Job security

[bandn]

A lot of people seem to think that the CRNAs will hurt the profession of anesthesia. I think that outsourcing for rads or the pop up of mintue clinics for IM/FP will hurt more than the CRNA. The fact is, as of now at least, the CRNAs can only do so much and need to be supervised. An MD/DO needs to be there to do the supervising. Even if tons of people go into CRNA, I don't think it will ruin anesthesia. Am I wrong, or am I just optimistic?

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[MissMuffet]

Am I wrong, or am I just optimistic?

I kinda wonder, from your posting of this thread, are you sadistic or masochistic?

 

[leopold stotch]

Don't worry about CRNAs dude. They are, generally, not as smart and they are definitely no threat. Just take a look at some of the posts on this site. I can't even read them any more, so f-ing stupid. Yeah some CRNAs are likely better than some MDs. But in general that's just not the case. MDs in anesthesiology are going nowhere else. Salaries may change, but job security is always going to be there. Do what you like best, and be the best at that field. Good luck.

 

[MissMuffet]

My apologies, leopold. I should have been less flippant.

I was referring to the fact that, as you said, the threads on this subject are "so f-ing stupid". I feared he was going to be flamed to bits for starting this one. Tried a little humor... poorly.

(BTW, I completely agree with your position on the subject. And I made a 33 on the MCAT years ago, but motherhood has intervened, so far.)

 

[leopold stotch]

That's cool.

I'm sick of these threads too.

 

[Idiopathic]

Don't worry about CRNAs dude. They are, generally, not as smart and they are definitely no threat. Just take a look at some of the posts on this site. I can't even read them any more, so f-ing stupid. Yeah some CRNAs are likely better than some MDs. But in general that's just not the case. MDs in anesthesiology are going nowhere else. Salaries may change, but job security is always going to be there. Do what you like best, and be the best at that field. Good luck.

Sure, but as you so eloquently put it elsewhere...

i'm new at this, start anesthesiology in july

Im on your side, but I hope the former comment is facetious.

 

[leopold stotch]

Sure, but as you so eloquently put it elsewhere...




Im on your side, but I hope the former comment is facetious.

don't flatter yourself, unless your my residency director, i could care less if your on my side.

rather than writing one-liners, please explain yourself dude. in your elaborate explanation, please note: i wasn't being facetious (rather eloquent word choice yourself) at all. thanks, by the way, for checking up on my daily logic. 20+ years of school and i still can't cut and paste like that.

edit: that's cool, sleep on it.

 

[Idiopathic]

Okay, well your statement was pretty abrasive and inflammatory, I figured you could take a little criticism. I happen to agree with you that CRNAs are not as big of a threat as many around here would have us believe, but I also think they are for the most part intelligent and well-trained.

 

[ThinkFast007]

begin reading from the beginning of the thread called "Job Prospects in 10 years".

Is the CRNA threat a real one? Yes, especially in the managed care settings we have NOW, as opposed to 10 years ago.

Can we do something? Yup. Ppl like you and me, can standed united in this cause and create great change!

 

[leopold stotch]

Okay, well your statement was pretty abrasive and inflammatory, I figured you could take a little criticism. I happen to agree with you that CRNAs are not as big of a threat as many around here would have us believe, but I also think they are for the most part intelligent and well-trained.

Make no mistake, your original sarcasm and your cutting-and-pasting was inflammatory itself. Still don't get your point.

Nevertheless, to clarify:
I said some of the posts were stupid.
I did not mean to imply that CRNAs are stupid, because we all know they are not.

The reason I rudely pointed out that MDs are smarter than most CRNAs:
1. this is an MD thread, so i'm not expecting to hurt anyone's feelings except nitecap's (he's tough, can take it).
2. to encourage med students to go into gas, regardless of the CRNA situation. because its a smaller issue than most med students perceive it to be. this get's blown out of proportion in med school. after med school, the fear and concerns rapidly dwindle.

The original point I'm making was about job security. I don't think the situation is analogous to the out-sourcing in rads. I feel its not so much a job security issue, but more a salary issue. The more power CRNAs have, the more money they make and the less we make. The more power MD/DOs have, the more money we make and the less they make. Is that a good reason to argue: hells yeah.

Y'all have a great weekend.

 

[cloud9]

Sure, but as you so eloquently put it elsewhere...

I thought the second half of the referenced post was just plain common sense. Some CRNAs will be fantastic, some will suck, some MDs are brilliant, some are idiots. I really can't see why you have issue with the post. That's just the way it is (in my opinion of course). I'm sure you went to school with some folks that you wondered how they got past the admissions committee (I know I did). No reason why medicine (and nursing) will be different from any other walk of life.

