Is there an advantage to being male when it comes to admissions?

[CanadianHope]

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This question has mostly to do with international and caribbean schools that might look beyond GPA's when making decisions regarding admission. Do any of you out there have first hand knowledge of males getting accepted to balance out the class?

 

[HopefulAg]

Since the male:female ratio is somewhere around 1:3 - 1:7, I think we can safely say males are not preferred over females to balance out the class. 😀

 

[LetItSnow]

Since the male:female ratio is somewhere around 1:3 - 1:7, I think we can safely say males are not preferred over females to balance out the class. 😀

It disappeared the last application cycle, but in the previous one, UMN CVM had a diversity statement on their web site that explicitly included men in the list of groups for which they were attempting to increase enrollment.

Didn't help me that year. 🙂

 

[CanadianHope]

Since the male:female ratio is somewhere around 1:3 - 1:7, I think we can safely say males are not preferred over females to balance out the class. 😀

That may have more to do with the ratio of applicants??

 

[moosenanny]

Changed my mind (see later post)

 

[shortnsweet]

Seeing as you asked about international schools, I can tell you at Glasgow the ratio is slightly more balanced than the US schools--probably similar to the other UK schools and Dublin too. It's probably more like 70:30 or 60:40 if you count the UK students in. I don't think being a guy helps you or hurts you in our admissions process. They tend to accept people with strong communication skills and varied experience to balance out GPAs and build classes.

 

[CanadianHope]

I seem to be recalling someone in this forum talking about how his marks were not great but at least one of the caribbean schools was pushing him to apply, indicating that the fact he was male would work in his favor. Has anyone experienced this?

 

[moosenanny]

I seem to be recalling someone in this forum talking about how his marks were not great but at least one of the caribbean schools was pushing him to apply, indicating that the fact he was male would work in his favor. Has anyone experienced this?

Rather than investigating this, why don't you just try to be the best applicant you can be and hope for the best, regardless of vet schools' perceptions of the Y chromosome? Do you really want to go around the rest of your life thinking that you were accepted only/mostly because you are a guy? I'd feel much more self-worth and pride if I were accepted based on my accomplishments and perseverance, and not my gender.

 

[Minnerbelle]

Rather than investigating this, why don't you just try to be the best applicant you can be and hope for the best, regardless of vet schools' perceptions of the Y chromosome?

haha, I love how around around the time VMCAS opens, we always get a nice flurry of these threads about whether people who are X, Y, Z have an advantage. you know the stress is on!

 

[jmo1012]

I seem to be recalling someone in this forum talking about how his marks were not great but at least one of the caribbean schools was pushing him to apply, indicating that the fact he was male would work in his favor. Has anyone experienced this?

without knowing the specifics of the actual thread, i have to point out that the caribbean schools push everyone to apply to them. they all want as many people as possible to be interested in them because they're going to get far fewer applicants than the US schools but need enrollment/money.

 

[Dsmoody23]

From what I hear, being male only benefits you if your stats are above average.

I was kicking this issue around with a few of the doctors at my job, and the prevailing conclusion was that my chromosomes won't get me a seat with mediocre grades.

But, apparently the place it does help is in differentiating between the qualified applicants.

If choosing between a male and female applicant with good to great stats, I'm hearing that the males are having some better luck.

 

[HopefulAg]

That may have more to do with the ratio of applicants??

That's what I was alluding to. Evidently the ratio of men to women in vet school reflects the application pool. If they were aiming to accept one gender over the other, then you'd expect the class ratio to be different.

 

[that redhead]

I have three male friends in Carribean schools. They were not accepted to any state schools because of weak numbers and (presumingly) not enough "other stuff" to balance that out. I don't know if they were favored down there because they were male but as Dsmoody mentioned, I'd imagine it would only make you more competitive against other highly qualified applicants. I doubt they'd give you a seat if your were significantly weaker than other female applicants.

 

[CanadianHope]

Rather than investigating this, why don't you just try to be the best applicant you can be and hope for the best, regardless of vet schools' perceptions of the Y chromosome? Do you really want to go around the rest of your life thinking that you were accepted only/mostly because you are a guy? I'd feel much more self-worth and pride if I were accepted based on my accomplishments and perseverance, and not my gender.

That's very noble but I think that most people would be less than honest if they didn't admit that acceptance outweighs the self-worth and pride issue.

