Just got kicked out of a volunteering gig... how will it affect my application?

[rifle4802]

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I was volunteering at a children's medical center for a few weeks before I started to realize that it wasn't the most productive use of my time. Not only was there very little for me to do there, but it didn't seem like anyone was really keeping tabs on me either. All the employees seemed busy with their work and didn't have the slightest care in the world about what I did. I'm totally cool with them doing their own work, but the point is that there was really nothing for me to do. Also, I was supposed to be there from 1-4 pm once a week.

Eventually it got to a point where I was so sick of this place that I just logged in at 1 pm, left the building and caught a movie or hit up an arcade for a few hours, then just showed back up around 3:50 pm for the last 10 minutes to log my 3 hours in.

I got away with this for a good month or so without anyone noticing/caring... until just last week. Somehow one of the secretaries got wind of what I was doing and told the volunteer coordinator. After putting me on blast in front everyone there (parents, visitors, kids, etc) she told me that I was officially relieved of my duties and said I was never to return again. I countered with a rancorous, expletive-laced comeback of my own and then left.

I'm not too bothered about not being able to return to this specific medical center because I wasn't really gaining any meaningful experience, but how do I go about describing this on my applications, if I do so at all?

I only logged ~20 hours before they kicked me out. Will it look odd if I did a volunteering activity for only 20 hours? Or would I be better off just not putting this activity on my application? Will this tank my chances? I should mention that I already have ~70 hours of clinical volunteering at a separate hospital, which is a currently ongoing activity.

Helpful advice needed here.

 

[claduva94]

That is incredibly dishonest. It calls into question whether the 70 hours you have at the other hospital are legitimate. I would suggest not including it because you didn't earn any of those 20 hours anyway.

 

[BeerZombie]

That is funny. Either put it on the app and just say you quit to pursue another position (unless of course you don't have any other job) or just don't list it at all.

 

[Sean Lee]

Absolutely leave it off your application!

20 hours is too little to include in the first place, and your 20 hours are filled with dishonesty.

 

[Dires]

Forget about the hours. Don't list them on an application or any resume for that matter.

I don't know when you're applying, but it shouldn't affect your application (so long as you don't mention your time there). I would suggest using this as a learning experience for the future. We have all made stupid decisions, but it's important to learn from them.

 

[chillinillinkillin007]

Before you made threads about not having a job and how it'll affect your application and you also posted if it's okay to enter medicine without wanting to help people. Even though I firmly believe you don't need to have a burning desire to help people to enter medicine or you don't need to have a job to show maturity, you are an immature kid. Logging fake hours to go to an arcade? Wtf seriously? And then posting if it's okay to list it on your application? Lol

 

[xffan624]

Just when you think it couldn't get any better, rifle comes through in a clutch. Classic.

 

[BeancheBlanco]

even if I you had an odd sense of morality, I would not include this on your application. It is insignificant and you risk a school contacting your reference and hearing the true story, which would probably be an auto-reject.

 

[rifle4802]

Absolutely leave it off your application!

20 hours is too little to include in the first place, and your 20 hours are filled with dishonesty.

Umm... the 20 hours were legit.

 

[rifle4802]

That is incredibly dishonest. It calls into question whether the 70 hours you have at the other hospital is legitimate. I would suggest not including it because you didn't earn any of those 20 hours anyway.

The 70 hours at the other place are real and like I told the guy above, the 20 hours at this place are legit as well.

 

[claduva94]

The 70 hours at the other place are real and like I told the guy above, the 20 hours at this place are legit as well.

My point is that if they find out why you were dismissed the validity of other hours will be called into question. It is best to not mention it at all.

 

[deleted407021]

Rifle is a known troll. Disregard anything he says.

 

[jared_the_great]

I strongly suggest you include this activity, along with the story, on your app. Just make sure to explain what you did, and why hitting up the arcade while clocked in was clearly a more productive use of your time. Mention how the volunteer coordinator was being completely unreasonable and totally deserved your "rancorous, expletive-laced comeback." Surely adcoms will understand.

