Im an alien (Canadian) wanting to get in somewhere....

[asdf987654321]

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Hello,

I appreciate anybody who takes some time to read this, and moreso if they could contribute some knowledge.

I'm a canadian wanting to get into medschool somewhere (Schools north of your border are limited and difficult to gain admission) and am willing to apply to a few 'murican schools. I'll post my stats and maybe some reasonable recommendations can be made:

GPA=3.9+
MCAT=32,
EC= plenty of volunteering (at risk children mentor/tutor, alcholhic homeless mingler+lawn maintenance, library, elementary school tutor/assistant, escorting old ppl from retirement home to doc appt), guitarist in a band, volleyball, weight lifting, but no shadowing (my kryptonite),
Research= plenty of medical research (co-op/work placements) but only one unaccredited publication (mainly worked for a private company, obviously doesn't publish much).

Also, I was wondering if there are any financial aid/services that can be used by international/Canadian students, as I have misplaced my 200k+ with my green card 😉 From what I can gather, I'm left to taking out loans from the motherland. I have read about some schools paying large parts of your tuition if your parents aren't rich, but I doubt I could qualify for those schools let alone the aid.

Thanks again.

 

[gyngyn]

Internationals who are not candidates for the heavily endowed schools must generally demonstrate a variably sufficient sum (one to four years COA) in an escrow account in order to matriculate.

 

[asdf987654321]

Haha unfortunately I have heard of this ridiculous requirement. So there are no US schools that are renowned for accepting internationals (and aren't ****ty)? and there is no scholarships/financial aid/etc intended to help internationals?

 

[URMD]

there are schools known for accepting canadians that are not ****ty
there are schools that offer scholarships/financial aid to internationals, but none are within your reach stats wise.

 

[gyngyn]

Haha unfortunately I have heard of this ridiculous requirement. So there are no US schools that are renowned for accepting internationals (and aren't ****ty)? and there is no scholarships/financial aid/etc intended to help internationals?

As there are no federally insured loans for international applicants, it would be inexcusable not to make this clear to those who might consider the US as an option.

Heck, we have no federal loans for those who have lived here their whole lives if brought in as babes in arms (without papers)!

 

[asdf987654321]

That's unfortunate!

 

[clever_smart_boy_like_me]

Internationals who are not candidates for the heavily endowed schools must generally demonstrate a variably sufficient sum (one to four years COA) in an escrow account in order to matriculate.

So is the US generally not a good option for Canadians who don't come from rich families or have access to some deep well of money? I seem to have misplaced my deep-well-of-money shovel...

 

[md-2020]

Haha unfortunately I have heard of this ridiculous requirement. So there are no US schools that are renowned for accepting internationals (and aren't ****ty)? and there is no scholarships/financial aid/etc intended to help internationals?

What US medical schools are "***ty"?
Assuming your 3.9+ GPA is of the massively over-inflated Canadian variety, if I were you I'd dream about any and all US institutions.

 

[GrapesofRath]

What US medical schools are "***ty"?
Assuming your 3.9+ GPA is of the massively over-inflated Canadian variety, if I were you I'd dream about any and all US institutions.

This

A 32 MCAT for Canadian Applicants in the US is on the rather low side of things. If you do end up applying, your dream should be to get into any MD school in the US.

 

[Romz]

I agree.

OP your MCAT is low and, considering your superb GPA, is indicative of grade inflation at your institution. Why don't you just stick to Canadian Medschools? So long as you have 10+ in each MCAT section, your GPA ranks you as a very competitive applicant. 🙂

 

[heebeejeebies]

What US medical schools are "***ty"?
Assuming your 3.9+ GPA is of the massively over-inflated Canadian variety, if I were you I'd dream about any and all US institutions.

The over-inflation is truly disgusting, recently the cutoff for Ottawa has been 3.93+. which is nice for Canadians applying to the US, but yeah a 32 isn't going to cut it for schools that can afford to offer Canadians aid (aka top 30 private schools with 10+ billion in endowments). I had to aim high (and will likely suffer for it) because I'd rather get into a school I can afford to go to, than get in and be an escrow cut.

