Input on Teaching

[G Costanza]

I currently TA for two classes, take 3 classes, work 15-20/week at a college counseling center and do research on the side. Right now my life is busy but not overwhelming by any means. I manage everything well.
I was just offered an instructor of record teaching opportunity for a class in another department. It's about 10/week in addition to what I do now. I'm still trying to decide if I want to do private practice or academia when I graduate.

I need some help figuring out if this opportunity is worth it. Adding 10 hours/week would push me into being stressed and I would not enjoy life to the degree I do now. But this kind of opportunity doesn't come along often and I assume would look great on my resume if I end up in academia.

How much does being an instructor of record matter on a vita? Does it help at all with matching on internship? I'm tempted to just bite the bullet and do it but I only want to if that kind of experience would significantly help my career. Thoughts?

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[cara susanna]

If you think you want to go into academia, I would do it. Otherwise, I dunno, if you think it will be too much work I would listen to your instinct. Teaching adds on a lot of work and it's not always the most rewarding thing ever.

 

[paramour]

I had 2 years "TA" experience (in addition to 1.5 years of being a "part-time instructor" or "instructor of record" as a separate experience) prior to applying for a position at a community college. Keep in mind I was applying to a CC--not a traditional university (where my previous experience was obtained). The dean basically scoffed at the TA experience, indicating that it was not the "real-world" (and I hadn't even brought it up, as I was attempting to emphasize the 1.5 years P/T instructor gig).

IF you have ample time to devote to it, I would certainly recommend it IF you are potentially considering an academic/teaching career in the future.

I struggled with this decision for a while when I came into my program as well. I wanted to continue teaching and knew that I could likely land a position at one of the local CC's buuut did I really have the time? Ultimately, I decided 'no.' And, I am so very glad that I didn't try it. I personally would not teach while also taking a full course-load myself, serving as a TA, working a practicum, and then conducting my research to boot. It's too darned much. Most of the folks I know who work at the community colleges around here are advanced students who have completed (or nearly completed) their coursework. Additionally, most of the clinical students do not attempt it at all due to their practicum requirements, even after they have completed their coursework, as they are still too darned busy (so it's usually the advanced grad students in I/O, cognitive, social, etc. who apply for these positions). Prep time, grading, administrative requirements, office hours, etc. all add up, and you start to feel it even if you're not overwhelmed with coursework, clients, research, and TA duties elsewhere.

Also, keep in mind, if this is your first instructor experience (outside of your TA duties), then there may be times when you can typically expect to work more than those 10 hours/week as you're getting your feel for things.

I think that it can be a great opportunity. Just don't let it be one in which you've already stacked the cards against yourself so that it's eventually going to overwhelm you due to stretching yourself too thin. If you think you can handle it, however, more power to you!

G'luck with your decision (and happy teaching if that's where it leads you)!

 

[cara susanna]

Yeah, I'm adjunct instructing one course and it is taking up so much time. Add that onto my clinical duties, research, and own coursework and it is extremely overwhelming. I am looking forward to next semester when I won't have as much going on (although I hope to continue teaching)!

 

[Psychadelic2012]

I currently TA for two classes, take 3 classes, work 15-20/week at a college counseling center and do research on the side. Right now my life is busy but not overwhelming by any means. I manage everything well.
I was just offered an instructor of record teaching opportunity for a class in another department. It's about 10/week in addition to what I do now.

Would it be possible to arrange to drop one of the TA-ships and teach your new class instead? Seems to me that teaching a class is better in every way than TA-ing. Are you required to TA for two classes or is there some wiggle room in your program?

 

[Pragma]

I am biased, but I think teaching is great.

However, pulling off teaching a class in 10 hours a week when you have never taught it before seems completely unrealistic. In my case, I'd say for a NEW class, between actual class time, office hours, and prep, you are looking at more like 15 hours/week. That does not include grading or any complicated student issues.

It takes less time the more you do it.

The other thing to consider is how much you want to learn from it and how well you want to do. If you are pulled in a lot of other directions, it can make teaching for the first time a tough endeavor. You have to be disciplined about when you get the prep done and available for students frequently (even just via email).

All that said, if you don't mind sucking it up work-wise for a semester, I'd say go for it. You might not get the opportunity again and you might love doing it!

Edit: My estimate also assumes you maybe have somewhere to start (a previous syllabus, maybe some powerpoints to work from, etc). If you don't have that, add more time up front and for prep because it takes a crazy amount of time to create a good, engaging class with visual aids, videos, and supplementary reading materials (which you presumably have read).

 

[ClinicalABA]

Teaching experience can certainly be helpful to have on your vita. Even if you don't go into academia, adjunct gigs can be a good way to stay current and make a few extra bucks. If the course/materials (e.g. syllabus; text and supplemental readings; lectures- including visual aids; assignments and grading rubric) are already designed, it shouldn't be too unmanageable. However, if you're starting from scratch, be prepared to spend an inordinate amount of time on the course- up to 20 hours per week average.

 

[wigflip]

Hi OP,

I'm just wondering what department you'd be teaching in. The discipline/class topic may determine whether it's worth it for your future. Not only in terms of appearing "focused" on your CV, but also in terms of the level of student hassles you have to endure (i.e. if there is any political component to the curriculum, you'll likely have to deal with vocal naysayers and the like). Will you have a TA? Will there be student papers to grade, or can you skate by with objective exams?

