Low GPA, Non-Traditional VMCAS Applicant

[ryanjoseph1906]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Hello! I am going to be 26 this year and I am just looking for some guidance as to what to do here. This is my 3rd VMCAS application and I have once again been rejected from all schools, which is to be expected with my academic background. My cGPA is a 2.49 (according to VMCAS w/ retakes) i did a postbacc program for 2 years after my undergraduate degree and that is the "average" that VMCAS came up with. My science pre-requsitie GPA is a 3.3 and last 45 hours is a 3.45.

I am aware that my cum GPA is low and i have done by hardest to improve in my few semester hours. I have taken biochem, organic chemistry, animal A&P, medical terminology all A's. That is why there is a huge jump from my science pre-req GPA and last 45 hours and my cum GPA is still low.

I have exceptional experience in large animal, Small animal, ER, Specialty, exotics, shelter med etc, (over 30,000 hours)
research hours
6 recommendations (4 vets, two that are boarded, academic advisor and supervisor)
essays are flawless according to vet students and admissions reviews of my applications in the past.

Its just my academic background that is preventing me from getting an interview

I have consulted with vets, academic advisors and even other vet students who got in with low GPA's. Some give words of encouragement, others have told me that me getting in is probably unlikely and that I should consider "vet tech school".

I applied to 5 schools this cycle Virginia Maryland (my instate), Lincoln Memorial, Iowa State, Ross and SGU. Denied from all, except Iowa I have yet to hear back from them.

any advice on what I should consider? I am applying to LMU's Masters program and I applied to some other masters programs and hopefully I get into one of those.

This is my dream and I have no desire to do anything else other than be a veterinarian. Any advice on what to do moving forward or what I can do?

Thanks so much!

 

[pp9]

Hello! I am going to be 26 this year and I am just looking for some guidance as to what to do here. This is my 3rd VMCAS application and I have once again been rejected from all schools, which is to be expected with my academic background. My cGPA is a 2.49 (according to VMCAS w/ retakes) i did a postbacc program for 2 years after my undergraduate degree and that is the "average" that VMCAS came up with. My science pre-requsitie GPA is a 3.3 and last 45 hours is a 3.45.

I am aware that my cum GPA is low and i have done by hardest to improve in my few semester hours. I have taken biochem, organic chemistry, animal A&P, medical terminology all A's. That is why there is a huge jump from my science pre-req GPA and last 45 hours and my cum GPA is still low.

I have exceptional experience in large animal, Small animal, ER, Specialty, exotics, shelter med etc, (over 30,000 hours)
research hours
6 recommendations (4 vets, two that are boarded, academic advisor and supervisor)
essays are flawless according to vet students and admissions reviews of my applications in the past.

Its just my academic background that is preventing me from getting an interview

I have consulted with vets, academic advisors and even other vet students who got in with low GPA's. Some give words of encouragement, others have told me that me getting in is probably unlikely and that I should consider "vet tech school".

I applied to 5 schools this cycle Virginia Maryland (my instate), Lincoln Memorial, Iowa State, Ross and SGU. Denied from all, except Iowa I have yet to hear back from them.

any advice on what I should consider? I am applying to LMU's Masters program and I applied to some other masters programs and hopefully I get into one of those.

This is my dream and I have no desire to do anything else other than be a veterinarian. Any advice on what to do moving forward or what I can do?

Thanks so much!

You are throwing your money away with your school choices.

Lincoln Memorial says they will only consider applicants with cGPAs <2.8 on a "case by case" basis. You need to figure out what needs to happen to be considered by them. Is there a process you don't know about? Do you have to provide additional information somehow? Contact the school.

Iowa's published cGPA minimum is 2.5. I don't know how lenient they are with it, but you objectively do not qualify for consideration there. I can't find VMCVM's minimum (Reddit says 3.0 but I just can't find it on their website), but 2.5 is the lowest published minimum you'll see. I don't think the island schools have minimum cGPA requirements, but that doesn't mean they don't have an internal cutoff.

I can all but guarantee your cGPA is causing you to be auto-rejected by schools that consider cGPA. A lot/all schools make an initial cut on academics alone, and your cGPA is not going to survive those cuts. You should only apply to schools that look at science and last 45 for your best chances, but being below a 3.5 in those categories might still give you some trouble.

If you are going to go through with a master's you need to do a lot more research than you have been (sorry, but it's true) when it comes to determining which schools will utilize master's credits more effectively than others.

I am guessing that you already have a degree - you are not going to significantly budge a cGPA that low once you have that many credits, so get the idea of that out of your mind. Focus on improving your science/last 45 GPAs and school choices.

admissions reviews of my applications in the past.