 

[heylodeb]

That's very noble but I think that most people would be less than honest if they didn't admit that acceptance outweighs the self-worth and pride issue.

This statement saddens me. You would really rather be chosen because of a genetic traits that you can't control rather than because you have the attirbutes to become a competent veterinarian? Interesting.

I agree with dsmoody. If you are a highly qualified applicant and your stats are 100% equal to someone else's, being a male may be an advantage. There's no stats to prove that though and really, who cares?

Just become the absolute best applicant possible, present yourself well in an interview, and hold thumbs that you'll be accepted. If it's out of our control, why worry? Worry about experience hours, GPA's, GRE's, etc....those are things that we know the adcoms care about and that we can use to be seen as a more "viable applicants."

 

[New Foundland]

let's not act like CanadianHope was lobbying for special treatment for males..
All I saw was him inquiring about admission chances, and a possible factor that affects those chances.. I don't see much wrong with that...

If you were of aboriginal descent, wouldn't you like to know whether that might positively affect your admission chances at certain schools?
Wouldn't you wanna know what your chances are In-State vs. what your In-state chances would be if you moved to a different state?

You haven't contributed anything in order to be born in that state. You haven't earned anything by moving states..

Inquiring about certain admission factors does not imply support for it..

Do I have better chances where I live than somebody else does applying internationally to a place like RCVM? Hell yeah, and I'm glad I do.. 😀

Do you really want to go around the rest of your life thinking that you were accepted only/mostly because you are a guy? I'd feel much more self-worth and pride if I were accepted based on my accomplishments and perseverance, and not my gender.

That's a bit of an extreme characterization.. I don't think anyone realistically expects an applicant would be taken mostly because of gender

If it were a factor in any given instance, I think it would likely be on the range of being a slight edge factor, i.e. contributing a tiny fraction to the total applicant ranking

Do I personally think it's a factor? No, not significantly and not in any trend.
There are likely many many more instances of people being accepted based on attractiveness than people being accepted based on gender..
Is this a nefarious shadow puppet-master group at play?
No, it's minor biases rooted in human psychology, rarely apparent to the host..

 

[Robdude]

Rather than investigating this, why don't you just try to be the best applicant you can be and hope for the best, regardless of vet schools' perceptions of the Y chromosome? Do you really want to go around the rest of your life thinking that you were accepted only/mostly because you are a guy? I'd feel much more self-worth and pride if I were accepted based on my accomplishments and perseverance, and not my gender.

Ummm, isn't that a bit like sticking your head in the sand?

If schools do give preferential treatment to some segment of the population (and they certainly do) and you are apart of the segment you'll never be able to say with certainty that you were accepted, solely, based on your accomplishments and perseverance.

Unless you are given the option to not disclose whether or not you are part of a given sub-group of the population. I might be wrong, but I thought you had to select either 'Male' or 'Female' on most applications.

 

[mas185]

This question has mostly to do with international and caribbean schools that might look beyond GPA's when making decisions regarding admission. Do any of you out there have first hand knowledge of males getting accepted to balance out the class?

Unlike most undergrad programs, most vet schools do not make admissions decisions based on quotas to be filled. This is clearly reflected in the 90% women and poor minority representation that I've witnessed in a lot of the schools. In Dublin we have 8 male grad students to 36 females, but the undergrad portion of the class is more like 30% men (like 25 guys out of 80). The ratios here are more reflective of the qualified applicant pool 🙂 They're definitely not looking at class balance when they accept people. That being said I've found in the european schools there is a greater number of males in the classes, but I think that has more to do with more guys being interested in being vets (especially here in Ireland because of the large agriculture/equine racing focus which have been traditionally male dominated fields in the past).

M.A.

 

[moosenanny]

Rather than investigating this, why don't you just try to be the best applicant you can be and hope for the best, regardless of vet schools' perceptions of the Y chromosome? Do you really want to go around the rest of your life thinking that you were accepted only/mostly because you are a guy? I'd feel much more self-worth and pride if I were accepted based on my accomplishments and perseverance, and not my gender.

I didn't mean that in reality he would only be accepted because of his "male-ness." I meant: Why question something an applicant has no control over? Why get SDN'ers to dredge up a few hearsay stories about unqualified males getting accepted to various schools. Then, the applicant may question his future acceptance, wondering if he was chosen because he was male, or because the school believed in him and his future veterinary abilities.