My two cents (as someone who has TAed a lot but not been instructor of record. Where I am, TAing means coming up with 50 minutes of discussion section lecture/activities each week because curriculum isn't standardized across sections. You end up lecturing because students don't do the reading, so there's nothing to "discuss" ).

Discipline is closely related to your specialty areas or in an area related to a declared doctoral emphasis: YES
You have a TA: YES
You can conduct objective exams with no more than one short paper to meet minimum university standards (3 pages): YES
Topic of class is "less political": YES
You have a head start on prep (via other profs, grad students willing to share previous syllabus, slides, other prep work): YES

FYI: If you have been TAing for psych classes only up to this point, you may not be aware just how badly students struggle with writing and how time-consuming it is grade. I'd say if you are probably going to get stuck grading a lot of student writing, it's an automatic NO. I had to grade over 700 student papers in one term, mostly unintelligible gobbledegook, then meet with the students to defend my (incredibly generous) grading to the little brats--ahem! I mean "little darlings." How much research did I get done that quarter, you ask? Well...

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Hi OP,

I'm just wondering what department you'd be teaching in. The discipline/class topic may determine whether it's worth it for your future. Not only in terms of appearing "focused" on your CV, but also in terms of the level of student hassles you have to endure (i.e. if there is any political component to the curriculum, you'll likely have to deal with vocal naysayers and the like). Will you have a TA? Will there be student papers to grade, or can you skate by with objective exams?

My two cents (as someone who has TAed a lot but not been instructor of record. Where I am, TAing means coming up with 50 minutes of discussion section lecture/activities each week because curriculum isn't standardized across sections. You end up lecturing because students don't do the reading, so there's nothing to "discuss" ).

Discipline is closely related to your specialty areas or in an area related to a declared doctoral emphasis: YES
You have a TA: YES
You can conduct objective exams with no more than one short paper to meet minimum university standards (3 pages): YES
Topic of class is "less political": YES
You have a head start on prep (via other profs, grad students willing to share previous syllabus, slides, other prep work): YES

FYI: If you have been TAing for psych classes only up to this point, you may not be aware just how badly students struggle with writing and how time-consuming it is grade. I'd say if you are probably going to get stuck grading a lot of student writing, it's an automatic NO. I had to grade over 700 student papers in one term, mostly unintelligible gobbledegook, then meet with the students to defend my (incredibly generous) grading to the little brats--ahem! I mean "little darlings." How much research did I get done that quarter, you ask? Well...

Teaching can certainly be a huge time sink, particularly if you're having to grade writing projects (I only required one 2-3 page paper of my ~75 student class, and it was a bear to get through). If you do require writing, as wigflip mentioned, be prepared for some fairly objectively-poor writing skills, and also realize there's a decent chance at least 1 or 2 of your students will copy-and-paste material (paragraphs' and possibly even pages' worth) from the internet wholesale into their papers.

I wasn't a grammar stickler, and didn't allot much of the final grade to grammar and mechanics, but I did at least point out when errors were made with the hopes that some of the students would learn from it.

 

[wigflip]

also realize there's a decent chance at least 1 or 2 of your students will copy-and-paste material (paragraphs' and possibly even pages' worth) from the internet wholesale into their papers.

I wasn't a grammar stickler, and didn't allot much of the final grade to grammar and mechanics, but I did at least point out when errors were made with the hopes that some of the students would learn from it.

Oh yeah--forgot to mention the plagiarism thing. One case took me about 12 extra hours of labor to resolve (memos, meticulous documentation, meetings, etc.).

I do correct grammar and spelling, but even more troubling than UGs' deficits in those areas is that the quality of writing is so poor that as a grader I simply can't figure out what they are trying to say. They can't/won't structure their arguments in any kind of logical way, and can't express themselves clearly. Even when I lay it out for them in office hours, I get slop. Which I could detach from if students' didn't then demand extra meetings, explanations, wield threats, etc. I've come to the conclusion that if I ever serve as instructor of record it's going to be objective tests all the way, regardless of what discipline I'm teaching (I've never TAed a class with objective exams--they're frowned upon in my department, along with textbooks).

 

[Pragma]

Oh yeah--forgot to mention the plagiarism thing. One case took me about 12 extra hours of labor to resolve (memos, meticulous documentation, meetings, etc.).

I do correct grammar and spelling, but even more troubling than UGs' deficits in those areas is that the quality of writing is so poor that as a grader I simply can't figure out what they are trying to say. They can't/won't structure their arguments in any kind of logical way, and can't express themselves clearly. Even when I lay it out for them in office hours, I get slop. Which I could detach from if students' didn't then demand extra meetings, explanations, wield threats, etc. I've come to the conclusion that if I ever serve as instructor of record it's going to be objective tests all the way, regardless of what discipline I'm teaching (I've never TAed a class with objective exams--they're frowned upon in my department, along with textbooks).

Yes that can be a pain. Of course, some up-front work is helpful. I almost always spend significant time in class discussing plagiarism up front, because some younger students are naive. For example, too much quoting is plagiarism in my book. For the most part, repeated warnings seems to work pretty well, and they also seem to step up their game a little knowing that I am reading the papers and not a TA.

