how did current path docs/residents feeling during MS3?

[mlw03]

---

Members don't see this ad.

I'm an MS3 who came into med school thinking I'd most surely go into pathology. I enjoyed the MS2 path course, did well in the course, and have enjoyed the limited amount of time I've had thus far shadowing pathologists. However I'm now a almost 1/4 thru MS3 and I'm finding I really enjoy the patient contact and clinical experience thus far. I'm writing to ask how people that went into pathology felt during their 3rd year of medical school. Did you truly not enjoy it and just sucked it up to get through the year? Did you enjoy it somewhat but knew you would prefer life as a pathologist? Or did you really love it, but knew you were better suited for pathology? I'm curious to see what ya'll have to say on this topic.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I'm an MS3 who came into med school thinking I'd most surely go into pathology. I enjoyed the MS2 path course, did well in the course, and have enjoyed the limited amount of time I've had thus far shadowing pathologists. However I'm now a almost 1/4 thru MS3 and I'm finding I really enjoy the patient contact and clinical experience thus far. I'm writing to ask how people that went into pathology felt during their 3rd year of medical school. Did you truly not enjoy it and just sucked it up to get through the year? Did you enjoy it somewhat but knew you would prefer life as a pathologist? Or did you really love it, but knew you were better suited for pathology? I'm curious to see what ya'll have to say on this topic.

I hated every aspect of 3rd year medical school, except for learning about disease entities. Sure, I liked chatting with patients but I like chatting with people on a social basis too...so it's not like I NEED patient contact to be happy. Let me say though, I tried to like MS3 year...honestly, I did. But I hated waking up each day to go pre-round. And every chance I got, I went home the first chance I got. And as the year went along, I hated my life as a MS3 student more and more. I even made it a point to go back to my old lab and work at the bench just to clear my mind.

I don't miss patient contact now. I didn't like managing patients' diseases and I certainly didn't like dealing with difficult patients. I like disease and studying disease...that's it...somebody else can treat the diseases. Granted, I didn't go into 3rd year with the intention of doing pathology to begin with...it was more of a process of elimination for me.

Check out the Eureka or anti-clinical medicine threads...should be buried somewhere in the annals of SDN Path. That way you can see how people like myself felt as we were actually going through the med school experience. Now, I'm so far removed from that experience that I've moved on and most of the cynicism regarding that experience has been defecated outta my arse.

 

[yaah]

Yup. I hated third year. Hated fourth year even more because of all the wasted time.

I liked meeting patients too and interviewing them, etc. I completely despise the physical exam, however, and I would rather submit myself to a colonoscopy than have a day of doing procedures or suturing in the OR, or whatever. I find that mindless work, and I prefer to think at work. I am not like every path resident though - many enjoy procedures and get really charged up for their FNA rotation.

But yeah, you might find you get tired of patient contact when you realize how much bull**** there is. And also, I remember reading somewhere that a higher percentage of hospitalized people have personality disorders as compared to individuals who are not hospitalized. I found this to be very true. You don't go into clinical medicine to make friends, socialize, etc. That can be a nice part of your job but it shouldn't be the reason you go into it.

 

[Anna Plastic]

I'm an MS3 who came into med school thinking I'd most surely go into pathology. I enjoyed the MS2 path course, did well in the course, and have enjoyed the limited amount of time I've had thus far shadowing pathologists. However I'm now a almost 1/4 thru MS3 and I'm finding I really enjoy the patient contact and clinical experience thus far. I'm writing to ask how people that went into pathology felt during their 3rd year of medical school. Did you truly not enjoy it and just sucked it up to get through the year? Did you enjoy it somewhat but knew you would prefer life as a pathologist? Or did you really love it, but knew you were better suited for pathology? I'm curious to see what ya'll have to say on this topic.

I was sort of torn--I didn not like the process of the thrid year (writing notes, endless rounds, etc.) because I though it was tedious and not very high yield in terms of mental stimulation. But I loved working with patients. I liked being able to develop a working relationship, be able to follow up in clinic, see how the person did over time. My experience was that the majority of my patients were good people, and it made up for the occasional borderline patient. I always felt more motivated to do things when I knew the person who was counting on my work--that was why I got out of basic science and came into medicine.

