I've had it with HIPPA!

[Chronic Student]

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Not exactly ER but I really value the opinions of those who lurk in this forum.

So, I have a patient in my office today who may have a post-op wound infection and another provider has ordered a CBC, ESR and CRP 2 days ago. I call the national lab chain (who shall remain nameless) to have the information faxed over.

They say that they can't do that because its a HIPPA violation to release this information to anyone who did not directly order the test. I tell them that this is BS and that she is sitting right here in my office and she is requesting it and I even have her get on the phone and say that to them and even offer for her to sign a release and fax it over to them.

No dice.

Then I ask them if it is illegal for me to check results of labs ans x-rays that other providers have ordered in the hospital, in which case every provider in the hospital is guilty of a HIPPA violation. She says she is not a lawyer and that is company policy.

I have to end up sending this lady over to the hospital to get it all redrawn. So, is it really a HIPPA violation for this patient to get their own lab results? I mean I have to expose this lady to pain, risk of infection and hassle to get this done, not to mention I'm driving up healthcare costs for unneccesary tests!

Help me out here people and tell me I'm not crazy.

-Mike

 

[deleted6669]

A written release should have done the trick.
I could tell you how I feel about hippa....and jcaho.....but I'm sure that's some sort of violation.....🙂

(I'm drinking coffee at my desk at work, RIGHT NOW....take that jcaho.....)

 

[GeneralVeers]

A written release should have done the trick.
I could tell you how I feel about hippa....and jcaho.....but I'm sure that's some sort of violation.....🙂

(I'm drinking coffee at my desk at work, RIGHT NOW....take that jcaho.....)

JCAHO is now called the "Joint commission".

In my opinion, one of the most evil scourges of mankind. HIPAA is just the bastard offspring of Hillary Clinton.

 

[docB]

Do this. Tell them that you are documenting their name and the fact that their policy or their interpretation of the policy is negatively affecting patient care and you want to make sure that any liability for that negative impact rests with the company that made the policy or the employee who is misinterpreting the policy. Get the address of the admin office of the lab or ancillary service or whatever it is. Then send a letter (I know but its actually pretty easy, I do it once a month or so) to the medical director of the lab (you can just send it to Attn: "medical director." CC: your dept head and the patient.

 

[DeLaughterDO]

(I'm drinking coffee at my desk at work, RIGHT NOW....take that jcaho.....)

I actually think this was OSHA who made up that crap of a rule...

We're trying to get our work stations designated as "non-patient care areas" so we can have drinks and such there. We'll see how far that goes.

jd

 

[ditch doctor]

What I think is great is that in order to look at *your own* labs/xrays you have to sign a release to yourself.... What has this world come to....

 

[southerndoc]

JCAHO is now called the "Joint commission".

In my opinion, one of the most evil scourges of mankind. HIPAA is just the bastard offspring of Hillary Clinton.

Huh? Where did you get this from?

Bill Clinton signed the bill into law, but as far as I know Hillary had little to do with its creation. HIPAA is the brainchild of Ted Kennedy and Nancy Kassebaum. It was formerly known as the Kennedy-Kassebaum Bill.

 

[deleted77919]

After reading the posts about Ted Kennedy, Hillary Clinton, and illegitimate children I had a terrible mental image. And I needed to share it with all of you.

 

[MacGyver]

Its NOT a hippa violation. HIPPA gets blamed for everything because nobody knows how to read and figure out what the law actually says.

Tell that secretary she's a stupid bitch and then tell her to look up the actual law instead of blaming everything but the rain on HIPPA.

 

[GeneralVeers]

Huh? Where did you get this from?

Bill Clinton signed the bill into law, but as far as I know Hillary had little to do with its creation. HIPAA is the brainchild of Ted Kennedy and Nancy Kassebaum. It was formerly known as the Kennedy-Kassebaum Bill.

Loosely, it is. Although she didn't come up with the exact concept of HIPAA, many of its concepts were borrowed from her health care restructuring plan in the 90's.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=27375

 

[deleted6669]

Its NOT a hippa violation. HIPPA gets blamed for everything because nobody knows how to read and figure out what the law actually says.

