If one does not match in SOAP, what next?

[bubleeshaark]

Hello friends,

For me, things are looking bleak regarding SOAP. I am still hoping to match a peds residency, or a TY if that somehow works out. If I get nothing in SOAP, I plan to contact AOA peds programs and see if they have any openings.

If that doesn't work, then I'll look at AOA TY programs.

If that doesn't work, what are my options? I would likely apply to peds programs again next year.

Application: DO student at middle of class. COMLEX I ~550, and COMLEX II ~420 (that's my red flag..). Passed clinical skills exam. All first try. One very strong letter from my regional-dean who's a pediatrician; one private practice pediatrician letter whom "wants me to take over his practice/join him" in a few years; one family medicine letter that's probably mediocre. No research experience. Lots of volunteer experience through my church.

Thanks.

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[NotAProgDirector]

1. You continue looking for a spot (as mentioned above). Perhaps a new program will open, or a current program will have an expansion. Or some matched resident will be unable to start. Lots of things can happen between now and July. You're going to get turned down quite a bit, so be ready for rejection.

2. Extend medical school by another year. This can be very expensive if they charge you full tuition again, but would give you more rotations, more chances for away rotations, etc.

3. Obtain another degree. This is much like #2, in that you pay more tuition but at least this time you get a new degree. But, you may not get any more clinical experience and that's not great.

4. Get a research job. If it's clinical research, you might get some clinical work with it also.

5. Get a job with a clinical focus. Paramedic / EMT. Clinical scribe. Medical assistant. etc.

6. Network. Anything you can do that gets you some facetime with programs is good.

7. Step 3. Whether this really helps or not is debatable. Not doing well on it will definitely not help, so make sure you are prepared. I personally think some clinical experience as a PGY-1 can help immensely with S3, so approach with caution if you're taking it without.

One last option I've raised in the past: challenge the visa system. One could argue that the US should not be giving visas to non-US citizens if there are US citizens who cannot get similar jobs. Others would argue that the positions should go to the best-and-brightest, whether they are US citizens or not, and that applicants requiring visas are already at a huge disadvantage in the application process. I am not taking a stand one way or the other. Neither H nor J visas have any official way (that I know) to challenge -- employers who are "H dependent" (meaning that >15% of their employees are on an H) must certify that the H employees are not displacing a similar quality US citizen candidate (and hence can be challenged) -- but 1) few hospitals are going to be H dependent [even if every single resident was on an H, the denominator for the calculation is all employees of the hospital], and 2) the displacement rules are waived if the employee requires a master's degree. But I expect that the current administration with their "america first" policy would be a willing listener, and Mr. T has mentioned cancelling the entire H visa program in the past.

Note that this can (and likely will) backfire horribly. Even if you were to challenge someone's visa successfully, that doesn't mean they have to hire you instead. They could (and probably would) hire someone else.

 

[bubleeshaark]

Thank you for the reply.

1. Are there resources that tell me if any positions open? Or do I learn of these by word of mouth, my school, etc?
2. How does extending medical school by a year look to residency programs?
3. I won't be going for another degree.
4.
5. Are there jobs that use my DO degree?
6.
7. I will probably not take S3 if I don't match. I agree not having the depth of clinical exposure would hurt me, and I'd rather put my best foot forward.
8. I don't have the heart to do that. Or rather, I have the heart to not do it.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

1. there's no reliable central resource. It's calling around, your school reaching out, etc.
2. There's mixed feelings about that. Whether it's better to extend, vs graduate and then do something else, is debatable. I think which makes more sense depends upon what you need to make your application more competitive. If you need rotations in a new field, then more medical school can help with that. If your exam scores are low, more school will not help with that. Your school may not allow it.
5. There are threads about this. The short answer is "sort of, but you have to hunt for them". You might be able to work in the insurance industry. Or for a state insurance bureaucracy. Or in research (although you don't need a medical degree for that).

