LECOM vs. NSUCOM

[810390]

Hey SDN physicians,

First of all I'd like to thank you for reading and considering answering my thread. A high school senior, I applied for BS/DO programs, performed interviews successfully at LECOM and NSUCOM, and am trying hard to select between the two. My peers, parents, and instructors are not knowledgable, so I'm asking for your valuable opinion. If you were accepted to BS/DO programs for both LECOM and NSUCOM as a HS senior, which one would you select?

Under the premises:
1. Being enrolled in such dual admissions can lead one to medical school in less time, expenses, and stress. In this program, I'll be able to maintain a sharp focus on undergraduate studies, and not have to spend another extensive period of time researching, worrying, and applying for colleges of osteopathic medicine.
2. LECOM's 3+4 and 4+4 require 3.4 cGPA and 3.2 sGPA. MCAT test scores not required for matriculation. However, aside med prerequisites, you must also take Biochemistry and Genetics, and earn a "C" or higher.
3. NSUCOM's 3+4 and 4+4 require a 3.3 cGPA. No sGPA minimum specified, but in prerequisite courses you must earn a "C+" or higher. MCAT required; minimum score is 502.
4. Both programs, while guaranteeing graduate matriculation if the minimum requirements are met, are not binding. If I exceed my expectations and reach a competitive GPA and MCAT score at the level for a possibly successful application toPCOM, NYCOM, A.T. Still COM etc., and mid-tier MD Schools, I may attempt those.
5. Multiple scholarship inquiries and interviews made at LECOM-affiliated undergraduate schools as well as NSU. NSU's cost of attendance lowered to around $6,000 a year. For a LECOM-affiliated university, I lowered it to around $13,000 a year.

If you were in my shoes, which program would you choose?
Thanks a lot!

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[Drrrrrr. Celty]

You're going to get a lot of mixed responses here tbh. My belief on the matter is that if you had the gpa and sat/act to get accepted to a BS/DO program then you're probably capable of doing well at a normal undergrad and doing the normal route of applying to medical schools at a point where you are more able to know that you are interested in being a doctor. Chances are it'll also be cheaper.

But if you are going to choose to go down this path, I would recommend thinking it through financially and really debating long and hard whether you want to be a doctor. And I mean really whether it is for you. Because if you're just interested in this for the sake of it being an academic challenge or because your parents told you, then you're going to find yourself miserable.


This should be moved to pre-osteo however.

 

[GOHOGS!]

I'm in my last semester before entering LECOM through the 3+4 program. Keep in mind you have to have a 123 ais score to do the entering into the medical school (this is around a 29 ACT and 3.6 GPA). Overall the program is solid and LECOM is a solid/affordable way to go. That being said, make sure you're ok going the DO route and going to one of their affiliate schools. Feel free to PM if you have any questions.


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[AnatomyGrey12]

I wouldn't do a BS/DO. Go to normal undergrad, dominate, matriculate to a baller MD school, win big. If you are capable of getting into this program then you are definitely capable of at least doing well enough in undergrad to get into LECOM or NSU the normal route. I wouldn't pidgeonhole yourself so early on in your academic career.

 

[hallowmann]

It really doesn't matter. Chances are you would get into LECOM with the requirements for the NSU program, and probably vice versa (plus the MCAT I suppose). If neither are binding and you want to go to those undergrad schools anyway, I'd go to the cheapest one you could. You don't need extra debt to get to the same place. Either way, I'd still apply by the end of it to other med schools (i.e. US MD and DO).

 

[doing_all_the_things]

I strongly recommend that you do neither and go on to an undergraduate institution. Apply to both DO and MD programs when the time comes and see where you end up. If you HAD to choose between NSU and LECOM then I would recommend NSU. My experience with LECOM-B has been exclusively negative and I can only imagine how terrible a BS/DO degree would be. The school is not a good value when you compare how much you are paying to how much you are getting back.

 

[810390]

Thanks for your suggestions people!

 

[Ravizzle]

Go to the cheapest one

 

[OMS398563]

In my humble opinion going to either of these programs would be a huge mistake. Go to the best (affordable) undergraduate institution you are accepted to and work your butt off. Shadow tons of doctors and look into both Allopathic and Osteopathic Medicine. If you like the idea of DOs and have an inclination toward primary care apply DO! If you do remotely well in undergrad you will certainly get in. If you love vascular surgery or want a more established clinical experience go MD. There is NO reason to commit yourself right now--especially considering how in flux medicine and Osteopathic Medicine in particular is.

While DO =/= primary care, the reality is certain doors WILL be closed to you should you become an OMS. Be absolutely sure these doors are not important to be before you take the leap.

 

[Geraltofrivia]

I wouldn't go to NSU lol. All I'm going to say about that.

