No, the institution is not obligated to find anyone a new program. Usually PDs in this situation will try their best, but there is no contractual provision. Welcome to 21st century America.😡
King/Drew To Close
- Thread starter GeneralVeers
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No, the institution is not obligated to find anyone a new program. Usually PDs in this situation will try their best, but there is no contractual provision. Welcome to 21st century America.😡
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This is obviously a bad situation for hte residents, and I do feel badly for them.
HOWEVER, King/Drew is the one of the worst hospitals in america and should be closed. The people who run that institution are complete idiots. Far too many of them are affirmative action hires "from the community" and people who would never be allowed to run any other hospital.
Harbor/UCLA taking over wont solve the problem either, because they dont have the balls to kick out the hardliners who are still installed at King/Drew. Furthermore, if Harbor/UCLA tries to do the right thing and clean house, the local community idiots who have propagated this disaster will start screaming RACISM and stage riots in teh street.
Every single time that King/Drew has been encouraged to change its ways, everybody screamed racism and nothing changed in that culture of corruption.
I guarantee you unless UCLA fires everybody at the leadership positions in that hospital and starts from scratch, in 2 years we will see another LA times multi part series on how King/Drew is killing patients right and left.
HOWEVER, King/Drew is the one of the worst hospitals in america and should be closed. The people who run that institution are complete idiots. Far too many of them are affirmative action hires "from the community" and people who would never be allowed to run any other hospital.
Harbor/UCLA taking over wont solve the problem either, because they dont have the balls to kick out the hardliners who are still installed at King/Drew. Furthermore, if Harbor/UCLA tries to do the right thing and clean house, the local community idiots who have propagated this disaster will start screaming RACISM and stage riots in teh street.
Every single time that King/Drew has been encouraged to change its ways, everybody screamed racism and nothing changed in that culture of corruption.
I guarantee you unless UCLA fires everybody at the leadership positions in that hospital and starts from scratch, in 2 years we will see another LA times multi part series on how King/Drew is killing patients right and left.
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Some developments on the situation:
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-kingdrew3oct03,0,3836783.story?page=1&coll=la-home-local
Essentially they are going to restructure the hospital, which means residency training there will probably cease. They claim that "emergency services will remain open". It's a mystery to me how they plan to do that without residents.
The GME director sent a letter to all residents and PDs yesterday, essentially saying she's developing a plan for placement.
This is good news, as it means they've finally realized they may have to give up. With Harbor, USC, UCLA, and Loma Linda, hopefully they'll be able to place everyone in L.A., at least for EM. We have 36 residents total.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-kingdrew3oct03,0,3836783.story?page=1&coll=la-home-local
Essentially they are going to restructure the hospital, which means residency training there will probably cease. They claim that "emergency services will remain open". It's a mystery to me how they plan to do that without residents.
The GME director sent a letter to all residents and PDs yesterday, essentially saying she's developing a plan for placement.
This is good news, as it means they've finally realized they may have to give up. With Harbor, USC, UCLA, and Loma Linda, hopefully they'll be able to place everyone in L.A., at least for EM. We have 36 residents total.
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I think they plan to hire a consultant from Duke Family Medicine.
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Good to have an actual decision.
BTW, I wouldn't rely on the GME director. She doens't exactly have a great track record for her effectiveness.
If I were you, I'd start to make my own inquiries, and keep an ear out for what happens next.
BTW, I wouldn't rely on the GME director. She doens't exactly have a great track record for her effectiveness.
If I were you, I'd start to make my own inquiries, and keep an ear out for what happens next.
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I'm not relying on our GME director. She's looking out for her own job. The ACGME should be able to give us some direction. The County Board just made a decision today, and have stated that all residency training at KDMC will cease by December 1, 2006. Some outpatient-based programs like Peds, FM and Optho may continue as residencies under Drew, but EM cannot possibly continue.
I've already made inquiries, and the job outlook is bleak. The only open spot in a 3-year program is LSU-Baton Rouge.
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Dude. Go to Baton Rouge. The program is awesome. I would have given a testicle and half of my considerable genital length to match there. I am from Louisiana, of course, so I may be a little biased but Baton Rouge is a nice town, the traffic is not as bad as LA, and they know how to party down there.