Having said that, I came into med school wanting to do pathology and I think it was a good choice. I'm doing transfusion medicine, which I think is the most meaningful patient contact I've have since starting residency (I don't count FNA as meaningful, because it is more of a stick-n-run type deal). I'm glad that I don't do full time patient care, because I think the burnout factor would have significantly decreased my enjoyment of patients, and I didn't want that to happen. But TM is a great field if you like pathology and patient contact, because you can interact with patients quite a bit, as well as having some really cool clinical pathology to boot (not so great if you like the anatomic path, tho).

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Yup. I hated third year. Hated fourth year even more because of all the wasted time.

I liked fourth year...but half of my 4th year was pathology! And those rotations were a joke!

Seriously though, I'm staying so far away from the hospital during my stay in A2...I've successfully repressed all the horrible, miserable memories of the Michigan clinical educational system. Damn...I'm like 5 miles away and I'm starting to develop hives.

Come to Dom's after work if you're free. My ETA is about 1 pm I'll probably be sloshed by evening.

 

[Gut Shot]

My M3 year:

Surgery: "Wow! The inside of a real OR! Where's the exit?"
Neurology: "Of course! The internal capsule! Is there an escape hatch nearby?"
Family Practice: "Fascinating story about your back pain, sir. I suggest you finish while I'm running down the block, screaming."
Pediatrics: "The rotavirus and bacterial sinusitis is just so worth it when you see the expression on a screaming, snot-nosed brat. Check please!"
Internal Medicine: "...and Mr. Jones wears his seatbelt, has fire alarms in his house, and keeps three unloaded firearms locked up. One more H&P and I'm going to drive home sans seatbelt, tear my smoke alarms off my ceilings, and cap myself in my living room."
OB/GYN: "Oh! The miracle of birth! I'll be in the bar looking for the father."
Psychiatry: "Have you had thoughts about hurting yourself lately? Join the club."

Now that I'm a PGY-2 I'm happy as a friggin' clam in straw.

 

[DruidDoc]

My M3 year:

Surgery: "Wow! The inside of a real OR! Where's the exit?"
Neurology: "Of course! The internal capsule! Is there an escape hatch nearby?"
Family Practice: "Fascinating story about your back pain, sir. I suggest you finish while I'm running down the block, screaming."
Pediatrics: "The rotavirus and bacterial sinusitis is just so worth it when you see the expression on a screaming, snot-nosed brat. Check please!"
Internal Medicine: "...and Mr. Jones wears his seatbelt, has fire alarms in his house, and keeps three unloaded firearms locked up. One more H&P and I'm going to drive home sans seatbelt, tear my smoke alarms off my ceilings, and cap myself in my living room."
OB/GYN: "Oh! The miracle of birth! I'll be in the bar looking for the father."
Psychiatry: "Have you had thoughts about hurting yourself lately? Join the club."

Now that I'm a PGY-2 I'm happy as a friggin' clam in straw.

That pretty much sums up most of my feelings so far in MS3. Please can I just start cutting something out of my patients and look at it under a microscope. No wait...can someone else cut it out and just bring it to me....oh I should be a pathologist...perfect!!

 

[deschutes]

...I'm happy as a friggin' clam in straw.

Clams in straws are happy? 😕

I barely remember what clerkships were like - I think it's traumatic amnesia! Having a transitional intern and med student on the service remind me though. Clerkships made me realize I was a diagnostician at heart - coming up with the perfect drug regimen and monitoring it over time, wasting hours rounding or getting placement for a patient with chronic illness held none of my interest. All I had to do was imagine doing this year after year until my retirement, and things became startlingly clear. Patient contact is overrated. I'd much rather have people-contact and keep my friends and family.

(I think our perspective of working life is skewed by the fact that in med school we're surrounded by people who work crazy hours and somehow working hard is an absolute good. In medicine, people talk about lifestyle as if it were a guilty pleasure. Come 2nd year residency, I don't even feel the slightest twinges of said guilt any more. There is a whole world of working people out there who start at 9 and are done by 5, and go home to make dinner and have fun in the evenings without the slightest thought about work, except when a project deadline looms.)

