How much trust can be put in the US News acceptance rate statistics?

[efle]

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I noticed today that US News lists a 19.6% acceptance rate for Texas A&M, but MSAR says only 18.8% of applicants got interviews.

Similarly, US News says UVA had a 12.5% acceptance rate, but MSAR says 12.7% get interviews.

...what's the deal? I know US News uses 2013 data while MSAR uses 2014 data, but these numbers still seem quite wrong. Are % interviewed rates being listed as acceptance rates by accident?

Should I trust the other, more reasonable seeming acceptance rates listed in US News or are there likely to be totally wrong values all over the place?

 

[breakintheroof]

I noticed today that US News lists a 19.6% acceptance rate for Texas A&M, but MSAR says only 18.8% of applicants got interviews.

Similarly, US News says UVA had a 12.5% acceptance rate, but MSAR says 12.7% get interviews.

...what's the deal? I know US News uses 2013 data while MSAR uses 2014 data, but these numbers still seem quite wrong. Are % interviewed rates being listed as acceptance rates by accident?

Should I trust the other, more reasonable seeming acceptance rates listed in US News or are there likely to be totally wrong values all over the place?

In this case, the difference is explained by different denominators. US News lists far fewer applicants to UVA. I suspect that UVA might be counting only completed applicants, rather than verified applicants as in the MSAR.

To the question in your thread title, I am less sure than I used to be. The US News data are self-reported. Supposedly someone at each school certifies their accuracy, but it seems that the schools interpret the questions idiosyncratically at best.

 

[LizzyM]

It could be that students admitted through a direct from undergrad program get counted as "accepted" but not counted among those interviewed? Ditto MD/PhD applicants who don't go through the regular admissions interview?? MSAR is complied by AAMC which knows who applied where and which schools made offers and where the applicant matriculated.

USNews, I suspect, depends on someone in an office filling out a form. Some clerical workers might not be very precise.

 

[hoihaie]

how many applicants did UVA get last year? if they had around 5000 applicants, 12.5% is at least 600 people. I doubt that's the number of people being accepted there.

 

[WedgeDawg]

how many applicants did UVA get last year? if they had around 5000 applicants, 12.5% is at least 600 people. I doubt that's the number of people being accepted there.

As per UVA's website, they interview 650 people and offer 300 acceptances for a class of 156.

http://www.medicine.virginia.edu/ed.../admissions-cycle/admissions-information.html

Not sure which of the two sources this matches up most closely too as I no longer have a subscription to either.

 

[efle]

Thanks for the quick answers! The handful of weird values make sense if schools differ in whether they report completed vs verified apps. I'll still assume numbers that make sense (accept rate around a third or half the interview rate) are valid.

 

[Goro]

In the med school admissions process, I strongly urge all pre-meds to trust nothing in USN&WR. Nothing.

I noticed today that US News lists a 19.6% acceptance rate for Texas A&M, but MSAR says only 18.8% of applicants got interviews.

Similarly, US News says UVA had a 12.5% acceptance rate, but MSAR says 12.7% get interviews.

...what's the deal? I know US News uses 2013 data while MSAR uses 2014 data, but these numbers still seem quite wrong. Are % interviewed rates being listed as acceptance rates by accident?

Should I trust the other, more reasonable seeming acceptance rates listed in US News or are there likely to be totally wrong values all over the place?

 

[Psai]

Man why do premeds have such a slavish devotion to usnews? It's garbage

 

[NickNaylor]

Man why do premeds have such a slavish devotion to usnews? It's garbage

It's the only thing that is "objective" (lol) and thus "useful" for externally validating notions of "success."

 

[efle]

In the med school admissions process, I strongly urge all pre-meds to trust nothing in USN&WR. Nothing.

Really?? I know the "research rankings" are pretty useless and I heard the Average Step 1 scores were highly suspect from mimelim but the other data (average MCATs, GPAs) seemed to agree with the MSAR. You think their acceptance rate info is nonsense too?

Man why do premeds have such a slavish devotion to usnews? It's garbage

I don't get the obsession with research ranks but info on acceptance rates is pretty nice to have and isn't found in the MSAR

It's the only thing that is "objective" (lol) and thus "useful" for externally validating notions of "success."

