How would you rank the shelf exams?

[Parietal Lobe]

I'm a second year preparing to start rotations in two months. I'm just wondering, which shelf exams did you guys find to be the easiest? My school only requires us to take three shelf exams (of our choosing). The other rotations will have school-administered exams. I'm interested in IM, so I'll take that shelf exam for residency purposes, but what other four should I elect to take just to get through the rotation (unless I find I like a field more than IM of course)?

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[2012mdc]

I'm a second year preparing to start rotations in two months. I'm just wondering, which shelf exams did you guys find to be the easiest? My school only requires us to take three shelf exams (of our choosing). The other rotations will have school-administered exams. I'm interested in IM, so I'll take that shelf exam for residency purposes, but what other four should I elect to take just to get through the rotation (unless I find I like a field more than IM of course)?

Only done four rotations but I would rank the 4 I did from hardest to easiest as
1. Surg - trickier than IM IMO.
2. IM - ton of material but if you study hard it's very doable
3. FM - not too bad but can be tricky
4. Psych - definitely the easiest I've had, just make sure you take it somewhat serious

Heard peds was difficult and OB was relatively easy

 

[PokerDoc]

I haven't done OBGYN or medicine yet, but of the four I have


1) Family Med (hardest, just all over the place)
2) Surgery
3) Pediatrics
4) Psych (easiest)

 

[buckeye12]

Hardest to easiest:

1) Family
2) IM
3) Surg
4) Neuro
5) Psych

 

[mordounhas]

Hardest to easiest:

1. FM
2. Neuro
3. Surgery
4. Ob
5. Psych

I did family medicine second after I started with surgery. It was easily the hardest- I have heard that it can be considerably easier if you do it after medicine, peds, etc.

 

[MilkmanAl]

Hardest first:

1. Surgery
2. Family
3. Neuro
4. OB/Gyn
17. Psych

 

[2012mdc]

Hardest to easiest:

1. FM
2. Neuro
3. Surgery
4. Ob
5. Psych

I did family medicine second after I started with surgery. It was easily the hardest- I have heard that it can be considerably easier if you do it after medicine, peds, etc.

I felt FM was easier even after Surgery. Maybe the test just seemed GI and Endo heavy so I was ready but Idk. Everyone who had FM 1st made it seem terrible but I thought it was a random but doable exam.

I put waaaaay more time into studying for Surg than FM and my scores differed by 1 point

 

[Depakote]

I'd say psych was one of the easier shelf exams.

OB/Gyn is pretty manageable.

Family wasn't terrible since I took it at the very end. It's killer at the beginning.

Peds was a little rough and had more minutia than I would have expected.

Surgery was a tougher one, but it was also my first, I wouldn't say it was the worst.

Medicine was a lot of volume. That might be the toughest.

 

[El Dooderino]

well this is hard because they're all curved, but on an absolute scale the "hard tier" is surgery, medicine, family
"middle tier" neuro, peds
"low tier" psych, ob/gyn

 

[cpants]

It's hard to get a good answer, because they get a lot easier as the year goes on. Someone, like me, who had OB first will tell you that was the hardest. I thought IM and FM were a piece of cake at the end of the year. Blew em out of the water. I would try to take your shelfs on you later rotations. There is a lot of overlap of the other rotations on each shelf, and the more under your belt, the easier they are.

 

[bioteach]

I agree with the above. Shelf exams get easier the more you've taken due to content overlap so the answers are going to vary based on order taken. I thought family was by far the hardest, but I took it second. If I'd already had peds, ob, IM - I probably would have found it much more agreeable. Surgery was the second hardest, but would have been quite a bit easier had I already taken IM.

1. Family
2. Surgery
3. OB
4. Neuro
5. Psych
(haven't done peds or IM yet)

 

[SGuttenberg]

Of the ones I have done, hardest to easiest.

1. Family
2. Peds
3. OB
4. Surgery

I don't get why family was so hard when its one of the specialities with the lowest usmle performance of its residents. That shelf was like sitting for step 2. I mean seriously how many FM docs have the slightest clue about treating AIDS and polyarteritis nodosa. Just give me COPD and type 2 DM questions like the patients you actually see on the rotation.

 

[Day man]

So is FM as a 1st rotation a terrible or OK idea? Anyone think step 1 carry over might help? ...I was happy to have this first, apparently no dice though.

