HS Interested in being a PA

[Volunteer93]

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Hi I'm 17 and a senior in highschool. I've always been Interested in science, helping people but more significantly how the human body works and how disorders, diseases, and medication effect the human body (i have suffered from a few disorders that have probably sparked the interest!). ANYWAYS I'm interested in being a PA because med school is a LONG time and despite my interest I think I would get burned out after a long time. I just have some questions and if you guys have any suggestions in between I'd be very grateful.
-I talked to my ortho PA who said she had offers thrown at her after graduation...is that the case with any subspecialty?
-can a physician assistant specialize in anesthesiology? I know CRNA but I don't like the nursing model....
-what kind of salaries do PAs receive? What's the average? What's the max potential? Reason I ask is I want my family to be comfortable and I don't have time for having trouble finding a good paying job at all.

Thanks in advance...

 

[Seahawk]

PA across the street from my college running his own practice. He functions just like an MD. It's actually quite amazing how much stuff he can do.

Makes a ton of money. Probably in upwards of 300k.


Total quack though.

I went in for a strep test, negative, left with the guys salary information (very insecure, kept volunteering info) and a bottle of Vicodin...For a sore throat...

 

[Volunteer93]

PA across the street from my college running his own practice. He functions just like an MD. It's actually quite amazing how much stuff he can do.

Makes a ton of money. Probably in upwards of 300k.


Total quack though.

I went in for a strep test, negative, left with the guys salary information (very insecure, kept volunteering info) and a bottle of Vicodin...For a sore throat...

Hmm interesting...doesn't sound like I want to be insecure or write prescriptions for opioids over a sore throat...

 

[Badger MD]

Hi I'm 17 and a senior in highschool. I've always been Interested in science, helping people but more significantly how the human body works and how disorders, diseases, and medication effect the human body (i have suffered from a few disorders that have probably sparked the interest!). ANYWAYS I'm interested in being a PA because med school is a LONG time and despite my interest I think I would get burned out after a long time. I just have some questions and if you guys have any suggestions in between I'd be very grateful.
-I talked to my ortho PA who said she had offers thrown at her after graduation...is that the case with any subspecialty?
-can a physician assistant specialize in anesthesiology? I know CRNA but I don't like the nursing model....
-what kind of salaries do PAs receive? What's the average? What's the max potential? Reason I ask is I want my family to be comfortable and I don't have time for having trouble finding a good paying job at all.

Thanks in advance...

My current dermatologist was actually a PA who later became a medical doctor. I don't know her reasons why, but it obviously worked out for her. She is now part of an 8 doctor + 1 PA dermatology practice which wins numerous awards every year. When I talked to her about her initially being a PA, she said she did it because she liked how you could switch specialties fairly easily (she was originally practicing internal medicine) however I'm not sure if you can switch that easily today... She told me her salary was somewhere between 180k-220k, but she joined a very established and popular practice right after obtaining her degree.

As for anesthesiology, this site might help 🙂
http://paanesthesiaworld.us/

 

[Seahawk]

Yeah neither of those are good.

The first thing I asked him was "So, are you an MD?"

If I were you, I would make sure that you are OK with hearing that. I am 100% confident that's why he was so insecure.

 

[deleted6669]

Let me be honest here. if you are in HS your goal should be MD. it looks like a long road now but it's even longer at 35 or 40 when you decide to go back after working as a pa.
the pa salaries above are not avg. a typical pa makes around 90k after a few yrs. very few make >150k. as a pa you will work more hrs than most docs for half as much money or less. you will work more nights/weekends/holidays. docs hire pa's to do the work they don't want to do when they don't want to do it.
if interested in anesthesiology check out the anesthesiologist assistant profession. similar to pa but does anesthesia without doing nursing first. similar training and scope of practice to crna. places that use both use them interchangeably.
focus on md and save yourself a lot of heartache later. trust me on this.
If you decide to pursue pa anyway check out the following:
www.aapa.org
www.appap.org
www.physicianassistantforum.com

also if you set your mind on pa spend as little time here at sdn as possible. it will only depress you seeing endless threads about how pa's suck and docs are awesome.

 

[avatarftw]

As a doctor you cannot easily switch between specialties; you have to do another residency. (3-7 years) Obviously it would be a big strain on your free time and financial health to forgo even more years of attending earning power.

