How Much Funding from Grants and Assistantships is Possible in PhD Programs?

[50MinuteHour]

In addition to the stipend and full tuition remission that many PhD programs offer, what kind of additional funds are possible and how much have you seen generated per year? I feel like the average $15k stipend just isn't enough, especially if you're in the northeast or on the west coast.

It seems like those researchers who undertake a more biologically-based approach have the best chances of generating outside funding, but I am not super enthusiastic about subjects like neuroscience. I'm not sure how possible this would be alongside the demands of a PhD program, but I really like the idea of generating my own grants from outside the program for some of the research I'm doing in the program or independently (probably clinical/counseling in nature), and maybe seeing a handful of patients privately.

Is it totally impossible to consistently earn $40k a year while engaged in full-time doctoral studies?

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[Pragma]

The last I saw NIH offered around 25k per year for predoctoral F grants. It would be up to your institution if they fund you more. Even getting a separate fellowship may end up meaning your school funds you less and uses the saved funds for other reasons. Talk to your mentor and DCT.

Some programs let you work outside but mine didn't. Loans are an option but you have to pay them back.

 

[50MinuteHour]

Talk to your mentor and DCT.

What does DCT stand for?

 

[Pragma]

Director of clinical training. I think in professional programs they call it DT sometimes.

If you are considering programs be sure to take into account cost of living, as your stipend could go far in some locales.

 

[50MinuteHour]

That has got to be a bummer to have funds taken away if you work to generate additional outside funding! I wonder how often that happens...

 

[bcliff]

Some programs have a funding cap, like students can't earn more than $25k from all funding sources - I haven't spent a lot of time looking into it, but I know I interviewed at a program that talked about they don't have a cap on student funding and used that as a major selling point.

 

[Pragma]

Some programs offer their funding assuming you don't have other funding. If you get other funding, it may mean they take theirs away.

Funding is prescious- i see it from both sides. If I get a huge grant my pay stays the same. I don't get any more money but I get resources and fewer classes to teach.

 

[50MinuteHour]

Funding is prescious- i see it from both sides. If I get a huge grant my pay stays the same. I don't get any more money but I get resources and fewer classes to teach.

Hey, time is money, right? I imagine many programs wouldn't particularly like the idea of having to lose cheap labor (e.g. pull you from teaching a couple of courses) and withdraw funding so we can do more independent work though, huh? I wonder if doing a little private clinical work would be more sensible (just 5 patients/week x 48 weeks per year = ~$17,000).

I really like the idea of not having a cap on student funding. That DOES sound like a major selling point!

 

[Pragma]

Welcome to the world of education funding. Indirect costs drive careers.

 

[MCParent]

Some programs have a funding cap, like students can't earn more than $25k from all funding sources - I haven't spent a lot of time looking into it, but I know I interviewed at a program that talked about they don't have a cap on student funding and used that as a major selling point.

If you're on line for a % effort for a grant you can't have an assistantship that makes your FTE goes over 100%. That would prettymuch be fraud against the government (bc you are either not doing the grant work you said you would, or you said it will take X time when it actually takes you X-assistantship time).

 

[WisNeuro]

There's always options for outside clinical research work if the opportunity avails itself. I had some sweet side testing gigs for a large research grant that paid $25/hour and time and a half on weekends. That definitely helped in the finances department.

 

[PsychPhDone]

I ramped up from about 22k to 30k during grad school (in a low cost of living area). I was able to bring in a little extra beyond the stipend through some extra departmental work, university/department awards, and external awards. It was a very comfortable amount where I lived (admittedly just supporting myself, no kids or anything). So performing well and seeking out extra opportunities is one way to make it happen. It's a trade-off though...each effort to get an award or grant means less time working on something else. We also had some folks do extra clinical work in the community with the DCTs blessing.

You can get 23k from an NIH F31 or 32k from the NSF GRFP. DoD had a grant too, but I'm unsure of their current funding level.

 

[irish80122]

Perhaps I have been on the "other side" too long, but I think many of you are missing the big picture on this. If you are concerned about your earnings, stipend is not important, what is important is how quickly you can get your PhD and get licensed. Here is a hypothetical situation that I ran our students through:

Student enters graduate school at age 22
Completes graduate school in anywhere between 4 and 7 years on-campus (i.e. 4 + 1 through 7 + 1, funded whole way with $10,000 stipend)
Completes an internship ($25,000) and a two year post-doctoral fellowship ($40,000)
Gets a job that pays $80,000 after post-doc with 3% annual raises
Retires at age 65

Here are the differences in pay over the course of one's career based upon how long you are in graduate school:
Years of Training

Total Earned Post BA

Difference from 4 + 1

4 years on campus + 1 year internship, total earned: $5,438,938
5 years on campus + 1 year internship, total earned:$5,217,076, difference of -$221,862
6 years on campus + 1 year internship, total earned: $5,000,967, difference of -$436,971
7 years on campus + 1 year internship, total earned $4,793,414, difference of -$645,523

As you can see, how long it takes you to get your doctorate and get into a permanent job makes a HUGE difference. Time spent making a little extra money would be far better spent doing research, for instance, if it could help you skip a post-doc, or to do a one-year post-doc instead of two.

