M1 confused about pathology as a career

[ironhorse8]

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So, I went to the pathology interest group at my med school, thought it sounded like a pretty cool specialty. Then I found this thread? WOW.

1) I hate to rehash the many threads of arguing, but as an M1 who wants to have a job when I get done with school am I wasting my time thinking about pathology?

2)Are people on this thread intentionally trying to prevent me from over saturating the field?

3)Are the prospects for academic pathology better?

4)Can you name some "types" of medicine that I should look into instead (i.e. ones that will lead to a job)? I am open to anything at this point and my interests are very diversified.

 

[LADoc00]

Well you are kinda in trouble in medicine regardless of the field you choose.

I would HIGHLY advise you to:
1.) take out the absolute minimal amount of debt possible.
2.) if you have NO parental help, consider at least for a bit some other way of pre-emptively NOT racking up debt like a military scholarship.
3.) do not burden yourself with unneccessary relationships with the opposite sex that will consume energy, limited financial resources and time. aka proceed to hook up lifestyle or become celibate based on your religious/spiritual world view, masturbation would be an option in both cases I guess depending on your schedule.
4.) focus down on a field which is NOT threatened by extender mission creep..ie- eliminate primary care fields.
5.) also sideline fields which have reached supersaturation levels and threatened by outsourcing, which would include both Rads and Path Im afraid.

If you are independantly wealthy, ignore 1-5 and proceed as your 1%'er heart desires (or hopefully your 0.1%'er heart).

 

[ironhorse8]

Well you are kinda in trouble in medicine regardless of the field you choose.

I would HIGHLY advise you to:
1.) take out the absolute minimal amount of debt possible.
2.) if you have NO parental help, consider at least for a bit some other way of pre-emptively NOT racking up debt like a military scholarship.
3.) do not burden yourself with unneccessary relationships with the opposite sex that will consume energy, limited financial resources and time. aka proceed to hook up lifestyle or become celibate based on your religious/spiritual world view, masturbation would be an option in both cases I guess depending on your schedule.
4.) focus down on a field which is NOT threatened by extender mission creep..ie- eliminate primary care fields.
5.) also sideline fields which have reached supersaturation levels and threatened by outsourcing, which would include both Rads and Path Im afraid.

If you are independantly wealthy, ignore 1-5 and proceed as your 1%'er heart desires (or hopefully your 0.1%'er heart).

Thanks for the reply, just to clarify...

1.) of course
2.) I don't have parental help, but debt will be repayable once I am doctor, right? Or are you saying if I still wanted to be a pathologist?
3.) lol
4.) googled extender mission creep, still not sure I understand what you mean by that. Eliminate primary care fields? Aren't those the fields with the most available jobs?
5.) what isn't supersaturated and isn't primary care?

I am categorically unaware of what it is like to be wealthy.

 

[yaah]

How much debt?

If you are worried about debt, find a debt payment calculator on line and see what you are looking at. $300k in loans (which sounds extreme but some people have this) can be close to $2k per month. That's a mortgage on a $300k house. And same time frame.

The comment about primary care fields relates to the increasing tendency for many primary care tasks to be given to midlevel practitioners - regular health checkups, physical exams, urgent care visits for minor problems, even minor surgical procedures. Some fields have been good about having regulations preventing this encroachment but it is probably going to continue. Why, for example, wouldn't we see PAs doing common surgeries especially if that is all they do, every day? With the surgeon only needed as a backup. So midlevels are getting more tasks but physicians aren't going away. But they may become more "supervisory" instead. That might be something you like, might not be. I wouldn't worry about primary care fields going away but they are unlikely to become that well compensated unless you can do something unique or special.

There really aren't any fields which are immune to this. Diagnostic fields like radiology and path are less threatened at present, but these fields as he said are more threatened by outsourcing or telemedicine or whatever, because being on site is not critical.

