How legitimate of a risk is failing out?

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chizledfrmstone said:
You don't consider 1-2 hours a day (2-4 if you're really intelligent or just aiming to pass) free time?

I have a final on Monday. I plan to watch 1/2 an episode of Royal Pains tonight and the other 1/2 of it after the Final.

During weeks where we didn't have an exam I could watch an episode of House of Cards every night during dinner.
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How is that show? Was thinking about starting it
 
8 hours a day is more than enough if you're efficient. With my constant ADD i probably put in 6 hours a day on a good day. I'm certainly not killing it by any means but life outside of class is important to my sanity.
 
Hey @Goro have you ever seen someone with a 30MCAT and 3.6 GPA, that put in effort, actually fail out?
 
Hustler101 said:
Why does everyone say that you'll have a bit of free time then? (serious question)
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There's lots of free time in MS1 and MS2 if you don't screw around while studying. Say 6 hours of lecture per day. 8 hours of outside studying. 8 hours of sleep. That's still 2 hours of free time. Now you watch lectures on 2x.. So 5 hrs of free time. Then you start cutting down 8 hours to 6 hours of studying because you're more efficient. That's 7 hours free on weekdays and 10 on weekends.

That's what worked for me, but obviously some people will study more and some will study less to get the same grades.
 
psych72 said:
I think this is true to some degree. But attending lectures helps you keep on float with some topics.
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chizledfrmstone said:
Really depends on the student.

I can learn 2x more by not going to class. I don't need someone verbalizing a PowerPoint.

I'm just finishing up first year so my experience is limited but if you're studying more than 8 hours a day just to pass then you really need to go see a learning specialist. If you're studying 8+ hours a day then you better be around the average or higher.

2nd year will be different so we'll see how that goes.
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Definitely agree that it depends on the student. My advisor always pushed me to go to class, but the truth is that I simply cannot learn that way. I easily distract myself one second and then spend the next 20 minutes not understanding anything of what was said. The times I went to lecture I spent almost all afternoon having to re-do the powerpoints to understand and then begin to learn. Thank god for video. On the other hand I have a friend that feels he's dying if he spends all day watching the video, so he needs to attend class.
 
Of those who failed out in my class, only one or two "didn't have it" - the screening process did a good job of getting those with enough smarts in the door, the problem was maturity; too much partying, socializing, not getting help when you really need help, going out and having fun when others were doing their work.

Granted, I believe you don't need oodles of "smarts" - to be a doc you need to just go at it and hit it hard everyday. I mean really hard, and (nearly) everyday.

If you can put in the time you'll be fine, you just have to settle in and get a feel for it. Very, very few who work their tail off until they understand the process and how to get grades they want go on to fail.
 
I put in somewhere between 40 and 60 hours per week of study/lecture/small group/whatever time depending on what needs to ge. If I had mandatory lectures, I'd probably have to add extra 10-15 hours to that. This gets me to 90 +/- 5 points on most exams, which is certainly good enough for me. YMMV.
 
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pmarank said:
Hey @Goro have you ever seen someone with a 30MCAT and 3.6 GPA, that put in effort, actually fail out?
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I was there (3.55/30) coming in. It took all my effort to barely pass first year (bottom 20% of class maybe?) and a fraction of that effort to do better than average second year. Just depends how long it takes to find your groove.
 
Kevin Baker said:
I was there (3.55/30) coming in. It took all my effort to barely pass first year (bottom 20% of class maybe?) and a fraction of that effort to do better than average second year. Just depends how long it takes to find your groove.
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mind sharing what didnt (and then did) work for you?
 
The amount of exaggeration in this thread is nauseating.


Nobody should be studying as much as these people are claiming they do.
You are doing something VERY wrong of you are putting in 60 hours per week.

I usually agree with goro, but to say that 9-5 isnt enough is laughable.
 
yanks26dmb said:
mind sharing what didnt (and then did) work for you?
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I'm sure it varies for everyone so take what I say with a grain of salt but finding time to sleep, exercise, and eat right, making time to date, etc. just being healthy and less burnt out was huge. I had other strategies like not going to class, getting a study group of type B people, rephrasing my notes as potential test questions, getting used to a professors style of questions, learning which ones to ignore as they'll test on some inane phd level receptor subtype conformation, etc. but balance is what really made the difference for me. I also set a schedule of one full day off per week, one half day, and 30 mins cardio most 5-6 nights a week where I'd study on my phone so it wasn't wasted time, and 20-30 mins lifting 2-3 times per week. First year I just hit the books too hard. It's about studying smarter not harder and ridding ones self of study inefficiencies.
 
