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Loan forgiveness

WallowaWanderer

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    So I'm looking at the big number at the bottom of my loan deferral form, and I'm wondering - does loan forgiveness exist in the world of EM? Anyone have experience with this?

    I would imagine that if your employer offered loan forgiveness then they would just reduce you salary by that same amount, right? And from the little I know you still have to pay taxes on the amount they pay on your behalf . . . so what is the benefit of loan forgiveness?
     

    NSAIDAllergy

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      I think only the primary care fields get such a break. For all the talk about the primary care function of EM docs, it just ain't real when it comes to being eligible for such programs.
       
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      iridesingltrack

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        Yea, it seems that a lot of loan repayment dollars are directed towards primary care. However, I know that the NIH has a loan repayment "grant" that you can apply for if you are doing research. This grant is competitive but I'm not exactly sure to what degree. More information can be found at http://www.lrp.nih.gov/

        Also, I don't know if this is true, but I've also heard that some private groups will give you money towards your loans as part of the compensation package. Has anyone else ever heard of this happening? Senior residents/Attendings any thoughts/experiences?
         

        WallowaWanderer

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          Also, I don't know if this is true, but I've also heard that some private groups will give you money towards your loans as part of the compensation package.

          Yeah, that's what I was thinking about and was wondering if it was really true. As far as I can tell, you have to pay income tax on that money anyway so I don't really see what the benefit is . . . maybe that's why it's not all that common.
           
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          deleted65604

            I got $40,000 loan repayment from the hospital (I signed a contract with the group that holds the contract for the ER). This is a forgivable loan that I "work-off" after 4 years. If I leave before then, I have to pay back the amount of money that I haven't worked off. It is just a ploy to make you more likely to stay on. Again, this did not come from the Emergency Department piggy bank.
             

            Drawing Dead

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              I've seen a classified for a position in Maine, and I think another one in Ohio that said "up to $200,000 in loan forgiveness" (In the back of one of the magazines that comes to my apartment). But, as they say in life, there is no such thing as a free lunch. They all probably involve most of the following:

              A committment to the position for x number of years (as mentioned)
              A decrease in salary compared to what is usually offered.
              "Less-desireable" areas of the country (by less desireable, I mean places where men are men and the sheep are scared.)
              Also, underserved areas, which can actually be a good thing.

              But yes, they do exist. Just beware of Greeks bearing gifts.
               

              RxnMan

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                WW - I've been looking at the NIH myself, and you can get #35k/yr (with the taxes paid by NIH) for two years if you do clinical research. You go to the link single track pointed out and you'll see that the 1st-time applicants are funded ~40% of the time, repeaters are ~70% successful. With Hauskoos working with HIV, you should have a good chance.

                Do a search. I know several MD's who did this in NYC. They simply drafted a letter explaining how EM is primary care.
                In NYC? This is interesting. Can you explain this a little more? PM me if you want.
                 

                roja

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                  WW - I've been looking at the NIH myself, and you can get #35k/yr (with the taxes paid by NIH) for two years if you do clinical research. You go to the link single track pointed out and you'll see that the 1st-time applicants are funded ~40% of the time, repeaters are ~70% successful. With Hauskoos working with HIV, you should have a good chance.

                  In NYC? This is interesting. Can you explain this a little more? PM me if you want.


                  http://www.highered.nysed.gov/kiap/scholarships/rplfap.htm


                  Basically, the two MD's applied (our hospital in manhattan is considered underserved) and regarding the primary care issue, wrote a letter explaining how ED's provide extensive primary care in our particular population. (peds, adult, etc)
                   

                  iridesingltrack

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                    WW, you may have seen this already but the link below will direct you to some interesting information from ACEP about the current status of Loan Repayment/Forgiveness programs. The National Health Service Corps is not an option for EM at this time (ACEP is lobbying for this to change). The Indian Health Service is available to EM, paying about 20k/year towards loans. Additionally, there are several states that provide loan repayment options that may be worth investigating esp if one knows where they want to live. The following states provide no loan forgiveness options to EM trained physicians: Alabama, Idaho, Illinois, Kentucky, Missouri, Nebraska, South Dakota, Virginia, West Virginia, and Wisconsin.

                    http://www.acep.org/practres.aspx?L...cal Education Debt/Loan Repayment-Forgiveness
                     

                    RxnMan

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                      http://www.highered.nysed.gov/kiap/scholarships/rplfap.htm


                      Basically, the two MD's applied (our hospital in manhattan is considered underserved) and regarding the primary care issue, wrote a letter explaining how ED's provide extensive primary care in our particular population. (peds, adult, etc)
                      Cool. Thanks for the link - I didn't know there was a program like this.