 

[Mycoalwin]

Not sure what to think...

 

[lmn]

Ahh the true meaning of a scumbag pre-med

 

[Planes2Doc]

If this story is true, then leave it off your app. The 20 legitimate hours won't help your app. On the contrary, it will actually hurt it because a small number will be very suspicious. You didn't leave the hospital on bad terms... You left it on HORRIBLE terms. Consider yourself lucky that you only ruined 20 hours, and not anymore.

I hope that you manage to find something more meaningful which you will enjoy. If you don't, then utilize that time to study for school, the MCAT, or use it for yourself. Don't do something as dishonest as ditching your shifts.

 

[ThisCouldBeYou]

I strongly suggest you include this activity, along with the story, on your app. Just make sure to explain what you did, and why hitting up the arcade while clocked in was clearly a more productive use of your time. Mention how the volunteer coordinator was being completely unreasonable and totally deserved your "rancorous, expletive-laced comeback." Surely adcoms will understand.

You should totally include this to your application, if haven't done so already. I think the adcoms will agree with you regarding finding a better use of your time. I mean, of course they've thought of doing that. You'll be one of their group. Be sure to mention how you clocked in first before hitting the arcade/movies. They'll be impressed.

Eventually it got to a point where I was so sick of this place that I just logged in at 1 pm, left the building and caught a movie or hit up an arcade for a few hours, then just showed back up around 3:50 pm for the last 10 minutes to log my 3 hours in.

 

[WillburCobb]

It's been a long time, I was wondering what happened to rifle. Anyone want to start bets as to how many people fall for him this time or how many pages this thread will go until it's locked?

 

[Planes2Doc]

It's been a long time, I was wondering what happened to rifle. Anyone want to start bets as to how many people fall for him this time or how many pages this thread will go until it's locked?

Whether this is true or not, we will not know. I can tell that many people on this thread are disgusted by this behavior, and unfortunately, such behavior is pretty common and I'm sure some of your future classmates will have done things like this. 🙁

 

[Gauss44]

Just don't mention that job.

If you need more volunteer hours, get them elsewhere. I don't know why people make a big deal over 100 hours. You could do that a few weeks!

 

[Lawpy]

Whether this is true or not, we will not know. I can tell that many people on this thread are disgusted by this behavior, and unfortunately, such behavior is pretty common and I'm sure some of your future classmates will have done things like this. 🙁

This is what happens when altruism is exploited by premeds and medical school admissions

 

[Planes2Doc]

This is what happens when altruism is exploited by premeds and medical school admissions

Well said... It's a shame that pre-meds have ruined something that's meant to be special.

 

[Sean Lee]

If this story is true, then leave it off your app. The 20 legitimate hours won't help your app. On the contrary, it will actually hurt it because a small number will be very suspicious. You didn't leave the hospital on bad terms... You left it on HORRIBLE terms. Consider yourself lucky that you only ruined 20 hours, and not anymore.

I hope that you manage to find something more meaningful which you will enjoy. If you don't, then utilize that time to study for school, the MCAT, or use it for yourself. Don't do something as dishonest as ditching your shifts.

Really?

I've volunteered across several hospital departments, and I have 40 hours at department A, 80 hours at department B, and 200 hours at department C. Will my 40 hours be suspicious?

 

[Kochanie]

Whether this is true or not, we will not know. I can tell that many people on this thread are disgusted by this behavior, and unfortunately, such behavior is pretty common and I'm sure some of your future classmates will have done things like this. 🙁

Now I feel bad for rounding hours up. 🙁

 

[chillinillinkillin007]

I went to a top 10 medical school and during orientation I was surprised that many of my classmates nonchalantly would admit to adding zeros to the hours they volunteered. Volunteering is dumb if it's just to add to the resume and not to help the needy.

tell me this isn't true...how long ago was this?

