Low stat Army vet with upcoming T20 interview. Hoping for advice.

[whorobbedthewoods]

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Hi all, I’m looking for some guidance and insight:

I have an interview coming up at Mt. Sinai. This was a delusional, starry-eyed reach for me--I have a 67 LM: <10th percentile MCAT, <25th percentile GPA. I didn’t have any research before my gap year. My clinical exposure is quite low. No prestigious awards. Graduated from my state school. Not URM. I included a few T20 (T25?) schools that I really loved because, according to multiple sources, military service is highly valued. I had the savings, so I decided to try.

I THINK the strengths of my application make me best suited for low tier schools with a strong service bent. I highlighted recurring themes like public health, social justice, compassionate leadership, and cultural competence. My other interviews are from Loyola (accepted), Maryland (state school) (waitlisted), and EVMS (upcoming). These interviews felt/feel easier to anticipate, as I can more clearly understand what they’d see in me--that is, my impression of my own application seemed to align more organically with their stats, mission, matriculant profile, etc.

I’ve also received several pre-II rejections from both mid and top tier schools alike, including Georgetown, Tufts, Dartmouth, Brown, and Tulane. While most are low-yield, they also have a reputation for loving non-trads, veterans, and "do-gooders." I’d concluded my stats were too low and/or my narrative was not compelling enough.

Enter my Sinai interview...where of course I want to do well. Ideally, I’d like to go in with some strong sense of what they liked about me--not only to steady my confidence, but also to help me highlight those elements they considered strengths. But now I’m a little distrustful of my evaluation of my application. Given they have their choice of top-tier candidates, I'm unsure what they saw in my application that mid tiers did not.

I’ve reviewed my application inside and out, and I’ve read everything on their website. I do feel that my app fulfills their “desired intangibles”...but not SO much that it compensates for low stats, low clinical, and no research. Could I be missing something? Can anyone offer insight into how I can best prepare for this interview? Perhaps I’m overthinking, but I want to put my best foot forward.

 

[bball0718]

This was a delusional, starry-eyed reach for me--I have a 67 LM: <10th percentile MCAT, <25th percentile GPA.

Numbers don't get into medical school, people do. You would not have gotten an interview if they did not see something in your app that impressed them. I guess the question isn't trying to figure out what they saw in your application that they didn't see in other "top-tier candidates", but what you see in yourself that makes YOU believe you will be a great doctor. I have basically no research and weak clinical experience but interviews have been great for me because I've been able to turn the conversation towards the experiences that I feel set me apart from other applicants. No two applications are alike, so I think you should embrace what makes yours different (in a good way, of course).

Good luck!

 

[Goro]

Hi all, I’m looking for some guidance and insight:

I have an interview coming up at Mt. Sinai. This was a delusional, starry-eyed reach for me--I have a 67 LM: <10th percentile MCAT, <25th percentile GPA. I didn’t have any research before my gap year. My clinical exposure is quite low. No prestigious awards. Graduated from my state school. Not URM. I included a few T20 (T25?) schools that I really loved because, according to multiple sources, military service is highly valued. I had the savings, so I decided to try.

I THINK the strengths of my application make me best suited for low tier schools with a strong service bent. I highlighted recurring themes like public health, social justice, compassionate leadership, and cultural competence. My other interviews are from Loyola (accepted), Maryland (state school) (waitlisted), and EVMS (upcoming). These interviews felt/feel easier to anticipate, as I can more clearly understand what they’d see in me--that is, my impression of my own application seemed to align more organically with their stats, mission, matriculant profile, etc.

I’ve also received several pre-II rejections from both mid and top tier schools alike, including Georgetown, Tufts, Dartmouth, Brown, and Tulane. While most are low-yield, they also have a reputation for loving non-trads, veterans, and "do-gooders." I’d concluded my stats were too low and/or my narrative was not compelling enough.

Enter my Sinai interview...where of course I want to do well. Ideally, I’d like to go in with some strong sense of what they liked about me--not only to steady my confidence, but also to help me highlight those elements they considered strengths. But now I’m a little distrustful of my evaluation of my application. Given they have their choice of top-tier candidates, I'm unsure what they saw in my application that mid tiers did not.