That said, some students just turn in complete crap no matter how hard you try to prevent it in advance. If they are young (i.e., freshman), I often will have a sit-down with them to figure out if they were just being naive. Some really might not realize that copying wikipedia and changing a few words around isn't writing (thanks secondary education system). I have let students redo things with a penalized grade before instead of pursuing formal academic integrity violations. But that is only when the offense didn't seem malicious.

Fortunately, it hasn't come up often. When it does, it is a big pain.

 

[wigflip]

For example, too much quoting is plagiarism in my book.

Agreed. Sometimes the only intelligible papers I get are the ones that consist of nothing but batches of lengthy quotations strung together.

some up-front work is helpful. I almost always spend significant time in class discussing plagiarism up front

I do this too, but it seems to yield nothing. They just roll their eyes as if they know it all already and then go ahead and plagiarize anyway, claiming they didn't know afterwards.

Fortunately, it hasn't come up often.

Glad to hear it. I get it every freakin' quarter!

 

[cara susanna]

Oh God, I just assigned my first writing assignment and now you guys are terrifying me! I've decided to be really lenient with it.

My issue with teaching is that the students just don't seem to have the remotest interest or care about the material, no matter how interesting I try to make it. I took it personally at first but pretty much everyone has told me that it's just the way students tend to be.

 

[wigflip]

Oh God, I just assigned my first writing assignment and now you guys are terrifying me! I've decided to be really lenient with it.

My issue with teaching is that the students just don't seem to have the remotest interest or caring about the material, no matter how interesting I try to make it.

Sorry cara. If it's a "summarize and critique/analyze" style paper, you can cover your butt by going over, perhaps several times, what it means to summarize and how that's different than providing original analysis/critique. My kiddies always struggle with that distinction.

Take my cynicism with a grain of salt anyway. I TA at a state school, mostly upper division classes populated by students with senioritis and no grad school/professional school aspirations. I have a friend who taught creative writing to undergrads at Brown--mainly privileged kids who'd been born and bred for success their whole lives, and who were studying a subject they were actually invested in--and s/he said that his/her students were wonderfully articulate, eager, and engaged. My little beasts, on the other hand, have largely squelched my teaching enthusiasm, and rendered me the cynical husk that I am.

 

[cara susanna]

Haha, I've pretty much had your experience so far. It's fine though, my experience thus far hasn't scared me away from teaching--although I haven't received my evals yet.

It's just a summarize and relate paper, so I'm hoping it will be okay.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Haha, I've pretty much had your experience so far. It's fine though, my experience thus far hasn't scared me away from teaching--although I haven't received my evals yet.

It's just a summarize and relate paper, so I'm hoping it will be okay.

Good to hear. Try not to let the evals affect you too much. Obviously something might be wrong if an instructor receives consistently below-average ratings, but you're almost guaranteed to get at least a few negative comments if you teach for a year or longer (likely that have little or nothing to do with the class or your instructional style, but that will nonetheless be inappropriately personal in their tone and direction).

 

[Pragma]

Good to hear. Try not to let the evals affect you too much. Obviously something might be wrong if an instructor receives consistently below-average ratings, but you're almost guaranteed to get at least a few negative comments if you teach for a year or longer (likely that have little or nothing to do with the class or your instructional style, but that will nonetheless be inappropriately personal in their tone and direction).

Yeah you will get conflicting ones too. "Too much discussion!" vs. "Not enough discussion!" was one of my classic favorites within the same section.

 

[wigflip]

Yeah you will get conflicting ones too. "Too much discussion!" vs. "Not enough discussion!" was one of my classic favorites within the same section.

Or something you do once becomes "always." I kept my kiddies after by about 90 seconds once and that became "always keeps us late!!"

Some people get racialized/gendered/appearance-based comments too. When I get called a "bitch" I know I've done something right.

 

[wigflip]

Yeah you will get conflicting ones too. "Too much discussion!" vs. "Not enough discussion!" was one of my classic favorites within the same section.

One way to deal with this is to conduct a midterm eval. You can take the pulse of the class, and if you bring discussion of the anonymous evals back to the group, students have an opportunity to see that others might understand the class differently (i.e. Students X, Y, and Z, who think there's too much discussion, hear that other students think there's not enough). Does this help with final evals? I dunno.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Or something you do once becomes "always." I kept my kiddies after by about 90 seconds once and that became "always keeps us late!!"

Some people get racialized/gendered/appearance-based comments too. When I get called a "bitch" I know I've done something right.

Ohh yeah. If you really want some entertainment and/or to feel good about yourself, look up some of the comments left about you on those instructor rating websites. It's like having your own personal set of Perez Hiltons.

Edit: and yep, I agree with the idea of using midterm evals. That way, as wigflip mentioned, if you receive conflicting comments, you can address them in class to really see what most poeple would prefer.

 

[Pragma]

One way to deal with this is to conduct a midterm eval. You can take the pulse of the class, and if you bring discussion of the anonymous evals back to the group, students have an opportunity to see that others might understand the class differently (i.e. Students X, Y, and Z, who think there's too much discussion, hear that other students think there's not enough). Does this help with final evals? I dunno.

