you are risking your chances. This program is a LAST chance attempt at medical school. Therefore you do not just have to perform as good as medical students, you MUST perform superior to them. If you are going to an SMP, be prepared to aim for the highest possible GPAs, and be very scared if you get anything below a 3.7 and you don't have a stellar MCAT...

 

[Doctor Bagel]

I didn't do Georgetown's SMP nor did I seriously research it, but I've always been dubious of its acceptance statistics. They make it sound like the acceptance rates are for US allopathic schools, but I suspect they include offshore schools and osteopathic schools in there. If you check out this site listing where alumni go, you'll see that some do indeed wind up at those institutions.

http://smp.georgetown.edu/prevclass.htm

Now the thing to say is that most students who can be admitted to Georgetown's SMP program already have good enough stats to be admitted to schools like SGU, most osteopathic schools and the lower tier state allopathic schools. So having alumni go to these schools isn't necessarily a reflection of the SMP's quality or prestige. One common thing I've seen on SDN is applicants who did the SMP who then also applied more broadly the next year and got accepted. Is it the SMP or the new application strategy that did the trick? Can't say.

Anyway, question the stats and ask what they're based on.

 

[Vihsadas]

Can I ask you what GPA your friends that have not got into med school yet have recieved from this program? Also are they applying while in the program? The 85 percent matriculation rate they advertise is for students that have already graduated and are applying the year after the completion of the program. I believe its only 40-50 percent for applicants applying during the program, and I suspect in these cases those applicants already had decent stats, they just needed that little extra, in which an above average grade as you and your friends have stated provides them.

3.77 SMP GPA, and 31 MCAT I believe. Did not get in last year, and is reapplying (after SMP) this year. I'll let you know how it goes!

Also, you need to be somewhat competitive to even get into G-towns SMP, I guess its for applicants that are borderline competitive for med school already. So if you are somewhat competitive in the first place why risk the SMP? Can I ask why you just wouldn't enroll in a local 4 year as a non-degree student and just start taking a crap load of undergraduate science courses to raise your GPA?

If your GPA is salvagable (if you can get it to 3.5 in one year), then that's the way to go...Mine is not though. However, I killed the MCAT, so here's hoping that the upward trend in my GPA reflects well on me and I'll be in next september!

I personally am not the gambling type and having graduated from a top undergraduate university am way too familiar with how tuff it can be to stay at the top. I can only imagine how tuff it will be to stay at the top at a competitive medical school. If what you are saying is true I would just start taking classes at a local university. Actually, I am currently taking some courses at the local university by my house, GMU in Fairfax, Virginia. If you are in the DC area, I want to let you know that I am finding this school WAY easier then my undergrad school. I am barely studying and acing everything? The courses are all upper level science courses too, I am quite baffled at how much of a difference there is here as opposed to where I went for my undergrad. Anyways I am starting to consider taking classes here to boost my GPA a little before applying. I was oringinally looking at the SMP cause I thought it would be cool to get a Masters and thought that if I could do well in the program that it would make me competitive for the top tiers. But if what you are saying is true, than I don't see why it is worth the risk? It's sort of gambling? Anyways keep me informed on any stats that you might happen to run across. I have already been leaning towards the idea of just random post bacc work at Mason since I started taking courses here this semester and have been finding them very easy. I might just do that after all.

Well it is a gamble, and actually it is really cool for the master's degree! That's the big attractor for me. And you're other concern is also true, there are some top tiers that really like the SMP programs, and if you were a borderline applicant before (because of your GPA) then getting a 3.9/4.0 in an SMP program will definitely give you a competitive shot. Just make sure your MCAT is stellar.
Were in similar situations, I graduated from a top tier university (McGill) and I know how hard it is to get above 3.5 at top institutions. Unfortunately for me, I have so many credits under my belt, it would be impossible for me to raise my GPA from 3.31 to 3.5 in one year. Therefore, I think the SMP would be my best shot of advancing. However, I'm in the 99.7 percentile for the MCAT, so hopefully I won't even need the SMP...If you're in a similar situation, you should definitely decide if the SMP is the right place for you. Don't get me wrong, if you KILL the SMP program it's a HUGE bonus to your application. You just have to make sure that you're willing to work that hard to make it happen...
GL.

 

[UnderdogMD]

Just be wary that the georgetown SMP deadline is dec. 1st this year I believe, and admissions is rolling, and they do get a TON of applications.

You just scared the $hit out of me. Dec 1st is when they start accepting applications, not the deadline.

 

[Vihsadas]

You just scared the $hit out of me. Dec 1st is when they start accepting applications, not the deadline.

ahhhhhh....my bad for the typo. You're totally right. The rolling starts on dec. 1st. But the class fills up pretty quick.

 

[nabeel76]

Vihsadas,

I just looked at your stats and you really did kill the MCAT, good job! Also your GPA is not that low. If you apply broadly I don't see why you wouldn't get in to one of your state schools or at least somewhere? Hopefully something turns out for you this app cycle, I still think you are competitive for some medical schools. Who knows that MCAT score might even open some doors for you at some of the mid to top tiers.

My situation is a little different, I have a semester of F's in non-science courses, that stem back from 1995. I took a full time job as a computer engineer about a week into my first semester of college (It was a Community College). Needless to say I accepted the position and did not show back up to class... Some of my teachers took roll and automatically withdraw me since I didn't show up while the others just gave me 0's. I ended up with 4 F's and 2 W's that semester. In 2003 I decided to pursue medicine and went back to school and finished a degree in Biology in 2007. My cummulative GPA was a 3.7x, however when amcas incorporates that semester of F's my cummulative is going to drop to a 3.2-3.3 as well. Anyways, I haven't taken the MCAT yet but am hoping to set myself apart by killing this as well - hopefully it will work out. Anyways, Good luck and let me know how your friends in the SMP turn out. I am kind of surprised that your friend w/ a 3.7 has not recieved any acceptances? I don't see how much better he can possibly do, I mean an A average is an A average.

 

[Krisss17]

Number 2) I'm not really sure what they told you on the phone, but my friend has specifically told me that to get A's in the SMP program you should ALWAYS be shooting for 90+. Alot of the time, the grading curve is very narrow. Something like: 89.2 - 90.1 = A, 88.4 - 89.1 = A-, 86.8 - 88.3 = B+
etc...I made the exact number up, but I have seen the grading curve for the important classes (like physiology), and I'm sure about the narrowness of the curve. I remember in one course he said that he missed the A by one question, ended up with an 88 instead of an 89 or something crazy like that.

How is this different than any other class? To me that sounds like common sense...if you want an A, you shoot to get a 90 or greater, while a B is 80 - 89, etc.

 

[Vihsadas]

How is this different than any other class? To me that sounds like common sense...if you want an A, you shoot to get a 90 or greater, while a B is 80 - 89, etc.

Because these aren't normal Ugrad courses. 89 is B for you guys!?!? They make our exams very difficult. An 'A' for us is 85, and student still work their asses off to maintain that. At the SMP, I guarantee that you'll find getting a '90' nowhere near as easy the ugrad you went to (or my ugrad!) given the grade breakdown you gave me.

Now, I'm not saying your ugrad was easy, I'm just saying while getting a '90' at your ugrad may be just as hard as getting an '85' at my ugrad, and thus an 'A' is just as difficult, getting a '90' in the SMP will definitely be more challenging than than getting an 'A' at either of our universities.