Math weaklings/fraidy cats how did you succeed in Physics?

[XT777]

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I really do hate math...really!

Any self-professed math weaklings that did well in physics want to share their methods?

XT777

 

[e_phn]

I really do hate math...really!

Any self-professed math weaklings that did well in physics want to share their methods?

XT777

PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE.

do the problems (different type) over and over again until you get the hang of them. seriously. practice makes perfect.
i know this is not a groundbreaking advice, but it's the truth.

 

[UIC Killa]

I really do hate math...really!

Any self-professed math weaklings that did well in physics want to share their methods?

XT777

I would consider myself a math weakling..getting B's on every math class i have taken (Algebra on up...)...but seriously physics is less about math and more about concepts. Learn the concepts of all the sub-field (mechanics, fluids, electromagnetism...etc) and the math is actually quite simple. Sometimes a lot of plug and chug. I took calc based physics I and also physics 2 and got A's. Math is really the only thing hurting my BCPM gpa...why does math have to be included in that!

 

[mychelle774]

I'm not really a math weakling (I get Calc), but I DO suck at Physics. It's just so hard for me to understand and ... stupid! Yeah, I know I'm being pigheaded, but this is the most widely shared pigheaded sentiment I know. It's not really math-based, but more conceptual like the previous poster said.

However, I did make A's in Physics I and II with horrible teachers both times. The first semester I dragged my own ass along pouring over my textbook and problems to teach myself. It was fairly easy, albeit time-consuming, because the material (gravitation and what not) was pretty easy to understand. The second semester I was taking the Princeton Review classes for the MCAT and their Physics lessons totally saved my butt for Physics II- that stuff (electrostatics and other physics words I don't even remember now) is super hard for non-physics-inclined people like me. My TPR teacher rocked and I had lightbulbs popping up left and right! I got a great grasp of the basics from TPR, so it wasn't hard for me to go back and teach myself the little caveats and subtleties I needed to know for my college Physics class.

BTW, I highly recommend taking TPR concurrently with undergrad Physics because you really get a bidirectional benefit from taking two classes that can fill in each other's holes (ew that sounded gross), I mean make up for each other's inadequacies. Beware of taking too much TPR into your undergrad classroom though. g=9.81 m/s^2 there, not 10. Don't get points off for doing that.

In summary, go find a good teacher. One that can explain things to you in terms you understand, i.e. a hip, young type. And do as many problems as you can. I found the problems in our assigned text to be too complicated when trying to learn the concepts, so finding a "Physics for dummies" or other simple-type book can help you cement those ideas initially. Since I was studying for the MCAT, I used Examcracker's 1001 Physics problems because they drill the stuff into you with each mini-section dedicated to a single topic, and nothing they would put on the MCAT is that difficult to understand. So start there, then tackle the textbook problems. Good luck!

P.S. My Physics lectures weren't that bad when compared to the lab . All's I can say there is sit next to a smart person. 😉

 

[makingmd]

So...hate math, got C's. Started my 1st Physics class post back 3 years. Got a 19% on the first test. I did not understand what could have happened. I went to class...every class, followed along, understood...therein lies the problem. Physics is such that it follows a step by step mechanism. There are rules to each step. It is easy to watch your professor go through each step and nod your head in agreement. YOU need to LEARN the steps. Memorize the formulas...the SAME formulas you will need in Phyiscs II so do it now. It is worth it. It is helpful for the MCAT too. Well (yes had to score 100% on both finals to do it, but...) Got an A in both Physics I and II. I just sold my College Physics book, but if anyone is using Serway & Faughn I have the solutions that I found helpful. Good luck.

 

[mfpullen]

Physics really isn't about math. My physics professors always showed us that you should manipulate the formulas into a form you can use with the information given before even putting in ANY numbers. After that, it's just plug and chug.

MFP

 

[):(]

What about honors physics? I am signed up for honors physics next fall and I am considering dropping it to do algebra based so I can concentrate on research more.

 

[Skaterbabe74]

What about honors physics? I am signed up for honors physics next fall and I am considering dropping it to do algebra based so I can concentrate on research more.

Honestly I thought calc-based physics was easier than algebra based. And yes, I am math deficient. It took me 3 tries to get through Calc I. I've had the same awesome prof for all 4 semesters tho (I decided after taking alg-based that I wanted a minor in physics). Much of the E&M stuff just makes much more sense when you have the calculus behind them. So, if it was me I'd stick with honors physics.

