manual skill test at Loma Linda

[futureD]

---

Members do not see this ad.

How hard is the manual skill test at Loma Linda? What design do we have to carve?

How hard are we graded? Do you know anyone who has passed the test or failed?

I have to take it on 12/2. But so far I have not done well on my practice chalks at home.

Thanks.

 

[maryh320]

There's a manual test at Loma Linda???

How come I have not heard of this before?
Can someone who's been thru it elaborate more?

thanks

mary

 

[ItsGavinC]

I hadn't heard of this either, but I think it's an interesting idea!

Anybody wanna update us on the specifics of this?

 

[futureD]

The test is required of interviewees with PAT score 16 or below.

It is given on the day of the interview and supposedly it tests manual dexterity.

The school sent us a suggestion of how we can practice at home. I have tried it and it is quite difficult.

 

[dudelove]

What is this text exactly? I remember when I was in dental school, one of my friends mentioned that he had to carve a piece of soap at some school. What do you have to carve it into? A tooth?

 

[futureD]

We have to carve a random object out of jumbo sidewalk chalk, of certain dimensions that they specify.

The soap carving that you're thinking of is a part of the Canadian DAT.

 

[dudelove]

What are you allowed to use to carve with? This doesn't sound like much of a useful test to me. How many schools require this?

 

[the tooth fairy]

Hey FutureD
I am a D1 at Loma Linda, but I haven't heard anything about this test so unfortunetly I can't be of much help. Good luck all the same.

the tooth fairy

 

[Bickle]

Originally posted by futureD
We have to carve a random object out of jumbo sidewalk chalk, of certain dimensions that they specify.

The soap carving that you're thinking of is a part of the Canadian DAT.

Your right, the Canadian dat has a soap carving section, which is rather easy with LOTS of practice.

I have practiced on both soap and chalk, and chalk is A LOT harder to get smooth planes and carve 90 degree angles. Are you sure you carve on chalk or soap? If its soap, then the carving should be easier, but if its chalk, then your in for some fun (sarcastic).

Good Luck

 

[toothache]

i think someone is pulling someones leg. i never heard of any school requiring a chalk carving. very interesting, i think it's a great idea. all schools should require you to do this, i think it can be a very accurate test.... we should ask tooth fairy, she probably can find out...

 

[futureD]

Here is the text part of the document I received from Loma Linda. I couldn't paste the image portion for obvious reasons.

....
Loma Linda University
School of Dentistry
Manual Skills Practice Exercises


Equipment and Supplies Needed:

1. X-ACTO KNIFE #1 ? Comes as X-Acto handle and one pointed blade and a #17 lightweight Chiseling Blade










2. Sidewalk chalk -- Chalk sticks are four inches long and approximately one inch in diameter in assorted colors.













3. A ruler that has a millimeter scale and sharp pencil.

Carving exercises

The carving of the chalk or plaster can be messy, so you will want to protect your clothes and surrounding area.

The exercise should be one that will test manual dexterity and accuracy of dimension, and absence of critical errors. Therefore, the dimensions and design suggested should be followed explicitly. Other designs may be created by the carver, but they should be designed so that there are specific dimensions to be carved to.

The manual skills test given by the Loma Linda University School of Dentistry as part of the admissions process is a design that is evaluated according to the following:

1. All surfaces must be flat and smooth
2. All angles are to be sharp and defined
3. Measurements are to be exact
4. External angles are to be free of chips
5. Internal angles are to be clean and sharp

Helpful Hints

With a sharp pencil, draw design using dimensions given. You may only want to draw one section of the design at a time so that you do not smear your lines while carving a different section.

To cut out or carve an area, lightly score around the entire design section with the pointed blade 1mm inside of drawn line. Do this a second and third time applying more pressure each time. The purpose of doing this is to prevent chipping on the outside edge of the finished carving.

Now place the square chisel type blade in the x-acto handle and proceed to shape the design as pictured. Most of the carving and shaping will be accomplished by using the square chisel blade.

Leave some time for final refining and sharpening of design. Carve to final dimensions.

Practice time for the exercise is 1.5 hours, which includes drawing the pattern and carving the design to the best of your ability and as accurately as possible.

 

[ent_doc]

Originally posted by futureD
How hard is the manual skill test at Loma Linda? What design do we have to carve?

How hard are we graded? Do you know anyone who has passed the test or failed?

I have to take it on 12/2. But so far I have not done well on my practice chalks at home.

Thanks.

The ENT residency at Kaiser in Oakland, CA used to make the interviewees carve something out of soap. Urban legend has it that an interviewee cut his hand on the knife, and left the interview and headed for the airport

 

[Bickle]

Originally posted by futureD


Practice time for the exercise is 1.5 hours, which includes drawing the pattern and carving the design to the best of your ability and as accurately as possible.

For the Canadian dat we only get 30 minutes for carving. 1.5 hours is more than enough time.

 

[groundhog]

I think chalk carving was once a part of the admissions process at many USA dental schools. I remember back in the middle 1960's I saw a fellow student carving different figurenes out of chalk. I asked him what he was up to and he replied that he was prepping to apply to the state dental school.