 

[Lamel]

Well said... It's a shame that pre-meds have ruined something that's meant to be special.

"Don't hate the player, hate the game."

 

[Planes2Doc]

Really?

I've volunteered across several hospital departments, and I have 40 hours at department A, 80 hours at department B, and 200 hours at department C. Will my 40 hours be suspicious?

Switching between departments in the hospital wouldn't be a big deal. If I were you, I would lump all of these hours together under one big hospital volunteering section on the application. I would mention that you rotated through the different departments.

Now I feel bad for rounding hours up. 🙁

Rounding up isn't a big deal, it's pretty common, and I'm guessing a lot of people don't find this unethical. Embellishing hours is a pretty big grey area, where no one has specifically drawn the line between ethical and unethical. This is entirely different than signing in and ditching, or making up fake experiences all together.

I went to a top 10 medical school and during orientation I was surprised that many of my classmates nonchalantly would admit to adding zeros to the hours they volunteered. Volunteering is dumb if it's just to add to the resume and not to help the needy.

Why am I not surprised? The meaning of volunteering was lost long ago. It hasn't been about helping the needy for probably a few decades, as pre-meds have been using it to help themselves first and foremost.

 

[Planes2Doc]

"Don't hate the player, hate the game."

Exactly. You can't blame pre-meds for the fact that volunteering has become an unwritten requirement. You can blame them, however, for being completely dishonest by either signing in and ditching or completely fabricating fake experiences. I don't blame anyone for gaming the system reasonably and honestly though, such as by utilizing down time to study for class or the MCAT. My rule of thumb is: Be respectful to the staff. Do whatever is asked of you. But do whatever you want during your down time as long as the staff have no issue with it.

With the system in its current state, there's no motivation for pre-meds to be proactive during their volunteer shifts. They are there to help themselves, and there to solely rack up verifiable hours. If ADCOMs and volunteer coordinators want more productive volunteers, there needs to be oversight. Without such oversight, you'll have unproductive volunteers all the way down to people who sign in and ditch, and the pre-meds aren't entirely to blame...

 

[Lamel]

OP this is a pretty scummy thing to do. And then cursing them out as if THEY did something bad. You can't act entitled to be given work as a VOLUNTEER, go around and find something to do, take initiative if you're really that bored.

Exactly. You can't blame pre-meds for the fact that volunteering has become an unwritten requirement. You can blame them, however, for being completely dishonest by either signing in and ditching or completely fabricating fake experiences. I don't blame anyone for gaming the system reasonably and honestly though, such as by utilizing down time to study for class or the MCAT. My rule of thumb is: Be respectful to the staff. Do whatever is asked of you. But do whatever you want during your down time as long as the staff have no issue with it.
With the system in its current state, there's no motivation for pre-meds to be proactive during their volunteer shifts. They are there to help themselves, and there to solely rack up verifiable hours. If ADCOMs and volunteer coordinators want more productive volunteers, there needs to be oversight. Without such oversight, you'll have unproductive volunteers all the way down to people who sign in and ditch, and the pre-meds aren't entirely to blame...

Agreed.

 

[Promethean]

I went to a top 10 medical school and during orientation I was surprised that many of my classmates nonchalantly would admit to adding zeros to the hours they volunteered. Volunteering is dumb if it's just to add to the resume and not to help the needy.

Totally believe this. And no one really checks up on what applicants claim, from what I can tell. At least not systematically. So, I would bet at least 50% of pre-meds inflate their hours at least a little, and that as many as 5% have invented ECs out of thin air. I've noticed that when the competition gets more intense it becomes easier and easier for some folks to lie.

 

[Sean Lee]

Totally believe this. And no one really checks up on what applicants claim, from what I can tell. At least not systematically. So, I would bet at least 50% of pre-meds inflate their hours at least a little, and that as many as 5% have invented ECs out of thin air. I've noticed that when the competition gets more intense it becomes easier and easier for some folks to lie.

