Mayo vs Top Medical School

[UGtoMed]

Please don't bash me for asking this question. I am a Yale senior. Would you say that Mayo, MN is as prestigious as the other Ivies. Let's say that I don't have any concerns about class size, weather, or fees. I got accepted into Mayo and am trying to see if I should wait and apply next year to see if I could get into Harvard, Stanford, Johns Hopkins, or Yale (my dream schools).

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[KdotLB]

Do. Not. Pass. Up. An. Acceptance. To. Med. School.

Especially not mayo.

Trying not to bash.

Also mayo isn’t an ivy, but that doesn’t matter for med school.


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[SCN1a]

This is a very personal and mostly dumb question and I should remind you that mayo is some people’s dream school. If you feel you’d prefer the ivy’s then try it and go there because I don’t think you’ll like mayo if you’ll always wonder if you would have gotten in somewhere else. And because you don’t seem to want to go there or value your acceptances because you’re asking this question. also, I saw you have an acceptance to both mayo and baylor both are excellent institutions and you probably can’t go wrong with either one. But My advice pick one (most likely Baylor as it’s cheaper and you can become anonymous there) and stick with it don’t turn down an offer anywhere

 

[SpoiledMilk]

So you got accepted into Mayo and you are considering declining and applying next year for another chance to get into one of the ivies?

OMG! Do it and see yourself blacklisted forever!!!

@gonnif

 

[Oso]

So you're only gonna go to medical school if it's an Ivy level school? Why even apply to other programs then?

To answer your question: you should definitely NOT turn down an acceptance in order to re-apply, especially from a well reputed and solid program like Mayo.

If you still have this prestige-hungry attitude then aim for Ivy for residency/fellowship.

 

[thenucleusaccumbens]

"Ivies" aren't really a thing for med school. Med school is not undergrad. Brown and Dartmouth are both "Ivies" but their med schools are ranked mid-tier.

I'm a Mayo MN student and I can tell you that the majority of my classmates also received acceptances from other top tier med schools like Hopkins, Stanford, Harvard, etc. and turned them down to be at Mayo. People come to Mayo because they really want to be here.

This is not meant to bash you at all, but I'm a bit confused as to why you applied to Mayo if you did not want to attend?

 

[scribbles&rambles]

It is never a good idea to pass off an offer from any medical school, just to take the gamble of going through the application cycle again in the hopes of getting somewhere else. Re-applicants face a somewhat different ballgame, and I feel like medical schools will wonder why you turned down Mayo just to reapply. Secondly, Mayo is an incredible medical school--well-known, reputable, great education--so I don't see why you're concerned with its level of prestige?

I know I'm just reiterating what everyone before me has said, but I personally feel it's a really bad idea to turn down Mayo to re-apply. At the end of the day, it's your decision, but I would strongly advise against it.

 

[thenucleusaccumbens]

Also I believe that if you turn down acceptances to reapply next year, schools may be able to see that you had an acceptance that you passed up on. That would not look good. Not 100% sure but maybe someone who knows more about this can comment from an admissions standpoint @Goro @LizzyM @gonnif

 

[MarineMDHopeful]

I say withdraw of go to Baylor. Not trying to be mean, but with a class size of 46 there is lttle room to fit someone who is so adamant about not going to Mayo that reapplying is a possibility. Choose Baylor or reapply.

In a small environment one person with the "I cant believe I am stuck here and didn't get into XSOM" attitude can decrease morale. Either be happy to go to the most selective school in the country or give it up to the dozens who are still sending updates and Interest letters to Mayo because they see Mayo's value to them.

 

[metview]

Do not take a year off and reapply. Mayo and Baylor are great schools. It would be silly to decline an offer and waste a year to get into a better school and there is no guarantee you will. Even if you were guaranteed a spot in a top 5 med school, I still wouldn't do it. Makes no sense.

 

[Goro]

Please don't bash me for asking this question. I am a Yale senior. Would you say that Mayo, MN is as prestigious as the other Ivies. Let's say that I don't have any concerns about class size, weather, or fees. I got accepted into Mayo and am trying to see if I should wait and apply next year to see if I could get into Harvard, Stanford, Johns Hopkins, or Yale (my dream schools).