As for-profit health care systems increase, their main focus is on cost and they will lowball everyone else and pay less attention to other quality metrics.

But the overall main thing for anyone considering medicine as a career is to find something you like to do. If you pick a career for lifestyle or financial or other perceived rewards, you are bound to be disappointed. A colleague and I have been noticing how often we encounter young physicians in other specialties who are disconcerted with their specialty choice. Some people hate the administrative tasks that keep increasing. Some hate being pressured from multiple angles. Some hate being so busy they can't sit down. Some hate the actual job they have to do. Some hate the patients. Find what you love. I am out of residency 4-5 years and I definitely made the right choice of specialties. You will ALWAYS find doom and gloom with anything you choose in life, and there will always be someone to tell you how miserable you are and how much worse it is going to get. While it is important to listen to people with something intelligent to say and people who are trying to help you, figure it out for yourself.

 

[Leukocyte]

5.) what isn't supersaturated and isn't primary care?

LOL...You think Primary Care fields are "super-saturated"?!!!

That is OK, you are still a medical student, and you do not really know the Primary Care job market. As a Family Medicine physician in the North East I can tell you that the Primary Care job market is the opposite of "super-saturated". In FM residency, you start getting bombarded with recruiter phone-calls...and the offers are crazy (some places are offering $1000 just to come and interview with them).

As much as I hate FM and clinical medicine, I will have to seriously admit that (IMHO) the BEST physician job markert IS the Primary Care job market.

As for the mid-levels taking over Primary Care....as a FM doc, I can tell you that this will not really happen. There is such a huge knowledge gap (I have practiced with NPs), and they cannot legally prcatice alone (at least in my State). NP here need a "Physician colaborator". It may seem to "the un-trained eye" that NPs do the same thing as FM and IM docs, but in real life, there is a huge difference. A NP is NO WHERE NEAR the level of a FM doc. And I am not saying this because I am a FM doc. I hate FM, but I have to speak the truth.

 

[ironhorse8]

LOL...You think Primary Care fields are "super-saturated"?!!!

That is OK, you are still a medical student, and you do not really know the Primary Care job market. As a Family Medicine physician in the North East I can tell you that the Primary Care job market is the opposite of "super-saturated". In FM residency, you start getting bombarded with recruiter phone-calls...and the offers are crazy (some places are offering $1000 just to come and interview with them).

As much as I hate FM and clinical medicine, I will have to seriously admit that (IMHO) the BEST physician job markert IS the Primary Care job market.

As for the mid-levels taking over Primary Care....as a FM doc, I can tell you that this will not really happen. There is such a huge knowledge gap (I have practiced with NPs), and they cannot legally prcatice alone (at least in my State). NP here need a "Physician colaborator". It may seem to "the un-trained eye" that NPs do the same thing as FM and IM docs, but in real life, there is a huge difference. A NP is NO WHERE NEAR the level of a FM doc. And I am not saying this because I am a FM doc. I hate FM, but I have to speak the truth.

I think you misinterpreted what I said, (because I typed it poorly). The original response said to stay away from supersaturated specialties and to stay away from primary care. I was essentially asking what is left if I am staying away from both of those fields?

 

[Leukocyte]

I think you misinterpreted what I said, (because I typed it poorly). The original response said to stay away from supersaturated specialties and to stay away from primary care. I was essentially asking what is left if I am staying away from both of those fields?

Sorry if I have misinterpreted what you said. I may be naive (and extremely confused) when it comes to the Pathology job market, but if there is one thinng I know well...it is Primary Care (FM specifically). Just to make it clear to those who are not in Primary Care:

-The FM job market is EXTREMELY strong.

-FM will NEVER be taken over by NPs. It may seem like it is, but in reality, NPs are only "filling in the gaps". I know from practice and experience what NPs can handle and cannot handle. For the "straight forward" cases...yes an NP is great. But beyond that...it is going beyond their training and comfort zone. In many States, there has to be a "Physician Colaborator" working with the NP.