Admissions to vet school is a big game. We are told some of the rules (have the best GPA/GRE/experiences possible), but we don't know all of them, and often they seem flexible at best, and random at worst. If applicants question every single criterion, they'll drive themselves crazy. Instead, I believe it is best to focus on what we do have control over (as others in this thread have discussed), and let the "veterinary admissions gods" take care of the rest.

 

[CanadianHope]

Thanks to those who stood up for me, particularly New Foundland. Of course I want to gain admission based on my qualifications. I am merely wondering if, because of the fact that so many more applicants are female, the adcoms might look a little longer at a male applicant with stats that don't blow them away.
We all want to "get in". That's why we apply. I say - whatever it takes as long as there is no dishonesty or misrepresentation.

 

[New Foundland]

I didn't mean that in reality he would only be accepted because of his "male-ness." I meant: Why question something an applicant has no control over?

Because it's useful to know your chances of getting in, therefore you'd like to know about the factors that contribute to those chances...
Also you want to know whether certain factors are weighted more heavily for certain schools, or whether they are completely irrelevant at certain schools..

Instead, I believe it is best to focus on what we do have control over (as others in this thread have discussed), and let the "veterinary admissions gods" take care of the rest.

Who's "focusing" on gender?

Somebody asking about whether gender might sometimes be a factor doesn't mean they're focusing any effort on it, anymore than people are "focusing on number of applicants" when they question the applicant stats in the current year at their school...



I feel like i'm stating the obvious here..

 

[Dsmoody23]

Beyond the basics (grades, GRE, hours of exp.) it's almost entirely arbitrary.

Just look at the 'Accepted Stats' thread. Or the thread started by the girl with the 4.0 who got rejected across the board.

I agree entirely with the former post, that you need to build your best possible application and forget about the rest of this +1/-1 nonsense.

Trying to pin down the specific details of a subjective process into an objective format is an exercise in complete futility.

 

[sunnyshine]

My opinion is kind of weird. I think that most schools "proclaim" to value diversity in gender, culture, race, and etc. Yet the actual statistics of the classes pretty much prove that that is not the case as 90 + % of the classes are caucasian females. IMO, schools shouldn't give preference to anyone based on something that the applicant has virtually no control over, i.e - the color of their skin or the contents of their underpants. Doing so could potentially rob a more qualififed apllicant of a less desireable background from an offer of admission.
And to be honest, I can't see why anyone would value diversity as a factor of admission. It basically tells one group of people that they worked hard, but will be selected against based on something they have no control over. And it tells another group that they really weren't good enough to be admitted solely on their righful qualifications alone. To an extent, everyone loses.

 

[sunnyshine]

Beyond the basics (grades, GRE, hours of exp.) it's almost entirely arbitrary.

Just look at the 'Accepted Stats' thread. Or the thread started by the girl with the 4.0 who got rejected across the board.

I agree entirely with the former post, that you need to build your best possible application and forget about the rest of this +1/-1 nonsense.

Trying to pin down the specific details of a subjective process into an objective format is an exercise in complete futility.

👍

 

[jtom]

And to be honest, I can't see why anyone would value diversity as a factor of admission.

Last year one of the schools I applied to had an essay in the supplemental application where they wanted us to talk about how we could contribute to diversity if chosen in the class; they obviously valued a diverse class.

 

[nyanko]

And to be honest, I can't see why anyone would value diversity as a factor of admission. It basically tells one group of people that they worked hard, but will be selected against based on something they have no control over. And it tells another group that they really weren't good enough to be admitted solely on their righful qualifications alone. To an extent, everyone loses.

The value in REAL diversity has to do with what's good for society in the future, not what's good for individuals in the present.

 

[breenie]

Last year one of the schools I applied to had an essay in the supplemental application where they wanted us to talk about how we could contribute to diversity if chosen in the class; they obviously valued a diverse class.

I had to write two of these. Neither included references to my race, gender, or other attributes about myself that were unchangeable. Both schools liked me and accepted me, despite being a white female. I maintain that I supplied good answers for why I was diverse, so many they value diversity on a broader spectrum than just skin color/sex/etc. I don't think we should assume we know what their version of diversity is.

 

[NStarz]

I had to write two of these. Neither included references to my race, gender, or other attributes about myself that were unchangeable. Both schools liked me and accepted me, despite being a white female. I maintain that I supplied good answers for why I was diverse, so many they value diversity on a broader spectrum than just skin color/sex/etc. I don't think we should assume we know what their version of diversity is.