It is true that they are based out of Earl K. Long which is a pretty crappy hospital in the worst part of town with an exclusively indigent patient base and no real specialist support but that is a plus for EM training (in my opinion). They actually do half of their ED months at Baton Rouge General which is a typical fair to middling size community hospital with most of the amenities and is a really a lot nicer than many hospitals in the state.
It is hot as blazes there, of course, but you will work in air-conditioning so it shouldn't matter. There is also a lot of night-life in Baton Rouge and despite the recent hurricane, the housing is still affordable.
I repeat. Give thier PD a call. You will love it if you are lucky enough to get a spot.
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When I say "considerable genital length" I am, of course, speaking of the metric system where every man is a giant.
Perhaps the only advantage I can see for the "centimeter."
Perhaps the only advantage I can see for the "centimeter."
What, humility? What happened to "MATCH THIS!"
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Check your contract. When I was there I seem to remember a clause regarding "in the event that a program closes" and transfers to ajoining programs. You may find that the LA county contract entitles you to a little bit more than the usual contract. If I remember right they are supposed to find you something in the county then region then finally US in the event if a program is to close. As far as the GME director; I wouldn't trust her at all. I had to leave for family reasons and the minute she found out I had been accepted at another program and had gotten a positive letter of rec from the program director at king drew she demanded that the department fire me before I leave. Start making plans. If it gets ugly get a lawyer. The place is so crooked that you may actually need it if they don't set up a clear exit strategy for the residents.
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Just like everywhere else, the best job opportunities of residency are never posted. They are created.
There wasn't an opening for me when I transferred. I called the PD directly and he made a spot for me. (hopefully he doesn't regret that decision now...🙂
Especially in your situation, I'm certain there will be many PDs willing to stretch an extra spot or two for you to finish your training. Email every PD for every program you're willing to go to and tell them your plight. You'll get some responses.
There wasn't an opening for me when I transferred. I called the PD directly and he made a spot for me. (hopefully he doesn't regret that decision now...🙂
Especially in your situation, I'm certain there will be many PDs willing to stretch an extra spot or two for you to finish your training. Email every PD for every program you're willing to go to and tell them your plight. You'll get some responses.
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Denial. Apparently, it is endemic there and, I'd guess, part of the problem that got them into this mess.
If I were interviewing this year, I'd pass on that particular interview.
Take care,
Jeff
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Let me correct myself.
I'd go ahead and interview if it were early in the season. You'll appreciate the practice and, if nothing else, you'll have lots to talk about.
Interviewing at a place only can increase your options, not decrease them.
Unless, of course, your discussion your options of putting that money to better use. Then I'll stick with my original comment. 🙂
Take care,
Jeff
PS, General, keep us up to date. Good luck!
I'd go ahead and interview if it were early in the season. You'll appreciate the practice and, if nothing else, you'll have lots to talk about.
Interviewing at a place only can increase your options, not decrease them.
Unless, of course, your discussion your options of putting that money to better use. Then I'll stick with my original comment. 🙂
Take care,
Jeff
PS, General, keep us up to date. Good luck!
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All residencies at King/Drew are postponing interviews until after November. At that point we should know which residencies will still exist, and where.
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I've talked to the dean and the chair at my program and we may be able to open up one or two spots for KDMC EM residents at Stony Brook.
I'll keep you updated.
beyond
I'll keep you updated.
beyond
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In the latest news of our ongoing drama at KDMC, our program director has been in contact with several local hospitals (which do not have residencies) to absorb the KDMC residency. He's made a tentative agreement with California Hospital (a very nice, private level I trauma center) to take on our residents, and presumably some of our "academic" faculty.
We'll be having our next conference day at this facility, so they can scope us out.
Any comments on the viability of this plan? (program director input appreciated)
We'll be having our next conference day at this facility, so they can scope us out.
Any comments on the viability of this plan? (program director input appreciated)
I'll pm you.
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I don't know if this is possible, but have you considered speaking with the PDs at the UF-Gainsville or Las Vegas programs? They're both new so they won't have any senior residents. Could some of your senior residents transfer to those programs? It sucks that this is happening. Good luck.
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--sp
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We've contacted Las Vegas at all levels (PD, residents, etc) however, they are not willing to take on 2nd and 3rd years at this point. It has to do with the fact that they are technically on probation as a new residency, and don't yet have everything in place to train upper level residents. The program director at Las Vegas trained at King/Drew, so she is sympathetic to our cause. I would imagine that Gainsville would similarly be unable to take any residents.