I think more people use it for average score and acceptance data, I dunno how knowing that stuff as a premed validates their success

 

[NickNaylor]

Really?? I know the "research rankings" are pretty useless and I heard the Average Step 1 scores were highly suspect from mimelim but the other data (average MCATs, GPAs) seemed to agree with the MSAR. You think their acceptance rate info is nonsense too?



I don't get the obsession with research ranks but info on acceptance rates is pretty nice to have and isn't found in the MSAR



I think more people use it for average score and acceptance data, I dunno how knowing that stuff as a premed validates their success

Then why not use the MSAR? That resource is infinitely more helpful than USNWR in that regard.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

To be fair, it's often referenced by med students, residents, and attendings i.e. I attend(ed) a top whatever school.

 

[efle]

Then why not use the MSAR? That resource is infinitely more helpful than USNWR in that regard.

Oh I agree, any time there's duplication I use the MSAR. Info on acceptance rates is only provided by USN though

To be fair, it's often referenced by med students, residents, and attendings i.e. I attend(ed) a top whatever school.

Yeah, the staff at the wustl hospital all had badges saying whatever Top 10 rank they got that year lol

 

[Psai]

To be fair, it's often referenced by med students, residents, and attendings i.e. I attend(ed) a top whatever school.

Maybe on sdn but that's more to preserve anonymity. I don't even know my school's rank. In real life people don't say or they tell you which one outright. But sometimes they'll be annoying like oh at the Clinic we always did it this way. Alright buddy you were in Cleveland for a few years ten years ago get over it

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Maybe on sdn but that's more to preserve anonymity. I don't even know my school's rank. In real life people just don't say or they tell you which one outright. But sometimes they'll be annoying like oh at the Clinic we always did it this way. Alright buddy you were in Cleveland for a few years ten years ago get over it

Yeah and premeds at my school rarely discuss US News rankings. Maybe it's more prevalent at other schools, but it's unfair to say that premeds in general have an obsession with US News.

 

[mimelim]

To be fair, it's often referenced by med students, residents, and attendings i.e. I attend(ed) a top whatever school.

We as a department care about it a lot because our patients care about it, a lot. A lot of the measures that they use for the calculations are bull****/easy to inflate, so there is an arms race among hospitals to have the data to justify sending better numbers to US News. But, at the end the day, we are a 'Top hospital' with the banners to prove it! Which is what a lot of patients go by.

US News was very smart to fill in a niche of ranking things that can't really be ranked or shouldn't be ranked, but people want ranked. And they make money for it.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

We as a department care about it a lot because our patients care about it, a lot. A lot of the measures that they use for the calculations are bull****/easy to inflate, so there is an arms race among hospitals to have the data to justify sending better numbers to US News. But, at the end the day, we are a 'Top hospital' with the banners to prove it! Which is what a lot of patients go by.

US News was very smart to fill in a niche of ranking things that can't really be ranked or shouldn't be ranked, but people want ranked. And they make money for it.

Also, these rankings most likely help certain schools recruit some of the best students. I'd imagine that US News rankings are more often discussed by students at top undergrads like your alma mater.

 

[efle]

Also, these rankings most likely help certain schools recruit some of the best students. I'd imagine that US News rankings are more often discussed by students at top undergrads like your alma mater.

Actually I think being an unknown name and in the slightly-past-10 range makes you LOSE some of the best. Student caliber may be the same by the numbers but people care a lot about Ivy name recognition or Top 10 status instead of going for the insanely nice dorms and better weather 😛

Source: SO MANY friends from high school chose places like Cornell or Brown or Duke for these reasons

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Actually I think being an unknown name and in the slightly-past-10 range makes you LOSE some of the best. Student caliber may be the same by the numbers but people care a lot about Ivy name recognition or Top 10 status instead of going for the insanely nice dorms and better weather 😛

Source: SO MANY friends from high school chose places like Cornell or Brown or Duke for these reasons

I was referring to students at top undergrads possibly discussing med school rankings at a greater frequency than students at other schools.

 

[efle]

Also, these rankings most likely help certain schools recruit some of the best students.