In my case, the teacher made all the difference tho. I enjoyed physics in high school (alg. based, not AP), and then I lucked out with the best prof on campus for my alg-based and calc-based physics I and II. (Still have to take calc-based III). I tutored someone in calc-based II last semester from a different prof and I don't think I would have gotten above a C if I had taken that prof. Every week I ended up going to my old prof for help so I could help my student because the other prof made the homework so dang hard. (He's bitter because too many of his E&M seniors failed his class having taken General from a really bad teacher who's no longer there.)

To the OP: The others are right - practice, practice, practice. And choose the best prof from ratemyprofessors.com. My prof for the both physics series plus my last Calc I teacher and a bio profs (biomechanics) got me over my math anxiety. Now everyone thinks I'm some sort of math whiz (which I'm not - I still have to really work hard at it but I can do it now, and don't dread every math class I take).

 

[_ian]

What about honors physics? I am signed up for honors physics next fall and I am considering dropping it to do algebra based so I can concentrate on research more.

Do you have a calc-based, non-honors class? At my school, honors physics moves very, very fast, because it is intended only for physics majors. I'd suggest taking a normal calc-based course... if "honors" is another name for calc-based, rather than the 3rd step, then take that.

 

[kevster2001]

If you practice enough it becomes mechanical. And the math itself in most intro phys problems aren't very hard, its the physics concepts itself that the problems focus on. I would suggest taking calc-based because most of the time its really just integrals that simplify into algebra anyways.

 

[DrBowtie]

Calculus was invented for Physics. Algebra based is degrading to the science.

 

[CptCrunch]

Calculus was invented for Physics. Algebra based is degrading to the science.

I agree with Tucker.

 

[g3pro]

Wanna know what's pretty sweet? If you learn the concepts well enough, you can walk into a physics exam without having done any studying or "practice" and walk out with an A. It was such an intensely concept-based course that sitting back in lecture and paying attention is all you really need to master the concepts.

Calculus-based physics is a lot different... that's when practice and studying is necessary.

 

[Pemberley]

As a non-calculus-based physics TA who teaches mostly pre-meds, I've gotta chime in here:

1) Most of my students benefit from doing many practice problems. They can help identify the concepts that you thought you understood when reading the book but actually hadn't grasped thoroughly.

2) Let your TA help you. I will spend as many hours as necessary getting my students both to understand and to apply the concepts, but there are three things I can't do for them:
(a) read the book carefully in advance of the lecture
(b) make their homework neat, orderly, legible, and elegible for partial credit. Use pencil and a great big eraser.
(c) force them to start a problem set early and then summon them to my office, before the set is due, when they really need help with a problem set.

3) Calculus-based is MUCH easier than non-calculus based. It fundamentally makes more sense. Things that make sense are easier to learn.

-Pemberley

 

[Philo]

Physics really isn't about math. My physics professors always showed us that you should manipulate the formulas into a form you can use with the information given before even putting in ANY numbers. After that, it's just plug and chug.

MFP[/QUOTE/]

I would agree that physics isn't really about math, but there really is no such thing as theoretical physics (with no math).

 

[XT777]

Thanks to everyone for your responses. I appreciate it.

To clarify, when I asked for responses from self-professed “math weaklings/ fraidy cats” I was imagining hearing from people who would not even consider taking calc-based physics...since these people wouldn’t have taken calc…I am looking for the mathematical “90 pound weaklings” here. Perhaps this is something people don’t want to admit or maybe… no such legitimate pre-med person exists? Anyway, if you fit this description and also rocked physics, I’d love to hear from ya…

thanks

XT777

 

[Gabby]

Thanks to everyone for your responses. I appreciate it.

To clarify, when I asked for responses from self-professed “math weaklings/ fraidy cats” I was imagining hearing from people who would not even consider taking calc-based physics...since these people wouldn’t have taken calc…I am looking for the mathematical “90 pound weaklings” here. Perhaps this is something people don’t want to admit or maybe… no such legitimate pre-med person exists? Anyway, if you fit this description and also rocked physics, I’d love to hear from ya…

thanks

XT777

I can't really contribute much to this, except to say that mathematical weaklings exist and I am one of them. I took three math classes in undergrad and got one B (in statistics) and two C's. I hate math with a passion. I haven't taken Physics yet, so I'm in the same boat as you. I'm going for alegebra based since I haven't taken a calc class yet and probably won't until next summer or fall of 2007, if at all (I'm putting it off as long as possible to decide if I even want to apply to schools that require it).

 

[mfpullen]

I would agree that physics isn't really about math, but there really is no such thing as theoretical physics (with no math).

A great deal of my physics class was "theoretical", we spent about 75% of the time discussing relationships between equations without using numbers, and 75% of our test grades were based on using and manipulating the right equations, again without numbers. I think that makes more sense and teaches you the concepts much better than drilling practice problems into your head. I am HORRIBLE at mathematics, and I truly understood probably 90% of physics I and II.

