I have a question...

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

ihaveaquestion

Junior Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
64
Reaction score
0
Hello all,

I'm a MS3 seriously considering PMR for residency. I have a question for the residents (or anybody in the know, actually) why PMR is not more popular.

I was looking at some '06 match lists UPenn, UMich, Brown, and Stanford, and noticed that nobody applies for PMR! 😕

If somebody could enlighten me I'd greatly appreciate it! 👍

TIA
 
The simple to answer to that question is that there are only about 350 spots nationwide, so there can only be a handful of people that go into the specialty from each school.

With that said, most med students have never even heard of PM&R because their med school does not have a PM&R department. PM&R has always been very popular with med students at my school because of "word of mouth". We generally have about 6-7 go into it each year.

Best of luck in your residency search.

ihaveaquestion said:
Hello all,

I'm a MS3 seriously considering PMR for residency. I have a question for the residents (or anybody in the know, actually) why PMR is not more popular.

I was looking at some '06 match lists UPenn, UMich, Brown, and Stanford, and noticed that nobody applies for PMR! 😕

If somebody could enlighten me I'd greatly appreciate it! 👍

TIA
 
Thanks for the reply. I think your second point is probably more on target; there aren't that many spots for derm but that hasn't really discouraged the barrage of applicants.

I just looked at the Northwestern match list and they have a good number of PMR residents to be's. I'm sure that RIC is a great rehab institution didn't hurt. 😉

I notice that you are at UCLA PMR; what do you know about job availability in Southern California? I grew up in Socal and it'd be great to be able to move back home and work.

P.S. Good luck tomorrow 🙂
 
PM&R is slowly getting more recognition and popularity. I believe one day it will be very competitive field. I would break it down like this:

1) Lack of recognition, knowledge of what PM&R docs do. 99% of the time when I explain what I can do as a PM&R doc, fellow med students and some attendings are surprised. Some docs have the mistaken idea that PM&R docs are the equivalent of glorified personal trainers. They don't realize the amount of medicine PM&R knows, or how broad one's knowledge base must be if they wanted to practice say pedi PM&R and inpt + outpt adult.
With this lack of recognition, there may be a lack of prestige to the field like matching into a highly competitive residency. To some people, the prestige of a field is really important. To me, practicing good medicine and helping others is foremost, and I don't care very much what other specialties think of me insofar as it will affect referrals, etc. I think this recognition is changing as more ortho/NS practices have PM&R docs on board.

2) Average salary is not as high as other specialties. I think no matter what, the average salary of a PM&R doc nation wide is not as high as other specialties such as derm, radiology, radonc, gas, etc. Of course there are many PM&R docs doing extremely well, but I'm talking averages here. There also seems to be a Lack of knowledge of salary information. I've heard some say expect to make $170K starting in private, and others say $220K. Who knows? Salary was not a huge deal for me, but I know when many of my classmates asked me, they seemed disappointed and chose fields like radiology or neurosurg.

3) People don't realize the hours we work until they themselves are in residency. And then they switch. I have heard of almost every single possible specialty switching into PM&R. I have heard of residents in ortho, gen surg, anesth, radiology, IM, ob/gyn, etc switching into PM&R.

4) Many do not want close patient contact, an integral part of PM&R. They hate clinic work/inpatient wards, they don't want to think of social issues or have family meetings, etc. I think you have to have a strong interest in your patients to do PM&R and be patient. I have gotten the comment from friends who told me honestly, "I don't think I have the patience for a field like PM&R."

When all is said and done, the future of PM&R looks bright. Some residents or practicing MDs congratulate me and say "excellent choice" about my decision.

There has been a move towards more outpatient based work in musculoskeletal medicine, which generally has allowed PM&R docs to be at the forefront and the first MD a patient will see. I think more students are recognizing the advantages of this field. There are some who think the field is 'easy to do,' but I can assure you that aside from hours, there is a lot to know just like any other field.

[On a rambling side note: Ironically, the 'easy to do' deterrent doesn't hold up when it comes to many popular specialties such as derm (which I have friends doing and they readily admit it is not rocket science or as broad as say a field like FP or med-peds). In the end, I suspect salaries to be the most critical factor (sadly) as this would be an explanation why something like derm is so popular. However, you can choose to specialize in a subfield that pays well in PM&R also, like EMG.]
 
I agree that the main reason PM&R is not more popular is because of the lack of exposure in med schools. My med school (Stony Brook) did not have any PM&R at the main university hospital, and therefore interested medical students have had to make a concerted effort to get any exposure.

For this reason, one of the main initiatives of the AAP has been to increase the number of mandatory clerkships. For example, my residency program (UMDNJ-NJMS) has a mandatory clerkship, and the residency program is very strong at an institution that doesn't have any other similarly regarded programs. For that reason, UMDNJ-NJMS has become a major feeder program, not just for Kessler, but for other PM&R programs throughout the country. It is the hope of the AAP that all medical schools could help "feed the beast" with talented medical students.
 
Top