                      EDIT: WW - I found this, this, and this, which may help you out.

                      EDIT 2: roja - can you get these things to stack? If you apply for repayment through several of these programs for the underserved, do you have to take only one? Can you be faculty and qualify for these? You could see $50k/yr + repayment if so, but it sounds too good to be true...
                       

                      roja

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                        Cool. Thanks for the link - I didn't know there was a program like this.

                        EDIT: WW - I found this, this, and this, which may help you out.

                        EDIT 2: roja - can you get these things to stack? If you apply for repayment through several of these programs for the underserved, do you have to take only one? Can you be faculty and qualify for these? You could see $50k/yr + repayment if so, but it sounds too good to be true...



                        I'm not sure if you can stack them. I know that both who have the NYS one have it. I imagine you would just have to read the fine print. :)
                         

                        MasterintuBater

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                          So, I'm probably bragging about the sweet-A$$ contract I signed, but they are paying back my student loans completely. All $221,000 big ones. They are essentially using the carrot-on-a-stick approach. They pay back 10% of my loans each year for 10 years. After each year of service, the previous year's tuition reimbursement is forgiven. That means I can walk away after 5 years with 50% of my loans paid off and owe them nothing. It is not skimmed off my salary. It was simply a recruitment tool. Hospital is 45 minutes from the metropolitan area I wanted to live in.
                           

                          WallowaWanderer

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                            So, I'm probably bragging about the sweet-A$$ contract I signed, but they are paying back my student loans completely. All $221,000 big ones. They are essentially using the carrot-on-a-stick approach. They pay back 10% of my loans each year for 10 years. After each year of service, the previous year's tuition reimbursement is forgiven. That means I can walk away after 5 years with 50% of my loans paid off and owe them nothing. It is not skimmed off my salary. It was simply a recruitment tool. Hospital is 45 minutes from the metropolitan area I wanted to live in.

                            Wow, that sounds incredible. I hope I can find something like this. I guess there is hope.

                            Thanks for the info everybody.
                             

                            Arcan57

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                              Keep in mind that depending on what kind of environment you want to practice in, high $200-low $300k jobs out of residency are available. Which is its own kind of loan forgiveness.
                               

                              primadonna22274

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                                Wallowa, it does happen (as stated by a few posters above). I like the person who said "EM is essentially primary care". :rolleyes: Unfortunately true.

                                I'm in semi-rural SC where our hospital ED (50,000 pt visits/yr) has some arrangement to pay student loans for EM docs. Unfortunately they're shortsighted and don't pay them for PAs. I don't know the specifics but one of my supervising physicians told me she had her student loans repaid over I think four years by the hospital. Didn't sound like she had a lower salary because of it. (In fact, this could not be, since the docs are employed by the EM group, not the hospital.)

                                Good luck!
                                 

                                anonymousEM

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                                  Just today I got a flyer in the mail from a recruiter advertising amongst other benefits up to 200k in loan repayment. Certainly there are strings attached but they are occasionally out there. This one was in Southern OH and said they are about to open a DO residency.
                                   

                                  AmoryBlaine

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                                    So, I'm probably bragging about the sweet-A$$ contract I signed, but they are paying back my student loans completely. All $221,000 big ones. They are essentially using the carrot-on-a-stick approach. They pay back 10% of my loans each year for 10 years. After each year of service, the previous year's tuition reimbursement is forgiven. That means I can walk away after 5 years with 50% of my loans paid off and owe them nothing. It is not skimmed off my salary. It was simply a recruitment tool. Hospital is 45 minutes from the metropolitan area I wanted to live in.

                                    Can I send you my CV?
                                     

                                    MaxDesMer

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                                      NYS recently made loan forgivness available to ANY specialty, if you agree to work in an underserved area.

                                      http://www.highered.nysed.gov/kiap/pdf/loanforgiveness2008.pdf

                                      http://www.highered.nysed.gov/kiap/scholarships/pdf/shortagearea2008.pdf

                                      Of course the military is an option....You can get 50K toward your loans in exchange for 3 years of Reserve duty with the Army. The Army is the only branch that I know of that has a Reserve program. The Navy and Air Force want you to do active duty for their money.


                                      http://www.highered.nysed.gov/kiap/scholarships/rplfap.htm


                                      Basically, the two MD's applied (our hospital in manhattan is considered underserved) and regarding the primary care issue, wrote a letter explaining how ED's provide extensive primary care in our particular population. (peds, adult, etc)
                                       
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