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Any word on what the latest is here? As far as the hospital AND residency?
All I can say is the county's prehospital care system better be ready for some looong waits in the ER when all these LA ERs close their doors...
All I can say is the county's prehospital care system better be ready for some looong waits in the ER when all these LA ERs close their doors...
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The LA hospital system is in dire straights right now. With the downsizing of king, and the closing of the Daniel Freeman ER, there are extremely limited options for most of South and South-Central LA. Additionally the county hosptial system, especially Harbor-UCLA may be crushed under the burden.
The fate of the hospital and the fate of our residency have been separated, and essentially do not effect each other any more.
I'll start with the hospital. LA County has approved a plan to downsize the hospital from approximately 200 beds, to 48 beds and plan to move most of the subspecialty services to Harbor-UCLA, which itself is already an overburdened hospital. MLK will be renamed King-Harbor, and be transitioned to the managment of of Harbor-UCLA between December and March. Eventually supposing the management has stabilized, they plan to gradually regain services, and expand the outpatient component of the hospital. Exactly how they plan to run the hospital and keep the ER open without residents is a mystery to me. LA County contract EM physicians get approximately $120 per hour, and no attendings I've talked to are willing to stay here for that pay level without residents.
As for the residency, DHS and ACGME have both stated that they want all residents out of the hospital on December 1st. Last week Drew University finally threw in the towel, and said they will withdraw all residency programs by July 1st, with the intention of gradually restoring them in 2008 (however I can bet this will never happen). That means all of the ER residents will be placed in a new program for July 1st, if they haven't found another position. All of the programs have submitted "transitional plans" to ACGME, designed to bridge the period between December 1st and July 1st when we don't have a training center. Our current plan is to rotate residents through Cedar-Sinai, California Hospital, Children's LA, and Riverside hospital. This plan is still pending RRC approval. If they decide to not approve the plan, it could mean immediate closure and placement of all EM residents in December/January. Unfortunately LA County and ACGME are all reluctant to make any kind of decision. Currently ACGME is waiting for LA County to decide if they will pay us through July 1 (despite our 1-year legally binding contracts). LA County keeps putting of that decision, and thus RRC keeps putting off theres. In theory if county illegally decides to cut off our pay after December 1, we cannot rotate at any outside hospitals, as we will have no salary, benefits, malpractice, etc. That would mean immediate closure of the residency and placement. It's an extremely frustrating scenario, because December 1st is coming up awfully quickly, and L.A. County (and ACGME) are dragging their feet, and potentially making it more difficult to place all of us.
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As a Harbor-UCLA ER resident, I can say that we have all been following the events of King very closely. We have already seen a drastic increase in patient numbers in the ER (the word about MLK has definitely spread quickly among the community and EMS services.) There are times in which the hospital, and therefore ER, are so packed that we have to see, workup, and discharge patients from the waiting room. All of the Harbor big wigs are still at the drawing tables trying to make sure the entire healthcare safety net of LA county does not come completely unraveled before our eyes.
As for funding of MLK, CMS announced last week or so that they would continue funding the hospital up through March. GV, this additional $$ should help you guys stay on board at King for a little while longer, right? 😕
As for funding of MLK, CMS announced last week or so that they would continue funding the hospital up through March. GV, this additional $$ should help you guys stay on board at King for a little while longer, right? 😕
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No, the CMS funding doesn't give us an extension. DHS has stated they want us out by December, because they feel that having residents present at the hospital adds an additional level of "complexity" that they don't want. Additionally ACGME has stated that they don't want us training there after December 1st. Potentially the CMS funding through March could give us some extra time, but both DHS and ACGME would have to approve it, which would be unlikely. Honestly I don't want to stay here past December, because we will have limited ability to admit patients, and no subspecialty services, which means I'd be spending my whole shift doing transfer paperwork, and babysitting patients pending transfer. This would not contribute to my education or experience at all.
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Wasn't sure if there was a more recent thread on this (I did a search)....but...yup, it happened. Patients are now being shipped farther out of the area, which I'm sure will put a strain on St. Francis, Gardena Memorial, Harbor, etc
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