My current dermatologist was actually a PA who later became a medical doctor. I don't know her reasons why, but it obviously worked out for her. She is now part of an 8 doctor + 1 PA dermatology practice which wins numerous awards every year. When I talked to her about her initially being a PA, she said she did it because she liked how you could switch specialties fairly easily (she was originally practicing internal medicine) however I'm not sure if you can switch that easily today... She told me her salary was somewhere between 180k-220k, but she joined a very established and popular practice right after obtaining her degree.

As for anesthesiology, this site might help 🙂
http://paanesthesiaworld.us/

 

[deleted6669]

As a doctor you cannot easily switch between specialties; you have to do another residency. (3-7 years) Obviously it would be a big strain on your free time and financial health to forgo even more years of attending earning power.

although some specialties lend themselves to variation via fellowships( IM) or broad scope of practice and procedural options(family med- can do almost any outpt procedure you get training for; sigs, vasectomies, treadmills, etc).

 

[mmmcdowe]

meh

 

[Seahawk]

Listen to emedpa.

And yeah, that 300k+ is DEFINITELY not average for a PA. Because very few PA's do what he is doing.

 

[Badger MD]

As a doctor you cannot easily switch between specialties; you have to do another residency. (3-7 years) Obviously it would be a big strain on your free time and financial health to forgo even more years of attending earning power.

If you actually read my post more carefully you would see she became a PA because of how easily you could switch specialties, not a doctor 😉

 

[Barcu]

Another thing about being a PA to add and to think about:

It is less schooling, so it is very intense (less than med school but also in half the time).

Due to less schooling, PA applicants are expected to have thousands of clinical hours. So, PA applicants tend to (not always) be older than MD applicants and have worked in the healthcare field as a nurse, CNA, or Medical Assistant. So, it is very likely that you will become a PA at about the same time you become a doctor or even later.

You can have a changeable specialty and a fair amount of independence. However, you will never have the responsibility of an MD and you will most likely not make over 90 or 100 thousand. Certainly, that is good money, but an MD will make more.

 

[Volunteer93]

Another thing about being a PA to add and to think about:

It is less schooling, so it is very intense (less than med school but also in half the time).

Due to less schooling, PA applicants are expected to have thousands of clinical hours. So, PA applicants tend to (not always) be older than MD applicants and have worked in the healthcare field as a nurse, CNA, or Medical Assistant. So, it is very likely that you will become a PA at about the same time you become a doctor or even later.

You can have a changeable specialty and a fair amount of independence. However, you will never have the responsibility of an MD and you will most likely not make over 90 or 100 thousand. Certainly, that is good money, but an MD will make more.

Changeable specialty does sound nice and 80-90 grand at 26-27 sounds nice too but that's not much with a family...I guess I could go through undergrad pre-med or whatever and decide from there maybe? Is that possible or do they want me to absolutely know I want to be a PA or MD.

 

[avatarftw]

I saw the matriculant characteristics document prepared by the APA and I was surprised to see that a large percentage (it was like 60% or so) of people accepted to PA school had very little clinical experience. (Less than a year or none) However, the 1,000 hours of clinical experience that many PA schools profess to require can be obtained relatively easily during college if you work during the summers.

Another thing about being a PA to add and to think about:

It is less schooling, so it is very intense (less than med school but also in half the time).

Due to less schooling, PA applicants are expected to have thousands of clinical hours. So, PA applicants tend to (not always) be older than MD applicants and have worked in the healthcare field as a nurse, CNA, or Medical Assistant. So, it is very likely that you will become a PA at about the same time you become a doctor or even later.

You can have a changeable specialty and a fair amount of independence. However, you will never have the responsibility of an MD and you will most likely not make over 90 or 100 thousand. Certainly, that is good money, but an MD will make more.

 

[avatarftw]

80 or 90 thousand per year is definitely enough for a person and their family. There are tons of people surviving on much less.

Changeable specialty does sound nice and 80-90 grand at 26-27 sounds nice too but that's not much with a family...I guess I could go through undergrad pre-med or whatever and decide from there maybe? Is that possible or do they want me to absolutely know I want to be a PA or MD.