Was responding to that bit about US News ranks in general. If you just meant the med school rankings then I bet the same thing happens, and also that med schools attached to big-name undergrads benefit from the connection

I haven't ever heard anyone in a real conversation mention US News med school ranks, it's just a big thing on these boards and privately for people that want that validation

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Was responding to that bit about US News ranks in general. If you just meant the med school rankings then I bet the same thing happens, and also that med schools attached to big-name undergrads benefit from the connection

I haven't ever heard anyone in a real conversation mention US News med school ranks, it's just a big thing on these boards and privately for people that want that validation

FWIW, a lot of med schools emphasize their US News rank. Even those ranked in the top 50. Look at UC Irvine.

 

[efle]

FWIW, a lot of med schools emphasize their US News rank. Even those ranked in the top 50. Look at UC Irvine.

Wow, and I thought Vandy was being weird making it front and center in their brochure.

Now are they doing this only because they know us dumb premeds love a sexy rank (like mimelim was saying about patients and hospitals), or do they buy into it themselves?

 

[Psai]

We as a department care about it a lot because our patients care about it, a lot. A lot of the measures that they use for the calculations are bull****/easy to inflate, so there is an arms race among hospitals to have the data to justify sending better numbers to US News. But, at the end the day, we are a 'Top hospital' with the banners to prove it! Which is what a lot of patients go by.

US News was very smart to fill in a niche of ranking things that can't really be ranked or shouldn't be ranked, but people want ranked. And they make money for it.

it's all silly people circlejerking one another

 

[efle]

it's all silly people circlejerking one another

Or bright people profiting on/dealing with the idiocy of the masses as best they can

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Wow, and I thought Vandy was being weird making it front and center in their brochure.

Now are they doing this only because they know us dumb premeds love a sexy rank (like mimelim was saying about patients and hospitals), or do they buy into it themselves?

Lol, I was also going to include a Vandy link. I think it's for both reasons.
UCSF lol.

 

[efle]

Lol, I was also going to include a Vandy link. I think it's for both reasons.
UCSF lol.

Well they shouldn't have included the "overall score" column. 86%? I have no interest in a B grade school.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Well they shouldn't have included the "overall score" column. 86%? I have no interest in a B grade school.

I'll be over the moon if that B grade school accepts me

 

[Shams al Deen]

Clearly a lot of schools and hospitals brag about their rankings, and I find this incredibly lame. I doubt you'd see Harvard ever bragging about their USNews rank lol. It reminds me of the difference between a Mercedes/BMW commercial versus a Kia or Hyundai commercial. Greatness shouldn't have to try to sell you that they're great.

 

[justadream]

Clearly a lot of schools and hospitals brag about their rankings, and I find this incredibly lame. I doubt you'd see Harvard ever bragging about their USNews rank lol. It reminds me of the difference between a Mercedes/BMW commercial versus a Kia or Hyundai commercial. Greatness shouldn't have to try to sell you that they're great.

Of course, but that is Harvard you are talking about. Vandy doesn't have as much public prestige as Harvard (many wouldn't even know what Vandy is!). Vandy wants to attract interest in its school and listing its ranking is an effective way to show the average person that yes, Vandy is a good school.

 

[EasternMer]

I would echo what a lot of posters have already stated, forget US News....focus on MSAR

 

[Shams al Deen]

Of course, but that is Harvard you are talking about. Vandy doesn't have as much public prestige as Harvard (many wouldn't even know what Vandy is!). Vandy wants to attract interest in its school and listing its ranking is an effective way to show the average person that yes, Vandy is a good school.

Yeah, Benz vs Hyundai.

 

[efle]

I would echo what a lot of posters have already stated, forget US News....focus on MSAR

But MSAR only has % interviewed data! Is there no valid source of acceptance rate data?

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Yeah, Benz vs Hyundai.

You're calling Vandy a Hyundai?!!😵😵

 

[mimelim]

You're calling Vandy a Hyundai?!!😵😵

I want a Hyundai more than I want a Benz.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

I want a Hyundai more than I want a Benz.

I would take that Hyundai in a heartbeat.
Nashville>>>>>>>>>>>>>Boston

 

[Shams al Deen]

You're calling Vandy a Hyundai?!!😵😵

I'm calling the strategy of boasting ratings Hyundai-esque. Kinda lame.