Is the Dream Denied

[captainbsm]

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I am 27 yr old single guy with no kids. I am currently pre-med after changing from a pastoral ministry career path. My GPA in my BA Theology was (2.9) and my Masters in Theological Studies was (3.1). I went to Vanderbilt for my Masters and I worked for the Vanderbilt Center for Molecular Neuroscience and the Vanderbilt Eye Institute. My question whether or not my grades affect my ability to get accepted into medical school? Also what should I do to honestly show my sincerity and passion for being a doctor? Also I am currently taking pre med classes that I did not include in the aforementioned GPA calculations. My first two semesters of Biology I earned two B's. I am currently taking Chemistry and Physics, and while Chemistry is fun and I am doing well, Physics is trying to grind me into the dust. Any advice on my situation is gladly appreciated.

 

[thirdunity]

Hi CaptainBSM,

I think this advice is applicable to all students, not just pre-meds.

If you are going to take a class that's based upon factual material that never changes, or changes very slowly, where *every* class or standardized test is going to expect the same knowledge of you, you can get a head start before you even set foot in the class. Get the book that will be offered for that class, and work with a tutor, a few months in advance of taking the class (say, over the summer). Get ahead *before* you even set foot in the class.

This works well for science and math classes. If you absolutely need that A in physics, calculus or whatever, get the book and learn it before you even go in!

Doesn't work as well for liberal arts, where each teacher is likely to want something different, and where passing courses is equivalent to being good at mind-reading (from my perspective, anyway). And it's one of the reasons I'm a science major, not a lib. arts major.

 

[captainbsm]

Hi CaptainBSM,

I think this advice is applicable to all students, not just pre-meds.

If you are going to take a class that's based upon factual material that never changes, or changes very slowly, where *every* class or standardized test is going to expect the same knowledge of you, you can get a head start before you even set foot in the class. Get the book that will be offered for that class, and work with a tutor, a few months in advance of taking the class (say, over the summer). Get ahead *before* you even set foot in the class.

This works well for science and math classes. If you absolutely need that A in physics, calculus or whatever, get the book and learn it before you even go in!

Doesn't work as well for liberal arts, where each teacher is likely to want something different, and where passing courses is equivalent to being good at mind-reading (from my perspective, anyway). And it's one of the reasons I'm a science major, not a lib. arts major.

Lol I hear you. Funny thing is I did better in science courses than I did in courses of my major.

 

[2Sexy4MedSchool]

I am 27 yr old single guy with no kids. I am currently pre-med after changing from a pastoral ministry career path. My GPA in my BA Theology was (2.9) and my Masters in Theological Studies was (3.1).....

Hello CaptainBSM (which, by the way, is a MUCH better screen name than CaptainBM).

My situation was somewhat similar when I left my first career to go back to school to knock out my prerequisite classes in 2002. At that time I was a 32 year old married guy with no kids; my non-science undergrad and graduate GPA were only a smidgen better than yours and my subsequent BCMP GPA was not substantially different. However, I did well on the MCAT, which helped show I am not a total idjit, and I spent nine years working in a field that emphaised working with the disadvantaged.

There is another thread currently going on the pre-allopathic board about race considerations and admissions, which I will assume doesn't apply to you and I know does not apply to me; I only mention it here because there is some interesting discussion about the relationship between grades, MCAT scores, and "other stuff". I think it is very easy for us to get wrapped up in our own heads about grades. Because it is one of only two objective factors used to evaluate applicants I think we tend to imbue it with disproportionate importance.

My point is that a pre-med is more than a GPA with a pulse. How much more -- extracurriculars, life experience, professional experience in another field, research background, musical-instrument proficiency, athletic prowess, charm, fresh breath -- whatever you do when you are not getting a grade, that's what makes you different from the next guy, right? So long as that "other stuff" doesn't involve a rap sheet, well, what's stopping you? Your grades are ok, nothing great but nothing awful; others have been admitted to med school without much more. You don't have kids to support, so why worry about it for now? Do the best you can in your physics classes and the O Chem and the physiology and biochem and do the best you can on the MCAT and then apply. You'll get in or you won't. If you don't get in the first time, try again. While all of this is going on your life will continue and at some point you will either (a) get accepted to med school, (b) get rejected for the last time, (c) realize there is something else more important to you like a wife and family, or (d) get eaten by a hippo. Get on with your life and don't let the parade of numbers discourage you.