Just curious breenie--did you go into your background/specific experiences? Or did you talk more about your point of view? Just trying to figure out how to attack those kinds of questions.

 

[lostbunny]

My opinion is kind of weird. I think that most schools "proclaim" to value diversity in gender, culture, race, and etc. Yet the actual statistics of the classes pretty much prove that that is not the case as 90 + % of the classes are caucasian females. IMO, schools shouldn't give preference to anyone based on something that the applicant has virtually no control over, i.e - the color of their skin or the contents of their underpants. Doing so could potentially rob a more qualififed apllicant of a less desireable background from an offer of admission.
And to be honest, I can't see why anyone would value diversity as a factor of admission. It basically tells one group of people that they worked hard, but will be selected against based on something they have no control over. And it tells another group that they really weren't good enough to be admitted solely on their righful qualifications alone. To an extent, everyone loses.

This is why I opted not to use VMCAS for admission. Thankfully the uni's I applied to all had other options for application. I found that a huge put off when I was using the practice VMCAS, when it asks you a bunch of irrelevant questions about your ethnicity, your parent's ethnicity, etc. All the other applications I'm filling out just ask you about whats important: your grades, your experience, your PS and your LORs.

To the OP:

I'm sure there is some bias that you are male, as a previous post titled something along the lines of 'politics upon admission'. But in any case- apply anyway. There's no real way to know if you had an advantage being male or a disadvantage. You will either get accepted or rejected- and after looking through 100s of applications, I'm sure the final statement to the decision of "Yes, he's accepted" will have been long forgotten. They would have just hoped they made the right decision.

 

[sunnyshine]

The value in REAL diversity has to do with what's good for society in the future, not what's good for individuals in the present.

I kind of see where you are coming from but I would tend to disagree. I would think that anyone of any race, culture, or gender would have the propencity to practice veterinary medicine just as well as anyone of another background. Therefore, I do not feel that a diversified veterinary workforce would be able to serve society any better than a homogeneous one. If a veterinarian is truly qualified to practice medicine and if society is truly unbiased towards another person background then the factor of sex/culture/race should be unimportant.

 

[nyanko]

I kind of see where you are coming from but I would tend to disagree. I would think that anyone of any race, culture, or gender would have the propencity to practice veterinary medicine just as well as anyone of another background. Therefore, I do not feel that a diversified veterinary workforce would be able to serve society any better than a homogeneous one. If a veterinarian is truly qualified to practice medicine and if society is truly unbiased towards another person background then the factor of sex/culture/race should be unimportant.

Society...unbiased? 🤣 good one....

I agree that none of those things are really factors when it comes to whether one can be a competent veterinarian or not, but the thing is that there are factors beyond a person's control that can serve as very large barriers to even getting to that point. A person's personal story and background, and the things that make the person who they are today, are just as much a part of the person's application as their organic freaking chemistry grade. So why shouldn't the person's background be taken into account?

I'm having trouble saying what I want to actually get across because it seems so obvious to me that it is really important to have a variety of backgrounds and viewpoints that I just can't really put it into phrase.

edit: I agree with breenie on the definition of "diversity" and think a lot of you are taking the whole concept the wrong way.

As a white chick, the majority, you know?

 

[breenie]

Just curious breenie--did you go into your background/specific experiences? Or did you talk more about your point of view? Just trying to figure out how to attack those kinds of questions.

I think it's a pretty personal thing. My dad once told me that when you're asked a hard question, answer the question you wish you had been asked. I attacked it as, "What makes you valuable?" Because it's likely that if something makes you valuable, not everyone possesses that trait.

 

[Nechochwen]

If you were of aboriginal descent, wouldn't you like to know whether that might positively affect your admission chances at certain schools?

When I got the supplemental application from LSU asking "How would I contribute to the diversity of my class", I told my parents that if they adopted me from a Pacific Islander family, I'd perfectly understand...just so I could write a paragraph or two on how I would add diversity!

I had been told afterward that my being male would have fulfilled the "adding diversity" question, but IMO I don't think striving to add diversity has excluded "excellent applicants, no diversity" and included "poor applicants, diversity".

A thought that comes to me also about trying to create diversity in vet school classes has to do with shaping the class not only in having people of different backgrounds, but also ensuring that vet students have class mates around them with different backgrounds. That is, some of the importance of diversity may also have to do with ensuring that the normal demographic of vets have friends/colleagues in their formative years of veterinary education. You get pretty close to your classmates during this process of vet school regardless of background...that may help you see past background once you get out dealing with clients/colleagues. Just a thought.