MFP

 

[akinf]

I used to be really bad at math, then one day it clicked, and i just don't mean I understood a type of question, I mean math in general just clicked. Now, learning new fields in math is pretty simple. However, it clicked because I kept going over questions over and over and over and over and over and over and over....you get the idea. Math is a mental sport, in physical sports you practice to get better, math is exactly the same way.

 

[_ian]

To clarify...

All the advice in this thread, aside from "take calc-based" is still great for you. Your difficulty with math shouldn't slow you down much... I tear up my math classes, but have to put some effort into my physics classes. The opposite can hold true as well.

A great deal of my physics class was "theoretical", we spent about 75% of the time discussing relationships between equations without using numbers, and 75% of our test grades were based on using and manipulating the right equations, again without numbers. I think that makes more sense and teaches you the concepts much better than drilling practice problems into your head. I am HORRIBLE at mathematics, and I truly understood probably 90% of physics I and II.

To be fair, introductory physics is neutered specifically so that is possible, because it's counterproductive for students to get hung up on the math when you're really trying to teach the concepts. That separation disappears around the third class, when concepts cannot be expressed without the corresponding mathematics... 'course, pre-meds never have to go that far if they don't want to.

 

[Gabby]

I used to be really bad at math, then one day it clicked, and i just don't mean I understood a type of question, I mean math in general just clicked. Now, learning new fields in math is pretty simple. However, it clicked because I kept going over questions over and over and over and over and over and over and over....you get the idea. Math is a mental sport, in physical sports you practice to get better, math is exactly the same way.

I just feel like I missed something along the way. You know that thing where you fear you'll skip a day of school and it'll be the day they teach everything? LOL

It could have been as early on as Algebra I in high school. In middle school, I did pre-algebra and I got an A. I struggled with Alg. though and ended up with a C. In 10th grade, I took Geometry and failed it TWICE. I had A's and B's in everything else. No C's or D's (except for the Alg I, which I got a C in). But I had two F's on my high school transcript, both in Geometry. Finally, I retook it my senior year (and had to double-up since I was short math credits) and passed with a B, but only understood enough to really get by. Since then, if I even see a triangle, I freak out. It's like my brain shuts down. I know it's mental. I just don't know what to do about it.

 

[mfpullen]

All the advice in this thread, aside from "take calc-based" is still great for you. Your difficulty with math shouldn't slow you down much... I tear up my math classes, but have to put some effort into my physics classes. The opposite can hold true as well.

To be fair, introductory physics is neutered specifically so that is possible, because it's counterproductive for students to get hung up on the math when you're really trying to teach the concepts. That separation disappears around the third class, when concepts cannot be expressed without the corresponding mathematics... 'course, pre-meds never have to go that far if they don't want to.

I think that the OP was referring to the intro classes. Why would someone who is not interested in math and is not good at it take advanced physics?

Isn't that kind of like punching yourself in the mouth?

MFP

 

[novawildcat]

i took the physics I and II that engineers and physics majors take. The math in it is a complete joke. Physics I and II doen't really have complicated math at all. Honestly, if you can't do the algebra required to pass physics I and II with a C, you probably shouldn't even be in college.

 

[Philo]

A great deal of my physics class was "theoretical", we spent about 75% of the time discussing relationships between equations without using numbers, and 75% of our test grades were based on using and manipulating the right equations, again without numbers. I think that makes more sense and teaches you the concepts much better than drilling practice problems into your head. I am HORRIBLE at mathematics, and I truly understood probably 90% of physics I and II.

MFP

I'm sorry maybe I missed something but when you are discussing relationships between equations all these relationships are mathematical relationships. When you are manipulating equations, you are manipulating them with mathematical operations. Numbers are not the only thing that math is concerned with. Theoretical physics employs mathematical models and abstractions, as opposed to experimental physics, in an attempt to understand Nature.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

I agree with NOVAWILDCAT.....stay away from calculus based physics if you aren't a mathematically gifted person (which I don't understand why anyone would take that as a premed, but whatever) and if you can't pass the algebra based physics, then perhaps you don't need to be in college let alone in medical school.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Calculus was invented for Physics. Algebra based is degrading to the science.

Spoken like a true physics major.

 

[mfpullen]

I'm sorry maybe I missed something but when you are discussing relationships between equations all these relationships are mathematical relationships. When you are manipulating equations, you are manipulating them with mathematical operations. Numbers are not the only thing that math is concerned with. Theoretical physics employs mathematical models and abstractions, as opposed to experimental physics, in an attempt to understand Nature.