Very good suggestion! I haven't been that motivated yet, but I think if I start teaching full time it would be good to integrate.

Another wonderful one, after explaining how Intro courses are more breadth vs. depth multiple times, was "Cover fewer topics so that we can go more in-depth." Winning.

 

[paramour]

Agreed. Sometimes the only intelligible papers I get are the ones that consist of nothing but batches of lengthy quotations strung together.

I receive lots of these as well. I sit and scratch my head for minutes, leave, come back, and still have no clue what they are trying to communicate. I also love the individuals who use textspeak to write their papers.

I do this too, but it seems to yield nothing. They just roll their eyes as if they know it all already and then go ahead and plagiarize anyway, claiming they didn't know afterwards.

I have a student who was literally printing off a page from a website and submitting it as his writing assignments. Print screen anyone? No changes in anything: titles, headings, oh, so clever sayings created by the website author, alongside the same weird font, font size, etc. . . They weren't even attempting to mask it.

I have other students who have submitted a paragraph (less than half a page) for a 2 to 3 page minimum. These are typically "reflection" papers, so as long as it seems as if they put some thought in it and pulled a reference from somewhere? Nope. They don't pull any references and instead spend half the paper discussing how it is a waste of time to even talk about the topic because they don't understand it.

I've reduced the number of writing assignments I assign in the past, and I'm now doing so again for my current class because they are oh, so very tiring! I just recently changed their "final project" because I cannot bear to go through what I know most of them will submit, especially being more familiar now with this particular section's writing skills. Not uncommon here (and not too many writing activities are assigned across sections, although there is some slight variation dependent on the faculty member). Otherwise, I was recently informed by the faculty supervisor conducting my midterm evaluation that I have been blessed with a section that historically does not do well because it is held on an undesirable day at an undesirable time (most of the students who sign up for it are those who waited until the last possible second to do anything about registration, have no other choice in times, etc.). There are still some "good" students in the bunch though, and even the ones at the bottom of the crop show some level of interest most of the time (sometimes you just have to help drag it out of 'em!).

 

[paramour]

Good to hear. Try not to let the evals affect you too much. Obviously something might be wrong if an instructor receives consistently below-average ratings, but you're almost guaranteed to get at least a few negative comments if you teach for a year or longer (likely that have little or nothing to do with the class or your instructional style, but that will nonetheless be inappropriately personal in their tone and direction).

I had someone complain about my shoes on an evaluation once. Otherwise, "everything else was great." They must have really disliked my plain, black dress shoes, however.

One way to deal with this is to conduct a midterm eval. You can take the pulse of the class, and if you bring discussion of the anonymous evals back to the group, students have an opportunity to see that others might understand the class differently (i.e. Students X, Y, and Z, who think there's too much discussion, hear that other students think there's not enough). Does this help with final evals? I dunno.

I usually do this as well (either after the first exam or around the midterms). It helps give you an idea of what's working okay and what might need a bit more tweaking while you still have a considerable amount of the semester left.

This is in addition to my "survey" of students the first day of class regarding their expectations, strengths/weaknesses (or what sort of assignments/exams they prefer or do better on vs. not so well), etc., to help me (attempt to) tailor the class to that group of students from day 1. It also serves to give me an idea of where everyone is coming from, their potential concerns (whether education-related or not), so on & so forth. The students seem to appreciate my taking the opportunity to do this, and it helps me finish fleshing out my semester plan as needed.

 

[wigflip]

This is in addition to my "survey" of students the first day of class regarding their expectations, strengths/weaknesses (or what sort of assignments/exams they prefer or do better on vs. not so well), etc., to help me (attempt to) tailor the class to that group of students from day 1. It also serves to give me an idea of where everyone is coming from, their potential concerns (whether education-related or not), so on & so forth. The students seem to appreciate my taking the opportunity to do this, and it helps me finish fleshing out my semester plan as needed.

I do this too, in written form. Gives them an opportunity to spout off; me an opportunity to collect handwriting samples to compare against final evals, in case someone writes something particular wonderful or insane.

 

[thewesternsky]

Good to hear. Try not to let the evals affect you too much. Obviously something might be wrong if an instructor receives consistently below-average ratings, but you're almost guaranteed to get at least a few negative comments if you teach for a year or longer (likely that have little or nothing to do with the class or your instructional style, but that will nonetheless be inappropriately personal in their tone and direction).

One of my friends taught a biopsych course last year, and received a number of comments (more than 5!) that read, succinctly, "Too much science."

It's still my favourite eval comment ever.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

One of my friends taught a biopsych course last year, and received a number of comments (more than 5!) that read, succinctly, "Too much science."

It's still my favourite eval comment ever.

Haha yeah, you can get some gems to be sure. I didn't ever receive anything that stands out in my memory as being particularly inappropriate, but I got plenty of conflicting comments across students (e.g., "too much info on the slides" vs. "wish the slides had more stuff on them;" "spends too much time on theory X" vs. "wish we spent more time on theory X").

I also had a student complain (via comment) that the class content wasn't what they'd wanted, despite the course catalogue clearly explaining the topic area (i.e., it was a personality theory class, yet this person had wanted to learn about personality disorders). I used this comment to explicitly debunk any perceived focus on personality disorders at the beginning of the next semester, so in that respect the feedback was actually very helpful. I also threw in an extra lecture briefly covering personality disorders to try and keep things interesting.

