May I ask during an interview?

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Let’s say I am interviewing at a program I like very much because I have done a rotation there or have heard very good things about their program. Is it appropriate at any time of the interview day to ask, “Am I a good fit for your program?” or “Do I stand a chance of matching here?” May a question be out-right asked if they are very interested in me or (are they just passing time with the interviewees?) I would very much like to know what is on their mind. Can I be upfront with them? Is this against the rules of the Match during an interview? Or will a second-visit request inform them I am seriously interested and then discuss my possibilities?😕
 
Let’s say I am interviewing at a program I like very much because I have done a rotation there or have heard very good things about their program. Is it appropriate at any time of the interview day to ask, “Am I a good fit for your program?” or “Do I stand a chance of matching here?” May a question be out-right asked if they are very interested in me or (are they just passing time with the interviewees?) I would very much like to know what is on their mind. Can I be upfront with them? Is this against the rules of the Match during an interview? Or will a second-visit request inform them I am seriously interested and then discuss my possibilities?😕

Do your homework and learn about the programs. Then, if you feel you are a good fit, tell the interviewers why you feel that way. By all means, let a program know that you are interested.....but Do NOT ask interviewers if you "stand a chance of matching." Presumably you have a chance since you were granted an interview, but it is impossible to know what the playing field is like until all of the candidates have been interviewed. Every program has a limited number of interview spots, so no one is going to be passing time.

Ranking the candidates is a long process. Express interest, but be sensible about it. Also, go to the NRMP site and read the rules of the match, if you are not clear what can and cannot be asked.
 
There is a movie called HITCH with Will Smith. He is an expert in helping guys with no game hook up with girls they like. He is talking to this one guy right before the date and says something like : This is good. She is going on a date with you. THat means she likes you. Your job is not to get her to like you at this point, she obviously already likes something about you. Your job is simply NOT TO SCREW IT UP!

If they asked you to interview, they already think you are a good fit - you just have to give them no reason to believe otherwise. Every program gets many more applications then they invite. If they invited you, they like you. Its not a game, where they invite people they don't like just to laugh at them behind their backs.
 
I respectfully disagree with the above.

A program invites you for an interview because they like you "on paper" - ie, you have the basic academic credentials they are looking for. If that was all there was to ranking residents, there'd be no reason for interviews.

The interview is where they see (and you) if you are a "good fit". There is no way to assess this, outside of letters and personal statements, in a file sitting on someone's desk. The interview does "make or break" you...we have seen fantastic "on-paper" applicants who were complete duds in the interview and we have found others who had mediocre academic credentials but they just shone and had a great personality.

So yes, its true...programs don't invite people they don't think they would match but its almost always soley based on academics, letters, and your personal statement (and sometimes not even all 3 of those). But they have no idea whether your personality, goals, desires, etc. would be a good fit until they meet you in person.

You should be encouraged to tell a program that is your top choice that they are so. But I would not engage any faculty in a discuss about "WAMC". Reason being is that residency ranking is a process - one faculty member or even the PD cannot accurately assess if or how high you will be ranked. It depends on the input of others and frankly, how much they like the other people who have also interviewed.

Additionally, you won't get a real answer. Applicants since time immemorial can tell you about the program who told them they were "certain" to be ranked highly, only not to match. Asking only puts your interviewer on the spot and they are most likely to say something positive but in the end it has no bearing on whether they actually think you are a good fit or will rank you highly. Do not try and force the program into committing a match violation.

Tell them you really, really like them and leave it at that.
 
I respectfully disagree with the above.

A program invites you for an interview because they like you "on paper" - ie, you have the basic academic credentials they are looking for. If that was all there was to ranking residents, there'd be no reason for interviews.

The interview is where they see (and you) if you are a "good fit". There is no way to assess this, outside of letters and personal statements, in a file sitting on someone's desk. The interview does "make or break" you...we have seen fantastic "on-paper" applicants who were complete duds in the interview and we have found others who had mediocre academic credentials but they just shone and had a great personality.

So yes, its true...programs don't invite people they don't think they would match but its almost always soley based on academics, letters, and your personal statement (and sometimes not even all 3 of those). But they have no idea whether your personality, goals, desires, etc. would be a good fit until they meet you in person.

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With the matches you have participated in, did you end up with a final selection of residents by more : a) picking those you really liked b) cutting those you did not like? Does everyone in your program who help choose candidates all say "YES, we like them" or do they talk more about who they really did not like?

It seems to me the candidates are all liked when they are selected to interview, and what stands out most is the dislikes during interview. So it would seem to be the goal to just not blow it and end up disliked. The same way business statistics show a customer that dislikes you will tell roughly twice as many people as the customer that likes you.
 
I respectfully disagree with the above.

A program invites you for an interview because they like you "on paper" - ie, you have the basic academic credentials they are looking for. If that was all there was to ranking residents, there'd be no reason for interviews.

.