Mayo IS a Top Medical School. By all means, give up your seat, because you clearly don't wish to be a doctor, and I'd rather your seat go to someone who does.

BTW, Dream schools are like dream girls: better in the abstract than reality”. –The exceptionally wise gyngyn

 

[MedicalDoge]

Why are y'all trying to help this person??

OP, yes please drop mayo and apply next year I would love to watch you ruin your life! Lol

 

[UGtoMed]

Thank you all for your input. I applied to Mayo with it's hospital ranking in mind.Now, I am a little confused about my decision on Mayo with the following two topics in SDN.
1. Residency director score isn't that great.
2. In a thread, it was said that Mayo is highly over rated/ranked.
I can honestly say that I am looking for answers on the above two topics.

 

[Willy38]

Don’t turn down an acceptance and reapply, you will be blacklisted everywhere.

If I were you I’d go to Baylor but Mayo is a good school too and both are plenty prestigious. Med school is a different animal than business or law, getting an acceptance to any med school is on par with acceptance at a top law or business school. It just may not be reflected in the layperson’s understanding of prestige which seems to be what you’re getting at.

I’d really think about how sure you are that you want to do medicine before committing.

 

[mw18]

I assume that you applied to Harvard, Stanford, Hopkins, and Yale this year and didn't get in. If you didn't apply there, then what were you thinking if that's what you wanted so badly? If you did, then what are you thinking? That you'd rather try again next year at places that have already shown a disinterest in you, compounded by the fact they'll know you turned down an acceptance? And not just an acceptance, but an acceptance at Mayo (and Baylor), one (two) of the best schools in the country. Mayo is a phenomenal place with a phenomenal match list. A match list of people going to great residencies. A residency is one of those things you'll probably never see if you turn your acceptance down.

 

[Willy38]

Thank you all for your input. I applied to Mayo with it's hospital ranking in mind.Now, I am a little confused about my decision on Mayo with the following two topics in SDN.
1. Residency director score isn't that great.
2. In a thread, it was said that Mayo is highly over rated/ranked.
I can honestly say that I am looking for answers on the above two topics.

I think historically people have said it’s overrated bc the hospital is stellar and the med school has had less NIH money and less competitive student metrics compared to some other top places. I don’t think this really matters though and seems to be changing if I’m not mistaken.

PD Scores on USNWR are a very loose proxy for what they intend to measure so I wouldn't weight that too heavily.

As @Goro says, the only people who care about USNWR stuff are pre-meds and deans. You won't get any flak coming from either Mayo or Baylor. And you've already got the Yale bachelor's degree so for lay prestige you are all set!

 

[hebrewBAMmer]

jesus christ....

 

[Dr. Meliodas]

My eyes are bleeding from reading this . . .

 

[KdotLB]

As Charles Barkley would say....

C’MON MAN!


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[curbsideconsult]

"Oh no, two women are in love with me. They're both gorgeous and sexy. My wallet's too small for my fifties and my diamond shoes are too tight!!"

 

[cloudcomputingunicorn]

If you think Mayo is not good enough for you and your heart is set on going to an Ivy League school, then please, for your sake and Mayo's, withdraw from Mayo. It's fair to say that there are plenty of WL peeps who would be happier than you would be at Mayo. Think about it. You don't want to spend the next four years regretting not going to your dream school (Harvard, Stanford, Johns Hopkins, Yale, etc.).

 

[KdotLB]

If you think Mayo is not good enough for you and your heart is set on going to an Ivy League school, then please, for your sake and Mayo's, withdraw from Mayo. It's fair to say that there are plenty of WL peeps who would be happier than you would be at Mayo. Think about it. You don't want to spend the next four years regretting not going to your dream school (Harvard, Stanford, Johns Hopkins, Yale, etc.).

Not to mention Princeton, right?


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[Dr. Meliodas]

I got accepted into Mayo and am trying to see if I should wait and apply next year to see if I could get into Harvard, Stanford, Johns Hopkins, or Yale (my dream schools).

Yale's not even top 10 anymore eww why would you rather there (sarcasm)

 

[Disciple of Sattar]

Thank you all for your input. I applied to Mayo with it's hospital ranking in mind.Now, I am a little confused about my decision on Mayo with the following two topics in SDN.
1. Residency director score isn't that great.
2. In a thread, it was said that Mayo is highly over rated/ranked.
I can honestly say that I am looking for answers on the above two topics.