 

[metallo]

Hardest: Surgery
Easiest: Psych

 

[2012mdc]

So is FM as a 1st rotation a terrible or OK idea? Anyone think step 1 carry over might help? ...I was happy to have this first, apparently no dice though.

Terrible. FM is the worst to have to 1st and Step 1 knowledge really doesn't help with FM, more with IM

 

[bleeker10]

I have to set up when I want to take the NBME shelfs and I may have to double up a couple of the shelf exams. We have to take them on certain dates starting the third month of rotations and then every other month. I have heard the Ob and peds shelfs are tough and to not take them the same day. Is there any truth to this? I am going to have to double up two of the tests and my options are:

1) Ob and peds
2) Peds and FP
3) FP and surg

Which would be the best situation? The tests are P/F at my school and don't go towards the grade for the rotation. It's more to make sure we are preparing for step 2 properly.

Thanks

 

[2012mdc]

I have to set up when I want to take the NBME shelfs and I may have to double up a couple of the shelf exams. We have to take them on certain dates starting the third month of rotations and then every other month. I have heard the Ob and peds shelfs are tough and to not take them the same day. Is there any truth to this? I am going to have to double up two of the tests and my options are:

1) Ob and peds
2) Peds and FP
3) FP and surg

Which would be the best situation? The tests are P/F at my school and don't go towards the grade for the rotation. It's more to make sure we are preparing for step 2 properly.

Thanks

I would do OB and peds. Haven't taken OB yet but I heard that shelf was the 2nd easiest after Psych. Mainly I would just avoid FM and Surg. Those are two of the more difficult shelf exams

 

[boobelle]

I'm a second year preparing to start rotations in two months. I'm just wondering, which shelf exams did you guys find to be the easiest? My school only requires us to take three shelf exams (of our choosing). The other rotations will have school-administered exams. I'm interested in IM, so I'll take that shelf exam for residency purposes, but what other four should I elect to take just to get through the rotation (unless I find I like a field more than IM of course)?

I'd rank whatever shelf you take first to be the hardest, and whatever shelf you take last to be the easiest. Really.

The more cumulative knowledge and the more clinical experience you have, the easier the shelf. For instance, surgery was my first shelf and I thought it was tough...but when I came back to surgery to prepare for Step 2, much of the material that seemed tough or unclear seemed obvious and intuitive. Also, the more exposure you have to shelfs and how to study, the better you will get at preparing for the exam. These are same reasons why Step 2CK is so much easier than Step 1, it's because you've had a year of direct experience and studying for shelf exams (old/alt. Step 2 questions).So, if you're interested in IM, I would do it later on in your year and last in terms of the exams you decide to take.

 

[unsung]

Terrible. FM is the worst to have to 1st and Step 1 knowledge really doesn't help with FM, more with IM

Can anyone clarify how the FM shelf is different from the IM shelf?

I guess I'm still not clear on how family med is all that different from internal med, since both are primary care treating the same patient population, with the same presenting complaints... (minus the kids)

So are the types of Qs different or ...?

 

[2012mdc]

Can anyone clarify how the FM shelf is different from the IM shelf?

I guess I'm still not clear on how family med is all that different from internal med, since both are primary care treating the same patient population, with the same presenting complaints... (minus the kids)

So are the types of Qs different or ...?

FM covers everything - peds, OB, psych, surgical issues, and mostly outpatient IM. In addition to the broad area covered the shelf covers pure memorization details like immunizations and screening tests. From what I remember FM seem to test more management aka "what would you do next during this clinic visit".

IM has more questions similar to Step 1 in terms of understanding disease processes and while it has still management questions it just seems to have less than FM.

 

[Krazykyle]

1) Internal Medicine
2) OB/Gyn
3) Pediatrics
4) Surgery - Came after IM for me, they are essentially the same exam except surgery is much easier.
5) Psych

 

[Deferoxamine]

Almost a full year removed from the MS3 shelf exams, and now with perspective on each of those experiences, looking back. Taking out the subjectivity that comes with each person taking them in a different order, and/or which subject shelf exams you have already taken prior to each one:

From hardest to easiest:

1.) Surgery
2.) Internal Medicine
3.) Ob-Gyn
4.) Family Medicine
5.) Pediatrics
6.) Psychiatry

 

[laputan]

Almost a full year removed from the MS3 shelf exams, and now with perspective on each of those experiences, looking back. Taking out the subjectivity that comes with each person taking them in a different order, and/or which subject shelf exams you have already taken prior to each one:

From hardest to easiest:

1.) Surgery
2.) Internal Medicine
3.) Ob-Gyn
4.) Family Medicine
5.) Pediatrics
6.) Psychiatry

Agree completely.