That takes some major guts to accomplish...

 

[Promethean]

Most of my volunteer hours happened a few years ago. One of the places that I volunteered for altruistic reasons was overrun with premeds trying to get hours in. They would come and help for three or four weeks and then disappear for good. I'm sure that those 12-16 hours became 120-160 on many applications. That behavior was the reason that, when I decided that I wanted to go to medical school myself, I didn't run out and find fresh volunteer gigs or research opportunities. I really don't want to look like someone who only cares when it pays off. I'd rather explain that no, I didn't volunteer much lately, since I was working more than full time and going to school full time, but that it is something that I did put a lot of hours into before I thought about applying to med schools.

 

[Promethean]

That takes some major guts to accomplish...

Only if you have a conscience.

 

[Lawpy]

Exactly. You can't blame pre-meds for the fact that volunteering has become an unwritten requirement. You can blame them, however, for being completely dishonest by either signing in and ditching or completely fabricating fake experiences. I don't blame anyone for gaming the system reasonably and honestly though, such as by utilizing down time to study for class or the MCAT. My rule of thumb is: Be respectful to the staff. Do whatever is asked of you. But do whatever you want during your down time as long as the staff have no issue with it.

With the system in its current state, there's no motivation for pre-meds to be proactive during their volunteer shifts. They are there to help themselves, and there to solely rack up verifiable hours. If ADCOMs and volunteer coordinators want more productive volunteers, there needs to be oversight. Without such oversight, you'll have unproductive volunteers all the way down to people who sign in and ditch, and the pre-meds aren't entirely to blame...

Volunteering dilemma is one out of many flaws of the existing medical school admissions (and even the AAMC route and this whole 2015 MCAT). There should be a major overhaul.

 

[chillinillinkillin007]

Why doesn't a medical school just hire someone to check the EC's of any applicant they are going to give an acceptance letter. Pay that person checking the EC's minimum wage. This would cost them hardly any money and get rid of all this BS.

 

[Barnosaur]

Why doesn't a medical school just hire someone to check the EC's of any applicant they are going to give an acceptance letter. Pay that person checking the EC's minimum wage. This would cost them hardly any money and get rid of all this BS.

Theoretically isn't that what AMCAS is supposed to do? Obviously they can't check every experience on every application, but don't they do random check-ins or flag things that look suspicious (I would guess if you said so much that you were working 100 hours a week + school your app would be flagged).

 

[chillinillinkillin007]

Theoretically isn't that what AMCAS is supposed to do? Obviously they can't check every experience on every application, but don't they do random check-ins or flag things that look suspicious (I would guess if you said so much that you were working 100 hours a week + school your app would be flagged).

Hell, if AMCAS or ADCOMS aren't gonna do it, I'll do it. Just send a generic email to the volunteer office at the hospital they said they volunteered at and wait for the response. It literally takes 5 seconds.

 

[Kochanie]

Theoretically isn't that what AMCAS is supposed to do? Obviously they can't check every experience on every application, but don't they do random check-ins or flag things that look suspicious (I would guess if you said so much that you were working 100 hours a week + school your app would be flagged).

The problem is if a person lied about having an average amount, it won't seem suspicious to adcoms.

 

[Barnosaur]

Hell, if AMCAS or ADCOMS aren't gonna do it, I'll do it. Just send a generic email to the volunteer office at the hospital they said they volunteered at and wait for the response. It literally takes 5 seconds.

I think you underestimate the incompetence of some office administrators. It will usually take 1 email with a deadline, 1 email after the deadline, and an additional reminder until you get an email that they will need to look further after which you will receive no more information despite the number of emails you send.

 

[Planes2Doc]

Theoretically isn't that what AMCAS is supposed to do? Obviously they can't check every experience on every application, but don't they do random check-ins or flag things that look suspicious (I would guess if you said so much that you were working 100 hours a week + school your app would be flagged).