Again, I am not saying this out of love for FM...Quite the opposite...I am leaving FM to go to Pathology (which is scaring the **** out of me). But I have to be thruthful to reality, despite my hatred of FM.

 

[ironhorse8]

Sorry if I have misinterpreted what you said. I may be naive (and extremely confused) when it comes to the Pathology job market, but if there is one thinng I know well...it is Primary Care (FM specifically). Just to make it clear to those who are not in Primary Care:

-The FM job market is EXTREMELY strong.

-FM will NEVER be taken over by NPs. It may seem like it is, but in reality, NPs are only "filling in the gaps". I know from practice and experience what NPs can handle and cannot handle. For the "straight forward" cases...yes an NP is great. But beyond that...it is going beyond their training and comfort zone. In many (if all states), there has to be a "Physician Colaborator" working with the NP.

Again, I am not saying this out of love for FM...Quite the opposite...I am leaving FM to go to Pathology (which is scaring the **** out of me). But I have to be thruthful to reality, despite my hatred of FM.

Can I ask why you are leaving FM?

 

[ironhorse8]

If you want you can PM me

 

[pathstudent]

If you are one of those social misfits who "hates all of third year med school", you sort of have no other choice but pathology. If you are a socially dynamic, AOA type who rocked the boards and wows all professors on clinical rotations, we could use you in pathology, but I would consider subspecialty surgery if I was you. Those latter specialties face many of the same challenges as pathology, but they hold so much more sway due to thei ability to generate millions of dollars for hospitals.

 

[Torsed]

Wish LaDoc would have told me about number 3.

It would have saved me much suffering.

 

[radman123]

Not sure why medical students go into fields with completely dead job markets. In my field (rad) there have now been 2 horrible markets in the last 15 years- mid to late 90s and about 2008-present. There are few jobs in metro areas and those go to connected types. Few partnership type jobs now many nighthawk, telerad, employee type positions with relatively low salaries approaching hospitalists/ low range specialists with little potential for increase. The lifestyle is not what people outside the field think it is especially in PP.

Plenty of med students still interested as radiology may be the lesser of the evils when it comes to medicine. But these med students will likely live very far from where they want to, make much less than the published averages, spend 6-7 years in training, work their butts off as it is a 24/7 field now, likely be employees. Then there are fields that have had more balanced markets like primary care, surg. Subspecialties, derm, etc. i would be extremely hesitant choosing radiology but many will and consider me a troll trying to make the field less competitive even though I have been out for years.

 

[Leukocyte]

Can I ask why you are leaving FM?

I am burnt-out. I am tierd of seeing patients, one after the other, after the other, after the other....I think burn-out studies listed ER and Primary Care at the top of the list when it comes to physician burn-out. FM practices are getting busier and busier by the year, and as the population grows. And now with the ACA starting in 2014...FM practices will not not be able to keep-up with the increased demand. Super burn-out.

Yes, the money is good in FM, but there is more to life than money. Plus I like Pathology...ever since my old days when I was a Medical Technologist.

 

[radman123]

Seeing specimen after specimen may be cool for a while but you will get burned out also. And you are the first person to say money is good in FM.

 

[WEBB PINKERTON]

Stay in Family Medicine Leukocyte. There will always be good demand for you despite midlevel creep. You dont want to be in our situation competing with EVERY pathologist who practices in the US. I would take competing with a bunch of NPs and PAs over what a pathologist has to deal with. You are much more in control of your destiny than we are. Very jealous.

If you like lab medicine, there are businesses out there that help you set up an in-office laboratory.

 

[Leukocyte]

And you are the first person to say money is good in FM.

Well, it depends what is considered "good" money in your perspective. The starting salary for a NEW FM grad here in my area is about $160,000 - $180,000. You can start at $200,000 if you work in Urgent Care, or in a Rural clinic (not in a major city). The avarage salary of an experienced FM depends on how many patients you see, so the sky is the limit (way over $200,000 if you want to work more).