YankeeCandle1141 said:
The amount of exaggeration in this thread is nauseating.


Nobody should be studying as much as these people are claiming they do.
You are doing something VERY wrong of you are putting in 60 hours per week.

I usually agree with goro, but to say that 9-5 isnt enough is laughable.
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you really believe this to be the case, even for the very average student who make take a little extra time learning something you would consider basic?

fyi - I'm not starting until August, so I have no idea, just asking...
 
DOFOSHO said:
And don't forget, the same probability of flipping a coin and getting tails is the same probability of being in the bottom half of your class.
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That's not true, the probability that the brightest people in the class will be in the bottom half is zero, unless they stop trying. You just need to be in the top half intellectually and work at your potential.
I was a lazy bastard the first 2 years, but I knew what worked for me coasted along and did fine. When 3rd year rolled around I crushed the old gunners on the daily because their old maniacal study habits don't work well on the wards and I finally took it out of overdrive and brought my A game. It was fun to watch.
 
YankeeCandle1141 said:
The amount of exaggeration in this thread is nauseating.


Nobody should be studying as much as these people are claiming they do.
You are doing something VERY wrong of you are putting in 60 hours per week.

I usually agree with goro, but to say that 9-5 isnt enough is laughable.
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I don't see how the occasional 60 hours when everything is accounted for is unreasonable. Those are weeks where I get just as much lecture along with other required crap that I can't just go 2x on (small group, labs, preceptorship, etc.),.
 
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YankeeCandle1141 said:
The amount of exaggeration in this thread is nauseating.


Nobody should be studying as much as these people are claiming they do.
You are doing something VERY wrong of you are putting in 60 hours per week.

I usually agree with goro, but to say that 9-5 isnt enough is laughable.
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Nothing wrong with studying that much.

Most people probably don't need 60 per week to pass. That doesn't mean it's wrong to study 60+ per week. The goal should be to learn as much as possible..
 
PIacebo said:
We have lost over 20 this past year, out of a class of about 115. Probably more due to remediation this summer
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Sorry to say this, but your school did a bad job of selecting people - either they found out that medicine wasn't for them or couldn't handle the rigorous schedule.
I wouldn't be surprised if your school is WCUCOM.
 
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chizledfrmstone said:
Really depends on the student.

I can learn 2x more by not going to class. I don't need someone verbalizing a PowerPoint.

I'm just finishing up first year so my experience is limited but if you're studying more than 8 hours a day just to pass then you really need to go see a learning specialist. If you're studying 8+ hours a day then you better be around the average or higher.

2nd year will be different so we'll see how that goes.
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I will be a M1 in the Fall at KCU...also thinking about not going to lectures since I do more active learning when I can pause/speed up and talk out loud to myself (can't do that in lecture haha). How many lectures would you suggest going to before stopping? I was wondering if I should make acquaintances via lecture so when grand rounds come around I will have a group to be in.
 
Drinkingtea said:
I will be a M1 in the Fall at KCU...also thinking about not going to lectures since I do more active learning when I can pause/speed up and talk out loud to myself (can't do that in lecture haha). How many lectures would you suggest going to before stopping? I was wondering if I should make acquaintances via lecture so when grand rounds come around I will have a group to be in.
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how are grand rounds tied to lecture?
 
PIacebo said:
We have lost over 20 this past year, out of a class of about 115. Probably more due to remediation this summer
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How's that even possible? Are these people with extremely low stats (relatively)?
 
PIacebo said:
We have lost over 20 this past year, out of a class of about 115. Probably more due to remediation this summer
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That's terrifying. We started with the same class size, didn't lose any between semesters from failing, lost one to just deciding to leave, and we're looking at losing under 5 if they don't remediate things successfully. Losing 20 seems like a lot.
 
seminoma said:
There's lots of free time in MS1 and MS2 if you don't screw around while studying. Say 6 hours of lecture per day. 8 hours of outside studying. 8 hours of sleep. That's still 2 hours of free time. Now you watch lectures on 2x.. So 5 hrs of free time. Then you start cutting down 8 hours to 6 hours of studying because you're more efficient. That's 7 hours free on weekdays and 10 on weekends.

That's what worked for me, but obviously some people will study more and some will study less to get the same grades.
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That only works if you literally live in the lecture hall and never shower or poop.
 
That's an almost Carib school attrition rate! If this is true, the accreditors will be all over this school.


PIacebo said:
We have lost over 20 this past year, out of a class of about 115. Probably more due to remediation this summer
Click to expand...
 
GUH said:
That only works if you literally live in the lecture hall and never shower or poop.
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What? Watch lectures at home on 2x, study at home, shower at home, poop at home, etc.
 