 

[wigflip]

I also had a student complain (via comment) that the class content wasn't what they'd wanted, despite the course catalogue clearly explaining the topic area (i.e., it was a personality theory class, yet this person had wanted to learn about personality disorders). I used this comment to explicitly debunk any perceived focus on personality disorders at the beginning of the next semester, so in that respect the feedback was actually very helpful. I also threw in an extra lecture briefly covering personality disorders to try and keep things interesting.

This is probably the only instance I've ever encountered in which student feedback was genuinely helpful. There are rare exceptions, but mostly undergrads don't know enough to determine whether their instructors are knowledgable and providing them with updated, relevant content. Undergrads know if they're entertained, and they know if they want to get in you're pants, but that's about it (or in paramour's case, whether you have terrific footwear ).

Other than gaging student libido, evals are probably best for alerting admin to inappropriate behavior on the part of the instructor (sexual harassment, religious prosthelytizing).

 

[Pragma]

This is probably the only instance I've ever encountered in which student feedback was genuinely helpful. There are rare exceptions, but mostly undergrads don't know enough to determine whether their instructors are knowledgable and providing them with updated, relevant content. Undergrads know if they're entertained, and they know if they want to get in you're pants, but that's about it (or in paramour's case, whether you have terrific footwear ).

Other than gaging student libido, evals are probably best for alerting admin to inappropriate behavior on the part of the instructor (sexual harassment, religious prosthelytizing).

Generally this is good for attendance.

 

[paramour]

Generally this is good for attendance.

There are several TAs in our program who allow their students to befriend them on facebook. There has been one who went a bit further than this, and the TA was emailing a few "select" students (males included). This particular TA in our program was discussing her desired lingerie options for her honeymoon if/when she ever got married . . . and sending pictures alongside them.

I don't guess she ever stopped to think whether or not this was appropriate behavior.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Generally this is good for attendance.

Haha, I definitely don't envy my female peers in that respect. I received the very occasional light-hearted, mildly-inappropriate comment, but some of the things I read and heard that were said to/about some of the female graduate instructors were completely out of line and took me aback (not the fact that male undergraduates would say these things at all, but that they'd actually write them on an official class rating).

Edit: And yep, I've had two or three students attempt to facebook friend me in the past. I sent them a brief reply as to why I felt it to be inappropriate, and then ignored the requests. I definitely think this is something it would behoove instructors to explain at the beginning of the semester.

 

[Pragma]

Haha, I definitely don't envy my female peers in that respect. I received the very occasional light-hearted, mildly-inappropriate comment, but some of the things I read and heard that were said to/about some of the female graduate instructors were completely out of line and took me aback (not the fact that male undergraduates would say these things at all, but that they'd actually write them on an official class rating).

Edit: And yep, I've had two or three students attempt to facebook friend me in the past. I sent them a brief reply as to why I felt it to be inappropriate, and then ignored the requests. I definitely think this is something it would behoove instructors to explain at the beginning of the semester.

Have you ever read female undergraduate comments on RMP? They are even worse than male students sometimes...although they are probably a lot less likely to actually say something to the prof.

 

[Pragma]

Haha, I definitely don't envy my female peers in that respect. I received the very occasional light-hearted, mildly-inappropriate comment, but some of the things I read and heard that were said to/about some of the female graduate instructors were completely out of line and took me aback (not the fact that male undergraduates would say these things at all, but that they'd actually write them on an official class rating).

Edit: And yep, I've had two or three students attempt to facebook friend me in the past. I sent them a brief reply as to why I felt it to be inappropriate, and then ignored the requests. I definitely think this is something it would behoove instructors to explain at the beginning of the semester.

That is nice of you. I just ignore the requests (Linked in too).

However, I am considering making a Google + profile solely for having a social newtorking presence for students. I know some people that have done that.

 

[wigflip]

Haha, I definitely don't envy my female peers in that respect. I received the very occasional light-hearted, mildly-inappropriate comment, but some of the things I read and heard that were said to/about some of the female graduate instructors were completely out of line and took me aback (not the fact that male undergraduates would say these things at all, but that they'd actually write them on an official class rating).

I've seen worse than that. Honestly, I'm used to sexual harassment from employers and peers. I don't need it now from people over whom I'm supposed to have authority.

And there should be a special place in hell for whoever decided to put a "hotness" rating on Rate My Professor.

 

[Pragma]

I've seen worse than that. Honestly, I'm used to sexual harassment from employers and peers. I don't need it now from people over whom I'm supposed to have authority.

And there should be a special place in hell for whoever decided to put a "hotness" rating on Rate My Professor.

Oh but it is just a benign Chili Pepper!

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Have you ever read female undergraduate comments on RMP? They are even worse than male students sometimes...although they are probably a lot less likely to actually say something to the prof.

I've definitely seen some of the venomous things posted by students on RMP. I somehow avoided having anything posted about me on there, but I've looked through peers'/friends' reviews with them, and much of it is pretty comical. Lots of comments about hair, outfits (e.g., "if she dressed a little hotter she'd look so much better"), and general levels of "bitchiness."