Dr.Cox, is there a way to indirectly feel the waters? For example, a few weeks after the interview if I were to contact the program and ask if I could take a second look, would they say something like "we would like to accomodate all second looks, but find we are just too busy this season" if they were not very interested in me? I did this just recently, asking a residency I have already interviewed at for a second look, they offered to let me and my wife stay in school housing while there and take us around to look at homes - I took this as a sign they were actually interested in me..... good or bad assumption.
 
With the matches you have participated in, did you end up with a final selection of residents by more : a) picking those you really liked b) cutting those you did not like? Does everyone in your program who help choose candidates all say "YES, we like them" or do they talk more about who they really did not like?

It seems to me the candidates are all liked when they are selected to interview, and what stands out most is the dislikes during interview. So it would seem to be the goal to just not blow it and end up disliked. The same way business statistics show a customer that dislikes you will tell roughly twice as many people as the customer that likes you.

The truth is that it is the rare candidate who totally blows it...I mean, who gets drunk at the dinner before, says something offensive or outright tells us he won't be ranking our program. Most everyone else falls somewhere in the middle.

It is certainly easy to "grade" those who totally blow it, and somewhat easy to grade those who just don't interest us. And what interests us (meaning the programs I've been involved in) may differ from faculty member to faculty member but in general there tends to be some agreement about which candidates fit in and those who don't.

The final selection therefore is a combination of cutting those we didn't like (which would have happened at the time of their interview, so they don't even come up for discussion again unless there has been some overwhelming information added since they came for interview) and keeping those we love. It is not one or the other. And candidates are only "liked" in the sense of academics, as I noted in my post above that there is a lot more to being ranked than your academics. I've never met these candidates so I don't necessarily like them but rather can tolerate them because of their file...it takes the interview and their input to make me like them.

Now I can understand where you are coming from that the idea is just "not to blow it". However, I would counter that for most candidates, they must do a little more.

An academic superstar? You'll probably match somewhere unless you are a real social misfit.

An academic loser? You probably won't match unless you have a winning personality, great LORs (which might explain your poor academic record), and a bit of luck.

The vast majority of candidates are swimming around in the middle of the pool and to get into the shallow end where your chances of matching are better, you need to do more than just "not blow it". You need to appear engaged, interested, interesting, the kind of person others like to be around. This means I will remember you more and think of you fondly when I rank you. It won't necessarily mean that you'll end up higher ranked than the guy from the Ivy League with a 245 on Step 1, but it will certainly pull you out of the masses.

So, in the end, I encourage people to strive for more than just "not blowing it" because while yes, I'll remember you if you are seriously inappropriate, I'll also remember those that I just enjoyed interviewing.

I can honestly say that I will never forget one candidate: looked good on paper - PhD, good academic record, well traveled, lot of community activities, etc. but talking to her was like talking to a robot. No engagement, no expression, didn't even laugh at my jokes. I (and other faculty who interviewed her) could just not see working well with her...I'm sure she was bright enough to do the work, but when I'm trapped in the hospital I not only want someone bright and hard-working to be with, but someone that I might actually be able to have a conversation with. Perhaps she was nervous, but I suspect that she was just personality-deficient.
 
Dr.Cox, is there a way to indirectly feel the waters? For example, a few weeks after the interview if I were to contact the program and ask if I could take a second look, would they say something like "we would like to accomodate all second looks, but find we are just too busy this season" if they were not very interested in me?

They might. Or they might be truthful...they would love to have you come back but it takes resources that they just don't have.


I did this just recently, asking a residency I have already interviewed at for a second look, they offered to let me and my wife stay in school housing while there and take us around to look at homes - I took this as a sign they were actually interested in me..... good or bad assumption.

At this early stage, most programs aren't totally ruling anyone out. If they have invited you for an interview, as you note, they are at least saying that you are academically qualified.

I would not however assume too much about their actions when you come to town. Its likely that these would be the same for everyone. Programs are just as interested in selling themselves to you as you are to them...its the rare program that can treat candidates poorly and still get applications. These are usually the big name places. At any rate, this program probably has funds and a program set up for people who want to come back for a second visit...its unlikely they are treating you any different than anyone else who would request the same.

As I've said elsewhere, there is a lot about this game that is cloak and dagger. Programs will tell you that they are seriously interested in you but end up not ranking you very highly (or at all) ...this could be because of others that they've interviewed are seen as better candidates, or maybe they're just trying to be polite or perhaps they just lie to all candidates. You'll probably never know.

More likely a program takes a request for a second look as serious interest from you...which is always flattering. I can't recall a candidate who wanted a second look that we despised and didn't want to come back, so you are usually allowed to, unless as I noted above, the program really feels too busy to accomodate you. If they get several of these requests, it can really strain resources.

Go into this without worrying about WHO likes you and instead worry about who YOU like. You cannot decipher what their actions mean and you shouldn't try, IMHO.
 
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