I’ve reviewed my application inside and out, and I’ve read everything on their website. I do feel that my app fulfills their “desired intangibles”...but not SO much that it compensates for low stats, low clinical, and no research. Could I be missing something? Can anyone offer insight into how I can best prepare for this interview? Perhaps I’m overthinking, but I want to put my best foot forward.

Many thanks for your service to our country.

Read this:

• Goro's Guide to Interviews
• Goro's Guide to Interviews: The View from Behind the Curtain
• Goro's Guide to YOUR Interview Questions (2018 edition)

 

[doc05]

Hi all, I’m looking for some guidance and insight:

I have an interview coming up at Mt. Sinai. This was a delusional, starry-eyed reach for me--I have a 67 LM: <10th percentile MCAT, <25th percentile GPA. I didn’t have any research before my gap year. My clinical exposure is quite low. No prestigious awards. Graduated from my state school. Not URM. I included a few T20 (T25?) schools that I really loved because, according to multiple sources, military service is highly valued. I had the savings, so I decided to try.

I THINK the strengths of my application make me best suited for low tier schools with a strong service bent. I highlighted recurring themes like public health, social justice, compassionate leadership, and cultural competence. My other interviews are from Loyola (accepted), Maryland (state school) (waitlisted), and EVMS (upcoming). These interviews felt/feel easier to anticipate, as I can more clearly understand what they’d see in me--that is, my impression of my own application seemed to align more organically with their stats, mission, matriculant profile, etc.

I’ve also received several pre-II rejections from both mid and top tier schools alike, including Georgetown, Tufts, Dartmouth, Brown, and Tulane. While most are low-yield, they also have a reputation for loving non-trads, veterans, and "do-gooders." I’d concluded my stats were too low and/or my narrative was not compelling enough.

Enter my Sinai interview...where of course I want to do well. Ideally, I’d like to go in with some strong sense of what they liked about me--not only to steady my confidence, but also to help me highlight those elements they considered strengths. But now I’m a little distrustful of my evaluation of my application. Given they have their choice of top-tier candidates, I'm unsure what they saw in my application that mid tiers did not.

I’ve reviewed my application inside and out, and I’ve read everything on their website. I do feel that my app fulfills their “desired intangibles”...but not SO much that it compensates for low stats, low clinical, and no research. Could I be missing something? Can anyone offer insight into how I can best prepare for this interview? Perhaps I’m overthinking, but I want to put my best foot forward.

Something to keep in mind: I work with doctors who've graduated from all sorts of different "tiers" of med school, and there's no difference. In fact, some of the biggest *****s I've worked with, who've lacked all manner of common sense, have been "top-20" grads. So it doesn't matter. You've already got an acceptance. Done.

But, if you really want to go to this school, stress your army background. It's impressive. Keep in mind that most doctors are complete wimps and would never have the guts to volunteer for the military. Talk about all the great things you learned in the service. It will humble your interviewers and make them want to accept you.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

It will humble your interviewers and make them want to accept you.

I don’t know if I would use that exact wording, but I agree with the sentiment. At the civilian schools I interviewed at, they asked me to talk a little about my military career. It was very, very positively received and I had more than one interviewer skip questions about leadership and the like because they knew I must have great experience from the military.

 

[LizzyM]

If you look at a map, you 'll see that Mount Sinai borders Central Park and is north of the very posh Upper East Side of Manhattan and nestled against Spanish Harlem and just south of Harlem itself. It has a MPH program within the medical school. Social justice is huge as is cultural competence given the location.

Be yourself. Your numbers were "good enough" that the adcom can see you being able to handle things academically (let's face it, this school has so much confidence in students being able to handle the curriculum that it even admits some who haven't taken o-chem but who have humanities backgrounds). Let them see your heart & soul and they'll be sold on you as a candidate for admission.

 

[whorobbedthewoods]

Thank you everyone for your thoughtful feedback. I believe I represented myself faithfully in my application, so--as you all advise--I'll try to be myself and focus on my strengths (as I see them). And hopefully they like me!

