how do you get a pgy2

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

turquoiseblue

Membership Revoked
Removed
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2007
Messages
601
Reaction score
7
I have a few questions:

Once you get a pgy1 in prelim surgery, how do you get to PGY2?--is it difficult to do? What is the process of applying for those or are they hard to come by? what about PGY2 in other specialties? or is it just easier to start over again as a pgy1 and apply via eras? can you get a pgy2 via eras? or would you just get a PGY2 eventually if you wait long enough for a vacancy? and what do you do in-between, while waiting for a pgy2...and lastly, what is the maximal wait to wait before giving up on trying for a pgy2?

Thanks in advance 🙂
 
From what I've seen, it's much easier to start all over again from a PGY-1 categorical. Intuitively, this also makes sense since there are a lot more PGY-1 categoricals being offered than PGY-2 positions and you will have a better chance at matching those. Not sure how many PGY-2 positions are out there, but I suppose you could get lucky and fill in a vacant position.

If you decide to start from square one, the challenge will be to juggle applying through ERAS and doing interviews during your prelim year. My guess is that you have to save your one week of vacation for the interviews. I don't really have much more info than this.
 
I have a few questions:

Once you get a pgy1 in prelim surgery, how do you get to PGY2?--is it difficult to do?

It can be. As surgery has become more popular, there is more competition for the PGY-2 positions (which are much fewer in number than PGY-1 Prelim positions).

What is the process of applying for those or are they hard to come by?

1. Check www.apds.org for listing of open positions
2. Tell everyone you know you are looking for a position; sometimes you can hear about something before a position opens up
3. Ask your program coordinator or trusted faculty member to let you know if they hear of any openings
4. Work your arse off all year long and hope your current program offers you a position for next year
5. Apply through ERAS for a PGY-1 position for next year
6. Look on ERAS for PGY-2 positions (but most of these are not listed on ERAS but rather apds.org)

They are not necessarily hard to come by, given the approximate 20% attrition rate in surgery, but again, there are a lot of people looking for these positions.

what about PGY2 in other specialties?

Depends on what the specialty is and if they accept a Prelim Surgery year. Remember many will be Advanced Matches, so PGY-2 positions for 2009 will have been matched last year. But people do drop out, die, get fired, etc. so these would potentially open up. Otherwise, you could apply for a PGY-2 position starting in 2010 via the match. Anesthesia and Rads will accept PGY-1 in Surgery.

or is it just easier to start over again as a pgy1 and apply via eras?

Yes and No. Yes, because there are more positions available as a PGY-1. No because you will have used up 1 year of GME funding, some programs may see you as "used" goods and prefer a med student over someone repeating an intern year.

can you get a pgy2 via eras?

Sometimes.

or would you just get a PGY2 eventually if you wait long enough for a vacancy?

I'm not sure what you are asking here. Positions might open up but that doesn't mean you will be offered them. You should be looking now for a position next year. People will quit and programs will have openings at any time during this year.

and what do you do in-between, while waiting for a pgy2

Whatever you can do. There are some research positions open, fellowships which don't require more training (some may be listed on apds.org - a user here, did a colorectal "fellowship" before his intern year...Faebinder), do another Prelim year, etc.

...and lastly, what is the maximal wait to wait before giving up on trying for a pgy2?

Only you can answer that (and you should have a plan).
 
Isn't funding determined by when you start a categorical residency, not by prelim year(s)?

Oops...yes, you are right.

Never mind.😛

Another issue about how many years you should try...be aware that the American Board of Surgery no longer accepts applications from residents who have done 3 or more Prelim years nor can you train at more than 3 programs. Thus you must get into a categorical position by PGY-3.
 
wow.. your responses were very complete and helpful and very much appreciated! 👍
 
With a prelim year behind you, does it make your chances better in the Match? ErAS costs a lot of money so is it worth it to even apply for the match in such a situation? Would waiting for the scramble be a better bet? Where should one apply? I am a foreign grad, so please keep that into consideration.

Thanks in advance🙂
 
With a prelim year behind you, does it make your chances better in the Match? ErAS costs a lot of money so is it worth it to even apply for the match in such a situation? Would waiting for the scramble be a better bet? Where should one apply? I am a foreign grad, so please keep that into consideration.

Thanks in advance🙂

Which are you asking? Does it help for a PGY-1 or PGY-2 spot?
 
I was asking about PGY1, and also about PGY2 where it applies. Are you able to apply for PGY2 via ERAS/Match? I just want to know what options are available in the situation of having a prelim surgical year, and the probability of each option.
 
I was asking about PGY1, and also about PGY2 where it applies. Are you able to apply for PGY2 via ERAS/Match? I just want to know what options are available in the situation of having a prelim surgical year, and the probability of each option.

You can apply for PGY-2 via ERAS but most PGY-2 positions are not listed on ERAS, only first year positions. APDS is the best source of advanced positions.

We can't tell you the probability of your options.
 
I was asking about PGY1, and also about PGY2 where it applies. Are you able to apply for PGY2 via ERAS/Match? I just want to know what options are available in the situation of having a prelim surgical year, and the probability of each option.
I would recommend you use ERAS but find the programs via APDS like WS says. Why? Programs often like the electronic packaged app from ERAS even if they don't post their advanced spot on ERAS. Find what programs have spots (i.e. APDS, etc...), contact them, and ask if they prefer an ERAS app.
 
With a prelim year behind you, does it make your chances better in the Match?
If you prelim, it is not uncommon to be viewed in some ways as damaged goods. PDs can't help but ask themselves....1. why you didn't match the first time out? 2. why the program your at didn't convert you to categorical or even "make" a spot for you? 3. if they hire you as a pgy1, you may be to "cocky" for your position/have too many bad habits/etc... if they hire you as a PGY2 you probably weren't trained as good as their PGY1/2. 4. maybe it's better to get a fresh grad?
Would waiting for the scramble be a better bet?
No
 
Does anyone have a list of PGY2 surgery programs listed in ERAS?
I will check in apds.org but just wondered if anyone knows of some programs already that may not be listed on apds.org at this time.
 
Top