Leave law school for pharmacy school?

[coldfeetJD]

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Hi all,

I am about to begin law school in a month, but am having some pretty cold feet about law school in general. The economy has hit the law field particularly hard, and there is a serious oversupply of lawyers. I believe around 15,000 new JDs each year are unable to find a job and the recent graduates of law school have had a 20% decrease in their average salary. It's not uncommon for some grads to come out with 150k debt and getting stuck with a 40k a year job. Typically, you need to be top 1/3 of class to get a decent job.

All of this brings me here. I was thinking about withdrawing from law school before I start, and actually head into pharmacy. I have a BS in Biology, and the only prerequisite I need I believe is organic chemistry 2. I'd have to relearn pretty much all of the chemistry again, but I think I could pick it up easily. I also have a science GPA of 3.53.

I've heard some things about oversupply of pharmacists, but I was wonder what you guys think I should do in this situation. I've always loved science, and pharmacy seems like a stable career option, especially with the ongoing retirements of the baby boomers. I'm just really not sure whether to just suck it up and attend or go through an entirely different path. I am 24 now, so it may not be until 30 that I graduate from pharm school. Any advice? Thanks!

 

[BMBiology]

Generally speaking, pharmacists' starting salary is higher than lawyers but there is a ceiling. The two professions are very different. You will be playing more of a supporting role as a pharmacist. I highly suggest that you do some shadowing before you decide to change career.

 

[armorking]

Hi all,

I am about to begin law school in a month at Emory Law, but am having some pretty cold feet about law school in general. The economy has hit the law field particularly hard, and there is a serious oversupply of lawyers. I believe around 15,000 new JDs each year are unable to find a job and the recent graduates of law school have had a 20% decrease in their average salary. It's not uncommon for some grads to come out with 150k debt and getting stuck with a 40k a year job.

All of this brings me here. I was thinking about withdrawing from law school before I start, and actually head into pharmacy. I have a BS in Biology, and the only prerequisite I need I believe is organic chemistry 2. I'd have to relearn pretty much all of the chemistry again, but I think I could pick it up easily. I also have a science GPA of 3.53. I'm also 24 if that matters.

I've heard some things about oversupply of pharmacists, but I was wonder what you guys think I should do in this situation. I've always loved science, and pharmacy seems like a stable career option, especially with the ongoing retirements of the baby boomers. Any advice? Thanks!

I made the jump from researcher to pharmacy and I am happy about my choice. If you want to make the switch, you look like you're in good shape gpa-wise. Age ain't nothing but a number IMO, and pharmacy is still a profession with options. I understand your doubts about law school and job security in the future. I was worried about my own prospects as a researcher but I wanted to add pharmacy to enhance my overall profile and learn more about the profession. Working at a pharmacy solidified my choice and I'm about to start my first year. Definitely look into shadowing/working at a pharmacy to make sure this is what you want to do. There are many other pharmacy students/pharmacists with way more experience on this forum than I (and tip my hat to) but these are my two cents.

 

[mustang sally]

I think it's pretty hard to pick a stable career in this economy, so I would pick something that you will love to do instead. And definitely don't take on a lot of student debt for a career you won't love (or at least tolerate) doing everyday!

 

[Chris co2012]

In retrospect, I wish I had chose the career "Billionaire."

 

[armorking]

In retrospect, I wish I had chose the career "Billionaire."

👍 This made me chuckle!

 

[PharMed2016]

Hi all,

I am about to begin law school in a month at Emory Law, but am having some pretty cold feet about law school in general. The economy has hit the law field particularly hard, and there is a serious oversupply of lawyers. I believe around 15,000 new JDs each year are unable to find a job and the recent graduates of law school have had a 20% decrease in their average salary. It's not uncommon for some grads to come out with 150k debt and getting stuck with a 40k a year job. Typically, you need to be top 1/3 of class to get a decent job.