 

[heebeejeebies]

I agree.

OP your MCAT is low and, considering your superb GPA, is indicative of grade inflation at your institution. Why don't you just stick to Canadian Medschools? So long as you have 10+ in each MCAT section, your GPA ranks you as a very competitive applicant. 🙂

Canada is the woodchipper of places for medicine. 3.9+ and a 34 may still leave you interviewless across the board. But I agree the 32 won't cut it, even with a 36 I'm juuuuuust on the cusp of having a shot.

 

[Romz]

Canada is the woodchipper of places for medicine. 3.9+ and a 34 may still leave you interviewless across the board. But I agree the 32 won't cut it, even with a 36 I'm juuuuuust on the cusp of having a shot.

36 is a fantastic score. Great job! I do agree - it's getting a little ridiculous now. This past cycle, UofT had an average matriculating GPA of 3.96 but an average MCAT score of 33. You have schools like McGill and the Maritimes which consider competitive GPAs as 3.5+, but even they have some messed up criteria for handing out MMI interviews. I'm in the process of filling out OMSAS right now and I'm slowly starting to lose hope lol. 😛

 

[heebeejeebies]

36 is a fantastic score. Great job! I do agree - it's getting a little ridiculous now. This past cycle, UofT had an average matriculating GPA of 3.96 but an average MCAT score of 33. You have schools like McGill and the Maritimes which consider competitive GPAs as 3.5+, but even they have some messed up criteria for handing out MMI interviews. I'm in the process of filling out OMSAS right now and I'm slowly starting to lose hope lol. 😛

Oh OMSAS, how in the world do schools think 48 items is appropriate when AMCAS requires 15? How many filler and short term experiences do some people plug in to fill those? I actually need to shor up my Dal and UBC apps before I dive into the 150 character x 48 mess of OMSAS.

 

[jayceee]

So is the US generally not a good option for Canadians who don't come from rich families or have access to some deep well of money? I seem to have misplaced my deep-well-of-money shovel...

The Canadian Big Banks (BMO, Royal, CIBC, TD...) will lend you $200,000-250,000 (you can take out $50-75k/year) at an interest rate of prime--2.7% right now. You need a co-signer if you're attending school outside of Canada.

http://www.rbcroyalbank.com/student/medical-dental/

https://www.bmo.com/home/personal/banking/mortgages-loans/loans-loc/loc/student-loc/medical

https://www.cibc.com/m/loans/prof-edg-st-pers-ln-credit.html

If you call up your bank they'll have more info for you.


You can also get Canada Student Loans, but at a max of like $16,000/year. These are interest free until you graduate.

http://www.canlearn.ca/eng/index.shtml

 

[jayceee]

Oh OMSAS, how in the world do schools think 48 items is appropriate when AMCAS requires 15? How many filler and short term experiences do some people plug in to fill those? I actually need to shor up my Dal and UBC apps before I dive into the 150 character x 48 mess of OMSAS.

Good luck with the UBC app!

 

[heebeejeebies]

Good luck with the UBC app!

Muchas gracias, who knows how they calculate that NAQ score...

 

[jayceee]

36 is a fantastic score. Great job! I do agree - it's getting a little ridiculous now. This past cycle, UofT had an average matriculating GPA of 3.96 but an average MCAT score of 33. You have schools like McGill and the Maritimes which consider competitive GPAs as 3.5+, but even they have some messed up criteria for handing out MMI interviews. I'm in the process of filling out OMSAS right now and I'm slowly starting to lose hope lol. 😛

You also need to consider that a lot of Canadian students don't study that hard for MCAT because the schools don't weigh the scores as heavily as their U.S. counterparts do.

Submitting an MCAT score is optional at McGill if you're Canadian.

 

[Romz]

You also need to consider that a lot of Canadian students don't study that hard for MCAT because the schools don't weigh the scores as heavily as their U.S. counterparts do.