A little long winded but, I'm at the end of the world (literally) and I have way too much time on my hands.

 

[StartingoverVet]

That's what I was alluding to. Evidently the ratio of men to women in vet school reflects the application pool. If they were aiming to accept one gender over the other, then you'd expect the class ratio to be different.

This is the key point (of course I believe so since I made it last year when this thread popped up!).

Unless you want to demonstrate that male applicants are generally less qualified than female applicants, then the similar acceptance ratios argue for no bias regardless of what adcoms actually say!

 

[sunnyshine]

Society...unbiased? 🤣 good one....

I agree that none of those things are really factors when it comes to whether one can be a competent veterinarian or not, but the thing is that there are factors beyond a person's control that can serve as very large barriers to even getting to that point. A person's personal story and background, and the things that make the person who they are today, are just as much a part of the person's application as their organic freaking chemistry grade. So why shouldn't the person's background be taken into account?

I'm having trouble saying what I want to actually get across because it seems so obvious to me that it is really important to have a variety of backgrounds and viewpoints that I just can't really put it into phrase.

edit: I agree with breenie on the definition of "diversity" and think a lot of you are taking the whole concept the wrong way.

As a white chick, the majority, you know?

I think we may actually agree on many of the same issues. I am not trying to say that a person's backgorund or life story is unimportant. If a person has gone through a unique experience, such as growing up in a troubled or socio-economically depressed environment then that is something that is out of that person's control that is of value to an admissions commitee and should be considered. My main point was to state my belief that the admission of an individual over another person SOLELY on the basis of gender/race is unfair.

I also agree with you and breenie on the definition of divesity. Diversity is quite a vague term.

 

[Minnerbelle]

My main point was to state my belief that the admission of an individual over another person SOLELY on the basis of gender/race is unfair.

well life is unfair... but don't sweat it, i highly doubt that people frequently get admitted to vet school over others SOLELY on the basis of gender/race.

i would imagine that the only time two people with two very similar qualifications would be compared where one is admitted and the other is not, is if neither of them really stood out anyway. sucks for the reject, but rather than worrying about being a middle class white female from a nondescript background, it might be more worthwhile for her to worry about why she was a lukewarm applicant to begin with.

plus, i sincerely believe that vet schools (at least that i've encountered) seem to be really good at defining diversity as a much broader term than just gender/race. isn't that a big part of why they ask what your career interests are and experiences have been too?

but maybe it's easy for me to say, 'cause i could very well be one of those minorities who take seats away from more qualified white folk.

 

[StartingoverVet]

but maybe it's easy for me to say, 'cause i could very well be one of those minorities who take seats away from more qualified white folk.

Actually, you are a good example of one of those people taking seats away from less qualified folk!

 

[alwayslistening]

I've seen a few articles talking about how there is a gender shift in veterinary medicine, y'all may have seen these too, about how potential male applicants are not making the apps to vet school for various reasons. We males are seen as unemotional, that we are not attracted to the profession because it pays less, etc etc, essentially, that it is becoming a woman's profession. It is reflected in my undergrad institution as well. Most of my classmates are female. It is a very odd thing, coming from a town and HS where the gender distribution was more even.

I for one, as a male, am apprehensive about going to a professional school where most of the class is female...(gets distracted) 😀

Now, to get back to the original thread topic, I do think that for males who have the right interests, such as large animal medicine, it could be helpful in the admissions process. I don't think the schools will ever say outright, because of federal regulations or whatnot (I am unsure), that "we want more males". It will probably be a more subtle thing

 

[CanadianHope]

I think you may be right, alwayslistening. Of course no school would admit that they are gender-biased but it may be "out there" in some cases.

 

[RadRadTerp]

A thought that comes to me also about trying to create diversity in vet school classes has to do with shaping the class not only in having people of different backgrounds, but also ensuring that vet students have class mates around them with different backgrounds. That is, some of the importance of diversity may also have to do with ensuring that the normal demographic of vets have friends/colleagues in their formative years of veterinary education. You get pretty close to your classmates during this process of vet school regardless of background...that may help you see past background once you get out dealing with clients/colleagues. Just a thought.

A little long winded but, I'm at the end of the world (literally) and I have way too much time on my hands.