Lastly, I truly believe for the vast majority of you your DCT has your best interest in mind and is trying to get you as much money as possible. We are always limited on our funding provided by the department, but we do the best we can. As MCParent said, often grants assume you will be 100% FTE, and it would be against the law for us to pay more. Additionally, when a student gets a grant we don't just take that money and spend it on us, in fact it is commonly in an account type that has to be spent on instruction. What we typically do is increase funding for all the other graduate students, or hire a lecturer to teach a class or an external student to help with TA duties so less teaching falls on the students. This differs from department to department, but I go to CUDCP and I know many of your DCTs and they are wonderful people. I genuinely think they are doing everything they can to help you out, whether it be financially or helping you make good, fast progress through the program. Sometimes even things like not allowing outside employment are to help you because we know the math I laid out above. We want you to graduate, get out there, and be successful.

I hope that helps some. I don't mean to sound defensive, because I really am not, I just think that most DCTs are working in your interest. It may just not always feel that way.

 

[Justanothergrad]

Stipend isn't /as/ important, but it is an important factor. A 10k stipend won't cover living expenses (rent alone) in many areas, which means debt. Do you have a car? If not, that means debt. Furniture might also be an issue because not everyone has that after college. Do you have to take summer courses? Do you get in state tuition for those courses? is your assistantship a 9 month or a 12?

Those earnings figures are a good baseline but leave plenty of room for concern. There is an assumption, I think, that people come from middle class families and that those families furnish a lot of those startup resources. That's not always the case. It would be very easy to accrue 80k in debt (as told since that is the median debt amount iirc) trying to balance those factors. 50k in loans at the current rate (in-sub) equals 65 if paid off after five years in full. Add that to the extra debt of everything else you may need to buy, and internship expenses (and moving). Fast is good but I think there is a sweet spot and that spot varies a little per person. And quality of life is important too since money (as the metric of when you should shoot to graduate) doesn't predict a large portion of variance in life satisfaction and happiness.


OP, to answer your question I have been able to work on jobs that increase my competitive on the job market after internship (grant funding my own research wth external funders doing non neuro research) and make around 30k. I work a lot though, with class and everything else. I think the advise to worry less about the amount is good advice, but be creative and you will be generative.

 

[Pragma]

If you aren't funded by a grant, there may be some circumstances where you can negotiate pay. For me one of the years I stuck around involved teaching and also working on research, and I was able to negotiate an hourly rate for the research. The department was only involved in the teaching portion.

I agree with what others have said - the opportunity cost of taking more years to get finished is worth thinking about at very least. Accept grad school for what it is - limited funding and living as a poor student. The fewer years you do that, the more that you can bask in financial independence.

 

[smalltownpsych]

You wouldn't really be able to do side clinical work for a variety of reasons. I did some computer consulting for extra cash and also took paid practice a for a few of the years. My year at the VA was unpaid but well worth the experience. I second what the others said about getting it done is more important than staying completely debt free. If you do have to take student loans, focus on the lowest interest, subsidized loans. Most of my loans were about 2.8 percent interest and the subsidized ones don't accrue interest while you are still in school or if you defer them during postdoc. I bought a house at beginning of grad school and took out student loans at the same time. My house has doubled in value, the loans have barely budged. When I took out a higher interest non-subsidized loan at the end of grad school to make up for the low income during internship and postdoc that is a whole different story and that one just got paid off cause it was growing like a weed.

 

[Justanothergrad]

If you do have to take student loans, focus on the lowest interest, subsidized loans. Most of my loans were about 2.8 percent interest and the subsidized ones don't accrue interest while you are still in school or if you defer them during postdoc.

Subsidies don't exist for grad student loans anymore and they begin around 6% federal, since 2012 as I recall. A real bummer for Grad students

 

[50MinuteHour]

You wouldn't really be able to do side clinical work for a variety of reasons. I did some computer consulting for extra cash and also took paid practice a for a few of the years. My year at the VA was unpaid but well worth the experience. I second what the others said about getting it done is more important than staying completely debt free. If you do have to take student loans, focus on the lowest interest, subsidized loans. Most of my loans were about 2.8 percent interest and the subsidized ones don't accrue interest while you are still in school or if you defer them during postdoc. I bought a house at beginning of grad school and took out student loans at the same time. My house has doubled in value, the loans have barely budged. When I took out a higher interest non-subsidized loan at the end of grad school to make up for the low income during internship and postdoc that is a whole different story and that one just got paid off cause it was growing like a weed.

I don't see in there a reason why one can't do side clinical work. If you're already independently licensed (say, as a social worker) and can bill a handful of Sunday morning clients per week out of a private office in your neighborhood, why would you not do that?

 

[smalltownpsych]

I don't see in there a reason why one can't do side clinical work. If you're already independently licensed (say, as a social worker) and can bill a handful of Sunday morning clients per week out of a private office in your neighborhood, why would you not do that?

Being licensed would be the one reason why you could do clinical work on the side. I don't know if the doctoral program would care or not as it could raise some potential liability issues for them. We had a great discussion on this one day during our law and ethics class and our professor who was a JD/PhD and member of the licensing board would advise against it. Of course, attorneys advise against lots of things that people do anyway. The challenge is when you either consult or don't consult with your training program on a case in your side practice that ends up in court. If you consult them, then are they liable and if you don't consult, maybe you should have since you are in a training program. Lawyers love that stuff. 🙄

 

[WisNeuro]

Honestly, if I was supervising a student and they asked me to consult on a case outside of the training practicum, I would refuse. Way too much liability.