 

[docB]

Let me be honest here. if you are in HS your goal should be MD. it looks like a long road now but it's even longer at 35 or 40 when you decide to go back after working as a pa.
the pa salaries above are not avg. a typical pa makes around 90k after a few yrs. very few make >150k. as a pa you will work more hrs than most docs for half as much money or less. you will work more nights/weekends/holidays. docs hire pa's to do the work they don't want to do when they don't want to do it.
if interested in anesthesiology check out the anesthesiologist assistant profession. similar to pa but does anesthesia without doing nursing first. similar training and scope of practice to crna. places that use both use them interchangeably.
focus on md and save yourself a lot of heartache later. trust me on this.
If you decide to pursue pa anyway check out the following:
www.aapa.org
www.appap.org
www.physicianassistantforum.com

When I read the OP my first thought was "Great. You know you want to be a PA in HS. You will be practicing by the time you're 24."

But after reading emedpa's post I have to agree with him for the most part. First, he knows what he's talking about. Second, once I thought about it, almost all the PAs I know became PAs as the result of a career change. Several were military, several paramedics, others were from totally different industries. But all were older with financial obligations and needed to get educated and back to earning status ASAP so they chose the 2 year PA path rather than the 7 year (at least) med path.

So I agree that while you're young and unencumbered you ought to consider medicine if you want to practice medicine. Not that PA isn't a great field with some benefits such as the ability to switch specialties.

also if you set your mind on pa spend as little time here at sdn as possible. it will only depress you seeing endless threads about how pa's suck and docs are awesome.

PAs do have to have really thick skins on SDN. The opinions of premeds and medical students are often very abrasive. They are also often uninformed and ignorant when it comes to financial issues in medicine such as midlevel practitioners.

 

[Volunteer93]

When I read the OP my first thought was "Great. You know you want to be a PA in HS. You will be practicing by the time you're 24."

But after reading emedpa's post I have to agree with him for the most part. First, he knows what he's talking about. Second, once I thought about it, almost all the PAs I know became PAs as the result of a career change. Several were military, several paramedics, others were from totally different industries. But all were older with financial obligations and needed to get educated and back to earning status ASAP so they chose the 2 year PA path rather than the 7 year (at least) med path.

So I agree that while you're young and unencumbered you ought to consider medicine if you want to practice medicine. Not that PA isn't a great field with some benefits such as the ability to switch specialties.

PAs do have to have really thick skins on SDN. The opinions of premeds and medical students are often very abrasive. They are also often uninformed and ignorant when it comes to financial issues in medicine such as midlevel practitioners.

I guess given I'll be 17 starting college that's a good consideration...eating my words here a bit but what do you guys think of CRNA's? For whatever reason anesthesia fascinates me (I went through some of my old surgical records today for fun), I guess I could deal with the nurse model. They make good money too right? Something like 120k a year sound right?

 

[DrYoda]

I'm going to echo what some have already said: at your age time shouldn't be deterring you from getting an MD if you want one.

Something like 120k a year sound right?

I think average CRNA income is more like 150k.

 

[the duck]

This is really a pointless discussion, the prereqs for MD and PA school are nearly the same, ( with MD schools wanting research and other ECs more, while PA schools really like clinical experience). This isn't a decision you need to be thinking about now, the path toward either is basically the same for the next few years.

 

[BLKPA2MD]

This is really a pointless discussion, the prereqs for MD and PA school are nearly the same, ( with MD schools wanting research and other ECs more, while PA schools really like clinical experience). This isn't a decision you need to be thinking about now, the path toward either is basically the same for the next few years.

....thank you. To the OP, the adviced you've been given thus far are adequate. If you're still undecided, I suggest you enroll in general studies program in college for a feel of what major you really enjoy, shadow an MD/DO, PA or whatever and then take it from there. Get it?

 

[DrYoda]

This is really a pointless discussion, the prereqs for MD and PA school are nearly the same, ( with MD schools wanting research and other ECs more, while PA schools really like clinical experience). This isn't a decision you need to be thinking about now, the path toward either is basically the same for the next few years.

Actually, the bolded isn't true. PA schools have a different set of pre-reqs (and it varies some between the schools). They usually have requirements, like anatomy, physiology, microbio, and psych, while requiring less chem/physics than med schools.

 

[BLKPA2MD]

Actually, the bolded isn't true. PA schools have a different set of pre-reqs (and it varies some between the schools). They usually have requirements, like anatomy, physiology, microbio, and psych, while requiring less chem/physics than med schools.