All of this brings me here. I was thinking about withdrawing from law school before I start, and actually head into pharmacy. I have a BS in Biology, and the only prerequisite I need I believe is organic chemistry 2. I'd have to relearn pretty much all of the chemistry again, but I think I could pick it up easily. I also have a science GPA of 3.53.

I've heard some things about oversupply of pharmacists, but I was wonder what you guys think I should do in this situation. I've always loved science, and pharmacy seems like a stable career option, especially with the ongoing retirements of the baby boomers. I'm just really not sure whether to just suck it up and attend or go through an entirely different path. I am 24 now, so it may not be until 30 that I graduate from pharm school. Any advice? Thanks!

If I was in your position, I would start law school and work my ass the next three years of school to do well. I just looked up Emory Law - its top 30 by US News and World which means its top ranked considering there are close to 200 law schools in the US. You may start off low comparatively - 40k but your room for advancement is beyond most pharmacist since we hit our ceiling once we leave school. In addition, I suspect in the next couple of years... especially by your anticipated graduation - your going to see the same thing in pharmacy as in law.

Just my 0.02.

 

[PharmD1988]

If I was in your position, I would start law school and work my ass the next three years of school to do well. I just looked up Emory Law - its top 30 by US News and World which means its top ranked considering there are close to 200 law schools in the US. You may start off low comparatively - 40k but your room for advancement is beyond most pharmacist since we hit our ceiling once we leave school. In addition, I suspect in the next couple of years... especially by your anticipated graduation - your going to see the same thing in pharmacy as in law.

Just my 0.02.

if pharmacy school is the next law school, is it possible some of the pharmacists with the better experience/rotations/residencies/ etc get a higher tier salary sort of like how it is in law (top 10 law school = 150k+)? whereas some of the pharmacists in a lower tier school/APPE rotation/residency would have a lower salary.

or it could be a worse case scenario where no matter what pharmacy school/rotation/residency you go through you still end up with a low salary. sort of like what it is today minus the six-figure salary. just got to hope for the best case scenario

 

[1ive2die]

if pharmacy school is the next law school, is it possible some of the pharmacists with the better experience/rotations/residencies/ etc get a higher tier salary sort of like how it is in law (top 10 law school = 150k+)? whereas some of the pharmacists in a lower tier school/APPE rotation/residency would have a lower salary.

or it could be a worse case scenario where no matter what pharmacy school/rotation/residency you go through you still end up with a low salary. sort of like what it is today minus the six-figure salary. just got to hope for the best case scenario

There is a difference between pharmacy and law. Lawyers are paid a premium for their skills/competency/experience. In this sense lawyers are highly differentiated from one another. A great lawyer may be paid several hundreds of thousands while a terrible lawyer may barely make 40k. Pharmacists on the other hand are more like commodities (not necessarily in a bad way) where no one is really willing to pay a significant premium for things like education/experience etc. Also most retail pharmacists are essentially interchangeable because all pharmacists are expected to provide a certain level of professional service and as long as that service is provided there is little difference where that person went to school or how long they've been practicing.

So essentially I don't think pharmacy will ever become tiered, rather if salaries are meant to increase, they'll increase for everyone and if they are meant to decrease they'll decrease for everyone.

 

[PharmD1988]

There is a difference between pharmacy and law. Lawyers are paid a premium for their skills/competency/experience. In this sense lawyers are highly differentiated from one another. A great lawyer may be paid several hundreds of thousands while a terrible lawyer may barely make 40k. Pharmacists on the other hand are more like commodities (not necessarily in a bad way) where no one is really willing to pay a significant premium for things like education/experience etc. Also most retail pharmacists are essentially interchangeable because all pharmacists are expected to provide a certain level of professional service and as long as that service is provided there is little difference where that person went to school or how long they've been practicing.

So essentially I don't think pharmacy will ever become tiered, rather if salaries are meant to increase, they'll increase for everyone and if they are meant to decrease they'll decrease for everyone.

good points. well I hope it doesn't decrease then.