Tell that secretary she's a stupid bitch and then tell her to look up the actual law instead of blaming everything but the rain on HIPPA.

for once you and I are in complete agreement.....🙂
(pigs seen flying, hell freezes over, cats and dogs seen living in harmony, etc....)

 

[docB]

Huh? Where did you get this from?

Bill Clinton signed the bill into law, but as far as I know Hillary had little to do with its creation. HIPAA is the brainchild of Ted Kennedy and Nancy Kassebaum. It was formerly known as the Kennedy-Kassebaum Bill.

HIPAA is a great example of how the legislative system can take a decent idea and turn it into a vile, steaming pile of crap. HIPAA was originally supposed to stop insurers from excluding everyone who might ever need healthcare when they moved and to stop insurers from selling private info to marketeers, other insurers, Al Queda and so on. The insurers set their legions of lawyers on these problems and now they exempt themselves from them by forceing everyone they insure to waive those provisions. The current HIPPA nightmare was born of the fact that the law mandates severe penalties against anyone or any orginization that violates it. It actually says that clinicians can freely exchange info for the purpose of providing care without all the forms and so on. The problem is that the penalites are so severe that each hospital, lab and so on created reactive policies to make sure none of their employees ever accidentally violates the law. Hence, the quagmire we have now that hurts healthcare. Oh well. American healthcare is such a high functioning, well oiled machine that it can take a few bad laws without any harm.

 

[Wackie]

No, you're not crazy.
I've had my own lab results faxed to another provider many o' times after signing a release. I think it's actually illegal for them to keep those lab results from the patient, isn't it?

 

[igcgnerd]

I think withholding lab results from the patient might fall under the freedom of information act but maybe that just applies to the feds

 

[Dimoak]

I'm not sure if the Freedom of Information Act can be invoked for confidential medical information, however I believe there is a law that grants a patient the right to view their own charts and other medical documents, provided only their own medical information is on there. To CS, did you try asking the secretary to speak to someone more senior at the lab? As others have mentioned, I believe a signed release form by the patient would protect the lab from legal liability.

 

[BADMD]

I think withholding lab results from the patient might fall under the freedom of information act but maybe that just applies to the feds

FOIA only applies to the Feds. However, HIPPA states that if you are caring for a patient, directly, you have access to their records, unless they have specifically asked that they not be shared, and even then, it is then up to the hosptial (that is a mouthful).

Everyone is afraid of the criminal penalties attached to disclosure and there is minimal if any penalty for non-disclosure. HIPPA actually allows for quite a large amount of disclosure. Law enforcement, insurance companies, billers, etc call all get stuff without too much difficulty. Its the healthcare providers that have difficulty.

 

[dilated]

It actually says that clinicians can freely exchange info for the purpose of providing care without all the forms and so on. The problem is that the penalites are so severe that each hospital, lab and so on created reactive policies to make sure none of their employees ever accidentally violates the law.

This is exactly right. The problem is when people say "it violates HIPAA" it almost never does. However it often DOES violate institutional policies on HIPAA because hospitals make up ridiculously strict and arbitrary policies on how to enforce it. There is an entire bureaucratic industry whose survival depends on having elaborate and extensive HIPAA rules. Violating your hospital's HIPAA guidelines on anything from email to disclosing info to people will get you formally reprimanded or fired EVEN IF it's not a violation of the actual law! It's pretty infuriating.

 

[southerndoc]

This is exactly right. The problem is when people say "it violates HIPAA" it almost never does. However it often DOES violate institutional policies on HIPAA because hospitals make up ridiculously strict and arbitrary policies on how to enforce it. There is an entire bureaucratic industry whose survival depends on having elaborate and extensive HIPAA rules. Violating your hospital's HIPAA guidelines on anything from email to disclosing info to people will get you formally reprimanded or fired EVEN IF it's not a violation of the actual law! It's pretty infuriating.