Something to keep in mind: I work with doctors who've graduated from all sorts of different "tiers" of med school, and there's no difference. In fact, some of the biggest *****s I've worked with, who've lacked all manner of common sense, have been "top-20" grads. So it doesn't matter. You've already got an acceptance. Done.

I hear you. I'm proud of my Loyola acceptance and would be thrilled to attend in the fall. But I'd be pretty disingenuous to pretend that this opportunity isn't really, really exciting, especially considering that (statistically) my chances were vanishingly small. I intend to make the best of my medical school education regardless of where I end up!

 

[PreMedMissteps]

Hi all, I’m looking for some guidance and insight:

I have an interview coming up at Mt. Sinai. This was a delusional, starry-eyed reach for me--I have a 67 LM: <10th percentile MCAT, <25th percentile GPA. I didn’t have any research before my gap year. My clinical exposure is quite low. No prestigious awards. Graduated from my state school. Not URM. I included a few T20 (T25?) schools that I really loved because, according to multiple sources, military service is highly valued. I had the savings, so I decided to try.

I THINK the strengths of my application make me best suited for low tier schools with a strong service bent. I highlighted recurring themes like public health, social justice, compassionate leadership, and cultural competence. My other interviews are from Loyola (accepted), Maryland (state school) (waitlisted), and EVMS (upcoming). These interviews felt/feel easier to anticipate, as I can more clearly understand what they’d see in me--that is, my impression of my own application seemed to align more organically with their stats, mission, matriculant profile, etc.

I’ve also received several pre-II rejections from both mid and top tier schools alike, including Georgetown, Tufts, Dartmouth, Brown, and Tulane. While most are low-yield, they also have a reputation for loving non-trads, veterans, and "do-gooders." I’d concluded my stats were too low and/or my narrative was not compelling enough.

Enter my Sinai interview...where of course I want to do well. Ideally, I’d like to go in with some strong sense of what they liked about me--not only to steady my confidence, but also to help me highlight those elements they considered strengths. But now I’m a little distrustful of my evaluation of my application. Given they have their choice of top-tier candidates, I'm unsure what they saw in my application that mid tiers did not.

I’ve reviewed my application inside and out, and I’ve read everything on their website. I do feel that my app fulfills their “desired intangibles”...but not SO much that it compensates for low stats, low clinical, and no research. Could I be missing something? Can anyone offer insight into how I can best prepare for this interview? Perhaps I’m overthinking, but I want to put my best foot forward.

They deemed you worthy, hence the interview. Do you know if the interview is blind?

Thank you for your service to our country. Were you a medic or something else medically-related?

And....Congratulations!!! On the acceptance to Loyola! You’re going to med school!

 

[whorobbedthewoods]

They deemed you worthy, hence the interview. Do you know if the interview is blind?

Thank you for your service to our country. Were you a medic or something else medically-related?

And....Congratulations!!! On the acceptance to Loyola! You’re going to med school!

Thank you!! According to the Icahn school-specific thread, the interview is traditional open file with one faculty member and one student.

And my Army job wasn't medical/clinical at all--I was an Arabic linguist / signals intelligence analyst.

 

[PreMedMissteps]

Thank you!! According to the Icahn school-specific thread, the interview is traditional open file with one faculty member and one student.

And my Army job wasn't medical/clinical at all--I was an Arabic linguist / signals intelligence analyst.

Ok, so your interviewers will have your file. You’re a nontrad. You’re a vet. That’s what they’re seeing. You’re not a college senior.

Do you have an upward trend GPA? Was your GPA negatively affected by classes that you took several years ago?

Try to imagine what sort of questions they’re going to ask you, a nontrad vet. Is there anything in the PS that would have piqued their interest and want to ask you more about? What was your PS about?

Maybe some here, like @Goro @LizzyM @gyngyn can suggest some questions they might have asked you if you were in front of them.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Also be prepared to talk about everything in your app that isn’t the military. That happened to me at one of my interviews. They said thanks for your service and then didn’t ask specifically about my military activities at all. I brought them up once or twice when they asked about leadership and working in small groups, but they asked about basically every other activity on my app.