If you've had file reviews, surely they told you that your cGPA is your biggest problem?

 

[ryanjoseph1906]

You are throwing your money away with your school choices.

Lincoln Memorial says they will only consider applicants with cGPAs <2.8 on a "case by case" basis. You need to figure out what needs to happen to be considered by them. Is there a process you don't know about? Do you have to provide additional information somehow? Contact the school.

Iowa's published cGPA minimum is 2.5. I don't know how lenient they are with it, but you objectively do not qualify for consideration there. I can't find VMCVM's minimum (Reddit says 3.0 but I just can't find it on their website), but 2.5 is the lowest published minimum you'll see. I don't think the island schools have minimum cGPA requirements, but that doesn't mean they don't have an internal cutoff.

I can all but guarantee your cGPA is causing you to be auto-rejected by schools that consider cGPA. A lot/all schools make an initial cut on academics alone, and your cGPA is not going to survive those cuts. You should only apply to schools that look at science and last 45 for your best chances, but being below a 3.5 in those categories might still give you some trouble.

If you are going to go through with a master's you need to do a lot more research than you have been (sorry, but it's true) when it comes to determining which schools will utilize master's credits more effectively than others.

I am guessing that you already have a degree - you are not going to significantly budge a cGPA that low once you have that many credits, so get the idea of that out of your mind. Focus on improving your science/last 45 GPAs and school choices.


If you've had file reviews, surely they told you that your cGPA is your biggest problem?

Yes! Last cycle I was told it use due to my cGPA and the pool of competitive applicants. I was told to take more advanced science courses and improve my last 45 hours and science GPA.

VMCVM does not have a minimum GPA and LMU will consider people <2.8 on a "case by case" basis. Iowa I did apply and they consider grade replacement and I already made it past the academic review with them because I have over a 2.5 cum GPA with retakes (according to them) and over a 2.8 pre-requisite science GPA. So I don't believe I am being auto-rejected.

I was recommended by LMU last cycle to apply to their Masters program, and VMCVM, LMU and Iowa all have told me that they would evaluate my masters courses and credits. I am considering Kansas State, Michigan State and Mississippi and UofA for next cycle.

 

[JaynaAli]

I agree with everything pp9 said. There was another thread over in the pre-vet WAMC thread recently (where this probably should have gone tbh and might get moved by a mod) with another applicant who had a poor cGPA. OP of that thread’s username had something khaos in it. I’d recommend you go read that thread because it’s really the same advice. Your chances are definitely low with that cGPA and you need to know absolutely what every school you apply to has for minimums and how they calculate their GPAs so you’re not wasting your money when applying there. A masters may be helpful but I’m not confident it’ll be enough. You’ll have to find the schools that either replace grades, only look at a prereq GPA, require classwork to be recent, or whatnot.

But also…30,000 hours of vet experience seems improbable at the age of 25/about to be 26, are you sure that’s accurate and realistic? Full time 40 hours a week is 2,080 hours a year…30,000 would be 14 years of full time work, so did you start working full time at 12? Even if you’re working like long 12 hr shifts five days a week and not taking vacations that’s more than 8-10 yrs full time employment. How’d you go to school and sleep with that number of experience hours? You probably graduated high school 70,000 hours ago (aka 8 years), and like half of that time was spent getting experience? I can maybe see 30,000 hours if a parent or other caregiver is a vet and you’ve been at the clinic since you were an infant perhaps, but otherwise it seems to be an extreme outlier for your age. I’m not saying tons of experience is bad in any way and if it’s real, it’s real, but it was part of your info that made me think…what?

 

[pp9]

VMCVM does not have a minimum GPA and LMU will consider people <2.8 on a "case by case" basis.

Correct. So do you need to petition for consideration? I truly don't know, but would verify with the school if you don't know for sure either.

I have over a 2.5 cum GPA with retakes (according to them) and over a 2.8 pre-requisite science GPA. So I don't believe I am being auto-rejected.

You didn't mention these other GPAs for us to go off of, but they are still quite low. Anything below a 3.0 is still very uncompetitive for vet school, so there is a good chance you are still not making it past the initial academic cuts that a lot of schools make. Their minimum GPA may be 2.5, but that doesn't mean they aren't making initial cuts at 3.3, for example. Even before the recent years of increased competition, successful applicants with GPAs <3.0 were uncommon.

@supershorty is probably going to move this thread to the WAMC sub-forum....utilize the format recommended there and give as much detail as possible. I'm still thinking the problems here is your school choice and cGPA, though.

I was recommended by LMU last cycle to apply to their Masters program

Of course they did. They financially benefit from you paying them for a degree that may or may not do anything for you.