 

[critterbug]

Originally posted by toothache
i think someone is pulling someones leg. i never heard of any school requiring a chalk carving. very interesting, i think it's a great idea. all schools should require you to do this, i think it can be a very accurate test.... we should ask tooth fairy, she probably can find out...

I think LSU still does the chalk/soap carving

 

[PERFECT3435]

ok i think its time to withdraw my app from LL

 

[Supernumerary]

My school had all the freshmen take a chalk carving test at the beginning of the year. These scores are then going to be compared with performance in clinical courses to see how much correlation there is. From what I understand there is a fair number of the faculty that would like to use the chalk carving and GPA as the main considerations in admissions. Apparently, the DAT has a very poor correlation to actual performance in dental school.

 

[Comet208]

futureD,
can you please share with us your stats and when you applied to LLU???


Perfect, have you received an interview from them yet??


BTW: I MUCH rather take the real DAT than having to do a chulk curving test at an interview...

Comet

 

[futureD]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?postid=977439#post977439

 

[Comet208]

you have awsome GPA FutureD. . can i ask you two questions?

1. what made you decide to go into dentistry even though you have a graduate degree in Computer Science?

2. are you affiliated with SAD?

Comet

 

[futureD]

Ok. I took the manual skill test at Lomda Linda on 12/2

We had to carve a rectangular geometrical design on a cube of plaster. It was bad. I had a rough start because they had told us to practice on chalk at home and chalk is much softer than plaster. So, I had a hard time figuring out an appropriate amount of force to apply.

I chipped a corner on my carving. I did the best I could given that it was my first time working with plaster.

I think the test is silly because it in no way measures your desire to become a dentist and that is what drives you to succeed through dental school.

 

[Supernumerary]

I think the test is silly because it in no way measures your desire to become a dentist and that is what drives you to succeed through dental school.

I fully agree that drive and desire are the most important factors involved in doing well in dental school. But they are not the only factors. I'm sure every dental student on this board can think of at least one person in their class who simply cannot hack it in lab. No matter how hard these people work, they are always producing mediocre to subpar results. They have the theory and protocol down cold and spend hours and hours in the lab, but if you don't have the hands it's just not gonna click for you.

Dentistry is very demanding in terms of manual dexterity. The first time an instructor rips your project to shreds for being 40 microns too bulky (yes, 40 microns! 😱 ) you will begin to understand. Of course, few people come in with golden hands; everybody has to work hard. But by using these tests to weed out the truly hopeless, the schools are doing both themselves and the students a favor. 😉

P.S. I'm sure you aced it. 😉

 

[aphistis]

Originally posted by Supernumerary
I fully agree that drive and desire are the most important factors involved in doing well in dental school. But they are not the only factors. I'm sure every dental student on this board can think of at least one person in their class who simply cannot hack it in lab. No matter how hard these people work, they are always producing mediocre to subpar results. They have the theory and protocol down cold and spend hours and hours in the lab, but if you don't have the hands it's just not gonna click for you.

Dentistry is very demanding in terms of manual dexterity. The first time an instructor rips your project to shreds for being 40 microns too bulky (yes, 40 microns[/]! ;eek: ) you will begin to understand. Of course, few people come in with golden hands, and everybody has to work hard. But by using these tests to weed out the truly hopeless the schools are doing both themselves and the students a favor. 😉

P.S. I'm sure you aced it. 😉

Agreed, James. We just had our final Occlusion project graded today, and the phrase driven through our heads this entire course has been "accurate to within 12 microns!" We basically get strips of mylar and try passing them between our waxed-up arches. It has to encounter "baby bear" resistance--not too much, not too little...it has to be <em>just</em> right. 🙄 It's bruising, and there are some people who just don't have the ability. Good intentions alone just aren't enough.

 

[futureD]

I had to take the test because I scored a 16 on the PAT. Hey...I could not sleep the night before and had difficulty visualizing the images.

I highly doubt that people who scored higher than 16 (and thus are not required to take the test) have more manual dexterity than I do. THATs BS. BS. It is also BS that people who do well on the PAT have manual dexterity.

 

[EyeCandy]

future D,

I haven't posted in a while in any of the forums but couldn't resist this one.... I feel your frustration and perhaps pain because of what transpired with your carving exam. Now, I don't want you to take my words as a candy-coated reply but actually more closer to what I know to be true.

There was an infamous/famous interviewer at Temple dental who would stress one thing and one thing only... which was that PRACTICE and hard work are what makes a truly great dentist. Luckily, I had the good fortune to converse at length with a few dentists and they had all told me that also. In your case, I understand how the carving test might seem like a bummer but it is in no way a prediction or correlation to your actual capabilities on becoming the dental practitioner that you want to become.

I have had a few profs tell me that they couldn't wax an anatomically correct tooth if their life depended on it.... yet what made them reach excellence was their motivation and unrelenting desire to improve and master the art and science of dentistry. Dentistry is all about self-motivation and there is a reason why they call their office a "dental practice."

Some advice for this application process: They say that all good cornerbacks have a short memory....... I think that all successful dental applicants should have a short memory also. Good Luck!