 

[2012mdc]

Almost a full year removed from the MS3 shelf exams, and now with perspective on each of those experiences, looking back. Taking out the subjectivity that comes with each person taking them in a different order, and/or which subject shelf exams you have already taken prior to each one:

From hardest to easiest:

1.) Surgery
2.) Internal Medicine
3.) Ob-Gyn
4.) Family Medicine
5.) Pediatrics
6.) Psychiatry

Haven't taken OB yet but everyone at my school has said OB is one of the easiest ones, even the people who took it first. Maybe they're doing something special on that rotation. Everyone at my school says Peds and FM are harder than OB

 

[OCallag]

From hardest to easiest

1. Surgery
2. Neurology
3. Pediatrics
4. Internal Medicine
5. Family Medicine
6. OB/GYN
7. Psychiatry

#5 is completely contingent upon when you have this rotation. I had it at the end of the year and it wasn't too hard.

Neurology was just all over the place.

 

[vicinihil]

1. Psychiatry
2. Family medicine
3. Surgery
4. Internal Medicine
5. Pediatrics
6. OB-GYN
7. Pediatrics

 

[OCallag]

1. Psychiatry
2. Family medicine
3. Surgery
4. Internal Medicine
5. Pediatrics
6. OB-GYN
7. Pediatrics

Pediatrics twice?

 

[drizzt3117]

Hardest to easiest:

1) surgery
2) ob-gyn
3) medicine

We don't take fm/peds here, I have psych last, just took surgery yesterday, it was fine though, def did have a lot of medicine in it.

 

[SGuttenberg]

Hardest to easiest:

1) surgery
2) ob-gyn
3) medicine

We don't take fm/peds here, I have psych last, just took surgery yesterday, it was fine though, def did have a lot of medicine in it.

You don't take Peds? I've never heard of that. I thought LCME rules were all M3s had to take Medicine,FM,Surgery,Obgyn,Peds and Neuro&Psych

 

[drizzt3117]

You don't take Peds? I've never heard of that. I thought LCME rules were all M3s had to take Medicine,FM,Surgery,Obgyn,Peds and Neuro&Psych

We have the rotation but have a departmental exam instead of a shelf. We also can take Neuro either 3rd or 4th year. Some schools don't have FM.

 

[deleted263296]

Peds > Ob/Gyn > Surg > IM > Neuro > Psych

 

[MilkmanAl]

Peds was freaking hard, but I didn't really care enough about it to get an accurate read on how hard it was. I guess I'd slot it in at #2 after surgery.

 

[WellWornLad]

Hardest to easiest:

1) IM
2) Everything else

I don't get the problem people had with surgery. It was the second to highest mean score for our group behind psych. IM was just brutal - infectious disease to heme-onc to pulm to cards to derm to endo to rheum, just way too much stuff. And half the questions had to do with ITP for some reason, as if I ever saw that on the wards.

 

[drizzt3117]

Hardest to easiest:

1) IM
2) Everything else

I don't get the problem people had with surgery. It was the second to highest mean score for our group behind psych. IM was just brutal - infectious disease to heme-onc to pulm to cards to derm to endo to rheum, just way too much stuff. And half the questions had to do with ITP for some reason, as if I ever saw that on the wards.

Partially it's just what people expected, the surgery test didn't have much surgery on it. Idk, I thought medicine was pretty easy tbh, it's the only shelf I didnt take all the time (finished in like 1:45)

 

[username456789]

Hardest to easiest:

1) IM
2) Everything else

I don't get the problem people had with surgery. It was the second to highest mean score for our group behind psych. IM was just brutal - infectious disease to heme-onc to pulm to cards to derm to endo to rheum, just way too much stuff. And half the questions had to do with ITP for some reason, as if I ever saw that on the wards.

It really all depends on when you take the exam, I guess.

FYI, our school's mean on the surgery shelf when I took it was 73. Our school's mean on the Medicine shelf when I took it was 81.