I'm very glad you wrote this. Most people that have hang-ups about "diversity" often lack a clear understanding of its importance in education. People hear diversity and immediately think "affirmative action," which most rational people disagree with. No one likes quotas, but I do value having people who were formerly lawyers, Chemistry PhDs, or French majors in my class because it exposes me to a variety of perspectives. It would be a shame if everyone who was admitted came from a traditional animal sciences (no offense intended to animal science people 😛) background and were just the top 1%ers in grades and GRE scores.

Personally, I would disagree with an admissions policy that only went by GRE scores (despite being a high scorer myself), for example, because it would seem to be biased towards good test-takers and wouldn't be able to distinguish someone with a 1200 with great life and animal experiences from someone with a 1275 who might have had a 4.0, but lacks animal experience. An admissions committee doesn't want to treat applicants as mere numerical figures, but as individual people who bring unique experiences and perspectives to the incoming class and profession as a whole. That's why there is generally an academic numerical cut-off you have to reach to be considered, but upwards of those values other factors like your PS, LORs, and experiences take more weight in deciding your potential admission.

However, I do agree with those who say it makes more sense to focus on your own strengths and accomplishments and less on what genetic attributes you have that might give you an "edge" with applications. The truth is that you're never going to be able to tell whether School A weighs your malehood 5 pts. vs. School B giving you 10+ pts, so don't worry about it 🙂 Just be the best you that you can be.

 

[nyanko]

I for one, as a male, am apprehensive about going to a professional school where most of the class is female...(gets distracted) 😀

I'm female and was apprehensive about it.

Coming into this field was new territory for me too, from a Computer Science background. There are pros and cons, but I assure you, white male privilege is still alive and well. 😉

 

[LetItSnow]

There are pros and cons, but I assure you, white male privilege is still alive and well. 😉

Back in the kitchen, you..... 😉

 

[Nechochwen]

A little off topic, but with that comment I have to brag on my Little Sib (first year student this fall). He's starting vet school this fall at 50 years old after working as the "Principle Materials Engineer, Space Shuttle External Tank Program, NASA". I win the "Coolest Little Sib" contest!

I'm sure he'll bring a unique perspective to things.

 

[twelvetigers]

A little off topic, but with that comment I have to brag on my Little Sib (first year student this fall). He's starting vet school this fall at 50 years old after working as the "Principle Materials Engineer, Space Shuttle External Tank Program, NASA". I win the "Coolest Little Sib" contest!

I'm sure he'll bring a unique perspective to things.

Send him to SDN! I wanna meet this guy.

 

[JSpitz]

Anyone have interesting stories on perspectives stemming from previous professions?

PS. nyanko, you are such an alpha nerd 😉

 

[vettobe2014]

Because most applicants are female these days, and the schools try to have a 50/50 male/female ratio, they lower the standards for the guys. I know this statement I'm making sounds really bad, but it's true. However, all the guys who get accepted will be just as good as the woman vets. It's all about how you do in vet school and how you do when you get out. Your criteria for getting in doesn't matter once you graduate.

 

[moosenanny]

Because most applicants are female these days, and the schools try to have a 50/50 male/female ratio, they lower the standards for the guys.

FYI, in America I am nearly certain there is only one school out of the 28 that tries to achieve a 50:50 ratio. The others are much closer to 70-80% female and 20-30% male. These ratios simply reflect the applicant pool.

 

[StartingoverVet]

Because most applicants are female these days, and the schools try to have a 50/50 male/female ratio, they lower the standards for the guys. I know this statement I'm making sounds really bad, but it's true. However, all the guys who get accepted will be just as good as the woman vets. It's all about how you do in vet school and how you do when you get out. Your criteria for getting in doesn't matter once you graduate.

Gotta love a wildly speculative, and inflammatory comment like this that is completelely unsupported by the few facts we have (male female ratios and admittance rates).

I need some more entertainment.... keep up with the fictions vettobe.

 

[moosenanny]

I need some more entertainment.... keep up with the fictions vettobe.

Haha, yeah I'm sitting here bored at work waiting for more entertainment . . . perhaps an all-out cyber fight will break out.

 

[LetItSnow]

Haha, yeah I'm sitting here bored at work waiting for more entertainment . . . perhaps an all-out cyber fight will break out.

I'm getting the impression that vettobe is just trolling? Yeah, I'm a little slow.... I probably shouldn't have responded to his/her first few posts. Sigh.