This is just a minute little sample (NOT the best offers out there).

And NO, there is NO competetion with NPs . There is either a NP job OR a FM doc job. There is NO competition for thye same job. To say that a NP competes with a FM doc for the same job, is just plain silly, and shows how naive the person is when it comes to the FM job market. In addition FM docs (for the MOST part) are NOT employees, unless you work in Urgent Care or are a hospitalist (not very common). Most FM docs are PARTNERS in medical groups. It is the FM docs who hire the NPs to "fill in" the clinic to see the straight forward cases. If the case is complex, the NP refers the case to the FM doc (that is if they want to keep their license).


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[Overhauser]

3.) do not burden yourself with unneccessary relationships with the opposite sex that will consume energy, limited financial resources and time. aka proceed to hook up lifestyle or become celibate based on your religious/spiritual world view, masturbation would be an option in both cases I guess depending on your schedule.

What wonderful advice. Thank you so much.

 

[mlw03]

What wonderful advice. Thank you so much.

Seriously? It's good advice to put one's personal life on hold entirely for the sake of money? Money does not equal happiness. A relationship alone does not equal happiness. Happy life comes from good balance of the two, with each person deciding what that balance is for themselves. Perhaps one could make a ton of money doing rural ob-gyn in North Dakota (someone has to deliver oil worker's wives babies I guess), but unless you like a rural life, you'll be unhappy. So you go home to your apartment at 6pm, and then sit around and spank it until work the next day, while your bank account grows? Or some pathology equivalent working where one must?

If this is what we're advocating to med students, we're going to have a tough sell.

The majority of threads on here end up down this same road... it's kinda depressing and boring. Maybe time for me to take a break again, spend some time on the home brew forums (one perk of an attending lifestyle - time and funds to indulge new hobbies 👍).

 

[Substance]

What wonderful advice. Thank you so much.

I sense the sarcasm. Good job.

MLW03 makes a lot of good points about happiness in life being due to a balance between work and life. Life is what you do for yourself and your loved ones, and work is what you do for others for a fee. If you think about it that way, you'll see that you need to have both to achieve true happiness and fulfillment.

The more I see medicine become oversaturated in all fields, not just pathology, the more I wonder what kind of work fulfillment awaits the new crop of medical school students. I know in Canada the subspecialty surgeons are encountering record rates of unemployment and are doing surgical assists and low-yield locums in the boonies just to put bread on the table. Not my idea of fulfillment.

To help answer your questions from a Canadian perspective (remember, you can apply to Canada in the first round of the match if you are coming from an American school)

1) No, you are not wasting your time thinking about it. But compared to other fields, its not something you have to work hard towards obtaining. In other words, its not very competitive, so any time you have to spend, spend it elsewhere.

2)Probably. Given the ASCP data and the fellowship creep, they've got good reason to.

3)Academics is a lifestyle suited to a very specific type of person. Don't go into any field thinking that you can tolerate academics if that's your only choice. You have to love academics (and the politics that goes with it) to thrive in it.

4) Sure. Any of the primary care fields, obstetrics and gyne, derm, psych.

 

[Leukocyte]

Seriously? It's good advice to put one's personal life on hold entirely for the sake of money? .....So you go home to your apartment at 6pm, and then sit around and spank it until work the next day, while your bank account grows?

I agree, being in a good relationship is much better than just "spanking it" But, divorce is a bitch. It can scar a person forever. So it all depends on your spouse. Some spouses are all nice and supportive during the good times...but when the bad times come, they have no tolerance at all. So choose your spouse wisely. Do not think with your d****. Her/His beauty means nothing...and WILL EVENTUALLY go away. What stays is their personality. AVOID divorce AT ALL COSTS.

