Likelihood with optho

[m3unsure]

Hey everyone,

I am currently finishing up third year, but I'm unsure about my chances in optho. I was able to pull off a lot of PRE-clinical honors (probably don't matter one bit) and a good step 1 (mid-240s). BUT I have had a rocky road (IMO) during third year with evaluators. I have been told that I am a hard worker, good grasp of what's going on, etc. However, I am only able to get high-pass vs an honors/outstanding. Guess it's better than just passing! I'm wondering if programs care about the clinical comments or just screen with letter grades. Also, anybody do any particular away rotations with cool attendings, preferably on the coasts? Thanks for suggestions/advice. Hopefully, those who have matched can help out with this one or even residents who have interviewed applicants.

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[rubensan]

ahhh, the one who high passes most rotations with good evals but doesn't honor the exam. first, make sure you spell ophthalmology correctly on your application. other than that, your position isn't that uncommon. i don't think you have told us anything that would preclude you from matching in ophthlamology. yes, programs care about clinical comments and yes, you are more than just a letter grade. i didn't honor everything and matched ok. keep up the hard work and give it your all during your ophtho rotations.

Hey everyone,

I am currently finishing up third year, but I'm unsure about my chances in optho. I was able to pull off a lot of PRE-clinical honors (probably don't matter one bit) and a good step 1 (mid-240s). BUT I have had a rocky road (IMO) during third year with evaluators. I have been told that I am a hard worker, good grasp of what's going on, etc. However, I am only able to get high-pass vs an honors/outstanding. Guess it's better than just passing! I'm wondering if programs care about the clinical comments or just screen with letter grades. Also, anybody do any particular away rotations with cool attendings, preferably on the coasts? Thanks for suggestions/advice. Hopefully, those who have matched can help out with this one or even residents who have interviewed applicants.

 

[KCS doc]

I am also a high pass monkey. Many top ten interviews and matched well. Find other ways to stand out and go for it!

 

[xaelia]

I'm pumped to include my undergraduate college transcripts with my application. Are they serious? Those are from like...>6 years ago now.

12 Cs and a D will help my application immensely.

 

[m3unsure]

At my school, the clinical grade is 66-75% clinical eval. Only 1/4 to 1/3 is the test. Sure, I can honor the test and get a high pass clinically to get honors overall, but only like 10% (4/40) are supposed to get that on the exam (some sort of bell curve). I usually miss the %&* cutoff by 2 points. To elaborate, if the clinical evals were honors, I would have honored everything so far. This is what is pI$$ing me off: getting dinged by a bunch of prejudice. I get the feeling that a brown or Asian person is expected to know 10 times more than others to be considered equal. I guess medicine is just about as shallow as the business world. And by the way, how many rotations were you able to honor? Just curious.

ahhh, the one who high passes most rotations with good evals but doesn't honor the exam. first, make sure you spell ophthalmology correctly on your application. other than that, your position isn't that uncommon. i don't think you have told us anything that would preclude you from matching in ophthlamology. yes, programs care about clinical comments and yes, you are more than just a letter grade. i didn't honor everything and matched ok. keep up the hard work and give it your all during your ophtho rotations.

 

[wtwei02]

This is what is pI$$ing me off: getting dinged by a bunch of prejudice. I get the feeling that a brown or Asian person is expected to know 10 times more than others to be considered equal.

Whoa there, hold on! That's not true. And even if it were true, that kind of attitude is not going to get you anywhere.

 

[cdql]

Whoa there, hold on! That's not true. And even if it were true, that kind of attitude is not going to get you anywhere.

I'll have to disagree and then agree.

I feel that attitude is pretty pervasive in both the business and medical world. This is especially true in my school seeing as we only have 5% minority students. There does seem to be a certain prejudice against those who are not the majority. Is it blatant favoritism? Of course not. But one can see that these students get different treatment.

However, I will agree with your second point. If I were an Asian student (or any student for that matter who is experiencing some form of discrimination), the solution isn't to get angry and bitter. The solution is to find a way around it. Work harder. Be nicer. And remember that when you leave medical school, the real world is just the same way. Being angry and bitter is only going to make things worse. You just have to grit your teeth and find someway to be even better than you are now!

 

[diopter]

I'm pumped to include my undergraduate college transcripts with my application. Are they serious? Those are from like...>6 years ago now.

12 Cs and a D will help my application immensely.

hehe.. funny enough some interviewers did look at college stuff.. but I doubt most do... my favorite interview question was (mind you, this was last year):
Interviewer: "So why did you get a B+ in Quantum Mechanics?"
Me: "I took Quantum Mechanics? When was that?"
Interviewer: "In... lemme see... Fall of... 1994... oh... nevermind then"

 

[m3unsure]

In response,

I work pretty hard. I spend a lot of time looking up stuff that someone is unsure about. I printout papers, do presentations, and pickup extra work. I don't sit around in a corner. I don't blow people off. I always get feedback (midway or so) and the response is always great. This happens to a lot of other students as well so it's not just me. I think for anyone who hasn't seen prejudice or been lucky third year it is easy to say that this doesn't exist. And I don't go around being bitter each and everyday. I just don't like the idea of my options being limited while some other lucky (sort of) slacker gets a better spot than me and more importantly in a good geographic location. I'm not in it to get the chairman position at Harvard or whatever. I just don't want to get stuck in the boonies (prefer urban areas like Seattle, Chicago, Phily, NYC, Boston). I guess my digressions will end here. Moving on, I would appreciate some info on good programs/attendings in the locations listed above. Thanks in advance.