I will now echo what everybody else is saying. Screw BS/DO. Bust your butt, get your BS with top grades, crush the MCAT and then go to MD school. Or be smart and avoid medical school entirely

 

[810390]

I wouldn't go to NSU lol. All I'm going to say about that.

I will now echo what everybody else is saying. Screw BS/DO. Bust your butt, get your BS with top grades, crush the MCAT and then go to MD school. Or be smart and avoid medical school entirely

Thanks for your post! But can't tell if trolling on the last part. Difficult life as a M1?

For other posters, are you thinking that the program is binding? It's just a medical seat guarantee for undergrads that meet the minimum requirements. We can apply out after the 3rd/4th year if the stats I build are impressive for schools that are better established compared NSUCOM.

In my humble opinion going to either of these programs would be a huge mistake. Go to the best (affordable) undergraduate institution you are accepted to and work your butt off. Shadow tons of doctors and look into both Allopathic and Osteopathic Medicine. If you like the idea of DOs and have an inclination toward primary care apply DO! If you do remotely well in undergrad you will certainly get in. If you love vascular surgery or want a more established clinical experience go MD. There is NO reason to commit yourself right now--especially considering how in flux medicine and Osteopathic Medicine in particular is.

While DO =/= primary care, the reality is certain doors WILL be closed to you should you become an OMS. Be absolutely sure these doors are not important to be before you take the leap.

Thanks. Primary care sounds like a fulfilling career, but I'm also considering anes, IM-Onc Fellow, and radio.

By your experience, even if I hold impressive COMLEX and USMLE scores, will it be much harder to land the above mentioned specialty matches as an osteopath?

 

[aDOdoctor]

As a DO student graduating very shortly, I would highly advise you to go the MD route if given the chance. I'm not saying that you won't have opportunities to be successful as a DO, they will just be harder to get than MD students. If you performed as a "top-tier" student in DO school, you would still not have access to top-tier institutions for residency. Even many mid-tier locations that MDs easily get, will be very difficult to get as a DO, depending on the specialty. It's best to have as many options open to yourself as you can, and MD school will do that for you. It will be less stress in the long run than graduating a year earlier.


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[810390]

As a DO student graduating very shortly, I would highly advise you to go the MD route if given the chance. I'm not saying that you won't have opportunities to be successful as a DO, they will just be harder to get than MD students. If you performed as a "top-tier" student in DO school, you would still not have access to top-tier institutions for residency. Even many mid-tier locations that MDs easily get, will be very difficult to get as a DO, depending on the specialty. It's best to have as many options open to yourself as you can, and MD school will do that for you. It will be less stress in the long run than graduating a year earlier.


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That was very helpful, sir. If I perform well in my undergraduate studies, I will attempt MD.

While pursuing a D.O. or an M.D., I also wish to complete a M.P.H. From your experience, is it possible, or, alternatively, how hard would it be to complete a medical degree and M.P.H. concurrently in four years? (beginning the summer after M1, completing the degree at the end of M3 or M4)

 

[tp1127]

I don't understand why everyone is advising to not go into a BS/DO direct program. It is smarter to go into one of the programs so that you have a safety net in case things don't work in your favor. You always have to think about the worst case scenario as well as the best case scenario and weigh the risks.

I was in a similar position when I was in high school. I had a choice between LECOM, NSU, and NJIT( all of them were direct med programs). I ultimately decided to go to NSU and I am a sophmore in the 3+4 dual DO program. I just took my MCAT on January 19. I am happy with my decision because if my score isn't high enough, I know that at least I will become a doctor from a pretty reputable medical school. If my score comes out to be competitive, then I will be applying out to MD schools. NSU is nonbinding so I can reserve my seat at my own school and also apply out. You honestly cannot get a better deal than that. Also, the only requirements you need to fulfill are getting an MCAT score of 502 and maintaining a 3.3 GPA. Obviously, if you want to apply out eventually, then you should maintain competitive stats but say for whatever reason something comes up in your life and you can't get enough extra curricular activities, or you can't get the MCAT score you wanted, you still have a safety net. It isn't uncommon for students to end up having to take a gap year because they got rejected from medical schools the first time they applied. I have one cousin who got a 37 on the old MCAT and had a high GPA, but medical schools didn't think he had enough volunteer hours or extra curriculum activities so he was rejected. It was also his fault, but the point is so many kids go into undergrad thinking they will be fine and some school will accept them and then when they don't, they have to take a gap year. It isn't as easy as it sounds to try and find doctor shadowing positions on your own without connections or to make yourself stand out against other pre-med applicants.