 

[trailblaze]

To the OP. I love my job. F#*king Love it! I'm a resident at a top 10 national institution, very busy, lots of cases, lots of responsibility. I wake up every morning excited to go to work and leave everyday with a great sense of fullfillment. Very often I think how lucky I am to have gone into Pathology. I would not be as happy and satisfied in another specialty, job security or not.

I will say that I can sympathize with a lot of the doom and gloomers . Many of them have been in practice for a long time and have seen an amazing specialty (and medicine in general) slowly move toward corporate and government control and the subsequent loss of autonomy, compensation, and all the other current negatives that plague medicine. I cannot sympathize with the complete discounting of pathology, however. In spite of the relative fall from glory, I still think it is highly worthwhile to become a physician and especially a pathologist. Half of all current doctors would disagree (at least on a survey). Pathology/career in medicine is not ideal, but nothing is in life. Having left another career to become a doctor, I regreted my decision quite often, especially during 3rd and 4th year when I found out how little the reality of medicine lived up to my premed idealistic image. I never thought I'd be a pathologist, I only came to it after a lot of exploring and finding out what my best fit is. I can't tell you how happy I am to be where I am now. I never thought I would love my job as much as I do and I there are lots of others who think and feel the same. A lot of important topics are discussed on this board and they must be considered, however, it is only a small limited side of the reality and very subjective.

Best of luck

 

[radman123]

I am happy for you trailblaze. But you may change your tune once you get out there and experience the terrible job market, outrageously sleezy antics some groups pull, and the endless mindless grind of private practice. I remember how womderful that feeling was for me years ago. Wish I could get it back....

 

[ironhorse8]

To the OP. I love my job. F#*king Love it! I'm a resident at a top 10 national institution, very busy, lots of cases, lots of responsibility. I wake up every morning excited to go to work and leave everyday with a great sense of fullfillment. Very often I think how lucky I am to have gone into Pathology. I would not be as happy and satisfied in another specialty, job security or not.

I will say that I can sympathize with a lot of the doom and gloomers . Many of them have been in practice for a long time and have seen an amazing specialty (and medicine in general) slowly move toward corporate and government control and the subsequent loss of autonomy, compensation, and all the other current negatives that plague medicine. I cannot sympathize with the complete discounting of pathology, however. In spite of the relative fall from glory, I still think it is highly worthwhile to become a physician and especially a pathologist. Half of all current doctors would disagree (at least on a survey). Pathology/career in medicine is not ideal, but nothing is in life. Having left another career to become a doctor, I regreted my decision quite often, especially during 3rd and 4th year when I found out how little the reality of medicine lived up to my premed idealistic image. I never thought I'd be a pathologist, I only came to it after a lot of exploring and finding out what my best fit is. I can't tell you how happy I am to be where I am now. I never thought I would love my job as much as I do and I there are lots of others who think and feel the same. A lot of important topics are discussed on this board and they must be considered, however, it is only a small limited side of the reality and very subjective.

Best of luck

Thanks for your post, good to hear "both sides".

 

[ironhorse8]

I am happy for you trailblaze. But you may change your tune once you get out there and experience the terrible job market, outrageously sleezy antics some groups pull, and the endless mindless grind of private practice. I remember how womderful that feeling was for me years ago. Wish I could get it back....

In an earlier post you said you didn't understand why med students would go into an over saturated field. What do you suggest to medical students then; find a field they like/can stand that isn't over saturated?

 

[radman123]

I would choose a field that has had a more balanced job market in the past. Primary care, surg subspec., derm, psych etc. This in my opinion should be one of the major factors in addition to "liking" a field which is tough to know after a brief exposure as a med student.

If you love path, rad or other field with terrible job market, you had better be ok with moving far away, potentially being exploited by a group, having few options to change jobs, making as much as those with 1/2 the residency training, etc. It will be tough to love a field under these conditions.

