Major & Advice

[blazinfury]

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I am new to this forum, but I would like some advice from the pros who are doing this for a living. I am an undergraduate freshman at Stony Brook. I am currently majoring in bio, but considering biochem. Nearly every MD/PhD person that I have spoken to in the med school at SBU had told me that they were a biochem major. Do you have to be a biochem major to get into this program? I am a bio major, but I intend to take biochem regardless b/c it helps with MCATs I hear. What classes would you recommend for MCATs (biochem, genetics, microbio, cell bio)? My reason for being a bio major is that I have more time to do research in the lab that I hold here. I am in a good spot and hope to pull off some publications by the end of this summer. I hope that I am not at a disadvantage if I maintain a 3.8 gpa and do well on MCATs w/ research experience, even though I am a bio major, right? Please provide me with some advice on this and some feedback on what are good things to do to actually get into this program, such as how important is it to join clubs in school and should I have equal hrs of physicians shadowing and research, or can I have a bit more research than physician shadowing experience? Should I go beyond physician shadowing or should I focus on research? I mean gpa plays a big factor, right-- aren't 1st eliminations based on weak GPA and MCAT? Thanks and sorry for the questions, but I just want to make the right move for my future.

 

[flaquita69us]

You can major in anything you want, although some programs require a science major. A biochemistry major is absolutely not required. If you think you'll do better in bio and that you'll have more time to do research, pursue that. The strength of your research and your understanding of what it means to be a scientist is way more important than what your major was. On that note, research is generally more important than physician shadowing when applying to MD/PhD programs. You should definitely try to get some clinical experience, but research is far and away the most important thing. It sounds like you have that covered, so just keep it up. And relax.

 

[blazinfury]

Now I hear that med schools want leadership. I am a freshman in college, but my mentor is having me virtually take over the whole project-- sort of a junior PI. She even took in another student assistant, which I need to train-- could I write that off as leadership and training to an effect since I will virtually lead the study (after consulting with her first). My other issue is doing other ECs. I mean do I need to be just as active as an actual pre-med b/c I want to keep my high gpa. I agree with what you say about clinical experience, but I can't find a physician to shadow. Do you suggest just being a regular volunteer at my university's hospital, since that's where my lab is? I want to do it, but I can't find anyone. Any advice.

 

[seraph524]

You can find leadership anywhere: either in clubs, student organizations, or like you mentioned, leader of the project. Any of these would be very good examples for medical schools. As for shadowing or clinical experiences, it seems to not be as important for MD/PhD applicants as it is for straight-MD applicants. Some of the very successful MD/PhD applicants in this forum have few if any clinical experience, but have received wonderful acceptances.

Shadowing, in my experience, is hard to get. My PI is a MD/PhD, and I couldn't even shadow him due to HIPAA rules. That is not to say its not possible, you just have to go through paperwork and have each patient sign a release form. (The hospital my PI worked at wasn't willing to let me do that.) Clinical volunteering at a hospital is more than enough. I have been asked before (once) why I didn't shadow, and to say because of HIPAA was a satisfactory answer.

 

[blazinfury]

How does the admissions council perceive ppl not getting adequate shadowing experience-- do they demean you or something, if you volunteered in a hospital. I mean I hear it is pretty brutal for MD (yes I know this isn't MD). Also, I have heard ppl say that at interviews, there are interviewers who open up your file and ask you about why you didn't get an A in this class, that class, etc. Is that true? I mean, to me, MD/PhD seems favorable but impossible to attain admission to b/c there are so many applicants for like 10 spots in each med school-- so I am scared that I have no hope. I will still try regardless b/c I am passionate about the field. But as you say, research is key, which is good b/c this what I love doing.

 

[Picklesali]

How does the admissions council perceive ppl not getting adequate shadowing experience-- do they demean you or something, if you volunteered in a hospital. I mean I hear it is pretty brutal for MD (yes I know this isn't MD). Also, I have heard ppl say that at interviews, there are interviewers who open up your file and ask you about why you didn't get an A in this class, that class, etc. Is that true? I mean, to me, MD/PhD seems favorable but impossible to attain admission to b/c there are so many applicants for like 10 spots in each med school-- so I am scared that I have no hope. I will still try regardless b/c I am passionate about the field. But as you say, research is key, which is good b/c this what I love doing.

