Institutional Action, Need Advice

[Nodal]

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So I am currently filling out my secondaries and have come to the institutional action section. In my sophomore year, my friend and I were fooling around with a laser pointer as we were unaware of school rules regarding it and received a complaint from passerby. We were written up and made fliers to speak out against improper use of lasers. Up until now, I thought it was just an informal slap on the wrist (and honestly, I had forgotten about it in the moment of filling out my primary). Recently, I found out that the incident is still on record in my University's judicial system.

Here's the problem: I already indicated on my AMCAS app that I was not the recipient of any institutional action. Obviously I should report it as it is on record at my university. Should I call AMCAS and have them update my app with this information? Should I just list it on my secondaries and state that I was unaware that the incident constituted an institutional action/disciplinary action?

Also, how would an IA like this affect my chances? I hear that IA/criminal record apps get placed in another pile for later review. I would hate something as small and stupid as a laser pointer to hurt my chances of getting into med school...This feeling is terrible. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

EDIT: Some secondaries don't offer a place to explain IA...Can AAMC update my AMCAS in a timely manner and send it to schools ASAP? Should I just call the schools?

 

[Goro]

I believe that you can update your app, but I'll leave it to others to verify.

Some schools have a "is there anything you'd like to tell us?" section in their secondary. You can put your explanation in there.

Your IA is the result of plain stupidity and carelessness, and as such, we'd ignore it. Just own it.

So I am currently filling out my secondaries and have come to the institutional action section. In my sophomore year, my friend and I were fooling around with a laser pointer as we were unaware of school rules regarding it and received a complaint from passerby. We were written up and made fliers to speak out against improper use of lasers. Up until now, I thought it was just an informal slap on the wrist (and honestly, I had forgotten about it in the moment of filling out my primary). Recently, I found out that the incident is still on record in my University's judicial system.

Here's the problem: I already indicated on my AMCAS app that I was not the recipient of any institutional action. Obviously I should report it as it is on record at my university. Should I call AMCAS and have them update my app with this information? Should I just list it on my secondaries and state that I was unaware that the incident constituted an institutional action/disciplinary action?

Also, how would an IA like this affect my chances? I hear that IA/criminal record apps get placed in another pile for later review. I would hate something as small and stupid as a laser pointer to hurt my chances of getting into med school...This feeling is terrible. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

EDIT: Some secondaries don't offer a place to explain IA...Can AAMC update my AMCAS in a timely manner and send it to schools ASAP? Should I just call the schools?

 

[IlDestriero]

It's a spectrum.
Pointing laser pointers at students to be annoying when drunk and/or stupid. Whatevs.
Pointing laser sight from weapon at students when drunk and/or stupid. Pass.
Pointing industrial laser at airplanes because drunk and stupid or lasers at uniformed police officers... nice knowing you, don't drop the soap.

 

[Nodal]

I believe that you can update your app, but I'll leave it to others to verify.

Some schools have a "is there anything you'd like to tell us?" section in their secondary. You can put your explanation in there.

Your IA is the result of plain stupidity and carelessness, and as such, we'd ignore it. Just own it.

Hopefully I can call the AAMC and send an updated version of my AMCAS to schools because some secondaries don't allow for an explanation at all. Anyone know for sure if I can update my verified AMCAS without being delayed? I must note again my primary is already verified and submitted to schools. I don't want to wait another 4-6 weeks.

It's a spectrum.
Pointing laser pointers at students to be annoying when drunk and/or stupid. Whatevs.
Pointing laser sight from weapon at students when drunk and/or stupid. Pass.
Pointing industrial laser at airplanes because drunk and stupid or lasers at uniformed police officers... nice knowing you, don't drop the soap.

Definitely just pointing the laser around out of stupidity. Only concern is being able to update my already verified app to include it in a timely manner so I'm not considered for interviews late in the cycle, I don't want schools to think I purposefully omitted it.

 

[smpbound]

I wouldn't be embarrassed about the laser pointing thing. I would be embarrassed about actually getting caught for something that juvenile.

Good luck on those med school apps.

 

[Sean Lee]

So I am currently filling out my secondaries and have come to the institutional action section. In my sophomore year, my friend and I were fooling around with a laser pointer as we were unaware of school rules regarding it and received a complaint from passerby. We were written up and made fliers to speak out against improper use of lasers. Up until now, I thought it was just an informal slap on the wrist (and honestly, I had forgotten about it in the moment of filling out my primary). Recently, I found out that the incident is still on record in my University's judicial system.

Here's the problem: I already indicated on my AMCAS app that I was not the recipient of any institutional action. Obviously I should report it as it is on record at my university. Should I call AMCAS and have them update my app with this information? Should I just list it on my secondaries and state that I was unaware that the incident constituted an institutional action/disciplinary action?

Also, how would an IA like this affect my chances? I hear that IA/criminal record apps get placed in another pile for later review. I would hate something as small and stupid as a laser pointer to hurt my chances of getting into med school...This feeling is terrible. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

EDIT: Some secondaries don't offer a place to explain IA...Can AAMC update my AMCAS in a timely manner and send it to schools ASAP? Should I just call the schools?