No. AMCAS only verifies your transcripts and your inputted grades. Everything else is up to ADCOMs. Remember that none of these ECs are actual requirements either.

 

[allantois]

I log all my hours through a verification center of my school and then they get hour confirmations from places where I volunteer and record them on my transcript.

You are lucky that your volunteering cordinator did not make any attempts to contact your school and somehow put a record of your dishonesty. I know a professor who enjoys marking students' transcripts very much.

 

[V5RED]

Based on OP's post history, he is either a troll or a snot nosed punk who very much deserves an ass kicking.

On the topic of cheating your hours, that should be easy enough to solve. I like the system described by @allenlchs . That said, someone who places no value on the health of his soul will always find some way to cheat the system. Personally, it isn't fear of getting caught that keeps me from cheating, rather it would be too shameful and I would have to live with the knowledge that I don't really deserve what I have achieved.

 

[Planes2Doc]

I log all my hours through a verification center of my school and then they get hour confirmations from places where I volunteer and record them on my transcript.

Interesting! It looks like your school is headed in a good direction.

You are lucky that your volunteering cordinator did not make any attempts to contact your school and somehow put a record of your dishonesty. I know a professor who enjoys marking students' transcripts very much.

In regards to the current system in place, it would be ridiculous if volunteer coordinators could do such things. As long as you aren't volunteering on behalf of the school or trying to fulfill graduation requirements, the organization has no right to tell your school, employer, family, friends, or anyone else of your dishonesty. But if a universal reporting system were in place, then yes, they would be able to tell someone. It's unethical for them to do something like that otherwise!

 

[milski]

Why doesn't a medical school just hire someone to check the EC's of any applicant they are going to give an acceptance letter. Pay that person checking the EC's minimum wage. This would cost them hardly any money and get rid of all this BS.

Or maybe get volunteers to do it... and they could put it on their applications later. 😉

 

[chillinillinkillin007]

Or maybe get volunteers to do it... and they could put on their applications later. 😉

yessssss

 

[Planes2Doc]

Or maybe get volunteers to do it... and they could put on their applications later. 😉

 

[milski]

If it was not a huge conflict of interest, I can imagine that AMCAS could use a few people during the application season to speed things up and make the process a lot less stressful.

 

[Planes2Doc]

If it was not a huge conflict of interest, I can imagine that AMCAS could use a few people during the application season to speed things up and make the process a lot less stressful.

I agree with you. But you're talking about transcript verification, right? As for ECs, they have no responsibility over that. As far as anyone is concerned, there is no such thing as an official volunteering requirement.

Currently, schools should do random checks on applicants, and make it known that they do them. These checks should be done regardless of how Kosher or suspicious an activity is. This should scare applicants into being truthful. It's sad that these kinds of measures need to be taken. 😳

 

[milski]

I agree with you. But you're talking about transcript verification, right? As for ECs, they have no responsibility over that. As far as anyone is concerned, there is no such thing as an official volunteering requirement.

Currently, schools should do random checks on applicants, and make it known that they do them. These checks should be done regardless of how Kosher or suspicious an activity is. This should scare applicants into being truthful. It's sad that these kinds of measures need to be taken. 😳

I was talking about transcript vrfy in the second post, the initial joke was about AMCAS using volunteers to check activities entries. It would make sense for them to do it, since that would avoid the duplicated efforts of each school.

I suspect that there is balancing attitude on the side of the medical schools where they tend to marginalize the importance of activities which are hard to verify or happen to be often exaggerated on applications.

In a similar anecdote, I remember interviewing applicants in my previous job who claimed to have 10+ years of experience with a programming language which has been around for no more than 2-3 years. Then again, at the same time you could find job ads looking for people with that much experience, so the "balance" was already there. 😀

 

[EDMPrincesss]

Who actually does 4 hours of work when volunteering? Even when I volunteer in a clinic, I'm usually done early and start late, yet the staff is perfectly fine with us staying until whatever time we were supposed to end.