And yes, there are some rad and path fellows who get great jobs in nice places but this is no where near the average outcome after training right now. And yes everyone gets jobs especially if you ask the faculty, but with what difficulty, compromise and crappy terms is usually left out.

 

[ironhorse8]

I would choose a field that has had a more balanced job market in the past. Primary care, surg subspec., derm, psych etc. This in my opinion should be one of the major factors in addition to "liking" a field which is tough to know after a brief exposure as a med student.

If you love path, rad or other field with terrible job market, you had better be ok with moving far away, potentially being exploited by a group, having few options to change jobs, making as much as those with 1/2 the residency training, etc. It will be tough to love a field under these conditions.

And yes, there are some rad and path fellows who get great jobs in nice places but this is no where near the average outcome after training right now. And yes everyone gets jobs especially if you ask the faculty, but with what difficulty, compromise and crappy terms is usually left out.

Wow, this is surprising. I have been led to believe that every kind of doctor will always have a job pretty much anywhere they want. Good to know this isn't always the case.

 

[Overhauser]

Seriously? It's good advice to put one's personal life on hold entirely for the sake of money? Money does not equal happiness. A relationship alone does not equal happiness. Happy life comes from good balance of the two, with each person deciding what that balance is for themselves. Perhaps one could make a ton of money doing rural ob-gyn in North Dakota (someone has to deliver oil worker's wives babies I guess), but unless you like a rural life, you'll be unhappy. So you go home to your apartment at 6pm, and then sit around and spank it until work the next day, while your bank account grows? Or some pathology equivalent working where one must?

If this is what we're advocating to med students, we're going to have a tough sell.

The majority of threads on here end up down this same road... it's kinda depressing and boring. Maybe time for me to take a break again, spend some time on the home brew forums (one perk of an attending lifestyle - time and funds to indulge new hobbies 👍).

I was being sarcastic. That piece of advice, if not tongue-in-cheek, may have been the single worst thing I've ever read on this website. While I will agree that it is a poor decision to become involved in a malignant relationship, especially when we have such a limited amount of free time, having a loving and supportive significant other is totally irreplaceable. Cold hard cash is nice, but at the end of the day I'd rather go to bed next to a wonderful woman and the prospect of waking up to a career I'm truly passionate about than a bunch of pretty golf clubs and a new Lexus. But maybe I'm just a simple man.

 

[Tissue issue]

Wow, this is surprising. I have been led to believe that every kind of doctor will always have a job pretty much anywhere they want. Good to know this isn't always the case.

I'm wondering who has told you this.....

 

[pathstudent]

Cold hard cash is nice, but at the end of the day I'd rather go to bed next to a wonderful woman and the prospect of waking up to a career I'm truly passionate about than a bunch of pretty golf clubs and a new Lexus. But maybe I'm just a simple man.

What about those of us who aren't concerned about pretty golf clubs or a Lexus but college tuition for multiple kids, retirement and a desire to travel with your family.

I'm sorry but those of you who say you just care about being passionate about your career regardless of compensation are incredibly selfish.

 

[MOHS_01]

What about those of us who aren't concerned about pretty golf clubs or a Lexus but college tuition for multiple kids, retirement and a desire to travel with your family.

I'm sorry but those of you who say you just care about being passionate about your career regardless of compensation are incredibly selfish.

...and incredibly naive. I have watched, over the past twenty years, the wide eyed ignorant naivety of youth evolve in a few well traveled paths. There's the sour grapes path wherein people rationalize their less than idealized station as some elementary defense mechanism. There's the bitter pissed off at the world type who realizes that they were fed a line of **** from others, that the world is not as it was sold, and would rather just sit in their own excrement extolling their woes rather than doing something about it... and then there's those who split the middle, are appropriately upset at the structured disadvantage they are the victims of yet realize that, while being unjustly ****ed, that is reality as it is and the viable alternatives are not necessarily any better.

Either way, the delusions of youth either get shattered or have to become grander.