I think there needs to be a disclaimer on this site reminding readers to take SDN neuroticism with a metric ton of salt. It might help reduce the perpetuation of ridiculous thinking like this.

 

[thenucleusaccumbens]

I think historically people have said it’s overrated bc the hospital is stellar and the med school has had less NIH money and less competitive student metrics compared to some other top places. I don’t think this really matters though and seems to be changing if I’m not mistaken.

PD Scores on USNWR are a very loose proxy for what they intend to measure so I wouldn't weight that too heavily.

As @Goro says, the only people who care about USNWR stuff are pre-meds and deans. You won't get any flak coming from either Mayo or Baylor. And you've already got the Yale bachelor's degree so for lay prestige you are all set!

In terms of student metrics at Mayo, you are right that has changed somewhat in recent years, but I think only really the average MCAT score of matriculants. 10 years ago it was around 85-90th percentile, but has gone up and in the last couple of years has been 95th percentile. The average GPA has been around 3.9, but they are not as strict with GPA screens compared to many of the other top schools. I think it's interesting that Mayo has had one of the highest Step 1 averages, even 10 years ago when the average MCAT was not as high as it is now, Step 1 average was still higher than many other top tier schools.

I think that historically the less NIH money thing may have hurt Mayo most with USNWR rankings because if you look at UCSF they technically have less competitive student metrics compared to the other top 10 schools (they are still very high of course); even though UCSF and Mayo had similar stats in the past, UCSF ranked higher. Now Mayo actually has higher stats than UCSF. Although Mayo doesn't receive as much NIH funding (comparatively speaking, they are still in the top 20 for NIH funding), they do get a lot more money from private benefactors. Overall I think Mayo has major differences from the other top tier med schools that make it like comparing apples and oranges - it's very small (only ~50 students in each class), it's not affiliated with a university, and while Mayo Clinic has been around since the 1800s the med school only started in the 1970s

 

[thenucleusaccumbens]

Thank you all for your input. I applied to Mayo with it's hospital ranking in mind.Now, I am a little confused about my decision on Mayo with the following two topics in SDN.
1. Residency director score isn't that great.
2. In a thread, it was said that Mayo is highly over rated/ranked.
I can honestly say that I am looking for answers on the above two topics.

The residency director score for Mayo is 4.1. Yale is 4.2. Harvard is the highest ranked med school in the country and their residency director score is 4.6 so not exactly a huge difference. There are other amazing med schools that are ranked in the top 20 that have residency director scores < 4 so I wouldn't say that Mayo's "residency director score isn't that great"

It's sad because there are people on the waitlist at Mayo who absolutely love the school and would do anything to be in your shoes. You really don't seem excited about Mayo at all. It's such a small class and might be hard for you to be around people who are thrilled to be here, many of whom chose it over the very schools you think are so much better. Mayo isn't for everyone and it's absolutely fine if you would rather be at a different school, but if you are at the point where you are seriously considering reapplying next year, then maybe you should just go with Baylor because at least the class will be 4x the size of Mayo's so you might have better luck finding someone to commiserate with.

 

[LizzyM]

Troll much?

 

[Prometheus123]

WTF!?!

-If I am not mistaken Mayo is the most competitive medical school in the nation.
-it is ranked the top hospital, not a top hospital, the top hospital in the nation by USNWR
-it is probably has more clinical talent and cutting edge clinical work than anywhere else in the world.
-it has a small class size so you get to work nearly 1 on 1 with top faculty and cream of the crop residency
-it was a place you decided to apply to and now you think it was a bad idea
-has this OP have his head so far up his A-S-S that he/she cannot see the incredible opportunities that Mayo offers?
-Maybe the OP is so blindly egotistical that they cant possibly imagine attending anything other than an Ivy
-Of course if they turn this down and reapply next year, every school will automatically know that you were accepted (via acceptance report) and that will be attached to your AMCAS ID

-And they will all say:
"What 'Schmuck' would turn down Mayo?"
"Who has such poor judgement to turn down Mayo?"
"Who is the egotist who thinks he/she is God's gift to Medicine?"