Submitting an MCAT score is optional at McGill if you're Canadian.

Hmmm not to sound rude, but I sincerely hope that apathy is not a reason for anyone to score "mediocre" on the MCAT :/. 35+ MCATs are always something to admire both in Canada and the U.S.. Besides, I've seen my fair share of matriculating students with 35+, 3.9+ GPAs entering Canadian medical schools. You reap what you sow, y'know?

McGill doesn't require the MCAT because it's located in Quebec, and the MCAT is not offered in french. I would highly recommend someone perform exceptionally well on the MCAT if they're applying to Mcgill from out of province. The only reason McGill wouldn't take the MCAT into consideration is if you're a born and tried Francophone who would've been disadvantaged taking the test. 😛

 

[heebeejeebies]

Hmmm not to sound rude, but I sincerely hope that apathy is not a reason for anyone to score "mediocre" on the MCAT :/. 35+ MCATs are always something to admire both in Canada and the U.S.. Besides, I've seen my fair share of matriculating students with 35+, 3.9+ GPAs entering Canadian medical schools. You reap what you sow, y'know?

McGill doesn't require the MCAT because it's located in Quebec, and the MCAT is not offered in french. I would highly recommend someone perform exceptionally well on the MCAT if they're applying to Mcgill from out of province. The only reason McGill wouldn't take the MCAT into consideration is if you're a born and tried Francophone who would've been disadvantaged taking the test. 😛

You also need to consider that a lot of Canadian students don't study that hard for MCAT because the schools don't weigh the scores as heavily as their U.S. counterparts do.

Submitting an MCAT score is optional at McGill if you're Canadian.

McGill allows you to substitute your MCAT for 50% of the weight of prereq GPA so it is still valuable for student like me who didn't exactly nail 1st year physics.

 

[oldanddone]

36 is a fantastic score. Great job! I do agree - it's getting a little ridiculous now. This past cycle, UofT had an average matriculating GPA of 3.96 but an average MCAT score of 33. You have schools like McGill and the Maritimes which consider competitive GPAs as 3.5+, but even they have some messed up criteria for handing out MMI interviews. I'm in the process of filling out OMSAS right now and I'm slowly starting to lose hope lol. 😛

My advice is that ontario is like California. Get the eff out and prove residence in a different province and apply in province when you can there. Some provinces quicker than others. Alberta better than maritime for instance. Go school to school and ask their requirements. Or apply tip tier in the states. Yale covers tuition for Canadians. As well check out premed 101 forums in canada. They are good for Canadian knowledge. Not sure about the grade inflation thing. I know MCAT used to be graded against cohorts not against the enter group. So a 34 in Ontario wasn't necessarily a 34 from other places....not totally certain on that one so needs verifying. Ie. Might not reflect grade inflation.

 

[jayceee]

Hmmm not to sound rude, but I sincerely hope that apathy is not a reason for anyone to score "mediocre" on the MCAT :/. 35+ MCATs are always something to admire both in Canada and the U.S.. Besides, I've seen my fair share of matriculating students with 35+, 3.9+ GPAs entering Canadian medical schools. You reap what you sow, y'know?

McGill doesn't require the MCAT because it's located in Quebec, and the MCAT is not offered in french. I would highly recommend someone perform exceptionally well on the MCAT if they're applying to Mcgill from out of province. The only reason McGill wouldn't take the MCAT into consideration is if you're a born and tried Francophone who would've been disadvantaged taking the test. 😛

McGill says MCAT is optional if you're a Canadian who attended school in Canada. https://www.mcgill.ca/medadmissions/applying/requirements-edu/mcat
Optional means you do not have to submit a score with your application. You can call admissions to find out, but they'll tell you that not submitting your scores will not place you at a disadvantage.

Ottawa doesn't care about it either: http://med.uottawa.ca/undergraduate/admissions/faq
NOSM doesn't require it either.
Schools like UBC weigh the MCAT in their 50% AQ score (GPA and MCAT), so the exam counts for a fraction of the points system they use to hand out interviews.
MacMaster only looks at your verbal section--not sure what this means for the new exam.

