Looking for Guidance

[485966]

Hello all,

I, like a majority of you, want to become a physician. My current situation involves a few factors that I haven't seen before on here...

I graduated from my University with a cGPA of 3.82 but I'm unsure about my sGPA, it should be a 3.9x, but I am not too sure since my online records don't say. I have my degree in Biology with a concentration in Biomedical Sciences. I applied last year (end of my junior year) through the Early Acceptance Program at UTMB (I live in Texas) and due to my low MCAT score, I didn't go straight into medical school through this program. They had told me to take the test by June which I did, but I got a low score, 18R, so then they said to take it again in August (2012) and I could still get in for that season. I got an even lower score 13R, which greatly lowered my confidence. :/

So as of right now, I have 2 low MCAT scores (18R and 13R) and since then, I took a Princeton course to prepare but still haven't taken it since I am afraid to take it officially. (I have heard that after 3 failed MCAT scores, schools begin to not even bother looking at your application, is this true?)

I am currently shadowing a physician and applied to become an ER Scribe the other day. I was planning on reapplying this year, but because I am not ready for the test, I have not submitted any applications. My Undergrad advisor told me to apply next season early and take the MCAT in January, which is my current plan, but I am just panicking with the time gaps that are inevitable when I apply in a year's time. I know that if I get the Scribe job, it would fill that gap, but I didn't want to be out of school for too long.

I have been thinking of applying to a Caribbean or Mexican school, that way I can just get into my medical education already this year, but I am worried about the accreditation coming to practice back in the US.

Does anyone have any advice as to what I should do? I feel lost, confused and scared. I am getting constant pressure from my family to get into everything and get it all done so I can finally become a physician. I do want it still, but I am beginning to feel too much pressure and am getting extremely stressed out. I'd appreciate any responses and/or advice any of you might have, and I thank you in advance.

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[SilverCat]

The GPA and MCAT scores don't make sense. Is there one section on the MCAT with which you struggle? Do you fall apart when taking the exam due to stress? How long did you study, and did you take practice tests? That low of a score indicates gaps in knowledge.

It isn't true that adcoms will ignore your app after three poor MCAT scores, but you have to show significant improvement. Don't take the test again until you're confident that you can do better (I'd say hitting around 26+ for DO schools).

And under no circumstances apply to the Caribbean or Mexico. It will be torture finding a residency spot as an IMG.

 

[Toss]

What was your score breakdown? What did you struggle with most on the MCAT? How did you study for your two attempts so far?

 

[485966]

@SilverCat

The section I appear to struggle most with is the Bio Section. That has always been my lowest score. I have also come to realize that I do not take standardized tests well. I have found that when I take a practice test with a friend of mine, my score shoots up, but it is because he knows how to reason out the questions even without prior knowledge. I think my problem might be that I over-think things and then end up stressing myself out. Or perhaps it is that I don't deduce what the question is asking correctly when I read over them. I have been taking some of the practice tests that I have from the Princeton Course, but I have not done all of them, and I find it frustrating that they don't tell you why an answer is right or wrong, so I have remained a bit unsure of my answers and thought process. As for the gap in knowledge, what do you mean exactly? I feel that I do know the information, but I know I can also work on it a lot more. Is there a better way to study other than just doing constant practice exams? I haven't checked, but does this forum have a section for techniques to do better in standardized tests?

And yes, I thought so. Thank you, I was just considering the Mexican and Caribbean schools due to my frustration, but I had heard about the many problems that arise when you study over there.




@Toss

My break down is this

18R: 9V 5P 4B
13R: 4V 6P 3B

The way that I studied for these two tests was self-study. And I do not know how long it was that I studied for, but it was quite a bit, though obviously not enough. I know that the second time I took the test, I messed myself up by not treating the exam like a brand new one. I didn't practice the Verbal section as much as I had the previous test, since I had done well the first time. As you can see, it made my score drop quite a bit. :/ But what upsets me more is the fact that my weakest section is always the Bio section, which was my whole purpose in college.

 

[SilverCat]

By gaps in knowledge, I meant that you didn't have a strong background in the material, and given your GPA, this doesn't make sense. It sounds more like you have severe test- taking anxiety more than anything else.

I know this forum has a 3 month MCAT study schedule- you can look it up in the references section of the top toolbar. I would also try the ExamKrackers books for additional practice.