There is no school, repeat, no school that will be impressed that you turned down Mayo to apply to them. They will think as we all do, it would be the dumbest, most boneheaded move ever made by any premed. Not only is turning any acceptance the biggest mistake that any premed can do, turning down Mayo would now be my number one, top example of the most foolish, idiotic, ridiculous, and ludicrous act that I have heard any premed make in my over 30 years of working in and around medical school admissions.

In sum, you would be a "Putz " for doing so. Go take a freezing cold shower until shiver uncontrollably and turn blue, then slap yourself in front of the mirror until this absurd idea is purged from your soul.

That's the time second time today you've had to break out your Moonstruck clip...it must be a fool moon or something.

 

[altblue]

Very solid job, 8/10.

 

[UGtoMed]

I assume that you applied to Harvard, Stanford, Hopkins, and Yale this year and didn't get in. If you didn't apply there, then what were you thinking if that's what you wanted so badly? If you did, then what are you thinking? That you'd rather try again next year at places that have already shown a disinterest in you, compounded by the fact they'll know you turned down an acceptance? And not just an acceptance, but an acceptance at Mayo (and Baylor), one (two) of the best schools in the country. Mayo is a phenomenal place with a phenomenal match list. A match list of people going to great residencies. A residency is one of those things you'll probably never see if you turn your acceptance down.

I submitted my secondary to Harvard, Stanford and Hopkins very late in October and did not get an interview. I was only wondering if that was the reason for not getting interview from these schools, and if it would even be a good idea to reapply early next year if that would make any difference.

I know that everyone is upset with me, but I am getting a lot of insight from the responses and do appreciate all your input.

 

[3toedsloth]

:troll:

 

[daisydukes99]

The residency director score for Mayo is 4.1. Yale is 4.2. Harvard is the highest ranked med school in the country and their residency director score is 4.6 so not exactly a huge difference. There are other amazing med schools that are ranked in the top 20 that have residency director scores < 4 so I wouldn't say that Mayo's "residency director score isn't that great"

It's sad because there are people on the waitlist at Mayo who absolutely love the school and would do anything to be in your shoes. You really don't seem excited about Mayo at all. It's such a small class and might be hard for you to be around people who are thrilled to be here, many of whom chose it over the very schools you think are so much better. Mayo isn't for everyone and it's absolutely fine if you would rather be at a different school, but if you are at the point where you are seriously considering reapplying next year, then maybe you should just go with Baylor because at least the class will be 4x the size of Mayo's so you might have better luck finding someone to commiserate with.

Where/how do you find residency director scores? I'm choosing between Miami and northwestern would you mind telling me theirs?

 

[LizzyM]

Please don't bash me for asking this question. I am a Yale senior. Would you say that Mayo, MN is as prestigious as the other Ivies. Let's say that I don't have any concerns about class size, weather, or fees. I got accepted into Mayo and am trying to see if I should wait and apply next year to see if I could get into Harvard, Stanford, Johns Hopkins, or Yale (my dream schools).

You might be the only Yalie holding an offer from Mayo at this point. Do you really want it widely known that you were not happy with your admission to Mayo? Here's hoping that Mayo faculty aren't reading this threa.

 

[MedicalDoge]

You might be the only Yalie holding an offer from Mayo at this point. Do you really want it widely known that you were not happy with your admission to Mayo? Here's hoping that Mayo faculty aren't reading this threa.

Here's to hoping they are..

 

[3toedsloth]

You might be the only Yalie holding an offer from Mayo at this point. Do you really want it widely known that you were not happy with your admission to Mayo? Here's hoping that Mayo faculty aren't reading this threa.

Here's to hoping they are..

Here’s to hoping OP was smart enough to lie about his school in his original post.

 

[altblue]

Here’s to hoping OP was smart enough to lie about his school in his original post.

I'm hoping they're just a troll... it'd be frustrating to know there are people who are profoundly concerned about a slight dip, if that, in prestige.

 

[dark_knight]

Wow. People here are really hateful. I understand the OP asked a rather foolish question, but if we were all judged on our dumbest comments none of us would fare much better. To wish failure on him/her is not beneficial to the situation and doesn't really help you, them or anyone. I was always taught "If you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all".