This is your biggest problem, IMO.

If you knew this counts as an IA, why did you not disclose it on your AMCAS? To me, the event sounds very minor and harmless, but the fact that you didn't disclose it on your primary application can be concerning.

As for the second bolded statement - I am not an ADCOM but I can tell you my experience. I also disclosed a minor IA, but I just received an interview invite from my top choice MD. My interview is in September. At least for that school, the IA did not prevent me from getting an early interview.

Finally, different medical schools probably view IAs differently. Some will laugh off even relatively serious incidents while others will unfairly give you a hard time even for minor incidents. The school that has given me an invite is probably among the harshest when it comes to IAs/criminal violations.

In the end, the IA itself will most likely not have any adverse impact. But the fact that you conveniently "forgot" to disclose the incident on your AMCAS will likely be a red flag. I would think carefully about how (or if) you should mention this IA on your secondaries. Good luck!

 

[Nodal]

This is your biggest problem, IMO.

If you knew this counts as an IA, why did you not disclose it on your AMCAS? To me, the event sounds very minor and harmless, but the fact that you didn't disclose it on your primary application can be concerning.

As for the second bolded statement - I am not an ADCOM but I can tell you my experience. I also disclosed a minor IA, but I just received an interview invite from my top choice MD. My interview is in September. At least for that school, the IA did not prevent me from getting an early interview.

Finally, different medical schools probably view IAs differently. Some will laugh off even relatively serious incidents while others will unfairly give you a hard time even for minor incidents. The school that has given me an invite is probably among the harshest when it comes to IAs/criminal violations.

In the end, the IA itself will most likely not have any adverse impact. But the fact that you conveniently "forgot" to disclose the incident on your AMCAS will likely be a red flag. I would think carefully about how (or if) you should mention this IA on your secondaries. Good luck!

I did not disclose it because, primarily, I had forgotten about it. I had forgotten about it because I was under the impression that it was an informal warning (not even a note in my file) and it had happened three years ago. No formal institutional action was taken therefore it did not come across my mind as IA. I only JUST found out that a minor record of the incident ever occurring is still in my University's judicial system record.

It's not like I'm trying to hide it, I want the schools I'm applying to to know of it. I'm willing to do what it takes for them to know it, however small it is. I just don't know how to let them know if it's not on my primary. I don't know whether to do that through secondaries or by emailing/calling the schools that don't have their own section for IA on secondaries. I just don't want to have to reprocess my primary. If I can update my primary and send an updated copy IMMEDIATELY to schools that would be optimal, but I'm asking if that is even possible.

 

[Sean Lee]

I did not disclose it because, primarily, I had forgotten about it. I had forgotten about it because I was under the impression that it was an informal warning (not even a note in my file) and it had happened three years ago. No formal institutional action was taken therefore it did not come across my mind as IA. I only JUST found out that a minor record of the incident ever occurring is still in my University's judicial system record.

It's not like I'm trying to hide it, I want the schools I'm applying to to know of it. I'm willing to do what it takes for them to know it, however small it is. I just don't know how to let them know if it's not on my primary. I don't know whether to do that through secondaries or by emailing/calling the schools that don't have their own section for IA on secondaries. I just don't want to have to reprocess my primary. If I can update my primary and send an updated copy IMMEDIATELY to schools that would be optimal, but I'm asking if that is even possible.

If it is "informal", is it regarded as a reportable "IA" by your school? If your school does not classify your incident as a reportable disciplinary incident, then you did the RIGHT thing answering "no" to the IA question.

Before you do anything else, contact your schools and know for sure that the incident is indeed an IA.

 

[Nodal]

If it is "informal", is it regarded as a reportable "IA" by your school? If your school does not classify your incident as a reportable disciplinary incident, then you did the RIGHT thing answering "no" to the IA question.

Before you do anything else, contact your schools and know for sure that the incident is indeed an IA.

I contacted the RD of my dorm and he said it is still in the system. I'll contact my university tomorrow and ask if it is indeed an IA (I have a feeling it is, the initial write-up is still there). Either way, do you know if I can call AAMC and have them change it for me without reprocessing?

 

[Sean Lee]

I contacted the RD of my dorm and he said it is still in the system. I'll contact my university tomorrow and ask if it is indeed an IA (I have a feeling it is, the initial write-up is still there). Either way, do you know if I can call AAMC and have them change it for me without reprocessing?

To my knowledge, I am nearly 100% certain that AAMC will not allow you to add your IA explanation to your primary application after you submit your application.

Wait until what your university says.

 

[Sean Lee]

I contacted the RD of my dorm and he said it is still in the system. I'll contact my university tomorrow and ask if it is indeed an IA (I have a feeling it is, the initial write-up is still there). Either way, do you know if I can call AAMC and have them change it for me without reprocessing?

FYI - just because something is "in the system" doesn't mean it is a reportable IA/disciplinary infraction. Schools keep all sorts of information in students' files, so the mere fact that something is "in your file" doesn't mean anything.