I took the exam in 2012, but it looked like the Bio section was moving toward research - paper based questions. Have you had much experience reading research papers in college, and picking information out of them? I think this is definitely a needed skill for the Bio section.

 

[Goro]

How badly do you want to be a doctor? We're addicted to standardized tests, and if ypu're having trouble with the MCAT, do you magically think you'll do better in medical school, or on boards.

STRONGLY advise to get some counseling to deal with your anxieties, both right nwo, and probable test-taking ones as well. And yes, multiple test-takers do tend to fair worse than people who take it 1-2x.

So as of right now, I have 2 low MCAT scores (18R and 13R) and since then, I took a Princeton course to prepare but still haven't taken it since I am afraid to take it officially. (I have heard that after 3 failed MCAT scores, schools begin to not even bother looking at your application, is this true?)


Again, your use of the word "panic" tells me that ou have some anxiety isses to deal with. Medcial school is a blast oven, so you need to fix this now, or seek another career.

I am currently shadowing a physician and applied to become an ER Scribe the other day. I was planning on reapplying this year, but because I am not ready for the test, I have not submitted any applications. My Undergrad advisor told me to apply next season early and take the MCAT in January, which is my current plan, but I am just panicking with the time gaps that are inevitable when I apply in a year's time. I know that if I get the Scribe job, it would fill that gap, but I didn't want to be out of school for too long.

Bad idea. FMGs are having a VERY hard time finding residencies, and there's that thing called board exam that you'll have to pass.

I have been thinking of applying to a Caribbean or Mexican school, that way I can just get into my medical education already this year, but I am worried about the accreditation coming to practice back in the US.

 

[485966]

By gaps in knowledge, I meant that you didn't have a strong background in the material, and given your GPA, this doesn't make sense. It sounds more like you have severe test- taking anxiety more than anything else.

I know this forum has a 3 month MCAT study schedule- you can look it up in the references section of the top toolbar. I would also try the ExamKrackers books for additional practice.

I took the exam in 2012, but it looked like the Bio section was moving toward research - paper based questions. Have you had much experience reading research papers in college, and picking information out of them? I think this is definitely a needed skill for the Bio section.

Thank you. I will look into the study schedule. I do have some of the ExamKrackers books as well, so I will be getting on those again. I am going to be working on my anxiety that comes about when I take these practice tests and hopefully I can report back here showing an increase in confidence and score.

I have not done that for the Bio section, but I will get on that and start looking up research papers to help better my score in that area. Thank you so much for your help SilverCat, it is greatly appreciated!

How badly do you want to be a doctor? We're addicted to standardized tests, and if ypu're having trouble with the MCAT, do you magically think you'll do better in medical school, or on boards.

Goro, I want to be a doctor very badly. I know that there is no magical solution, otherwise everyone in the world would be a doctor. I realize that my scores do not look good, but I feel like everything else, it is a learned skill. I know that once I overcome this obstacle and my anxiety of standardized tests, all of them, I will be an excellent doctor.

STRONGLY advise to get some counseling to deal with your anxieties, both right nwo, and probable test-taking ones as well. And yes, multiple test-takers do tend to fair worse than people who take it 1-2x.

What kind of places teach anti-anxiety for test-takers?

Again, your use of the word "panic" tells me that ou have some anxiety isses to deal with. Medcial school is a blast oven, so you need to fix this now, or seek another career.

I plan on overcoming this panic, and I know it may take a while, but I am willing to do so because of my desire to practice medicine. I also feel that I will be able to handle the wealth of information that is thrown at students in Medical School due to the large course loads I took as an UG. I think that given my final GPA, it proves that I was still able to achieve high status despite my large course load. I, of course know that the load in Medical School is much larger, but I am confident that when I get in, I would be able to handle it, thank you.

Bad idea. FMGs are having a VERY hard time finding residencies, and there's that thing called board exam that you'll have to pass.

I have been thinking of applying to a Caribbean or Mexican school, that way I can just get into my medical education already this year, but I am worried about the accreditation coming to practice back in the US.

Ah, yes I am aware it is called the Board exam, the name had slipped my mind at the time of my posting. But the Caribbean and Mexican schools were only an option for a short while in my mind, as I was going through my options these recent weeks. Thank you for your response.