I typically didn't see as much of the innuendo from female raters as from males, but I also haven't looked at reviews for many male instructors/professors.

 

[wigflip]

Oh but it is just a benign Chili Pepper!

Clearly you're joking, but anything that facilitates the sexualization of female academics is no laughing matter. One more headache on the way to tenure (or burnout). I'm not there to give them a lapdance or provide visuals to be stored in the wank bank; I'm there to attempt to teach the little bastards something.

 

[Ollie123]

Am I the only one who likes teaching?

Its an obscene amount of work, but I do genuinely enjoy it. Still undecided whether I want it to be a substantive part of my career since I still prefer research, but I have actually really enjoyed it. Yes, evals do always contain weird/insane things but you learn not to take them too seriously. I was at the NITOP (National Institute on the Teaching of Psychology) conference and they actually have a reading of outlandishly weird teaching evals. I figure if the folks attending a conference like NITOP, many of whom have won local, national, and international teaching awards get comments like "You are the devil incarnate", I have no reason to get bitter about the comparatively tame complaints I have gotten (e.g. "You don't care about students and are completely unavailable to help students because you spend too much time on research") during a semester when I had a small class and never (not once) turned down an offer to meet a student outside office hours.

One of my female friends had a student respond to "What characteristics of the instructor were most helpful?" with "Boobs ". Such is the life of the college instructor - and men definitely get inappropriate (sometimes vulgar) and appearance-focused comments as well. Haven't done a comparison so I can't compare the frequency, but I'd wager they are closer than many realize.

RE: utility of evaluations, I just look for broad themes in the content, and actually have derived some useful information. For example, assignments that I thought were clear but students did not helped me expand upon my original "assignment page". Sure, some won't be happy unless I hold their hand every step of the way, but I can meet them in the middle. 90% of it is useless, but there is usually something I can pull from it.

Some of this may depend on subject though. I've only taught upper level seminars so they've already made it through some things, my grade distributions shift slightly higher (mid-upper 70's), etc. Ironically, I seem to get applied classes (i.e. taught behavior mod despite not remotely considering myself a behaviorist) which allows me a bit more freedom for activities rather than just lecture. I would love, love, love to teach stats which is the last course most people want (particularly here due to some weird systemic issues with the university that lead to many people taking it who shouldn't). Even some of our "Good" students get nauseous at the idea that they may be expected to do basic math they should have learned when they were 11, yet still somehow think they can go to grad school in psych. I have some ideas for how I'd do it though, that might turn out well or might be disastrous, but I kinda want to find out

 

[Pragma]

Clearly you're joking, but anything that facilitates the sexualization of female academics is no laughing matter. One more headache on the way to tenure (or burnout). I'm not there to give them a lapdance or provide visuals to be stored in the wank bank; I'm there to attempt to teach the little bastards something.

Yes it was a joke. However, I have never heard the term wank bank before and can't help but find it hilarious.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Am I the only one who likes teaching?

Its an obscene amount of work, but I do genuinely enjoy it. Still undecided whether I want it to be a substantive part of my career since I still prefer research, but I have actually really enjoyed it. Yes, evals do always contain weird/insane things but you learn not to take them too seriously. I was at the NITOP (National Institute on the Teaching of Psychology) conference and they actually have a reading of outlandishly weird teaching evals. I figure if the folks attending a conference like NITOP, many of whom have won local, national, and international teaching awards get comments like "You are the devil incarnate", I have no reason to get bitter about the comparatively tame complaints I have gotten (e.g. "You don't care about students and are completely unavailable to help students because you spend too much time on research") during a semester when I had a small class and never (not once) turned down an offer to meet a student outside office hours.

One of my female friends had a student respond to "What characteristics of the instructor were most helpful?" with "Boobs ". Such is the life of the college instructor - and men definitely get inappropriate (sometimes vulgar) and appearance-focused comments as well. Haven't done a comparison so I can't compare the frequency, but I'd wager they are closer than many realize.

RE: utility of evaluations, I just look for broad themes in the content, and actually have derived some useful information. For example, assignments that I thought were clear but students did not helped me expand upon my original "assignment page". Sure, some won't be happy unless I hold their hand every step of the way, but I can meet them in the middle. 90% of it is useless, but there is usually something I can pull from it.

Some of this may depend on subject though. I've only taught upper level seminars so they've already made it through some things, my grade distributions shift slightly higher (mid-upper 70's), etc. Ironically, I seem to get applied classes (i.e. taught behavior mod despite not remotely considering myself a behaviorist) which allows me a bit more freedom for activities rather than just lecture. I would love, love, love to teach stats which is the last course most people want (particularly here due to some weird systemic issues with the university that lead to many people taking it who shouldn't). Even some of our "Good" students get nauseous at the idea that they may be expected to do basic math they should have learned when they were 11, yet still somehow think they can go to grad school in psych. I have some ideas for how I'd do it though, that might turn out well or might be disastrous, but I kinda want to find out

Oh, don't get me wrong, I enjoyed teaching and would certainly do it again. There was nothing that happened during my classes that turned me off from it forever, or that even significantly stressed me out (I may very well have been luck in that regard). I did teach upper-level undergrads, though, and many of the most inappropriate comments I've seen came from intro psych classes.