 

[nitecap]

Make no mistake, your original sarcasm and your cutting-and-pasting was inflammatory itself. Still don't get your point.

Nevertheless, to clarify:
I said some of the posts were stupid.
I did not mean to imply that CRNAs are stupid, because we all know they are not.

The reason I rudely pointed out that MDs are smarter than most CRNAs:
1. this is an MD thread, so i'm not expecting to hurt anyone's feelings except nitecap's (he's tough, can take it).
2. to encourage med students to go into gas, regardless of the CRNA situation. because its a smaller issue than most med students perceive it to be. this get's blown out of proportion in med school. after med school, the fear and concerns rapidly dwindle.

The original point I'm making was about job security. I don't think the situation is analogous to the out-sourcing in rads. I feel its not so much a job security issue, but more a salary issue. The more power CRNAs have, the more money they make and the less we make. The more power MD/DOs have, the more money we make and the less they make. Is that a good reason to argue: hells yeah.

Y'all have a great weekend.

CRNA's are compensated well b/c there is a large demand for them and thats it. The majority of CRNA's work for MD run anesthesia groups. So that means the majority of CRNA's get paid their larger salaries by you guys. Why? B/c there is big demand. Outpt surg centers popping up all over, MD groups wanting to get that contract requiring more providers to expand the coverage. IT happens in this city everyday. MD groups competing over experienced CRNA's offering great packages, large sign-on bonuses and great salaries.

Two different groups here have mixers at local resturaunts at least quaterly. Free food, drinks ect just to whoo SRNA's to work for them post graduation.

So due to the fact that reimbustments are decreasing which means less extra income for partners, lower pay raises for non partner MD's and staff CRNA's and lower starting salaries for new employees. CRNA's in no way your lower your salary. If anything we increase them since you may supervise 4 at a times and bill for all the cases. You guys really have no freaking clue what you are talking about, its hallarious how uninformed you are and how stupid you sound.

I have heard of no place that CRNA's are stealing jobs from MD's? Its all paranoia.
Few than 10% of the 33,000 practicing CRNA's work as independent contractors. And these independent guys are effected by the same decreases in reimburstments that you are.

You guys preach and preach screw midlevels lets just hire MD's however the MD's that work in large groups want no part of this b/c it will greatly increase their overhead and decrease their salaries.

 

[jetproppilot]

I have heard of no place that CRNA's are stealing jobs from MD's? Its all paranoia.
Few than 10% of the 33,000 practicing CRNA's work as independent contractors..

Sorry Dudes.

Nitecaps on the money with this one.

 

[nitecap]

Lets do an example. Anesthesia group of 10 anesthesiologist and 20 CRNA's

MD salary total - at 300k each = 3million
CRNA salary total at 150k each =3million
total direct expenses via salaries = 6 million

Replace all CRNA's with MD's all at 300k.
Total direct expenses d/t salary = 9 million

This doesnt even include even include indirect expenses that are benefit related.

Thats 3million more in expenses which has to come most likely from this little place called your salary. You guys are freaking out man and really just foaming at the mouth. The crap you preach is the very thing that will infact decrease your salary. As far as reimburstment CRNA's do not effect that directly and lobby against reductions just as the ASA does.

 

[djipopo]

Lets do an example. Anesthesia group of 10 anesthesiologist and 20 CRNA's

MD salary total - at 300k each = 3million
CRNA salary total at 150k each =3million
total direct expenses via salaries = 6 million

Replace all CRNA's with MD's all at 300k.
Total direct expenses d/t salary = 9 million

This doesnt even include even include indirect expenses that are benefit related.

Thats 3million more in expenses which has to come most likely from this little place called your salary. You guys are freaking out man and really just foaming at the mouth. The crap you preach is the very thing that will infact decrease your salary. As far as reimburstment CRNA's do not effect that directly and lobby against reductions just as the ASA does.

First off, I doubt that anything you say has any credence, but even if it did, I would rather see a physician take home a slightly smaller paycheck than to be out of a job because a murse is getting it instead.

 

[stephend7799]

I have heard of no place that CRNA's are stealing jobs from MD's? Its all paranoia.
Few than 10% of the 33,000 practicing CRNA's work as independent contractors. .

the number of independent CRNAs is so high because the oldergeneration has rested on its laurels and let those crnas run amok. Yes 10 percent is HIgh. Would you wanna be living where that 10 percent is practicign independently? I didnt think so..

and the number of independednt crnas is 10 percent but the number of them who wanna be independent is 100 percent.. If you wanna be independent.. go to medical school, do an internship and an anesthesia residency and you wont have an argument from anybody on this board. and you can be as independent as you want.