 

[Goro]

Your university will also have counselors and learning specialists who will help you get through this. Talk to your own doctor about this as well.



What kind of places teach anti-anxiety for test-takers?

 

[485966]

Your university will also have counselors and learning specialists who will help you get through this. Talk to your own doctor about this as well.

Thank you, I will look into this.

 

[cabinbuilder]

Thank you, I will look into this.

I agree with GORO. YOU need to see your doctor about your anxiety. Medical school is tests EVERY WEEK. It just gets worse from there. You can take the MCAT 3 times and will be ok as far as applying. But until you get some medication on board to calm yourself down, your future is not a positive one.

 

[occams_razor]

Hello all,

I, like a majority of you, want to become a physician. My current situation involves a few factors that I haven't seen before on here...

I graduated from my University with a cGPA of 3.82 but I'm unsure about my sGPA, it should be a 3.9x, but I am not too sure since my online records don't say. I have my degree in Biology with a concentration in Biomedical Sciences. I applied last year (end of my junior year) through the Early Acceptance Program at UTMB (I live in Texas) and due to my low MCAT score, I didn't go straight into medical school through this program. They had told me to take the test by June which I did, but I got a low score, 18R, so then they said to take it again in August (2012) and I could still get in for that season. I got an even lower score 13R, which greatly lowered my confidence. :/

So as of right now, I have 2 low MCAT scores (18R and 13R) and since then, I took a Princeton course to prepare but still haven't taken it since I am afraid to take it officially. (I have heard that after 3 failed MCAT scores, schools begin to not even bother looking at your application, is this true?)

I am currently shadowing a physician and applied to become an ER Scribe the other day. I was planning on reapplying this year, but because I am not ready for the test, I have not submitted any applications. My Undergrad advisor told me to apply next season early and take the MCAT in January, which is my current plan, but I am just panicking with the time gaps that are inevitable when I apply in a year's time. I know that if I get the Scribe job, it would fill that gap, but I didn't want to be out of school for too long.

I have been thinking of applying to a Caribbean or Mexican school, that way I can just get into my medical education already this year, but I am worried about the accreditation coming to practice back in the US.

Does anyone have any advice as to what I should do? I feel lost, confused and scared. I am getting constant pressure from my family to get into everything and get it all done so I can finally become a physician. I do want it still, but I am beginning to feel too much pressure and am getting extremely stressed out. I'd appreciate any responses and/or advice any of you might have, and I thank you in advance.

You have an excellent GPA and science GPA. You are perfectly capable of doing well on this exam but it seems the anxiety is getting in the way. As others have said I recommend talking to a counselor/social worker or doctor who can help with this test anxiety. There are people out there and resources so definitely take advantage of them. I have a friend who is incredibly intelligent (3.9 undergrad GPA from a top school) and while she was pre-law she had this same exact problem when it came to taking the LSAT. She suffered from extreme test anxiety and her scores were not at all indicative of her abilities or intelligence. She found a counselor who specialized in test anxiety and it really helped her. So Have faith! You can overcome this. Good luck

 

[485966]

I agree with GORO. YOU need to see your doctor about your anxiety. Medical school is tests EVERY WEEK. It just gets worse from there. You can take the MCAT 3 times and will be ok as far as applying. But until you get some medication on board to calm yourself down, your future is not a positive one.

I know that there are constant tests, but there are Standardized Tests every single week of Med school? And I have begun practicing more and more and am glad to say my scores are improving little by little.

You have an excellent GPA and science GPA. You are perfectly capable of doing well on this exam but it seems the anxiety is getting in the way. As others have said I recommend talking to a counselor/social worker or doctor who can help with this test anxiety. There are people out there and resources so definitely take advantage of them. I have a friend who is incredibly intelligent (3.9 undergrad GPA from a top school) and while she was pre-law she had this same exact problem when it came to taking the LSAT. She suffered from extreme test anxiety and her scores were not at all indicative of her abilities or intelligence. She found a counselor who specialized in test anxiety and it really helped her. So Have faith! You can overcome this. Good luck

Thank you so much @Swimmer125, you have given me more confidence in myself!! I graduated recently though, so I am not sure yet if I can still access the counselors, but I will see what I can do. Thank you again!

 

[cabinbuilder]

I know that there are constant tests, but there are Standardized Tests every single week of Med school? And I have begun practicing more and more and am glad to say my scores are improving little by little.
!