I once had a paramedic crew refuse to leave a copy of their PCR after they transported a patient from another facility. The crew left a copy of this modified PCR that had times and such, but had nothing relevant to patient care. Had this been a direct receipt instead of a transfer, I would have blown a gasket. I actually read the pre-hospital PCR's and would have been extremely offended had they not left one on a non-transfer.

 

[pmdc222]

I once had a paramedic crew refuse to leave a copy of their PCR after they transported a patient from another facility. The crew left a copy of this modified PCR that had times and such, but had nothing relevant to patient care. Had this been a direct receipt instead of a transfer, I would have blown a gasket. I actually read the pre-hospital PCR's and would have been extremely offended had they not left one on a non-transfer.

I once responded on the ambulance to a rehab hospital (I have no recollection of the patient's problem) and the nurse told me that she would be violating HIPAA if she let me see the patient's paperwork. I explained to her that we have to know the past medical history/medications/history of present illness because 1. We actually treat people in the ambulance and we have to know if what we are doing is appropriate for the patient 2. we have to give a report to the ER when we get there. She still refused saying that she would be violating HIPPA. Instead she decided to read out of the chart and yell the patient's medical history across the floor so that we could hear it verbally instead. Unfortunately, so did every patient and family member on the floor. So much for privacy.

 

[LifetimeDoc]

At the hospital I volunteer, patients are able to write back thank you notes to the staff and physicians about their stay in the ED. Many patients are grateful for the kind and caring treatment they received, so the staff thought it would be nice to post those comment cards in the department for all to see.

Last week, a directive that posting anything that might identify who the patient was that sent the comment card was a violation of HIPAA and must be removed. What are they supposed to do? Black out the names and info about the patients so that all the comments read...

"Dear Dr. ########, Thank you so much for taking care of me when I came in with #######. Your staff, especially ######, ######, and ##### worked so hard and took care of my ###### and #######. Thank #### for spending time with me and my #####. Sincerely,######".

👎

 

[146233]

I once responded on the ambulance to a rehab hospital (I have no recollection of the patient's problem) and the nurse told me that she would be violating HIPAA if she let me see the patient's paperwork. I explained to her that we have to know the past medical history/medications/history of present illness because 1. We actually treat people in the ambulance and we have to know if what we are doing is appropriate for the patient 2. we have to give a report to the ER when we get there. She still refused saying that she would be violating HIPPA. Instead she decided to read out of the chart and yell the patient's medical history across the floor so that we could hear it verbally instead. Unfortunately, so did every patient and family member on the floor. So much for privacy.

Something like this happens to me no less than three times a week. I just threaten to call the police to have them arrested for interfering with emergency medical care [huge lie], and that usually scares them out of it.

 

[sjt9721]

"Dear Dr. ########, Thank you so much for taking care of me when I came in with #######. Your staff, especially ######, ######, and ##### worked so hard and took care of my ###### and #######. Thank #### for spending time with me and my #####. Sincerely,######". 👎

This reminds me of "Mad Libs"...Anyone remember those? This one would go as follows:

• Last Name
• Injury/Illness
• 3 First Names
• 2 Body Parts
• First Name
• Type of Relative
• First/Last Name

 

[Flopotomist]

HIPAA One P, Two A's. Most of the people who spout off about HIPAA don't even know what it stands for, let alone what policies are covered by it.

 

[Chronic Student]

HIPAA One P, Two A's. Most of the people who spout off about HIPAA don't even know what it stands for, let alone what policies are covered by it.

I never really looked at the spelling until you pointed it out. I just used the fonetik spelling😳

-Mike

 

[moonshade13]

Hello all ,
I work in a medical Imaging file room. We get lots of calls form reports and film. All I need to give a Doctor or other medical staff a report is 1 name and spelling 2 date of birth 3 what report you want . Then we fax it because it is Continuing Medical Care. If you want a x-ray we fill out a release so that if we look back we can say who go it. I love all of your stories and want to thank all of you for your hard work.
P.S. my husband is an LPN so I hear a lot to.