Moral of the story:
1. Hit the books and really research every school to determine where you are most competitive. This likely involves hand-calculating GPAs for each school according to their pre-reqs, how they approach repeated courses, etc. Gonna take you a while.
2. Read the thread that Jayna suggested.
3. Only get a master's degree if you're really going to use it. A master's is not going to make you more competitive automatically. It can help you, but only at certain schools and in certain circumstances.

 

[ryanjoseph1906]

I agree with everything pp9 said. There was another thread over in the pre-vet WAMC thread recently (where this probably should have gone tbh and might get moved by a mod) with another applicant who had a poor cGPA. OP of that thread’s username had something khaos in it. I’d recommend you go read that thread because it’s really the same advice. Your chances are definitely low with that cGPA and you need to know absolutely what every school you apply to has for minimums and how they calculate their GPAs so you’re not wasting your money when applying there. A masters may be helpful but I’m not confident it’ll be enough. You’ll have to find the schools that either replace grades, only look at a prereq GPA, require classwork to be recent, or whatnot.

But also…30,000 hours of vet experience seems improbable at the age of 25/about to be 26, are you sure that’s accurate and realistic? Full time 40 hours a week is 2,080 hours a year…30,000 would be 14 years of full time work, so did you start working full time at 12? Even if you’re working like long 12 hr shifts five days a week and not taking vacations that’s more than 8-10 yrs full time employment. How’d you go to school and sleep with that number of experience hours? You probably graduated high school 70,000 hours ago (aka 8 years), and like half of that time was spent getting experience? I can maybe see 30,000 hours if a parent or other caregiver is a vet and you’ve been at the clinic since you were an infant perhaps, but otherwise it seems to be an extreme outlier for your age. I’m not saying tons of experience is bad in any way and if it’s real, it’s real, but it was part of your info that made me think…what?

Hi! I am sorry I miss typed the 30,000 hours, I meant over 3,000 hours of veterinary experience. Animal and veterinary experience hours combined is almost 8,000.

However, I have been working/volunteering/shadowing in clinics since 2016.

and thanks for your advice, however my pre-req GPA and last 45 hours GPA are not terrible. I think adding in 30 credits of a masters if I get over a 3.7+ matched with a last 45 hours that is already a 3.4ish would be competitive. Even with a cum GPA of 2.7-2.8 (with an added masters credits) shows great academic trajectory maybe?

After a review with VAMD and LMU last cycle. They really look at academic trajectory and I know some current students who had a cum GPA around the 2.6 range who were successful at getting into those programs.

 

[ryanjoseph1906]

Correct. So do you need to petition for consideration? I truly don't know, but would verify with the school if you don't know for sure either.


You didn't mention these other GPAs for us to go off of, but they are still quite low. Anything below a 3.0 is still very uncompetitive for vet school, so there is a good chance you are still not making it past the initial academic cuts that a lot of schools make. Their minimum GPA may be 2.5, but that doesn't mean they aren't making initial cuts at 3.3, for example. Even before the recent years of increased competition, successful applicants with GPAs <3.0 were uncommon.

@supershorty is probably going to move this thread to the WAMC sub-forum....utilize the format recommended there and give as much detail as possible. I'm still thinking the problems here is your school choice and cGPA, though.


Of course they did. They financially benefit from you paying them for a degree that may or may not do anything for you.

Moral of the story:
1. Hit the books and really research every school to determine where you are most competitive. This likely involves hand-calculating GPAs for each school according to their pre-reqs, how they approach repeated courses, etc. Gonna take you a while.
2. Read the thread that Jayna suggested.
3. Only get a master's degree if you're really going to use it. A master's is not going to make you more competitive automatically. It can help you, but only at certain schools and in certain circumstances.

Okay great ! Thanks for the suggestion for the other forum !

 

[JaynaAli]

. I think adding in 30 credits of a masters if I get over a 3.7+ matched with a last 45 hours that is already a 3.4ish would be competitive. Even with a cum GPA of 2.7-2.8 (with an added masters credits) shows great academic trajectory maybe?

But that’s the point PP and I were making…some schools may not care about the masters much at all. For example, Oklahoma State (which I know isn’t a school you’ve mentioned but it’s one I’m familiar with) mostly looks at pre-req GPA. I think cGPA factors in a little maybe but they mostly care about that core GPA, or at least they did when I was giving prospective student tours. They won’t factor in a masters much if at all, but if your prereq GPA is higher than your cGPA you may look good on paper there. The Illinois website says they will only factor in 8 hours of masters credits into your science GPA, so if you applied there after doing a masters it will help a little, but not 30+ credits worth, just 8. That’s why we’ve said make sure you do the research and apply smartly. An upward trend and a high last 45 is great but if you’re not meeting ALL the minimums however the schools calculate them it won’t matter because if you’re under on another category they’ll toss your app before it’s evaluated. So apply smartly. It’s not impossible for you to get in but it’ll require a lot of legwork on your end to figure out where you look good on paper and where you aren’t as competitive.