Well, how do you think they get you ready for the boards? The exams are structured exactly like the standardized board exams so you get used to the questions. While they are geared toward that material of that week, they are all multiple choice and mimic the boards. SO I would say YES, it's just like any standardized tests you would see.

 

[QofQuimica]

Well, how do you think they get you ready for the boards? The exams are structured exactly like the standardized board exams so you get used to the questions. While they are geared toward that material of that week, they are all multiple choice and mimic the boards. SO I would say YES, it's just like any standardized tests you would see.

This.

OP, while acing standardized tests won't make you a great physician, failing standardized tests will mean you never get to become a licensed physician in the first place. So this is a very important area of weakness for you to work on before you even think of applying. Even if you could get an acceptance with an MCAT in the teens, going to med school under those circumstances would probably be setting you up for failure by not making it through the licensing process. I would say that an MCAT in the mid twenties is the bare minimum you should be able to achieve in order to set yourself up for having a good chance of passing your med school classes and the USMLE steps (boards) on the first try. And even then, you will probably have to work a lot harder to make it through the med school and licensing exams than most of your classmates who have more innate ability at standardized exams. I'm not at all saying this to discourage you, but to make sure you're prepared and willing to work a lot harder to achieve your goal than a lot of your peers will be working.

I would also say, based on your MCAT score breakdowns, that your weakness is not bio specifically. *Both* of your science subscores are significantly below average, which is an 8-9 for each subsection for all test-takers. You may know the science material very well based on your grades, but you are not applying that knowledge the way you need to be on the MCAT, and that is something you need to work on in physical sciences as well as the bio sciences. Your first VR score of 9 is encouraging and suggests to me that you have the ability to achieve an average total score (mid 20s) on the MCAT. I don't know what to make of the second VR subscore of 4. But again, a minimum total score of around 24-25 is where you want to be, ideally with all 8s or better on each section. If you can achieve that on your third MCAT attempt, I think it would go a long way toward assuaging some adcoms' fears about you maybe not being able to make it through the training and licensing exams. If you are not able to achieve a mid-twenties score even with proper preparation, counseling for text anxiety, etc., you should give serious thought to choosing another career.

Best of luck to you.

 

[cabinbuilder]

This.


.

Enjoying your support Q. Been having quite a bit of head shaking reading some of these boards lately. Nice to know there is another voice of reason out there. I appreciate you.

 

[Gauss44]

First of all, congratulations on your high GPAs. Secondly, you mentioned some very low MCAT scores. If it were me, I would not take another real MCAT until my AAMC practice test scores were at least in the upper 20's. What puzzles me is how someone with such high grades could be bombing the MCAT, unless you have another problem interfering like a learning disability or psychological issue like test anxiety. If this were me, I would get a neuropsychological evaluation to detect any learning disabilities, and I would see a licensed psychologist to diagnose any other issues. If any problems were detected that could be helped by accommodations (like extra time), I would apply for those. Meanwhile, I would make sure that I understood how to do every last question in the Examkracker lecture books (NOT 1001 books), and watch all the Chad videos. If you do all of that, I could not imagine you getting less than a 25 MCAT score. Your grades imply that you can do this.

If you are still considering the Caribbean route, make sure that you search SDN for threads about that if you haven't already. I personally know very little about those schools, but have read some compelling stories about those schools. Do NOT apply there until you look up those threads.

Edit: I previously just read the original post. Just now, I skimmed through some of the replies. You might be able to get an extra time accommodation for test anxiety and panic if that would help you. I would also suggest searching Psychology Today's listings, http://therapists.psychologytoday.com/rms/prof_search.php for a counselor to help you with test anxiety. Try out a few and see who helps you the most if you haven't done so already.

 

[QofQuimica]

Enjoying your support Q. Been having quite a bit of head shaking reading some of these boards lately. Nice to know there is another voice of reason out there. I appreciate you.

I appreciate you sticking around to provide your perspective and advice. Wish we had more senior trainees and attendings like you who were willing to answer the premeds' questions. :/

 

[cabinbuilder]

I appreciate you sticking around to provide your perspective and advice. Wish we had more senior trainees and attendings like you who were willing to answer the premeds' questions. :/

Fortunately for me my days in urgent care are feast or famine so I have time to peruse and comment and things that make me crazy.