 

[ZucattiManicotti]

One last option I've raised in the past: challenge the visa system. One could argue that the US should not be giving visas to non-US citizens if there are US citizens who cannot get similar jobs. Others would argue that the positions should go to the best-and-brightest, whether they are US citizens or not, and that applicants requiring visas are already at a huge disadvantage in the application process. I am not taking a stand one way or the other. Neither H nor J visas have any official way (that I know) to challenge -- employers who are "H dependent" (meaning that >15% of their employees are on an H) must certify that the H employees are not displacing a similar quality US citizen candidate (and hence can be challenged) -- but 1) few hospitals are going to be H dependent [even if every single resident was on an H, the denominator for the calculation is all employees of the hospital], and 2) the displacement rules are waived if the employee requires a master's degree. But I expect that the current administration with their "america first" policy would be a willing listener, and Mr. T has mentioned cancelling the entire H visa program in the past.

Note that this can (and likely will) backfire horribly. Even if you were to challenge someone's visa successfully, that doesn't mean they have to hire you instead. They could (and probably would) hire someone else.

As a Non US citizen at a DO school, this scares me.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

As a Non US citizen at a DO school, this scares me.

You can train on an OPT visa, which is an extension of your F. No one is talking about mucking with that.

 

[ZucattiManicotti]

You can train on an OPT visa, which is an extension of your F. No one is talking about mucking with that.

As I understand OPT is 1 year only, so that wouldn't let me finish residency, meaning I would still need an H1/J1 after that year. Also most individuals like me, who are in US-soil schools, want to stay to practice (well, at least I do....)

 

[NotAProgDirector]

OPT is now 3 years for STEM fields (I believe). In any case, that gives you much more flexibility in getting another work visa.

 

[Whitney DeLozier]

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Hello friends,

For me, things are looking bleak regarding SOAP. I am still hoping to match a peds residency, or a TY if that somehow works out. If I get nothing in SOAP, I plan to contact AOA peds programs and see if they have any openings.

If that doesn't work, then I'll look at AOA TY programs.

If that doesn't work, what are my options? I would likely apply to peds programs again next year.

Application: DO student at middle of class. COMLEX I ~550, and COMLEX II ~420 (that's my red flag..). Passed clinical skills exam. All first try. One very strong letter from my regional-dean who's a pediatrician; one private practice pediatrician letter whom "wants me to take over his practice/join him" in a few years; one family medicine letter that's probably mediocre. No research experience. Lots of volunteer experience through my church.

Thanks.

Hello friends,

For me, things are looking bleak regarding SOAP. I am still hoping to match a peds residency, or a TY if that somehow works out. If I get nothing in SOAP, I plan to contact AOA peds programs and see if they have any openings.

If that doesn't work, then I'll look at AOA TY programs.

If that doesn't work, what are my options? I would likely apply to peds programs again next year.

Application: DO student at middle of class. COMLEX I ~550, and COMLEX II ~420 (that's my red flag..). Passed clinical skills exam. All first try. One very strong letter from my regional-dean who's a pediatrician; one private practice pediatrician letter whom "wants me to take over his practice/join him" in a few years; one family medicine letter that's probably mediocre. No research experience. Lots of volunteer experience through my church.

Thanks.

 

[ZucattiManicotti]

OPT is now 3 years for STEM fields (I believe). In any case, that gives you much more flexibility in getting another work visa.

You're right that it gives you and the program flexibility to get your visa hammered out.

However medicine, according to USCIS, is not considered a designated STEM field for OPT extension beyond one year.

 

[PistolPete]

OPT is now 3 years for STEM fields (I believe). In any case, that gives you much more flexibility in getting another work visa.

I believe medicine does not fall under STEM so International students from a US medical school still only get 12 months of OPT

 

[TrickyRicky121]

When people apply to new programs outside the match, how do they submit LORs? Do you contact the LOR writer and ask them to send it to the program?

 

[ThoracicGuy]

When people apply to new programs outside the match, how do they submit LORs? Do you contact the LOR writer and ask them to send it to the program?

Since you matched, that wouldn't really affect you.

You really need to think hard about giving up a residency spot for a possible spot at another place. You weren't a strong enough candidate the first time, so how will you be stronger than other candidates to get the new spot.

 

[precisiongraphic]

This here is a helpful post.