As a practicing Board Certified Physician Assistant applying to MD sch, PA schools does not have a different set of pre-reqs. For PA sch, I took 8cr hrs chem/phys/A+P/Micro bio/ Organic chem I etc.... In my program, every students are required to take Biochemistry, Pathophysiology, Gross Anatomy with cadaver disection prior to 3rd year of the PA program. PA sch is not a work in the park! It just as intense as med sch (not comparing though).

 

[DrYoda]

As a practicing Board Certified Physician Assistant applying to MD sch, PA schools does not have a different set of pre-reqs. For PA sch, I took 8cr hrs chem/phys/A+P/Micro bio/ Organic chem I etc.... In my program, every students are required to take Biochemistry, Pathophysiology, Gross Anatomy with cadaver disection prior to 3rd year of the PA program. PA sch is not a work in the park! It just as intense as med sch (not comparing though).

I'm not really following this, much of what you listed aren't med school pre-reqs. So I guess we agree😉.

Also, a google of a variety of programs confirms. It look like anatomy, physiology and microbio are pretty standard pre-reqs (and they aren't for med school). Psych varies by school. I've yet to find one that requires physics or the same # of chemistry classes as med school (and no, this is not a comment on the rigor of either program). So OP: pick your courses/major carefully if you are undecided on which route to go.

The progams I'm basing this off of:
http://www.shrs.pitt.edu/pa.aspx?id=755&nav=756
http://www.washington.edu/medicine/som/depts/medex/applicants/mchs_prerequisites.htm
http://www.bcm.edu/pap/index.cfm?PMID=6194
http://paprogram.mc.duke.edu/Admissions/Prerequisites/
http://www.ucdmc.ucdavis.edu/fnppa/req-prereq-courses.html

 

[deleted6669]

really depends on the program. "old school pa programs" tend to focus more on clinical experience, microbio, a+p, etc as the above poster mentioned.
many of the newer "academic pa programs" have less of a focus on medical experience but do want 1 yr bio, 2 yrs chem(general +o-chem), biochem, stats, etc(more like medschool prereqs).
I only know of 1 pa program which requires physics(which I think is a shame as physics is both more interesting and useful as a practicing pa than o-chem).
if uncertain as to path doing a degree aimed at medschool prereqs + getting some clinical experience (emt, etc) will likely set you well on your way to either path. if you later decide on pa you may need to go back for microbio, a+p, etc if not taken the first time around. it actually wouldn't be too hard to use electives to fulfill requirements for both in 1 degree( lots of bio majors take a+p, micro, etc anyway).

 

[Volunteer93]

Wow thanks for the replies I really appreciate it..I think if I go the PA/MD Route I will defiantly look at both PA and MD schools reqs and follow both and if if I can't decide by junior year just apply to both...but I'm starting to be tempted by CRNAs...sure they make more money but how much patient contact is there? I wouldn't say I'm a total people person but still...any suggestions for CRNA route? My aunts an anesthesiologist and she says she enjoys not having a rediculous amount of patient contact (at least when there asleep), I think I might talk to her, I wish I could just spectate some of the various specialties for a day or something.

 

[DrYoda]

Wow thanks for the replies I really appreciate it..I think if I go the PA/MD Route I will defiantly look at both PA and MD schools reqs and follow both and if if I can't decide by junior year just apply to both...but I'm starting to be tempted by CRNAs...sure they make more money but how much patient contact is there? I wouldn't say I'm a total people person but still...any suggestions for CRNA route? My aunts an anesthesiologist and she says she enjoys not having a rediculous amount of patient contact (at least when there asleep), I think I might talk to her, I wish I could just spectate some of the various specialties for a day or something.

You can, contact people in various specialties (maybe ask your aunt for anesthesia) and ask if you can shadow.

 

[Volunteer93]

You can, contact people in various specialties (maybe ask your aunt for anesthesia) and ask if you can shadow.

I can? My aunt lives a few hours away but everyone around here is either an anesthesiologist (there's literally 10 in a 10 mile radius), and surgeon, or a lawyer. How would I go about this? Not sure where to ask...

 

[DrYoda]

I can? My aunt lives a few hours away but everyone around here is either an anesthesiologist (there's literally 10 in a 10 mile radius), and surgeon, or a lawyer. How would I go about this? Not sure where to ask...

Try emailing/calling clinics or hospital departments with the specialty you're wanting to shadow. It's not 100% effective, but if you contact multiple places you'll probably get some to bite.