I'll have to disagree and then agree.

I feel that attitude is pretty pervasive in both the business and medical world. This is especially true in my school seeing as we only have 5% minority students. There does seem to be a certain prejudice against those who are not the majority. Is it blatant favoritism? Of course not. But one can see that these students get different treatment.

However, I will agree with your second point. If I were an Asian student (or any student for that matter who is experiencing some form of discrimination), the solution isn't to get angry and bitter. The solution is to find a way around it. Work harder. Be nicer. And remember that when you leave medical school, the real world is just the same way. Being angry and bitter is only going to make things worse. You just have to grit your teeth and find someway to be even better than you are now!

 

[smiegal]

At my school, the clinical grade is 66-75% clinical eval. Only 1/4 to 1/3 is the test. Sure, I can honor the test and get a high pass clinically to get honors overall, but only like 10% (4/40) are supposed to get that on the exam (some sort of bell curve). I usually miss the %&* cutoff by 2 points. To elaborate, if the clinical evals were honors, I would have honored everything so far. This is what is pI$$ing me off: getting dinged by a bunch of prejudice. I get the feeling that a brown or Asian person is expected to know 10 times more than others to be considered equal. I guess medicine is just about as shallow as the business world. And by the way, how many rotations were you able to honor? Just curious.

You're not entitled to an honors grade. The fact that "only like 10%" get an honors on the exam and you just miss the cutoff has nothing to do with being "brown or asian". No doubt that med school evals are bizarrely subjective/arbitrary (and sometimes unfair), but chill out with the racial crap unless you're going to back it up way more than you did in your posts. Several of my asian friends matched at great Ophthalmology programs. Maybe it's your spoiled attitude keeping you from getting honors....

 

[cdql]

You're not entitled to an honors grade. The fact that "only like 10%" get an honors on the exam and you just miss the cutoff has nothing to do with being "brown or asian". No doubt that med school evals are bizarrely subjective/arbitrary (and sometimes unfair), but chill out with the racial crap unless you're going to back it up way more than you did in your posts. Several of my asian friends matched at great Ophthalmology programs. Maybe it's your spoiled attitude keeping you from getting honors....

While his attitude isn't the greatest, he may be bringing up a valid point. Perhaps there are more Asian students are your school and as such, since the doctors are used to seeing them, the level of discrimination is low. Or perhaps your friends were so bright, cheerful, and motivated, that it was unpossible to knock them down.

Their experiences may differ from this poster's experiences. I know my med school has a very small Asian population (minority population in general is paltry here) and as such, there may be a bit more discrimination as the doctors here just aren't used to seeing that particular type of student.

I think we can all agree though the openly showing your displeasure with this so called perceived "racism" is not the best way to handle the situation. If you have tried your hardest and still can't get the honors grade, then it just wasn't meant to me. To be honest, I don't think missing out on honors is going to keep you from the best residency programs.

 

[rubensan]

i am not going to comment on this racial prejudice issue. but, what i will say is that you have to remember that you are more than your grades. life is more than a grade. ophtho programs look at the whole picture. i maintain, that there is nothing in your original post that is going to prevent you from matching in an ophthalmology residency. work hard, make some good contacts in your sub-is, spend some time thinking about your personal statement, get some strong LORs (you should if they are giving you high pass evals), get on a research project and you will have statistics on your side. there are many programs in the areas that you are interested in. remember, once you get the interview, programs have deemed you academically worthy. at that point, the interview becomes important and i hate to tell you this, but the process becomes much more subjective. i also hate to be the one to imform you that prejudice (and i'm not referring to racial) pervades academia on many different levels. there are some programs that discriminate against their own applicants in favor of those from top medical schools. there are others that favor their own applicants and discriminate against those from other programs. you did too much research for one program to take you seriously, but not enough for another program to consider you. some years, a program may want to take more women then men, etc. you will be much better prepared to manuever and thrive in this environment if you recognize and capitalize on your own strengths. instead of getting angry and discouraged, concentrate on what you can bring to the table and be prepared to answer the question that many interviewers will ask you "why should we accept you to this program?"

Good luck!

At my school, the clinical grade is 66-75% clinical eval. Only 1/4 to 1/3 is the test. Sure, I can honor the test and get a high pass clinically to get honors overall, but only like 10% (4/40) are supposed to get that on the exam (some sort of bell curve). I usually miss the %&* cutoff by 2 points. To elaborate, if the clinical evals were honors, I would have honored everything so far. This is what is pI$$ing me off: getting dinged by a bunch of prejudice. I get the feeling that a brown or Asian person is expected to know 10 times more than others to be considered equal. I guess medicine is just about as shallow as the business world. And by the way, how many rotations were you able to honor? Just curious.