The patients are not going to get any fewer, their frustrations (and yours) are not going to get any less. I'd be useless as an unhappy physician. Common sense dictates that you have to know what you want, or you won't know it when you get there. 👍

 

[sapience8x]

Overall i hated everything about 3rd year EXCEPT for the pt contact that didn't come after reasonable hours. I realize now that i still like talking to patients. however like a PP mentioned, i could talk to anyone and be okay. Pathology is the best fit for me. I enjoy it and quite a few physicians out there wokring in clinical medicine told me they wish they had chosen pathology because of all of the bull in what they are doing now. and quite a few have switched into path. sometimes you'll find that you'll like a few different specialties but i boils down to the one that you like the best and is the best fit.

 

[Cabbage Head]

I didn't hate patient contact, but I didn't *need* patient contact. I don't mind talking to patients during FNAs and stuff like that, but I don't miss talking to them, either. I guess it's nice to have someone directly tell you how much you helped them, but I found it wasn't something I needed another few decades of. Internal medicine residency is a penalty for shoplifting in some countries.

 

[ilovepath]

I'm an MS3 who came into med school thinking I'd most surely go into pathology. I enjoyed the MS2 path course, did well in the course, and have enjoyed the limited amount of time I've had thus far shadowing pathologists. However I'm now a almost 1/4 thru MS3 and I'm finding I really enjoy the patient contact and clinical experience thus far. I'm writing to ask how people that went into pathology felt during their 3rd year of medical school. Did you truly not enjoy it and just sucked it up to get through the year? Did you enjoy it somewhat but knew you would prefer life as a pathologist? Or did you really love it, but knew you were better suited for pathology? I'm curious to see what ya'll have to say on this topic.

what rotation are you on? what would you consider instead of path?

 

[mlw03]

what rotation are you on? what would you consider instead of path?

I'm finishing up emergency medicine and have already done neuro and psych. the other specialties I'm considering are neurology, EM, and urology. I've had some exposure to each of these fields and have enjoyed them, although I've also enjoyed my time in pathology. i recognize i'm early in MS3 and that by March I may being saying, "ok, I've enjoyed this little foray into the clinical world, but pathology is where I should be." I also know that I could easily combine some of those other interests with pathology, focusing on either neuropathology or urologic pathology. I'm planning to do my electives early in MS4 to help me decide on a specialty.

 

[Gene_]

...neurology, EM, and urology...

😱

How about narrowing it down a little. It would be hard to come up with four specialties that are more different from each other than these you listed. It's actually pretty easy. To cut or not to cut? Shift work or not. Talk to patients: all day/some/not at all.

To cut: urology
Talk to patients all day: neurology
Shift work: EM
No cutting, no shift work, no patient contact: path

 

[mlw03]

😱

How about narrowing it down a little. It would be hard to come up with four specialties that are more different from each other than these you listed. It's actually pretty easy. To cut or not to cut? Shift work or not. Talk to patients: all day/some/not at all.

To cut: urology
Talk to patients all day: neurology
Shift work: EM
No cutting, no shift work, no patient contact: path

Problem is that I like the shift work of EM, and at my med school you don't really get a decent chance to evaluate urology, neuro, or path until MS4. Maybe my general surgery clerkship will clear up the cut vs. no cut issue. As to the others, I wish I knew how to narrow it down based on my limited experience thus far, which is part of why I'm asking how people that have already been where I am felt during third year.

 

[yaah]

I think the surgery clerkship will help you with Urology. While urology does include a lot of outpatient stuff, residency includes a lot of operating time and procedures.

EM, also, is procedurally based to a certain extent. While EM is full of lots of people with no attention span, there are also lots of people who just like the variety and being able to take care of everything, but yet not having to deal with the responsibility of long term issues (unless you are John Carter MD who goes into ER to take care of patients and get to know them).

Ultimately, you will probably have to go with your gut. As Kramer says, "What does the little man inside you say? Listen to the little man."