I have very little clinical experience and went on 11 interviews and was never demeaned. Nobody ever asked me about my grades either. One person was looking at my file and kept repeating "oh you get straight A's, very good very good" (In actuality I had an AMCAS GPA 3.84)

 

[seraph524]

Again, shadowing is nothing, its just another thing to list down for clinical experience. Just because a student did not shadow does not make them inferior to one who did. Clinical experience of any sort is good. And no, as far as I know, schools do not look down on students who "only have" volunteering clinical experience.

As for having so little slots, I like to think of the MD/PhD application world as just a scaled down version of the MD application world. You are right that there are limited slots, but there are also limited applicants.

For example, at Penn, 8000 apply, they interview 800, and they accept 150 (I think this is right?)

However, for MD/PhD, there are only about 500 applicants total (based on rejection letters I get =P), most schools interview about 70, and accept 10-15. Schools like WashU and Penn accept a significantly higher number (25-30).

So either case, its about the same odds. I think MD/PhD may be slightly easier.

 

[Picklesali]

Again, shadowing is nothing, its just another thing to list down for clinical experience. Just because a student did not shadow does not make them inferior to one who did. Clinical experience of any sort is good. And no, as far as I know, schools do not look down on students who "only have" volunteering clinical experience.

As for having so little slots, I like to think of the MD/PhD application world as just a scaled down version of the MD application world. You are right that there are limited slots, but there are also limited applicants.

For example, at Penn, 8000 apply, they interview 800, and they accept 150 (I think this is right?)

However, for MD/PhD, there are only about 500 applicants total (based on rejection letters I get =P), most schools interview about 70, and accept 10-15. Schools like WashU and Penn accept a significantly higher number (25-30).

So either case, its about the same odds. I think MD/PhD may be slightly easier.

To qualify that, I think that MD/PhD is easier if you are qualified. i.e. there are many qualified MD-only applicants who don't get in anywhere, or get into much 'lower-tiered' schools than you would expect.

 

[seraph524]

To qualify that, I think that MD/PhD is easier if you are qualified. i.e. there are many qualified MD-only applicants who don't get in anywhere, or get into much 'lower-tiered' schools than you would expect.

Oh haha, yea, shes right. I meant to say I would get destroyed if I applied straight-MD only, since I love research too much 😵

 

[Picklesali]

(seraph did you see my 'preparation H' video in that other thread?)

 

[seraph524]

yes, haha, i forgot who mentioned preparation H to me in the first place...i think it was somebody at yale or cornell or something....

 

[Picklesali]

AND, I'm not stalking you....


I would call it....tag-teaming??

 

[j-weezy]

How does the admissions council perceive ppl not getting adequate shadowing experience-- do they demean you or something, if you volunteered in a hospital. I mean I hear it is pretty brutal for MD (yes I know this isn't MD). Also, I have heard ppl say that at interviews, there are interviewers who open up your file and ask you about why you didn't get an A in this class, that class, etc. Is that true? I mean, to me, MD/PhD seems favorable but impossible to attain admission to b/c there are so many applicants for like 10 spots in each med school-- so I am scared that I have no hope. I will still try regardless b/c I am passionate about the field. But as you say, research is key, which is good b/c this what I love doing.

I say this with all kindness: CHILL

you're a freshmen....focus on getting good grades, kicking a$$ in your lab, etc.

In a year or so start thinking about taking the MCAT, volunteer in a hospital or shadow or both (I only had one semester of 4 hours a week of hospital volunteering), keep up the research.

MD/PhD is much more "predictable" in one sense and way less "predictable" in another.

Good grades, good MCAT scores, good research/letters of rec = acceptance to an MD/PhD program. Not true for MD only. The hard part is predicting where you end up!

Good luck and stop freaking out (at least for a year or 2)!!

edit: if you're really a freshman in college you may want to change your status from MD/PhD Student...

 

[Picklesali]

<-- wondering if I would be more neurotic than I already am, if I had been set on MD/PhD when I was a freshman and had simultaneously discovered SDN.... Hmmmmm....

 

[seraph524]

<-- wondering if I would be more neurotic than I already am, if I had been set on MD/PhD when I was a freshman and had simultaneously discovered SDN.... Hmmmmm....

I think the world would explode O_O

 

[Picklesali]

I think the world would explode O_O

CHECK OUT WHAT I FOUND!!!!!

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zAZjVuNREk[/YOUTUBE]

 

[seraph524]

omg hahahaha 3,500 joules!!



come here pickles!!!! *brandishes electrical clamps*

*evil grin*

 

[Picklesali]

omg hahahaha 3,500 joules!!



come here pickles!!!! *brandishes electrical clamps*

*evil grin*

You see?? It's this sort of maniacal nature that prevents us from becoming facebook friends.