 

[ryanjoseph1906]

But that’s the point PP and I were making…some schools may not care about the masters much at all. For example, Oklahoma State (which I know isn’t a school you’ve mentioned but it’s one I’m familiar with) mostly looks at pre-req GPA. I think cGPA factors in a little maybe but they mostly care about that core GPA, or at least they did when I was giving prospective student tours. They won’t factor in a masters much if at all, but if your prereq GPA is higher than your cGPA you may look good on paper there. The Illinois website says they will only factor in 8 hours of masters credits into your science GPA, so if you applied there after doing a masters it will help a little, but not 30+ credits worth, just 8. That’s why we’ve said make sure you do the research and apply smartly. An upward trend and a high last 45 is great but if you’re not meeting ALL the minimums however the schools calculate them it won’t matter because if you’re under on another category they’ll toss your app before it’s evaluated. So apply smartly. It’s not impossible for you to get in but it’ll require a lot of legwork on your end to figure out where you look good on paper and where you aren’t as competitive.

Okay gotcha! I appreciate it and I have done my research on the schools that I have applied too. I have only looked into schools that either have no minimum or do not look at cum GPA as a whole

VMCVM - no minimum GPA in all catergories
LMU - 2.8cum GPA minimum (however can and will make special consideration on a case by case basis, with exceptional academic resilence in the last 60 hours of coursework - i feel as if I possess this with my last 45 hours and science pre-req GPA)
Iowa - 2.5 minimum (I meet) and 2.8 science pre-requisite GPA ( i meet)
Ross - no minimum
SGU - no minimum

Is there any other schools I should consider?

I was looking at Kansas State and Michigan State (does not look at cum GPA at all, only looks at Pre-req Science GPA and Last 45 hours.)

 

[indysadventures]

Okay gotcha! I appreciate it and I have done my research on the schools that I have applied too. I have only looked into schools that either have no minimum or do not look at cum GPA as a whole

VMCVM - no minimum GPA in all catergories
LMU - 2.8cum GPA minimum (however can and will make special consideration on a case by case basis, with exceptional academic resilence in the last 60 hours of coursework - i feel as if I possess this with my last 45 hours and science pre-req GPA)
Iowa - 2.5 minimum (I meet) and 2.8 science pre-requisite GPA ( i meet)
Ross - no minimum
SGU - no minimum

Is there any other schools I should consider?

I was looking at Kansas State and Michigan State (does not look at cum GPA at all, only looks at Pre-req Science GPA and Last 45 hours.)

Michigan State I believe would be worth your time, but you need all your prerequisites finished for them in order to apply so check now to make sure.

Have you talked with Iowa in order to make sure you’re on their radar? I think they would probably be willing to give you an honest opinion about your likelihood of real consideration.

I think you’re going to run into the issue of still being at an uncompetitive GPA despite improvement, and it will hurt you in a tie-breaker every time. Maybe consider retaking classes that are prerequisites that you scored poorly in, as well as adding some upper level biomedical classes to really show that you are prepared for vet school?

I’d do this rather than investing in a masters degree- it’s cheaper, you’ll have more options, and it will move your GPA more, specifically your last 45 and science/prerequisite.

 

[ryanjoseph1906]

Michigan State I believe would be worth your time, but you need all your prerequisites finished for them in order to apply so check now to make sure.

Have you talked with Iowa in order to make sure you’re on their radar? I think they would probably be willing to give you an honest opinion about your likelihood of real consideration.

I think you’re going to run into the issue of still being at an uncompetitive GPA despite improvement, and it will hurt you in a tie-breaker every time. Maybe consider retaking classes that are prerequisites that you scored poorly in, as well as adding some upper level biomedical classes to really show that you are prepared for vet school?

I’d do this rather than investing in a masters degree- it’s cheaper, you’ll have more options, and it will move your GPA more, specifically your last 45 and science/prerequisite.

When I contacted Iowa admissions this is word for word what was said (just copy and pasted the email) "

"We only use the cumulative GPA when determining if you may apply because a 2.50 cumulative undergraduate GPA is required. You have a 2.50 cumulative GPA so you are OK.



I went ahead and calculated your initial required science GPA and it is a 3.12. You are over the 2.80 required science GPA needed so your application will be sent for full file review. I did not calculate your last 45 credit GPA which will be done after Fall 2024 transcripts are received. Your required science GPA will also be recalculated at this time."