 

[danaphosaurus]

Yeah- Maybe I miss that good patient that you actually help but you have to see 500 drug seekers and old people first- 3rd year was the worst year of my life- I love path and I like to point and laugh at those people who are starting their evening rounds when I am leaving work- And we get paid the same-

 

[joedirt]

every stinking moment of 3rd and 4th year, save for my pathology electives. Second half of medschool seemed to be a waste for those destined to become pathologist. In the end, the response was "you will be a well rounded physician." Whatever the hell that means.

 

[gungho]

"you will be a well rounded physician." Whatever the hell that means.

http://www.funfry.com/data/507/medium/ugly_fat_man_big_tummy_funny_pictures_funfry_resize.JPG

 

[mlw03]

Thanks for all the comments. I'm a bit surprised to hear that the general consensus is that the path residents/practitioners here didn't enjoy MS3 too much. But I appreciate everyone's candor and the time ya'll took to comment.

 

[rirriri]

Internal Medicine and Family Practice made me want to strap myself into a stretcher and be launched across the pacific ocean with my hair set on fire.

cheers!

 

[DebDynamite]

Problem is that I like the shift work of EM, and at my med school you don't really get a decent chance to evaluate urology, neuro, or path until MS4. Maybe my general surgery clerkship will clear up the cut vs. no cut issue. As to the others, I wish I knew how to narrow it down based on my limited experience thus far, which is part of why I'm asking how people that have already been where I am felt during third year.

My school is similar to yours, except I get to do one month of 4th year in March (the downside is I don't "officially finish" 3rd year 'till Sept 1st). I am going to therefore do a month of Path in March. I had my fill of the ED in Surgery/Trauma call, and stitching and casting for that matter. I have three months of Family in the spring- and I intend to use every spare minute for step 2 and get all of this OVER with.

This thread has summed up nicely exactly how I feel about 3rd year- where is the EXIT door for Chrisssakes? Gimmee outta here!

 

[soopa]

Internal Medicine and Family Practice made me want to strap myself into a stretcher and be launched across the pacific ocean with my hair set on fire.

cheers!

that's how i feel with obgyn right now. the residents and attendings are unhappy, the hours suck, everyone is just messed up. i can't wait til this is over.........4 more weeks!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ilovepath]

Thanks for all the comments. I'm a bit surprised to hear that the general consensus is that the path residents/practitioners here didn't enjoy MS3 too much. But I appreciate everyone's candor and the time ya'll took to comment.

i'm surprised ur surprised. if u like ms3 y not be a fcking barista? get me my latte and lipitor!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mlw03]

i'm surprised ur surprised. if u like ms3 y not be a fcking barista? get me my latte and lipitor!!!!!!!!!!!

this is one of the less intelligent comments i've seen posted in this thread. so because i'm enjoying some patient interaction that means i should be serving coffee? comments like yours are why people often give me weird looks when i say i'm considering path - because they recognize that i'm not the type of person who'd say something like that. and before everyone starts getting all pissy with me, i of course recognize that not all pathologists think this way - in fact most of the ones i've met face to face are awesome people who probably would have been solid clinicians. but i suppose every specialty has people who can make dumb comments at times, and i'm just going to take this to be one of them.

i hope you're happy doing what you do (because we all should be), but please don't be a jerk to students like me who are trying to make a difficult decision and politely ask legit questions and then participate in the discussion.

 

[Cougarblue]

Third year for me was a love/hate relationship. I came into the year thinking that I was going to be a trauma surgeon. Fortunately, that didn't last long. The nail in the coffin was only seeing my boys awake two times in three months. What a joke. My youngest was seven month old when I finished surgery. He cried for a week everytime I tried to hold him, because he didn't have a freaking clue who I was. BRUTAL!

I enjoyed the MICU, but general medicine was PAINFUL! We had a lady with a laboratory positive porphyria exacerbation, who spent most of her time chatting on the phone and disappearing off the floor to go smoke. The only time she complained of any pain was when she reappeared on the floor for her q4 hour demerol. When we finally explained that we were not a demerol hotel she started dropping the f-bomb and said, "You know if you turn me out, I'm just going to get some heroin, at least you know that this stuff is clean!" Good reason, OK, next!