But you can totally tie it in even if they don’t ask. They ask about leadership? If you were ever in a leadership role, that’s great. Teamwork? Easy. Adjusting to working long hours and performing under stress and fatigue? Easy.

 

[whorobbedthewoods]

Do you have an upward trend GPA? Was your GPA negatively affected by classes that you took several years ago?

Try to imagine what sort of questions they’re going to ask you, a nontrad vet. Is there anything in the PS that would have piqued their interest and want to ask you more about? What was your PS about?

I have an upward trend, but not too dramatic. I had a couple of C's and W's back in the day--when I left college for the Army, my GPA was maybe 3.4ish. My recent coursework (almost exclusively science) is a little over 3.7--nothing lower than a B/B+ (physics, biochem, calculus) and mostly A/A- (bio, gen chem, o-chem, stats). So I suppose someone looking closely at my transcript of 200+ credits would see a marked improvement in my academic performance from the past to the present.

If they had also read my work/activities section, I don't think anything in my PS would surprise them (discussion of Army, clinical, service work). I wanted my application to feel coherent as a whole, so I used my PS as an opportunity to weave individual elements in my app into a long-form "why medicine" narrative. It does maybe fall a bit on the creative side (with restraint I hope), which I understand can be a turn-off. But I consider writing to be a strength, so I decided to take this measured risk.

Thanks for asking these questions! Whether or not it helps me anticipate their questions outright, it certainly helps me think more critically and thoroughly about my application.

Also, I have a lot of faith & trust in my LOR writers, but my understanding is these usually carry more weight after the interview--i.e. LORs won't do much to get you to the door.

 

[DokterMom]

I think what they're going to see is maturity, leadership, service and diversity -- someone who brings to the student body a more nuanced view of life and its complexity.

If you're prone to stereotyping, the military skews conservative and red and 'social justice' folks skew blue and liberal. You've somehow managed to navigate the entire spectrum and that seems to be vanishingly rare these days. Passion without prejudice.

Be who you are. That's what they saw and liked.

(And congratulations! )

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

If you're prone to stereotyping, the military skews conservative and red and 'social justice' folks skew blue and liberal.

It’s a shame that people still stereotype that way. At all three of the permanent commands I’ve been stationed at, there has been a sizable number of progressive and liberal sailors. All three commands had organizations within them to promote diversity and lgbt support. One of my commands even gave the “first kiss” at homecoming from deployment to a gay sailor and his husband, and I don’t recall anyone having an issue with it at all with the majority of people thinking it was great.

One day the stereotypes will change. Sigh.

But since they haven’t, I totally agree with your post. OP has a great app and has demonstrated a lot of versatility and progression. I’m expecting more acceptances on the way!

 

[PreMedMissteps]

Teamwork? Easy. Adjusting to working long hours and performing under stress and fatigue? Easy.

Winner!

 

[Gurby]

I just want to chime in and say not to be intimidated... I met a military vet on an interview at a low tier school, and then saw he ended up going to Harvard Med. You'll bring a lot of value and diversity to any class - don't sell yourself short.

 

[whorobbedthewoods]

If you're prone to stereotyping, the military skews conservative and red and 'social justice' folks skew blue and liberal. You've somehow managed to navigate the entire spectrum and that seems to be vanishingly rare these days. Passion without prejudice.

This hadn't occurred to me at all. Thank you for this insight!

It’s a shame that people still stereotype that way.

I agree that the stereotype isn't fair. There's certainly a variety of opinion among vets--I even have some limited experience in organizing progressive veterans, which I discussed in my app. But having spent just about my whole life around the military (Army brat), I understand completely why the stereotype exists. Thank you for your kind words! Even if it's all rejections from here, though, I've got my acceptance and that's what matters.

 

[mindlight1]

We're rooting for you! Hope to hear a great update 🙂

 

[seanm028]

It’s a shame that people still stereotype that way. At all three of the permanent commands I’ve been stationed at, there has been a sizable number of progressive and liberal sailors. All three commands had organizations within them to promote diversity and lgbt support. One of my commands even gave the “first kiss” at homecoming from deployment to a gay sailor and his husband, and I don’t recall anyone having an issue with it at all with the majority of people thinking it was great.