 

[MOHS_01]

I was being sarcastic. That piece of advice, if not tongue-in-cheek, may have been the single worst thing I've ever read on this website. While I will agree that it is a poor decision to become involved in a malignant relationship, especially when we have such a limited amount of free time, having a loving and supportive significant other is totally irreplaceable. Cold hard cash is nice, but at the end of the day I'd rather go to bed next to a wonderful woman and the prospect of waking up to a career I'm truly passionate about than a bunch of pretty golf clubs and a new Lexus. But maybe I'm just a simple man.

Maybe, but my money would be on a lack of perspective more than fixed ideals. Perhaps you will feel the same after entering the workforce a decade or more later than your peer group, likely with significant loans (the interest for which will largely be nondeductible -- meaning the cost burden to you is 1.5x, give or take), and expectations beyond what you can reasonably expect to deliver. When you want your kids to go to the best school in the area (that you can afford), to live in a nice neighborhood, and plan for retirement...

Who knows, you truly may be simple -- but the world you will live in will not be. The two must reconcile eventually... and while $$$ is not everything, it is one hell of a lubricant for most processes. 😉

 

[WEBB PINKERTON]

To the OP. I love my job. F#*king Love it! I'm a resident at a top 10 national institution, very busy, lots of cases, lots of responsibility. I wake up every morning excited to go to work and leave everyday with a great sense of fullfillment. Very often I think how lucky I am to have gone into Pathology. I would not be as happy and satisfied in another specialty, job security or not.

I will say that I can sympathize with a lot of the doom and gloomers . Many of them have been in practice for a long time and have seen an amazing specialty (and medicine in general) slowly move toward corporate and government control and the subsequent loss of autonomy, compensation, and all the other current negatives that plague medicine. I cannot sympathize with the complete discounting of pathology, however. In spite of the relative fall from glory, I still think it is highly worthwhile to become a physician and especially a pathologist. Half of all current doctors would disagree (at least on a survey). Pathology/career in medicine is not ideal, but nothing is in life. Having left another career to become a doctor, I regreted my decision quite often, especially during 3rd and 4th year when I found out how little the reality of medicine lived up to my premed idealistic image. I never thought I'd be a pathologist, I only came to it after a lot of exploring and finding out what my best fit is. I can't tell you how happy I am to be where I am now. I never thought I would love my job as much as I do and I there are lots of others who think and feel the same. A lot of important topics are discussed on this board and they must be considered, however, it is only a small limited side of the reality and very subjective.

Best of luck

Wait till you get out into the real world.....

 

[LADoc00]

Good luck Trailblaze. Keep that chin up.

You remind me of a young lady skippy down a country road blooming with beautiful Spring flowers moments before she meets the Green River Killer.



TRUST NO ONE.

 

[WEBB PINKERTON]

I was thinking more like "When Bambi meets Godzilla" when I read that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXCUBVS4kfQ

Anyone going into pathology needs to understand how the business works before making a decision to go into it. I think many of us would have stayed away if we knew we would be disrespected and constantly fending off every "Dollar lab" that crawls out from under a rock.

 

[pathstudent]

I was thinking more like "When Bambi meets Godzilla" when I read that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXCUBVS4kfQ

Anyone going into pathology needs to understand how the business works before making a decision to go into it. I think many of us would have stayed away if we knew we would be disrespected and constantly fending off every "Dollar lab" that crawls out from under a rock.

I don't agree with you. If you are hell bent on academics or married to another doc or professional with a good income, you don't need to worry about these pressures as much.

 

[MOHS_01]

I don't agree with you. If you are hell bent on academics or married to another doc or professional with a good income, you don't need to worry about these pressures as much.

I don' t know about all that.... it does not seem to me that adding another's income (and concomitant labor) to your own in an effort to compensate for the inadequacies of your given profession constitutes a very valid or sound argument. In fact, it sounds more like shortchanging your significant other to me. Now.. if you want to be some institutional bitch and don't mind what goes along with that, by all means...