 

[jnmnh]

I might disagree a little. A retail pharmacist might be interchangeable with a new C-average grad. But I would think for a residency-trained clinical pharmacist or a hospital pharmacy administrator, there is a larger difference in desirability between a minimally-adequate person and a highly competent one.

If salaries do not keep pace with inflation, therefore, the effect might be one of retail salaries lagging down to match clinical salaries. That's just the scenario in my own head, fwiw.

 

[PharmaTope]

I might disagree a little. A retail pharmacist might be interchangeable with a new C-average grad. But I would think for a residency-trained clinical pharmacist or a hospital pharmacy administrator, there is a larger difference in desirability between a minimally-adequate person and a highly competent one.

If salaries do not keep pace with inflation, therefore, the effect might be one of retail salaries lagging down to match clinical salaries. That's just the scenario in my own head, fwiw.

and you guys talk like there are 100s of jobs like that. you seem to forget there are how many pharmacists that graduate years ahead of you and behind you?

there are how many pharmacy administrator jobs available at EACH HOSPITAL? how many new hospitals are being opened?

lol, honestly, leaving law to do pharmacy isnt a good decision. there is major pharmacist surplus now as well. its the new law school to be honest. salaries will drop and definitely not keep up with inflation.

 

[coldfeetJD]

thanks for all the advice, i didn't know the pharmacy surplus was going to be that bad. i think i'll plan to bust my butt off in law school, and if that doesn't work out, i may try my hand at pharmacy school afterwards and do patent law. it sounds like a daunting amount of schooling, but you gotta do what you gotta do i guess.

 

[lorain]

if you are emory you should be fine

just contact well and i think an emory grad can find jobs

 

[PharMed2016]

👍

thanks for all the advice, i didn't know the pharmacy surplus was going to be that bad. i think i'll plan to bust my butt off in law school, and if that doesn't work out, i may try my hand at pharmacy school afterwards and do patent law. it sounds like a daunting amount of schooling, but you gotta do what you gotta do i guess.

Good choice. 👍

 

[lorain]

thanks for all the advice, i didn't know the pharmacy surplus was going to be that bad. i think i'll plan to bust my butt off in law school, and if that doesn't work out, i may try my hand at pharmacy school afterwards and do patent law. it sounds like a daunting amount of schooling, but you gotta do what you gotta do i guess.

honestly, to be successful from now on in pharm, youre gonna need pharm school, a residency, and probably a 2nd degree....so thats like 8 years right there

hardwork is going to be required either way

 

[jnmnh]

and you guys talk like there are 100s of jobs like that. you seem to forget there are how many pharmacists that graduate years ahead of you and behind you?

there are how many pharmacy administrator jobs available at EACH HOSPITAL? how many new hospitals are being opened?

I don't suggest half the jobs out there are clinical pharm or admin. But they are out there, and it's just absurd to hear people post that such jobs are "unicorns." It's a lot like how $150k starting salaries for lawyers are "unicorns" with all the unemployed third-tier graduates. I have a close friend at BU Law who caught the unicorn and a close friend who is job hunting out of a third-tier.

I don't talk like there are a ton of those jobs. But those jobs are there for top candidates. I guess its a matter of making yourself a top candidate.

And I agree with Lorain, when I started pre-req'ing for pharm I wasn't aware a residency would be basically required for a great job. But I'm in it, so I'm in it to win it.

 

[Shnurek]

I enjoy reading other SDN forums to see how things are in other professions as well. Check out the optometry forums. Many optos can't even fill their schedules with patients and take crappy vision insurance plans that pay $30 per eye exam just to get a warm body in their exam chair. Just reiterates the point that its better to do what you love than worry about oversupply in this bad economy. Also, if you enjoy physics go opto (4 years + 1 year optional residency). If you enjoy organic go pharm.