I mean I believe this is stating that they are going to do a full review of my application including my Casper + my experiences and essays. Also I have retaken all of the courses that I could. I have nothing less than a B minus in any prerequisite courses that I have gotten anything less than a B in. I afraid the only thing I can do is apply for a masters at this point?

 

[indysadventures]

When I contacted Iowa admissions this is word for word what was said (just copy and pasted the email) "

"We only use the cumulative GPA when determining if you may apply because a 2.50 cumulative undergraduate GPA is required. You have a 2.50 cumulative GPA so you are OK.



I went ahead and calculated your initial required science GPA and it is a 3.12. You are over the 2.80 required science GPA needed so your application will be sent for full file review. I did not calculate your last 45 credit GPA which will be done after Fall 2024 transcripts are received. Your required science GPA will also be recalculated at this time."

I mean I believe this is stating that they are going to do a full review of my application including my Casper + my experiences and essays. Also I have retaken all of the courses that I could. I have nothing less than a B minus in any prerequisite courses that I have gotten anything less than a B in. I afraid the only thing I can do is apply for a masters at this point?

I think that retaking courses where you got a B- could be helpful if you know you could knock it out of the park. I’d also encourage you to take upper-level but undergraduate biomedical courses- if you are dead-set on being a vet, a master’s degree honestly won’t help you a ton regarding school admission. Take a look at a few threads, there are others who have tried this route, and have discovered that their master’s hasn’t been considered heavily at all. Just make sure you know what you’re getting into.

 

[pp9]

I afraid the only thing I can do is apply for a masters at this point?

Maybe, if you chose your schools well. Without reading through all of your transcripts (not that I'm asking for them), it's hard to know how much else you can do to improve your cGPA. We don't know if you have prereqs with really low grades, gen ed courses, etc. Certain schools allow you to petition to have grades deleted - I've seen the ability to delete courses that are 6+ years old, and/or the ability to delete the entire first year of your undergrad career. That can help, but of course you would have to repeat any prereqs that would be deleted by doing that.

Have you scheduled appointments with admissions advisors at any schools? Everything suggested on here is absolutely valid, but some of these cases are a bit complicated and it gets hard to give good advice when we don't have all of the information (which we can't always get in an online forum that's supposed to be anonymous).

I also want to say that I think repeating courses is reasonable, but anything below a B- seems a bit high. I'd say anything below a C/C- (some schools won't accept less than a C or C- anyways, iirc). Personally, anything I got a B- in was probably not something I'd be able to guarantee getting a better grade in unless it was the only course I was taking at the time (or at least, not a full load of credits with it). If I had gotten C/D's or failed a course, I'd be more confident that I could probably do a bit better and a higher grade would get me farther. I only say this because repeating courses gets expensive. It's not as costly as a master's but can still be expensy, so it would make sense to choose your repeated courses wisely.

 

[indysadventures]

Maybe, if you chose your schools well. Without reading through all of your transcripts (not that I'm asking for them), it's hard to know how much else you can do to improve your cGPA. We don't know if you have prereqs with really low grades, gen ed courses, etc. Certain schools allow you to petition to have grades deleted - I've seen the ability to delete courses that are 6+ years old, and/or the ability to delete the entire first year of your undergrad career. That can help, but of course you would have to repeat any prereqs that would be deleted by doing that.

Have you scheduled appointments with admissions advisors at any schools? Everything suggested on here is absolutely valid, but some of these cases are a bit complicated and it gets hard to give good advice when we don't have all of the information (which we can't always get in an online forum that's supposed to be anonymous).

I also want to say that I think repeating courses is reasonable, but anything below a B- seems a bit high. I'd say anything below a C/C- (some schools won't accept less than a C or C- anyways, iirc). Personally, anything I got a B- in was probably not something I'd be able to guarantee getting a better grade in unless it was the only course I was taking at the time (or at least, not a full load of credits with it). If I had gotten C/D's or failed a course, I'd be more confident that I could probably do a bit better and a higher grade would get me farther. I only say this because repeating courses gets expensive. It's not as costly as a master's but can still be expensy, so it would make sense to choose your repeated courses wisely.

I think this is really valid. As a non-traditional applicant, the advice I was given by admissions officers quite genuinely changed the course of my trajectory and helped me successfully apply.

I think OP should seriously consider this advice and build from what these officers might have to say. They also will likely not be able to give you advice about your previous applications, but can give you advice about going forward, so just be aware.

I agree about the B- courses, unless you know you can get an A, you’re not getting maximum reward.