 

[WEBB PINKERTON]

Ok, forget worrying about a career. Just marry money.

 

[yaah]

Good luck Trailblaze. Keep that chin up.

You remind me of a young lady skippy down a country road blooming with beautiful Spring flowers moments before she meets the Green River Killer.



TRUST NO ONE.

He only killed prostitutes though. Maybe some runaways.

 

[LADoc00]

He only killed prostitutes though. Maybe some runaways.

Are you saying Ive been safe all these years?!

 

[yaah]

Are you saying Ive been safe all these years?!

From the Green River Killer? Most definitely since he has been in jail for more than 10 years. Didn't you see that lifetime movie with the guy from that lame show "Ed" who played the cop who chased him for years?

 

[pathololology]

Thanks for your post, good to hear "both sides".

This is both sides coming from a resident who loves his residency. Not a recent grad looking for a job. If you really love path, then I would say go into it, but don't go into it without seriously considering the current job market. More than likely things will change, but this is a very very bad time to be a pathologist. It is directly related to the 88305 cuts and the other looming cuts that CAP is threatening to sue CMS over. Things probably won't improve with Obamacare or the pendulum that is swinging more and more towards socialized medicine. I talk with my friends in radiology who are also recent grads and we have been scratching our heads over our job markets and wondering what in the hell happened. Now, if we were aware of this at the outset, and we were still mulling things over before 3rd and 4th year electives (obviously you can't predict the future and hindsight is 20/20) we probably would have chose a more stable career field that allowed us to be close to any of the major cities that we were from or wanted to go to. I honestly think the job market will change and will probably change in 5-10 years for pathologists. Even with the cuts, at some points groups have to realize they still have to hire and that their salaries will just have to come down some. JUST BE AWARE OF THE CURRENT ISSUES IN PATHOLOGY. It doesn't mean don't do it, if it is the only thing you could see yourself doing, but if you would be equally happy being a dermatologist or a pathologist, then picking dermatology is an absolute no brainer . . . . I hope that helps.

 

[pathololology]

I agree 100000% percent radman. If I had seen this post above, I wouldn't have wasted posting below. Very well said.

I would choose a field that has had a more balanced job market in the past. Primary care, surg subspec., derm, psych etc. This in my opinion should be one of the major factors in addition to "liking" a field which is tough to know after a brief exposure as a med student.

If you love path, rad or other field with terrible job market, you had better be ok with moving far away, potentially being exploited by a group, having few options to change jobs, making as much as those with 1/2 the residency training, etc. It will be tough to love a field under these conditions.

And yes, there are some rad and path fellows who get great jobs in nice places but this is no where near the average outcome after training right now. And yes everyone gets jobs especially if you ask the faculty, but with what difficulty, compromise and crappy terms is usually left out.

 

[pathololology]

2)Are people on this thread intentionally trying to prevent me from over saturating the field?

[/QUOTE]

Ummmm. We can't do that. I wish we could, but as the saying goes . . . "if you build it (i.e. if there is a residency spot) they (foreign medical graduates) will come" By complaining about the job market on here and convincing US grads not go into pathology b/c the job market is bad will do nothing to change the job market as long as there is a long line of FMGs wanting to go into pathology b/c their medical school was free in their country (i.e. they have no debt enslaving them so they can just get a PhD here in the US where they make money for several years and look even more attractive to US pathology residencies) and they do not have full mastery of the English language and can get a path spot quickly and easily.

Now before I get accused of anything on here (I have lots of friends who are FMGs, are great pathologists, are dear friends of mine, and are incredibly smart people); I am not saying that FMGs are bad residents or not smart (in fact quite the opposite most of the time), but I am saying that with no med school debt and a specialty where you don't have to talk to patients or clinicians very often (i.e. don't need full mastery of the English language), it is a much easier specialty for FMGs to get into.