Humility - A Dying Attribute?

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baylordude

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Given that many us would eventually like to do some form of psychological therapy and doing so would seem to necessitate the need for a rather large abundance of humility, do you find it ironic that many of your psych colleagues (undergrad, grad, and online) are some of the most pompous, snead individuals you've ever met? Do you think it's common that many people choose psychology as a compensatory device?
 
I'm not sure I totally agree with this. Since this is the only field we are working in, we are susceptible to bias, because we are not being exposed to inside workings of other professions, and the fact that we are more likely to remember psychologists that were this way to us (i.e., the availability heuristic/fallacy) The base rate of occurrence of being a "pompous jerk" is important here. It's probably not any higher in this profession versus the general populations.

That being said, I think much of what we do see is the result of competitive academic environments and the personalities they attract. The Ph.D psychologists that go into full time practice are very different from those Ph.Ds going into "publish or perish" academia. It takes a very strong, independent, and focused individual to survive and thrive in academia. Unfortunately, over time (especially if the person is not seeing patients and doing purely experimental research), these traits can lend themselves to dismissive and rough interpersonal styles. Second, when one spends all their time researching an area, and becoming the "expert," it can be hard not to get defensive when that view is challenged.....leading to behavior that can be construed as pompous or arrogant.
 
I'm not sure I totally agree with this. Since this is the only field we are working in, we are susceptible to bias, because we are not being exposed to inside workings of other professions, and the fact that we are more likely to remember psychologists that were this way to us (i.e., the availability heuristic/fallacy) The base rate of occurrence of being a "pompous jerk" is important here. It's probably not any higher in this profession versus the general populations.

Perhaps you're right, perhaps the heuristic is at play here. However, in my own personal experience (and generally agreed upon by other psych friends of mine), there is an apparent difference between the psych persona and those of other majors. Psych individuals tend to be really nice people or complete asses - and they seem to accumulate in the latter category in rather large quantities. Of course, the base rate in my case is only reflective of psychology pools at three different universities that I've been affiliated with. My comparison group would be people from classes I've taken that weren't a part of my major and non-psych work environments that I've been exposed to- people seemed to be a nicer lot on the whole.

Second, when one spends all their time researching an area, and becoming the "expert," it can be hard not to get defensive when that view is challenged.....leading to behavior that can be construed as pompous or arrogant.

I think defending a view and being defensive are two separate things. I don't think defending leads to narcissism, but I do think defensiveness does and doesn't deserve the time of day in academia or practice. The latter is not being construed as pompous or arrogant, it simply is.

And not to offend by any means, but are you suggesting that the base rate of assholishness is higher in Ph.D environments compared to Psy.D environments? If that's the case, perhaps I can conclude that a large portion of psych undergrads are Ph.D bound 😀jk .
 
wow, that response got screwed up somehow....i need to work on my quoting skills :laugh:.
 
"Perhaps you're right, perhaps the heuristic is at play here. However, in my own personal experience (and generally agreed upon by other psych friends of mine), there is an apparent difference between the psych persona and those of other majors. Psych individuals tend to be really nice people or complete asses - and they seem to accumulate in the latter category in rather large quantities."

I would use my age old classic..."Your personal experiences are not empirical studies." to counter this conclusion. And yes, I do think it is more likely to come from Ph.D academics, rather than Psy.D who are more likely to clinically oriented and to be the stereotypical "people person." I am myself am a Ph.D ***......lol Just kidding!
 
Compared to the other areas I've had a fair amount of exposure to (medicine, business, and computer science) - psychology folks were actually by FAR the least arrogant.

Understand we're still looking at a jerk : Non-jerk ratio of at least 2:1, its just more like 3:1 or 10:1 in other areas (maybe I just have unreasonable standards...). Admittedly though, the other areas I've been involved in are sort of notorious for being the worst of the worst in terms of arrogance.

Edit: I actually also think it probably happens more on the academic side of things (I say this as someone who wants nothing to do with therapy). Lots of reasons why, I think academia draws that personality type more, its easier to get away with it in academia, etc. That being said, I think the nicest people I know are also in academia (though I admittedly know far more academics than practitioners). I wouldn't be surprised if academia had more "extreme" personalities in either direction though.
 
I agree my personal experiences and those of others aren't the rule of thumb, I was simply pointing out an observation that seemed to be somewhat of a common occurrence. I don't think it's necessary to pull out your "age-old" retort - I'm well aware of the differences between empiricism and simple observation/intuition. A little insight is all I was looking for.

And I didn't get your end quote...where you calling yourself an ass? I would agree...LOL...only joking....
 
But you also have to remember (when considering the researcher vs. practitioner angle) that some researchers would make awesome practitioners, & some practitioners would make awesome researchers. Going with a PsyD, as someone mentioned, or being a practitioner in general, doesn't necessarily make you more of a people person. Most people I know think that I would "change the world" if I became a practitioner. However, I changed my career path to research, because I personally feel like I could make a broader impact (& therefore be more likely to "change the world") in a research setting. Now, this may have a little to do with my population(s)/disorder(s) of interest, but I don't speculate that is all of it. That being said, I am just cautioning against generalizations. Maybe more professors at certain institutions are pompous, because their work climate supports/encourages that attitude. Maybe some come across that way, because working with certain undergrads has made them prematurely old & overly annoyed. Maybe some are pompous only because of your own self-fulfilling prophesies. And maybe some are just straight-up pompous. And maybe some professors are the nicest people you'll ever meet.
 
Is there a reliable, empirically validated jerk/pompous *** scale that we can administer to members of various professions in order to put our anecdotal observations to the test? 🙂
 
Why not survey students and have your groups be psych, english, etc.? Nobody tells it like it is like a college student. Limit your sample to those students who have declared that subject as their major - they know the profs better and are more serious about the subject matter so that would take out some error due to bias against the subject itself rather than the prof. Design the survey with a Likert scale asking them to rate statements like "My prof is an @#$%^", "My prof is humble", and the like. 🙄
 
I think the closest we have is the MMPI-2 scales.....😀

Actually the MCMI does a nice job on it... I think it started off with, "in our view this fighter pilot..." in the one I took. Not that Narcissism is a trait ever seen in fighter pilots or psychologists.

Mark
 
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