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Another question, sorry to post again. How do I find out which states require step 3 before starting PGY2? Anyone know, is there such a listing?
Check with the board of medicine for the state you're interested in.... should be easy to google and find their requirements online. I don't know of any "master list" or database.
Why not just take step 3 and be done with it.
I'm not aware of any state that requires you to take Step 3 before PGY2 year and the only state I know about (not the only one that exists, just the only I know about) that requires Step 3 and a full unlimited license at any specific point in training is CA.
FWIW, this is a question that could have been answered with a 30 second conversation with the program coordinator at your new residency.
Well some programs require step 3 before starting an advanced, PGY2 program no? Yes I realize I can ask the coordinator, but since there is a score reporting delay that will occur starting this month, it is what it is. I don't want to be seen as a problem resident before I even start.
I guess if it's not a state requirement per se, why do some programs require step 3 before starting residency?
Agree with gutonc: I was always under the impression that except for rare exceptions, this was a program decision not a state decision.
Programs can do whatever they want as long as it's within US employment law.
And FWIW, I've never heard of a residency program that required Step 3 before starting. Fellowships, sure, but not residencies.
Again...you can sit here and mentally jerk off about this on the internet until the ROL deadline. Or you can make a quick phone call on Monday and be done with it. Your call.
I see. So I can then get a temporary, resident license in MA in the case that there are issues with not passing step 3, God forbid? Are programs required to tell you about step 3 during the interview process at all? I certainly did not ask, it couldn't have been further away from my mind.
I have no idea since this may be program specific. They should be able to tell you. I wouldn't worry about being labeled as a "trouble maker" resident; there is an official posting that Step 3 scores will be delayed until June 5, 2013.
BTW, you cannot get an unrestricted license in Massachusetts without at least 2 years of GME, so I'm not sure why they want/need you to have Step 3 done before PGY-2 since you can't get a license anyway.
And who fails Step 3?
I don't know, but the pass rate, even for AMGs like myself is 96% I think, so about 4% of the people who take it fail it, and there are a number of posts on this forum about step 3 failures, people getting fired for not passing step 3 during/before second year, and so forth. Even some postings for PGY-2 in Anesthesia and EM on the Residency available section says that Step 3 should be done before starting PGY-2. So I guess I thought I'd ask.
Of course I realize some people do fail, but honestly 4% is a pretty small number. Realistically, its not something the vast vast majority of residents need to worry about.
Heck, even I, a dumb surgeon, passed it as a PGY-3 (and given that there were precisely 4 surgical questions on the whole thing and I still got around the national average score).
That's interesting. There are over 100 practice questions on gen surg on Uworld not to mention that the chapter on Kaplan is like 30 pages. 2 only questions on surgery!? Wow, that's pretty crazy.
Oh well, I hope you are right and that it's not an issue. I'm stressing out about it!
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I guess if it's not a state requirement per se, why do some programs require step 3 before starting residency?
Well some programs require step 3 before starting an advanced, PGY2 program no? Yes I realize I can ask the coordinator, but since there is a score reporting delay that will occur starting this month, it is what it is. I don't want to be seen as a problem resident before I even start.
I guess if it's not a state requirement per se, why do some programs require step 3 before starting residency?
I think you guys are confused. You have to pass step 2 before advancing to PGY-2. Some states, like TX only allow 3 tries to pass step 2 and you have to passed before advancing to second year of residency. If you fail step 2 three times, you are kicked out of residency in TX. You usually have to pass step 3 in order to get a license. In our residency (FP), it was up to us when we wanted to take step 3 but of course you have to finish step 3 before you graduate and take the certification boards.
I think you guys are confused. You have to pass step 2 before advancing to PGY-2. Some states, like TX only allow 3 tries to pass step 2 and you have to passed before advancing to second year of residency. If you fail step 2 three times, you are kicked out of residency in TX. You usually have to pass step 3 in order to get a license. In our residency (FP), it was up to us when we wanted to take step 3 but of course you have to finish step 3 before you graduate and take the certification boards.
You are correct, but there are some states (at least one...CA) that require all residents to pass Step 3 before moving on to PGY3.
You are correct, but there are some states (at least one...CA) that require all residents to pass Step 3 before moving on to PGY3.