 

[relentless11]

You will find that a non-science background is a good thing. Although your prior GPA is not spectactular, it is the past. You have to show the adcoms that you can do well in the pre-reqs, AND upper div science classes. A's and B's are good, hopefully more A's than B's. Do well on the MCAT, about 28+, combine that with some good EC's, clinical experience, then you're in good condition. Can't guarantee if this recipe will get you in, but those that meet/exceed such stats aren't guaranteed much either.

Averages are just that though, don't let it bug you too much if you're below, and don't let it go to your head if you're above it. Because they are just that, averages, and so many variables are involved that it leaves nearly arbitrary characteristic to how one gets into med school..haha.

But yea, I think the way to go at it is to start off with a "clean slate", and look at your post-bacc GPA. Your undergrad GPA, and grad GPA are done, and in the past, and really in terms of med school curriculum, don't indicate how well you'll do in the science classes. So show them you can handle challenging science classes, while capitalize on your diverse background to get in. Good luck.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

I am 27 yr old single guy with no kids. I am currently pre-med after changing from a pastoral ministry career path. My GPA in my BA Theology was (2.9) and my Masters in Theological Studies was (3.1). I went to Vanderbilt for my Masters and I worked for the Vanderbilt Center for Molecular Neuroscience and the Vanderbilt Eye Institute. My question whether or not my grades affect my ability to get accepted into medical school? Also what should I do to honestly show my sincerity and passion for being a doctor? Also I am currently taking pre med classes that I did not include in the aforementioned GPA calculations. My first two semesters of Biology I earned two B's. I am currently taking Chemistry and Physics, and while Chemistry is fun and I am doing well, Physics is trying to grind me into the dust. Any advice on my situation is gladly appreciated.

Like another poster said, your application is the sum of many parts, and "external" activities that show a dedication to helping others, and a dedication to medicine will help you out.

That being said, I would be a little concerned about only getting Bs in your first 2 semesters of post-bac. classes (and it sounds like you are working towards a B or worse in Physics.) Your previous GPAs aren't really competitive, and you need to show the ADCOMs that you have improved in your studies significantly and are at least (if not more) competitive an applicant than the people currently graduating from college, and that you can handle the academic challenges that medical school will present.

You also need to be honest with yourself about how well you are learning the material in the classes that you are taking. Ultimately, you will have to re-prove your knowledge of Biology, Chemistry, and even Physics on the MCAT, and a low GPA coupled with a low MCAT will be a recipe for disaster.

Focus your time and energy on getting As -- go to your Professors' office hours if there is ANYTHING you don't understand. Take all of the advice that they give (going to Professors' office hours also helps you to get to know them, which will come in handy when you need to get LORs.) Read the material that will be covered in lecture BEFORE going, and try to work some of the problems. Work all of the problems well in advance of the due dates of homeworks and exams, and compare answers with other students, or go in and ask your Professors about ANYTHING you are not 100% sure about, and you will get As. Be honest with yourself about what you do and don't understand. In my own experience, the classes DON'T get easier as you move to upper-division classes, but all of the study skills you learn in your earlier classes will help you in your later classes. The more you understand the material, the more you will retain, which will help you in later classes. I've found this to be especially true in Biology classes.

Anyways, I am not trying to be overly negative, but as a fellow non-traditional pre-med, my personal attitude is to give the ADCOMs as few reasons as possible to reject my application. With MCAT, GPA, etc, there is no "magic number." I think it is universally true that higher is better for both of those numbers.

Good Luck,

Jota

 

[efex101]

Jota is exactly right about getting A's this is specially important if you are trying to make up for a poor prior GPA. There will be an intense scrutiny of your recent grades and anything lower than A's "could" give adcoms an excuse for NOT admitting you or even granting an interview. Non-trads that are going back to school to prove to adcoms that they can hack it need excellent grades (A's) this is specially true for those with subpar GPA from eons ago. So shoot for A's and IF you happen to get a B that is fine but do not make this a habit...for again it is more ammunition in the adcoms hands to prevent you from reaching your goal. Good luck.

 

[medworm]

I hate to be doling out this kind of advice, but do consider going DO if your grades aren't competitive enough for MD. Good luck!