One day the stereotypes will change. Sigh.

But since they haven’t, I totally agree with your post. OP has a great app and has demonstrated a lot of versatility and progression. I’m expecting more acceptances on the way!

Great to hear you had such diverse commands! I wish I could say I've had the same experiences. I was on deployment during the last election... Oh boy. The stereotype was alive and well in my little world. I consider myself a pretty hardcore moderate (if that's even a thing), which led to a handful of people asking me to explain the "liberal perspective" on certain issues. I hardly felt qualified.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Great to hear you had such diverse commands! I wish I could say I've had the same experiences. I was on deployment during the last election... Oh boy. The stereotype was alive and well in my little world. I consider myself a pretty hardcore moderate (if that's even a thing), which led to a handful of people asking me to explain the "liberal perspective" on certain issues. I hardly felt qualified.

To be fair, I'm in the Navy which I think has always been a little more liberal than the Army.

 

[whorobbedthewoods]

To be fair, I'm in the Navy which I think has always been a little more liberal than the Army.

Bingo.

 

[whorobbedthewoods]

Hey everyone, just wanted to let you all know that I got the acceptance email from Sinai earlier this evening! Truly cannot overstate how happy I am! Thank you all so much for your input and encouragement. It was very helpful to me as I was preparing. I've been hopeful but not too optimistic--I loved my experience at the school, but I was really nervous at the interview and wasn't very confident in my performance. That combined with my late interview date had me pretty certain I would be waitlisted at best.

@Goro thank you for those links with your exhaustive interview tips! Like I said, I'm not sure how well I executed your advice, but I did take it to heart.

 

[Goro]

Hey everyone, just wanted to let you all know that I got the acceptance email from Sinai earlier this evening! Truly cannot overstate how happy I am! Thank you all so much for your input and encouragement. It was very helpful to me as I was preparing. I've been hopeful but not too optimistic--I loved my experience at the school, but I was really nervous at the interview and wasn't very confident in my performance. That combined with my late interview date had me pretty certain I would be waitlisted at best.

@Goro thank you for those links with your exhaustive interview tips! Like I said, I'm not sure how well I executed your advice, but I did take it to heart.

😍😍😍👍👍👍
Now go read this:

• Goro's Guide to Success in Medical School (2018 edition)

 

[givesumacceptpls]

Hey everyone, just wanted to let you all know that I got the acceptance email from Sinai earlier this evening! Truly cannot overstate how happy I am! Thank you all so much for your input and encouragement. It was very helpful to me as I was preparing. I've been hopeful but not too optimistic--I loved my experience at the school, but I was really nervous at the interview and wasn't very confident in my performance. That combined with my late interview date had me pretty certain I would be waitlisted at best.

@Goro thank you for those links with your exhaustive interview tips! Like I said, I'm not sure how well I executed your advice, but I did take it to heart.

That's outstanding!

 

[mindlight1]

So happy for you, OP!!!!!

 

[Pharaoh95]

These are the kind of success stories that warm my heart. Congratulations and thank you for your service!

 

[TempuraOreos]

These are the kind of success stories that warm my heart. Congratulations and thank you for your service!

Same thought. I love seeing people thrive and succeed like this. Congrats, are you committing to Sinai?

 

[Gurby]

Hey everyone, just wanted to let you all know that I got the acceptance email from Sinai earlier this evening!

 

[whorobbedthewoods]

Thank you all so much!! You are an amazing group of internet strangers!

Same thought. I love seeing people thrive and succeed like this. Congrats, are you committing to Sinai?

Almost definitely (so I guess the immediate answer is "not officially"). I want to make sure I've thought/talked through the details--finances, family situation, etc.--before I fully commit. I was afraid to do that before acceptance because I didn't want to get my hopes too high!

 

[TempuraOreos]

Thank you all so much!! You are an amazing group of internet strangers!



Almost definitely (so I guess the immediate answer is "not officially"). I want to make sure I've thought/talked through the details--finances, family situation, etc.--before I fully commit. I was afraid to do that before acceptance because I didn't want to get my hopes too high!

Awh that's awesome. Hopefully, it all gets sorted out.