G'night! 😀

 

[blazinfury]

If I may ask, what were some of your majors? Did you choose your major because it was something that you wanted or are doing a PhD in currently? Or is your major not entirely related to your PhD pursuit? Also when you apply, are you supposed to choose a PhD field or do you go in undecided?

 

[j-weezy]

If I may ask, what were some of your majors? Did you choose your major because it was something that you wanted or are doing a PhD in currently? Or is your major not entirely related to your PhD pursuit? Also when you apply, are you supposed to choose a PhD field or do you go in undecided?

Dude! Calm down - you have like 2 or more years before you need to start freaking out!

Me: Bio (BS) Major

Current research: gene therapy

Proposed graduate field on AMCAS: anything from Molecular/Cell Biology to Physiology etc.

Research I WANT to go into: cancer (hypoxia, microenvironment, angiogenesis)

 

[Neuronix]

I am new to this forum

Welcome!

I am currently majoring in bio, but considering biochem. Nearly every MD/PhD person that I have spoken to in the med school at SBU had told me that they were a biochem major. Do you have to be a biochem major to get into this program?

A basic science major will help if you want to continue doing basic science research. They don't care if that's Bio, Chem, Biochem, Physics, etc... Many people dual major to get the liberal arts bent too, if that's what you're into. This is up to you.

What classes would you recommend for MCATs (biochem, genetics, microbio, cell bio)?

This is the kind of question for your undergrad advisor and they can tell you what to take. This is standard for all applicants. For the MCAT you need 1 year of Intro Bio, 2 years of chem (general and organic), and 1 year of Intro Physics. That's it. Whether those other classes you mentioned or other classes would help you is debateable, but they are definately not required. Ask your advisor and/or the MCAT forum (do a search there) for more info.

My reason for being a bio major is that I have more time to do research in the lab that I hold here. I am in a good spot and hope to pull off some publications by the end of this summer. I hope that I am not at a disadvantage if I maintain a 3.8 gpa and do well on MCATs w/ research experience, even though I am a bio major, right?

Nobody cares what your major was. You are not at ANY disadvantage as a Biology major versus those other majors. Keep your GPA as high as possible. It sounds like you are doing the right things. I don't know why the people you know at your school happen to be Biochemists, but it's more likely coiincidence (the people you know) more than anything else.

Should I go beyond physician shadowing or should I focus on research? I mean gpa plays a big factor, right-- aren't 1st eliminations based on weak GPA and MCAT? Thanks and sorry for the questions, but I just want to make the right move for my future.

I addressed some of your questions in the other thread. As for physician shadowing, you need roughly 100 hours of volunteering/shadowng sometime during undergrad to know what you're getting into. Sure, the cutoffs are based on GPA and MCAT but even after you interview these still play a role at most places. Those two combined with your research experience make you a strong applicant. So focus on research! If something else interesting keeps up while you're an undergrad, keep your mind open.

 

[Neuronix]

In regards to your second questions,


I think I said this in the other thread, but I was a dual Biology and Psychology major. I applied for MD/PhD programs in Neuroscience, but this is flexible and some programs really don't care what programs you're applying for. Here you definately apply and interview for a given PhD program, but it's understood that the MD/PhD program is selecting for the "best" applicants regardless of the department applied for (i.e. there's no quotas) and they are flexible. You are definately welcome at any MSTP I'm aware of to choose whatever department in the basic sciences you wish for your PhD and this can chosen or changed after the second year of medical school.

I am now in the Biophysics PhD program.

 

[violarocks]

I am a bio. and a music major, and I've done research all over the map, including cardiology, biochemistry, and physiology.

Yes.. you read correctly.. music major. How is this going to influence me in my choice of research/medicine? No idea. I'll let you know in a year or two.

 

[seraph524]

If I may ask, what were some of your majors? Did you choose your major because it was something that you wanted or are doing a PhD in currently? Or is your major not entirely related to your PhD pursuit? Also when you apply, are you supposed to choose a PhD field or do you go in undecided?

My main department home is physiology, but I also took up a chemistry major because the two were so similar, and I only needed 3-4 extra classes to get another degree. The reason I chose physiology was because it is the "pre-med" major of my college and everybody does it (I'm a lemming). I chose chemistry because I love chemistry.

But this is not to say you have to have a pre-med major or even a biology major. Any major is fine, be it physics, engineering, biochem, etc. One of my good friends is a chemical engineering major and he will be going to Tufts med in the fall. Also, your major does not have to reflect your research interests. I work in a physiology department lab, but my research revolves around organic chemistry.