 

[Nodal]

FYI - just because something is "in the system" doesn't mean it is a reportable IA/disciplinary infraction. Schools keep all sorts of information in students' files, so the mere fact that something is "in your file" doesn't mean anything.

If it is reportable, do you think stating it in my secondaries or, for schools that don't allow that, emailing/calling them would make up for it not being on my primary?

 

[Sean Lee]

If it is reportable, do you think stating it in my secondaries or, for schools that don't allow that, emailing/calling them would make up for it not being on my primary?

If it is reportable, then you have two options.

One: just ignore it and hope that it never comes up.

Two: disclose the incident on secondaries, but also contact each medical school individually and explain what happened. Explain to them the inconsistency between your primary and secondary.

 

[LAtoDavis]

Don't laze me, bro

 

[Nodal]

If it is reportable, then you have two options.

One: just ignore it and hope that it never comes up.

Two: disclose the incident on secondaries, but also contact each medical school individually and explain what happened. Explain to them the inconsistency between your primary and secondary.

I'm not omitting anything that's reportable. I guess I'll have to call each medical school and ask them if I can email them an explanation of my IA (some don't have an option to describe an IA on the application).

 

[TheLionheart]

As others have mentioned, not everything is reported to other universities. For example, my university does not report residence life infractions because they aren't handled by the Dean of Student's office. Call whoever handles these things at your school and see if it'll be included in an inquiry.

 

[Nodal]

As others have mentioned, not everything is reported to other universities. For example, my university does not report residence life infractions because they aren't handled by the Dean of Student's office. Call whoever handles these things at your school and see if it'll be included in an inquiry.

It was handled through residence life at my university, not the Dean of Student's office. I called the RD of the building I lived in but I'm not sure he would know for certain if something in the judicial system records could be reported. I guess I'll call student conduct or the Dean's office to ask if it constitutes an IA.

 

[Sean Lee]

It was handled through residence life at my university, not the Dean of Student's office. I called the RD of the building I lived in but I'm not sure he would know for certain if something in the judicial system records could be reported. I guess I'll call student conduct or the Dean's office to ask if it constitutes an IA.

Good.

 

[Nodal]

Called a conduct officer and was told I must report it, it is on record for 7 years (4 now since it happened 3 years ago). Called most of my schools individually, some say it's ok to put it on the secondary, some say it's ok to email them, some didn't answer and I need to call back, one school said I need a letter from the conduct officer and myself explaining the situation...

 

[Nodal]

So for the last school I called, the director of admissions said I should self report the discrepancy to AMCAS investigations or he would do it. I was confused why he was suggesting that but I emailed an explanation of the mistake on my primary to investigations email. Was this a mistake? Are they going to open an investigation on me or something? Idk why this one particular school took it so seriously... I didn't lie I just forgot to include it, I seriously did not know that minor residence life record was considered IA.

I don't know what to do, it was either I report it or he does.

 

[Nodal]

Anyone? I'm freaking out

 

[LizzyM]

You should freak out. https://www.aamc.org/students/apply...iftheaamcconcludesivecommittedaviolation.html

That said, you failed to report a IA that was the most stupid, most inconsequential IA of all time. Most schools, I suspect, will not give a fig. Don't worry about it. In the end, it won't matter.

 

[Nodal]

You should freak out. https://www.aamc.org/students/apply...iftheaamcconcludesivecommittedaviolation.html

That said, you failed to report a IA that was the most stupid, most inconsequential IA of all time. Most schools, I suspect, will not give a fig. Don't worry about it. In the end, it won't matter.

I agree that is was a stupid IA, and forgetting about it to the point of not reporting it is even dumber. I genuinely did not purposefully omit it, and I emailed a full explanation to the aamc investigations email account, detailing that I have already let my schools know of the discrepancy. Is this going to prompt an investigation or damaging report? It's such a small issue and I've told them I've already reported it.

 

[LizzyM]

I agree that is was a stupid IA, and forgetting about it to the point of not reporting it is even dumber. I genuinely did not purposefully omit it, and I emailed a full explanation to the aamc investigations email account, detailing that I have already let my schools know of the discrepancy. Is this going to prompt an investigation or damaging report? It's such a small issue and I've told them I've already reported it.

I wouldn't worry too much. I wouldn't expect a med school to throw the book at someone who did a dopey laser thing on campus and I would't expect them to discriminate against an applicant who forgot to put a dopey thing on the application. On the other hand, if the applicant had "forgotten" to report academic dishonesty or stalking or something really serious, then it would be a different story.

 

[Nodal]

I wouldn't worry too much. I wouldn't expect a med school to throw the book at someone who did a dopey laser thing on campus and I would't expect them to discriminate against an applicant who forgot to put a dopey thing on the application. On the other hand, if the applicant had "forgotten" to report academic dishonesty or stalking or something really serious, then it would be a different story.

Thank you, hearing that calms me a bit. I know schools probably won't care, but the AAMC/AMCAS might especially since I basically told them myself that there is a discrepancy (they might not care that I forgot to list such a trivial incident, it still wasn't on there). I'm hoping they understand. The last thing I want is an investigation/report. In the mean time, I'll continue to note it on secondaries and via emails to schools.