I'd say take some time to think about it and make sure to weigh the pros and cons of each school. I had gotten full tuition from both NSU and the direct med MD program at NJIT but I didn't want to go to the Caribbean for medical school and I wanted the option to apply out to other schools so I decided to go to NSU. If you're worried about the cost, it is pretty easy to get the President's Scholarship at NSU which is a full tuition scholarship.

Good Luck with whatever decision you make!

 

[810390]

I don't understand why everyone is advising to not go into a BS/DO direct program. It is smarter to go into one of the programs so that you have a safety net in case things don't work in your favor. You always have to think about the worst case scenario as well as the best case scenario and weigh the risks.

I was in a similar position when I was in high school. I had a choice between LECOM, NSU, and NJIT( all of them were direct med programs). I ultimately decided to go to NSU and I am a sophmore in the 3+4 dual DO program. I just took my MCAT on January 19. I am happy with my decision because if my score isn't high enough, I know that at least I will become a doctor from a pretty reputable medical school. If my score comes out to be competitive, then I will be applying out to MD schools. NSU is nonbinding so I can reserve my seat at my own school and also apply out. You honestly cannot get a better deal than that. Also, the only requirements you need to fulfill are getting an MCAT score of 502 and maintaining a 3.3 GPA. Obviously, if you want to apply out eventually, then you should maintain competitive stats but say for whatever reason something comes up in your life and you can't get enough extra curricular activities, or you can't get the MCAT score you wanted, you still have a safety net. It isn't uncommon for students to end up having to take a gap year because they got rejected from medical schools the first time they applied. I have one cousin who got a 37 on the old MCAT and had a high GPA, but medical schools didn't think he had enough volunteer hours or extra curriculum activities so he was rejected. It was also his fault, but the point is so many kids go into undergrad thinking they will be fine and some school will accept them and then when they don't, they have to take a gap year. It isn't as easy as it sounds to try and find doctor shadowing positions on your own without connections or to make yourself stand out against other pre-med applicants.

I'd say take some time to think about it and make sure to weigh the pros and cons of each school. I had gotten full tuition from both NSU and the direct med MD program at NJIT but I didn't want to go to the Caribbean for medical school and I wanted the option to apply out to other schools so I decided to go to NSU. If you're worried about the cost, it is pretty easy to get the President's Scholarship at NSU which is a full tuition scholarship.

Good Luck with whatever decision you make!

I do think they are misunderstanding the terms of the program. They probably conceived it as binding for the participating student.

I've just received the 3+4 confirmation email, and decided to study at NSU next fall! The campus is stunning and so is the COM, the students & staff are friendly and helpful, and the housing is nice. I'll message you before the next orientation if you want to hang out : I

Few more inquiries. From your experience, is NSU's premedical coursework difficult? As in: easy, average, manageable, difficult, or burning inferno assrape hell? Did you transfer in any AP credits, and if you did, which courses did you successfuly waive? What would you suggest I do right now to prepare myself for success?

Thanks alot @tp1127

 

[OMS398563]

Thanks for your post! But can't tell if trolling on the last part. Difficult life as a M1?

For other posters, are you thinking that the program is binding? It's just a medical seat guarantee for undergrads that meet the minimum requirements. We can apply out after the 3rd/4th year if the stats I build are impressive for schools that are better established compared NSUCOM.



Thanks. Primary care sounds like a fulfilling career, but I'm also considering anes, IM-Onc Fellow, and radio.

By your experience, even if I hold impressive COMLEX and USMLE scores, will it be much harder to land the above mentioned specialty matches as an osteopath?

Hi!

As of today that is a totally reachable goal as a DO. Tomorrow? Who can say. Heme/Onc is a pretty competitive fellowship and to land it you will need to attend at least a mid tier university IM program. This is totally doable as a DO. That said, do you really want to be the best in your class with a 750 Comlex and 270 USMLE and have that the best you can do? Do you even want to TAKE two board exams?

I understand that that the BS/DO program is not binding. However, should you do well on the MCAT "elite undergraduate institution" will look much better and be more competitive than a BS from LECOM or NOVA. I am sorry to say that, in medicine, pedigree matters.

Also keep in mind the possible cost of NOVA over the 7 years vs. a state school doing a traditional 4 +4. A B.S. and M.D. from University of Florida (based on your choices I am assuming you are from FL) will run you around $150,000. The BS/DO program will run you around $280,000.

Good Luck!

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I don't understand why everyone is advising to not go into a BS/DO direct program. It is smarter to go into one of the programs so that you have a safety net in case things don't work in your favor. You always have to think about the worst case scenario as well as the best case scenario and weigh the risks.