Hmm...I suppose you could say that since we were performing basic mathematical operations when manipulating variables and constants, sure, it was using math in physics. However, if you will please read the rest of the thread, we are discussing how many math skills as in higher math are required. I don't recall adding and subtracting variables without using numbers being a higher mathematics skill...

 

[novawildcat]

LOl it took the famous philosophers/logicians Russell and Whitehead 200+ pages to prove that 1+1=2. Just be greatful we can take operations like addition and subtraction easily for granted.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

I take most things involving math for granted. That is why I think physics and large parts of the general chemistry courses I've taken are totally pointless. Does it really matter (to anyone other than a chemist or the people who write the MCAT) how much energy is released or consumed in a given chemical reaction>

 

[Skaterbabe74]

Thanks to everyone for your responses. I appreciate it.

To clarify, when I asked for responses from self-professed “math weaklings/ fraidy cats” I was imagining hearing from people who would not even consider taking calc-based physics...since these people wouldn’t have taken calc…I am looking for the mathematical “90 pound weaklings” here. Perhaps this is something people don’t want to admit or maybe… no such legitimate pre-med person exists? Anyway, if you fit this description and also rocked physics, I’d love to hear from ya…

thanks

XT777

I was actually one those people who never thought to take calculus, and never would have if my major (biology) hadn't required it. I started math in college in intermediate algebra and would have stopped after college algebra and maybe trig if not for my major. I really was math phobic and deficit. I certainly never planned on taking calc-based physics, but after taking algebra-based physics, and finally having calculus click (I had to take Calc I 3 times - 2 D's and then an A- after finally getting a good teacher) I ended up going on to a physics minor and calc-based physics. So while a lot of the posters weren't really what you were looking for, my response was exactly what you were looking for.

Seriously, don't be afraid of alg-based physics. Just make sure you do tons of problems over and over, utilize the TA's and tutoring services if need be, and definitely check out the profs on ratemyprofessor.com to make sure you get the best rated prof for your class.

 

[Igni Fera]

As a non-calculus-based physics TA who teaches mostly pre-meds, I've gotta chime in here:

1) Most of my students benefit from doing many practice problems. They can help identify the concepts that you thought you understood when reading the book but actually hadn't grasped thoroughly.

2) Let your TA help you. I will spend as many hours as necessary getting my students both to understand and to apply the concepts, but there are three things I can't do for them:
(a) read the book carefully in advance of the lecture
(b) make their homework neat, orderly, legible, and elegible for partial credit. Use pencil and a great big eraser.
(c) force them to start a problem set early and then summon them to my office, before the set is due, when they really need help with a problem set.

3) Calculus-based is MUCH easier than non-calculus based. It fundamentally makes more sense. Things that make sense are easier to learn.

-Pemberley

I have been hearing all these years that calculus-based is easier than non-calc based, and all of you are saying the same thing...God, I hope so!

I took the 2 quarter Physics for Bio majors (non-calc) in my undergrad and it was torture from beginning to end. I completely grasped the concepts, but when it came to rearranging formulas and plugging numbers, I lost it. I have always been good at Math, at least up to Calculus (hence taking non-calc physics which i thought would be better). I did really well on homework and labs, but bombed the tests. I did not end up doing too well, gradewise.

So...I am retaking it starting this Fall because I need a 3 quarter series and to fix the scores. This time its calc-based, and I have been freaked out about it until reading this thread. You all are making me feel like I'll do much vetter this time around. Thanks for the confidence booster!

 

[TheFreshPrince]

I have been hearing all these years that calculus-based is easier than non-calc based, and all of you are saying the same thing...God, I hope so!

I took the 2 quarter Physics for Bio majors (non-calc) in my undergrad and it was torture from beginning to end. I completely grasped the concepts, but when it came to rearranging formulas and plugging numbers, I lost it. I have always been good at Math, at least up to Calculus (hence taking non-calc physics which i thought would be better). I did really well on homework and labs, but bombed the tests. I did not end up doing too well, gradewise.

So...I am retaking it starting this Fall because I need a 3 quarter series and to fix the scores. This time its calc-based, and I have been freaked out about it until reading this thread. You all are making me feel like I'll do much vetter this time around. Thanks for the confidence booster!

It depends. I believe calc-based is easier because you gain a better understanding of the formulas. However, if you're not good at math then algebra based physics would probably easier. Like others have said you'll want to do lots of problems.

 

[KingTutATL]

If you aren't taking calc based physics, most of what you do is just algebra/trig/ and a little precalculus. Nothing too difficult. Although people who do take the calc physics will probably score much better on the MCAT.