 

[PharmaTope]

if pharmacy school is the next law school, is it possible some of the pharmacists with the better experience/rotations/residencies/ etc get a higher tier salary sort of like how it is in law (top 10 law school = 150k+)? whereas some of the pharmacists in a lower tier school/APPE rotation/residency would have a lower salary.

or it could be a worse case scenario where no matter what pharmacy school/rotation/residency you go through you still end up with a low salary. sort of like what it is today minus the six-figure salary. just got to hope for the best case scenario

lol NO. thing is, you cannot be THE BEST pharmacist. the skills a pharmacist does are not highly sought after by the public.

a great lawyer can name his price for a client and they will pay it. look at OJ's lawyers and Casey anthony's attorney. they will charge an arm and a leg. pharmacists do what other pharmacists do. plain and simple. in law at least you can become one of the best, it is hard, but you can

 

[PharmaTope]

I don't suggest half the jobs out there are clinical pharm or admin. But they are out there, and it's just absurd to hear people post that such jobs are "unicorns." It's a lot like how $150k starting salaries for lawyers are "unicorns" with all the unemployed third-tier graduates. I have a close friend at BU Law who caught the unicorn and a close friend who is job hunting out of a third-tier.

I don't talk like there are a ton of those jobs. But those jobs are there for top candidates. I guess its a matter of making yourself a top candidate.

And I agree with Lorain, when I started pre-req'ing for pharm I wasn't aware a residency would be basically required for a great job. But I'm in it, so I'm in it to win it.

they post them as "clinical" but they are not clinical jobs. you will come to find that they post staffing postions as "clinical". admin jobs want 5-8 yrs experience with previous as a manager to even look at your app. then consider who you are up against. not gonna happen to tell you the truth.

 

[jnmnh]

edit, not worth fighting this, don't want to further derail the thread.

But to OP, the basic point is that you need to look at the conditions in each job market (as you seem to be) and determine what the effort needed and the odds are of getting to where you would like to be in a given career.

 

[Lubeckd]

op, why dont you do PharmD/J.D? some schools offer it.

 

[Quiksilver]

I might disagree a little. A retail pharmacist might be interchangeable with a new C-average grad. But I would think for a residency-trained clinical pharmacist or a hospital pharmacy administrator, there is a larger difference in desirability between a minimally-adequate person and a highly competent one.

If salaries do not keep pace with inflation, therefore, the effect might be one of retail salaries lagging down to match clinical salaries. That's just the scenario in my own head, fwiw.

I don't know if you know what you are talking about. There are zero jobs out there and a limited number of residencies. LOL if you think you can even apply to a hospital and get in with a job. This is coming from a guy who worked in a hospital, won a national award for his research project and has two accepted publications and two more that are in review. I am not a "C-average" grad but retail is what I ended up in. Maybe you shouldn't be so ignorant.

op, why dont you do PharmD/J.D? some schools offer it.

This. Although you usually are enrolled in pharmacy school first. I think you get involved in this you set yourself up to make a lot of money.

 

[tungsten87]

I don't know if you know what you are talking about. There are zero jobs out there and a limited number of residencies. LOL if you think you can even apply to a hospital and get in with a job. This is coming from a guy who worked in a hospital, won a national award for his research project and has two accepted publications and two more that are in review. I am not a "C-average" grad but retail is what I ended up in. Maybe you shouldn't be so ignorant.



This. Although you usually are enrolled in pharmacy school first. I think you get involved in this you set yourself up to make a lot of money.

There are plenty of people on this forum and that I know from my school who got hospital jobs without residencies and some even without hospital experience.

Edit: I shouldn't say plenty. It's actually probably rare but it does happen.

 

[owlegrad]

There are plenty of people on this forum and that I know from my school who got hospital jobs without residencies and some even without hospital experience.

Edit: I shouldn't say plenty. It's actually probably rare but it does happen.

Same.

 

[type b pharmD]

Same.

Same. I have not ever even worked with a residency trained pharmacist at a hospital, and the handful of other pharmacy students ive known who have graduated in the last couple of years, several went on to employment at a hospital (without residency training)