And yep, you can definitely get some great input from evals (particularly mid-semester evals, which allow you to actually facilitate some change with the current group of students). The vast majority of my students were respectful, engaged, came to class regularly, gave appropriate feedback, and were generally easy to deal with. As with most other things in life, it's always the one or two more "colorful" students/interactions that stand out the most.

 

[wigflip]

Am I the only one who likes teaching?

I really used to like it. The students beat it out of me.

I hear that being instructor of record makes things better. I may have a chance to find out later this year. At least in my department, dealing with other TAs (when they bother to show up) is a special hell unto itself.

I think my cynicism is also fomented by the very high volume of papers I have to grade. You haven't lived if you've never had to grade 70 papers a week, every week, except for the week you have to grade 210! And deal with the resulting complaints, demands to meet immediately! to discuss a grade change, etc.

Not completely sure who's who here, but if I'm recalling correctly, the folks who seem more positive about teaching here are mostly men? Anecdotal, but the women I talk to (online and in person) seem to have more trouble with students--in particular we have difficulty with students acknowledging our authority. I did read one article indicating that women receive worse evals, though I can't recall the citation. One man told me that when he co-taught, his female co-instructor was treated much worse than he was. Being disrespected daily by people young enough to be your children grinds you down after a while.

Edit: that post was a nonlinear mess, but I've been up since 3:30.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I really used to like it. The students beat it out of me.

I hear that being instructor of record makes things better. I may have a chance to find out later this year. At least in my department, dealing with other TAs (when they bother to show up) is a special hell unto itself.

I think my cynicism is also fomented by the very high volume of papers I have to grade. You haven't lived if you've never had to grade 70 papers a week, every week, except for the week you have to grade 210! And deal with the resulting complaints, demands to meet immediately! to discuss a grade change, etc.

Not completely sure who's who here, but if I'm recalling correctly, the folks who seem more positive about teaching here are mostly men? Anecdotal, but the women I talk to (online and in person) seem to have more trouble with students--in particular we have difficulty with students acknowledging our authority. I did read one article indicating that women receive worse evals, though I can't recall the citation. One man told me that when he co-taught, his female co-instructor was treated much worse than he was. Being disrespected daily by people young enough to be your children grinds you down after a while.

Edit: that post was a nonlinear mess, but I've been up since 3:30.

I wonder if any of that might change by geographic region? I know in the south, I've seen staff at some clinical practicum sites treat female peers differently than me at times. I'm not sure if that's also the case with teaching, but I can say I've heard a relatively equal number of positive and negative outlooks/experiences from female instructors in my program.

Attempting to establish proper boundaries (and at least a mild sense of authority) early on was actually one of the reasons why I let students know they could address me as, "Mr. ____" during my first class each semester. I also made sure to always "sign" emails with my full name rather than just my first name. If students called me by my first name after that, I didn't attempt to correct them, but it might have been one of the things that contributed to my experiencing fewer boundary-related issues while teaching (that, or I've just been very lucky). As I mentioned earlier, though, I also had upper-level undergrads, which likely also accounted for having fewer problems.

 

[wigflip]

Attempting to establish proper boundaries (and at least a mild sense of authority) early on was actually one of the reasons why I let students know they could address me as, "Mr. ____" during my first class each semester. I also made sure to always "sign" emails with my full name rather than just my first name. If students called me by my first name after that, I didn't attempt to correct them, but it might have been one of the things that contributed to my experiencing fewer boundary-related issues while teaching (that, or I've just been very lucky). As I mentioned earlier, though, I also had upper-level undergrads, which likely also accounted for having fewer problems.

Ah, that wouldn't fly in my program, where the professors encourage even the UGs to call them by their first names. I've never heard of a TA using a title before, but as you suggest, it may be regional. But I like the ring of that, "You may call me Ms. Wigflip. And keep me the hell outta your wank bank."

Interestingly, I've found my lower division students to be more respectful. A few of them actually appear to still be interested in learning. The third, fourth, and fifth year students mostly appear to be interested in gaming the system, conning me, or bargaining. Watching some of them go into this whining, wheedling routine is bizarre to say the least. The really overestimate their charm. I'm always tempted to ask them, "Does that really work on your parents?"

I also hear that the students are less skilled, but more respectful at community colleges. A generalization I hope proves true (at least the latter part).

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Ah, that wouldn't fly in my program, where the professors encourage even the UGs to call them by their first names. I've never heard of a TA using a title before, but as you suggest, it may be regional. But I like the ring of that, "You may call me Ms. Wigflip."

I also hear that the students are less skilled, but more respectful at community colleges. A generalization I hope proves true (at least the latter part).

Yeah, they give us a good amount of leeway in my program when it comes to most aspects of classes that we teach. I don't know if the TAs typically go with the Mr./Ms. deal, but I got the idea from another grad student when he was instructor for his first class a few years back. I think when I was a TA rather than instructor of record, the professor would usually introduce me using my first name. But as you suggest, it might be very regional (nearly all of our professors go by Dr. ____ with undergrads, and probably a little over half do so with grad students as well).

Then again, I'm more of a Mr./Ms./Dr. person "by default" when addressing others myself (even after professors say to use their first names), so it might come more naturally to me to introduce myself that way to undergrads. I typically use my first name with clients right now, but once I'm actually able, I'll likely switch to Dr. ___.