Peds was outstanding. I had a very hard time deciding between Peds and Path. Family Practice was a fun month not because I thought I wanted to do FP, but because my preceptor and his staff were incredibly cool people. Surprisingly, I loved Psych, but only because I did it in the Forensic ward of one the state medical hospitals. Nothing beats a 6'5" psychotic schizophrenic inmate intermixing random, fragmented passages of Hamlet, with the Book of Revelations, with made up combinations of curse words before jumping on the table in front of you only to dismount with a backflip worthy of a 6.0 from the Romanian judge. Perhaps the biggest shocker, I had a great time on OB/GYN in large part due to the quality of the residents at UVA.

I could be wrong, but it seems like there are a couple of diffent types of people who go into Path. 1) The hardcore research types. 2) Those who despise patient contact and all things clinical. 3) Those, who like me, liked clinical medicine, but found that they were more fascinated with the science of medicine than with its actual practice. 4) The antisocial, unibomber types who are even now digging themselves a small, dark hole in the basement near the morgue. (The last one was sarcasm in case anyone waiting with a flamethrower missed it)

 

[ilovepath]

this is one of the less intelligent comments i've seen posted in this thread. so because i'm enjoying some patient interaction that means i should be serving coffee? comments like yours are why people often give me weird looks when i say i'm considering path - because they recognize that i'm not the type of person who'd say something like that. and before everyone starts getting all pissy with me, i of course recognize that not all pathologists think this way - in fact most of the ones i've met face to face are awesome people who probably would have been solid clinicians. but i suppose every specialty has people who can make dumb comments at times, and i'm just going to take this to be one of them.

i hope you're happy doing what you do (because we all should be), but please don't be a jerk to students like me who are trying to make a difficult decision and politely ask legit questions and then participate in the discussion.

this is the reason i think we should get a baseline anal sphincter manometry of ppl considering path--if it's too tight u should consider another profession--one that derives your sense of ego by putting others down.

 

[mlw03]

i'd be glad to name some of the various usf path faculty i've spent some time working with and have all found to be intelligent, nice, normal people - Reed, Strickland, Wheeler, Rojiani, Nicosia, and Vega. Now what purpose did that serve? what purpose do you think using my real name will serve, and why don't you have the integrity to use your own if you're going to use mine? i've never said anything on these forums that i'm embaressed by, nor anything that i feel would impair my chance to get into a residency, whether that's in path or another specialty. now that you've posted these nasty, negative, personal insults - do you have the courage to use your real name and show some of the people who may be interviewing you and deciding whether they want to spend a few years working with you who you are? are you comfortable with residency directors having the ability to match the comments you've made here to your application, and should you be granted an interview, to your face? if you are, then go ahead and share your real name with the forum and some of the people who'll be evaluating your residency application, as you have mine despite your never having met me before.

 

[yaah]

Post was deleted. Please do not post personal information without permission.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Tears flow down my face when I see med students who sit there and feign enthusiasm when I know they really don't give a rats chocolate starfish! That year was the most miserable, most demeaning year of my entire life. I wouldn't wish that upon my worst enemy.

 

[yaah]

Tears flow down my face when I see med students who sit there and feign enthusiasm when I know they really don't give a rats chocolate starfish! That year was the most miserable, most demeaning year of my entire life. I wouldn't wish that upon my worst enemy.

I didn't really find it that demeaning. I agree with miserable though. I felt like the entire year I was coming up with new ways to try to fake enthusiasm or try to avoid objectionable tasks. The problem is, when 75% of what you do on floor medicine is objectionable, it gets difficult.

The other odd thing is that once I gave up trying to fake enthusiasm people thought I was being more enthusiastic. One of the secrets I think was to find a really bitter resident or intern (which wasn't difficult) and be their sounding board for complaints about other residents.

 

[deschutes]

when I see med students who sit there and feign enthusiasm when I know they really don't give a rats chocolate starfish!

It happens in path too. Makes my hair stand. Yeeeesh.