At my school, we're known for giving OMM more than lip service, but still, one has to actually work at failing OMM!

"hearing with your fingers"? Did your Faculty actually use that phrase?

I love my OMM colleagues dearly, but if any of them ever pull the "I can detect a hair under a piece of paper" line, I'll bust that delusion very quickly!



DOFOSHO said:
just fyi, at my school more people failed due to OMM than anything else. several people got held back, several people quit. it can be a really tough course especially having to memorize stuff that doesn't exist and perform supernatural feats such as "hearing with your fingers" "ignore what you learned in kindergarten, we're going to make some s### up just to f### with your head."
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SouthernSurgeon said:
This is how every studying thread goes.

Some people exaggerate.

Some people are at the high and low extremes.

Some people have bad memories and have whitewashed their perspective over time so they think they did less than they did.

Some people are horribly inefficient and spend 8 hours "studying" with only 2 or 3 actual study hours thrown in.

Some people never go to class. Some people count class time in that 8 hours.

---

Bottom line, everyone is different and has to find their own methods and habits to be successful. Comparing yourself to others in terms of workload only leads to neurosis.
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So you mean it keeps SDN in business.
 
DOFOSHO said:
in this particular circumstance they do.
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no, not really.

Take 2 examples. Student A is a superstar. He took the MCAT and crushed in in 2 weeks. He triple majored in Chemistry, Biology and Mathematics, pulled a 4.0 without a sweat. Is his chance being in the bottom 50% the same as a guy who scrapped by in undergrad, needed 3 retakes to score a 30 on the MCAT, needed an extra year just to get through orgo, and barely pulled a 3.0 while studying 10+ hours a day?
 
DOFOSHO said:
i didn't analyze it that far so you may be right. i was just thinking in terms of if there was 100 people in a class 50% would be in the top half, 50% would be in the bottom half.

Your student A and student B probably ended up at different schools, so your study design is flawed anyways. Are you the guy who needed an extra year and 2 retakes?
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i'm neither 🙁
 
DOFOSHO said:
i didn't analyze it that far so you may be right. i was just thinking in terms of if there was 100 people in a class 50% would be in the top half, 50% would be in the bottom half.

Your student A and student B probably ended up at different schools, so your study design is flawed anyways. Are you the guy who needed an extra year and 2 retakes?
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@notbobtrustme is the guy who got 269 on Step 1 so...
 
notbobtrustme said:
no, not really.

Take 2 examples. Student A is a superstar. He took the MCAT and crushed in in 2 weeks. He triple majored in Chemistry, Biology and Mathematics, pulled a 4.0 without a sweat. Is his chance being in the bottom 50% the same as a guy who scrapped by in undergrad, needed 3 retakes to score a 30 on the MCAT, needed an extra year just to get through orgo, and barely pulled a 3.0 while studying 10+ hours a day?
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I'm pretty close to being that second guy and I'm ranked pretty high in my class.. So I'd say yes. Yes because undergrad has nothing to do with med school.
 
Mad Jack said:
Uh, it's way more than a 9-5, brosephine. I put in probably 50-80 hours a week, depending on how close we were to a block exam. Average was around 65-70 hours a week.
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I average 40 hrs a week including lectures plus labs. And I go to lecture. It's going to vary among individuals.
 
NontradCA said:
I average 40 hrs a week including lectures plus labs. And I go to lecture. It's going to vary among individuals.
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True. The majority of people I knew, and I mean near unanimous majority, put in well over 40 hours per week though. Then there were some people like my roommate that didn't study at all until two weeks before block, popped open his Adderall script, and went to town for 80 hours a week for two weeks.
 
seminoma said:
I'm pretty close to being that second guy and I'm ranked pretty high in my class.. So I'd say yes. Yes because undergrad has nothing to do with med school.
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I'm curious but why doesn't it? I feel like all the main bio courses are very similar at any university basically. You memorize in different ways and go at multiple choice questions that range from easy to hard. Many questions require higher order thinking but I had plenty of questions like that in first year bio all the way to advanced biochemistry. If I studied a lot I got an A. If I studied a moderate amount I got a crappy grade. Isn't medical school fairly similar to that?
 
MedWonk said:
I don't see how the occasional 60 hours when everything is accounted for is unreasonable. Those are weeks where I get just as much lecture along with other required crap that I can't just go 2x on (small group, labs, preceptorship, etc.),.
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Hey man could I please get your thoughts on UMASS in general? Any advice? thoughts on classes and faculty? I'm an incoming M1 this Fall. Thanks!!
 
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