 

[cara susanna]

I think I'd like teaching more if it were a subject more in my area of interest and not a survey course. I definitely can see myself doing this as part of my career (as long as it accompanies research, of course. )

Thanks for the reassurance about evals. I'm just worried that they'll all be negative or something, haha.

I use my first name. When I get my fancy schmancy PhD, I'll probably go by "Dr."

Btw, love the comments about the "Hotness" rating. Have you seen that research that found people rated as hot on RMP were also rated as better instructors?

 

[wigflip]

Btw, love the comments about the "Hotness" rating. Have you seen that research that found people rated as hot on RMP were also rated as better instructors?

Please provide citation. Must read when I'm done throwing up.

 

[cara susanna]

I can do you one better, here is the actual article: http://www.suu.edu/faculty/robertsw/Evaluation Task Force/Hot or not.pdf

It's probably the Halo Effect rearing its ugly (beautiful)? head.

 

[Ollie123]

Also use my first name. For now, zero problems experienced on that front. Though I'm also male, "look" a bit older than I am, and regularly get comments on my "presence and confidence" on evals (at least now that I'm a bit more experienced...my first evals commented on my complete and total lack of confidence!). Don't know what I will do once I get my doctorate, but will likely carry on with first name unless given a reason to switch. My personal opinion is that these labels likely play a relatively minor role compared to most other things that impact student opinion.

wig - I'd heard somewhat the opposite of the CCs here. Our students who come from CCs are used to being able to "Get away" with things since they tend to cater to populations for whom academics is not a priority (generalizing of course). People think they can take exams when they want, the rules don't apply, etc. Now they may not be outright disrespectful (i.e. calling you out in class), but at least many of the CC transfers I've taught seem to have (surprisingly) very little understanding of how things work in the real world, and that I'm not willing to bend over backwards to accommodate them.

 

[Pragma]

I wonder if any of that might change by geographic region? I know in the south, I've seen staff at some clinical practicum sites treat female peers differently than me at times. I'm not sure if that's also the case with teaching, but I can say I've heard a relatively equal number of positive and negative outlooks/experiences from female instructors in my program.

Attempting to establish proper boundaries (and at least a mild sense of authority) early on was actually one of the reasons why I let students know they could address me as, "Mr. ____" during my first class each semester. I also made sure to always "sign" emails with my full name rather than just my first name. If students called me by my first name after that, I didn't attempt to correct them, but it might have been one of the things that contributed to my experiencing fewer boundary-related issues while teaching (that, or I've just been very lucky). As I mentioned earlier, though, I also had upper-level undergrads, which likely also accounted for having fewer problems.

Re male/female differences: Yes I am sure that for some students, sexism implicity may affect how they perceive and treat different instructors.

That said, the majority of psychology students are females in my experience, and we talk a lot of about sexism, feminism, and inequality in my classes since those areas are generally integral to the subject matter. Talking about the elephant sometimes makes it seem smaller within the classroom context.

Re: Authority, I honestly think a lot of it has to do with your personality. Most of my colleagues are females. Many of them get awesome marks and comments on RMP. Some don't. Some just aren't good at teaching, and all of them are a victim of some bias.

I am very laid back. I leave it up to the students if they want to call me Dr. ____ or call me by my first name. Interestingly, it seems they are more likely to show more respect when you leave that part up to them. I don't know, but I have had good experiences teaching students where by showing respect, you get respect back. If you have a negative attitude towards your class from the get-go, they pick up on it immediately and tension ensues.

I will admit, with SOME (not all) students (AND patients), I clearly have scored points because of being a man before I have even opened my mouth. But that is certainly not always the case, and most professional settings I have ever worked in are dominated by females. Almost every boss I have had is a female. I am the only male psychologist at my level where I work. Some patients, especially with previous experience in mental health, might appreciate having a male psychologist just because of the novelty of it.

Re: Liking teaching: I love it. I am knee-deep in the TT job market.

 

[Pragma]

I think I'd like teaching more if it were a subject more in my area of interest and not a survey course. I definitely can see myself doing this as part of my career (as long as it accompanies research, of course. )

Thanks for the reassurance about evals. I'm just worried that they'll all be negative or something, haha.

I use my first name. When I get my fancy schmancy PhD, I'll probably go by "Dr."

Btw, love the comments about the "Hotness" rating. Have you seen that research that found people rated as hot on RMP were also rated as better instructors?

It's funny, but I didn't teach survey courses until after I had taught upper level "interesting courses". Those are great for obvious reasons, but I actually LOVE teaching Intro now. It is so fun, IMHO, because students are at that point where they are seeing how interested they are in the field. You are an ambassador for it, and it forces you to re-teach yourself about areas you know less about.

I have found it has informed my own clinical practice even, because it forces me to think about how other psychology concepts are related to the narrow area of education I focused on.

 

[wigflip]

Thanks, cara. I look forward to reading it???

Oh, sorry for the confusion, Ollie. I didn't mean CC students who transfer to four year schools. I'm talking about what I hear from my friends who teach or adjunct at CCs.

My four year folks think they can take exams at will or turn in papers at their own convenience (mostly unstapled).