Canadian medical schools don't have an equivalent of Steps 1, 2, and 3. Also, most use a pass/fail grading system. These factors lead to schools not placing as much of an emphasis on a student's ability to crush a standardized exam.

 

[jayceee]

Muchas gracias, who knows how they calculate that NAQ score...

According to the stats on UBC's website, you have a 1/5-1/4 chance of admission if you're a BC resident. That's not too bad.

 

[heebeejeebies]

According to the stats on UBC's website, you have a 1/5-1/4 chance of admission if you're a BC resident. That's not too bad.

Ontario mate, it's a hard knock life, for us.

 

[Romz]

McGill says MCAT is optional if you're a Canadian who attended school in Canada. https://www.mcgill.ca/medadmissions/applying/requirements-edu/mcat
Optional means you do not have to submit a score with your application. You can call admissions to find out, but they'll tell you that not submitting your scores will not place you at a disadvantage.

Ottawa doesn't care about it either: http://med.uottawa.ca/undergraduate/admissions/faq
NOSM doesn't require it either.

Oh I get what you're saying bud. I've heard otherwise about the disadvantaged portion though. McGill medicine has to fill quotas of francophone and non-franchophone applicants from both its traditional and CEGEP pathways. There are a ton of extremely competitive candidates from both options, all go whom are not required to write the MCAT. This is because the MCAT was english-only.

http://www.macleans.ca/education/uniandcollege/mcgill-eliminates-mcat-requirements/

NOSM and Ottawa do not need the MCAT because they also service a large francophone community. Now, we have McGill university catering to this largely francophone community and, in the spirit of fairness, decided to eliminate the requirement all together for other Canadian citizens. Please note that the MCAT is NOT COMPULSORY for students from Canadian universities. It IS however still taken into consideration and a good MCAT score will place you at an advantage over non-submitters. Hell, we have french quebecers submit 37+ MCAT scores into the school, why would Ontarian students not be held to the same standards? What linguistic barrier would prohibit anglophone Canadians from succeeding as well? By all means, if you scored a 27 on the MCAT, hide it - you have that privilege. Please realize though that students with high MCATs at McGill are considered in a favourable light, as opposed to other schools like Ottawa who really could not care less about the MCAT. I hope I'm getting my point across.

Can't talk for other universities.

 

[Spector1]

what's wrong with canadian med schools? Mcmaster and Mcgill are excellent as far as I know.

 

[md-2020]

what's wrong with canadian med schools? Mcmaster and Mcgill are excellent as far as I know.

OP probably wants to practice in the states, my guess.

Better pay.

 

[Spector1]

OP probably wants to practice in the states, my guess.

Better pay.

Could always try for a us residency. I dont think canadians are considered international medical graduates in the US are they?

 

[md-2020]

Could always try for a us residency. I dont think canadians are considered international medical graduates in the US are they?

I think the process is much harder. A quote I keep hearing is "if you want to practice in the US, go to a US med school" @gyngyn , I believe.

 

[gyngyn]

I think the process is much harder. A quote I keep hearing is "if you want to practice in the US, go to a US med school" @gyngyn , I believe.

True, but Canadians schools are LCME accredited. The USMLE will be required for a US residency and most residencies do not want to support international visas, though.

 

[URMD]

True, but Canadians schools are LCME accredited. The USMLE will be required for a US residency and most residencies do not want to support international visas.

Does this mean that Canadians studying in US schools are at a disadvantage when applying to residencies in the U.S? As they are on F-1 while studying for a USMD they will still require an international visa, no?

 

[gyngyn]

Does this mean that Canadians studying in US schools are at a disadvantage when applying to residencies in the U.S? As they are on F-1 while studying for a USMD they will still require an international visa, no?

That's exactly what I mean.

 

[URMD]

So it would be more like green card/citizen USMD > USMD > green card IMG > IMG? in terms of advantage in applicant pool?