I was in a similar position when I was in high school. I had a choice between LECOM, NSU, and NJIT( all of them were direct med programs). I ultimately decided to go to NSU and I am a sophmore in the 3+4 dual DO program. I just took my MCAT on January 19. I am happy with my decision because if my score isn't high enough, I know that at least I will become a doctor from a pretty reputable medical school. If my score comes out to be competitive, then I will be applying out to MD schools. NSU is nonbinding so I can reserve my seat at my own school and also apply out. You honestly cannot get a better deal than that. Also, the only requirements you need to fulfill are getting an MCAT score of 502 and maintaining a 3.3 GPA. Obviously, if you want to apply out eventually, then you should maintain competitive stats but say for whatever reason something comes up in your life and you can't get enough extra curricular activities, or you can't get the MCAT score you wanted, you still have a safety net. It isn't uncommon for students to end up having to take a gap year because they got rejected from medical schools the first time they applied. I have one cousin who got a 37 on the old MCAT and had a high GPA, but medical schools didn't think he had enough volunteer hours or extra curriculum activities so he was rejected. It was also his fault, but the point is so many kids go into undergrad thinking they will be fine and some school will accept them and then when they don't, they have to take a gap year. It isn't as easy as it sounds to try and find doctor shadowing positions on your own without connections or to make yourself stand out against other pre-med applicants.

I'd say take some time to think about it and make sure to weigh the pros and cons of each school. I had gotten full tuition from both NSU and the direct med MD program at NJIT but I didn't want to go to the Caribbean for medical school and I wanted the option to apply out to other schools so I decided to go to NSU. If you're worried about the cost, it is pretty easy to get the President's Scholarship at NSU which is a full tuition scholarship.

Good Luck with whatever decision you make!

I don't believe a person who just recently graduated from a place where they needed permission to relieve themselves is in a position to decide what they're interested in doing as an adult. I personally furthermore believe that college is a time to explore and figure out what you really like to do with the rest of your life. I wrestled for a very long time between a career in behavioral research, biochemistry, and medicine before finally knowing through experience that medicine is what I truly wanted.
Being set on a constrained pathway of taking classes for 3 years to graduate into a DO program isn't something that lets you explore or grow. And when it comes down to it, if the op had potentially greater talents for another field and is actually unable or likely going to be miserable in medicine they'll find themselves stuck with an expensive degree in biology or premedical studies and a need to reeducate to get to where they actually want to be.

So in short I cannot recommend it. I think there's an advantage to growing up, finding yourself, and spending college learning outside of biology and science.

I mean you lucked out, you seem to have an interest in medicine and were given an enormous scholarship. But for another person in your class they probably would have been happier being an artist or historian but instead are going into a career they're lukewarm about or believe is reputable because their parents think so.

 

[tp1127]

I do think they are misunderstanding the terms of the program. They probably conceived it as binding for the participating student.

I've just received the 3+4 confirmation email, and decided to study at NSU next fall! The campus is stunning and so is the COM, the students & staff are friendly and helpful, and the housing is nice. I'll message you before the next orientation if you want to hang out : I

Few more inquiries. From your experience, is NSU's premedical coursework difficult? As in: easy, average, manageable, difficult, or burning inferno assrape hell? Did you transfer in any AP credits, and if you did, which courses did you successfuly waive? What would you suggest I do right now to prepare myself for success?

Thanks alot @tp1127

Congratulations and welcome to the NSU family! Yeah, definitely let me know next time you are on campus!
In my opinion, NSU premed coursework is generally easy. The chemistry and physics classes are generally easier, but the bio classes tend to run a bit harder, especially Anatomy and Physiology. However, take that with a grain of salt because I have always just performed better in chemistry, physics, and math all my life. It also depends on who your professor is! But overall, it isn't hard to get an A in all of you classes as long as you put in the effort and show up to class.

I was able to transfer all of my AP credits from high school so I came in with 38 credits. I didn't have to take any gen ed reqs except for Bio 1/2 and Comp. I was even able to transfer my AP Chemistry credit and get out of taking Gen Chem 1/2, so I took Org Chem 1/2 my freshman year. If you are planning on taking the AP Chemistry exam, I highly suggest it because since it is an accelerated program, you're going to want to take Gen Chem 1/2, Org Chem 1/2, and Biochemistry before taking your MCAT your sophomore year. Since those are 5 classes and you only have 3 or 4 semesters before you take your MCAT (depending on when you decide to take it) it really helps to not have to take Gen Chem 1/2. Otherwise, most other students take summer school to catch up on the chemistry courses. If you also don't want to take Comp 1500 and 2000, but you didn't get the AP score you need, you can take the CLEP exam which is easier than the AP exam. I was too stupid to not take it, but my brother took the exam a few weeks ago and he passed with very little studying.

Let me know if you have any more questions, happy to help!