In fact I'm rather terrified that most of you all will become future physicians, taking care of patients who will say the dumbest stuff to you. I hope you will afford them more kindness and guidance when that happens.

To OP. I understand your frustration. You think you're competitive for "more prestigious"institutions and you're disappointed at your results. At the same time, I want to warn you that you are not thinking clearly. Mayo is a very prestigious and highly ranked institution (as of this year "Top 6"). They have one of the best hospitals in the world. You will receive outstanding training.

My advice to you is attend Mayo and do the best you can. You can always do residency or fellowship at the places you listed.

 

[Prometheus123]

I think everyone here is just pushing the OP to improve his bad attitude, and there's nothing wrong with that. We're also reacting to the fact that there are thousands of people who got waitlisted or rejected who have probably worked just as hard, would make excellent physicians, and, unlike the OP, would be grateful for the extraordinary opportunity he has been given.

This thread makes me wish that the rankings didn't exist. This is just my $0.02*, but for our own sakes, I think we should choose schools based on whether there's a good fit, e.g. shared values and mission, proximity to family or friends, the presence of teachers and researchers we like and want to learn from, opportunities to serve our favorite populations maybe, etc. Choosing a school based exclusively on ranking is as shallow and misguided as choosing a partner based only on the average attractiveness of their exes. I'm not saying ignore rank entirely (although that is what I choose to do), just that that shouldn't be the primary (and certainly not the only) reason for pursuing schools.

*EDIT: To be more accurate, this is a combination of my opinion and the opinion of the AAMC.

 

[thenucleusaccumbens]

Wow. People here are really hateful. I understand the OP asked a rather foolish question, but if we were all judged on our dumbest comments none of us would fare much better. To wish failure on him/her is not beneficial to the situation and doesn't really help you, them or anyone. I was always taught "If you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all".

In fact I'm rather terrified that most of you all will become future physicians, taking care of patients who will say the dumbest stuff to you. I hope you will afford them more kindness and guidance when that happens.

To OP. I understand your frustration. You think you're competitive for "more prestigious"institutions and you're disappointed at your results. At the same time, I want to warn you that you are not thinking clearly. Mayo is a very prestigious and highly ranked institution (as of this year "Top 6"). They have one of the best hospitals in the world. You will receive outstanding training.

My advice to you is attend Mayo and do the best you can. You can always do residency or fellowship at the places you listed.

The vast majority of comments in this thread are not hateful or wishing failure on the OP. The OP has actually been given a lot of solid advice and even responded that they appreciate the insight people have shared.

 

[Prometheus123]

The vast majority of comments in this thread are not hateful or wishing failure on the OP. The OP has actually been given a lot of solid advice and even responded that they appreciate the insight people have shared.

True, which hopefully shows the beginnings of capacity for improvement on the OP's part, though I think that remains to be seen.

 

[dark_knight]

The vast majority of comments in this thread are not hateful or wishing failure on the OP. The OP has actually been given a lot of solid advice and even responded that they appreciate the insight people have shared.

You're right. Most of the responses were helpful. I'm more disappointed in comments like this.....

Why are y'all trying to help this person??

OP, yes please drop mayo and apply next year I would love to watch you ruin your life! Lol

It's sad to see a comment like this receive so much support here (over 11 likes). It makes me scared that this is the mentality of my future colleagues. I expect more empathy and compassion (especially with all the volunteering, talk of helping people, blah, blah).

Maybe I'm just really naive.

 

[Prometheus123]

You're right. Most of the responses were helpful. I'm more disappointed in comments like this.....



It's sad to see a comment like this receive so much support here (over 11 likes). It makes me scared that this is the mentality of my future colleagues. I expect more empathy and compassion (especially with all the volunteering, talk of helping people, blah, blah).

Maybe I'm just really naive.

That was only said because, frankly, the OP was being oblivious, privileged, ungrateful, disrespectful, and irrational. It's only natural to want there to be some justice in the world, especially since it's about what's right for patients, not for any one of us. And I don't know about you, but I'd rather my family members be taken care of by someone who's better at making decisions than this guy and who isn't so obnoxious.

Don't worry. This thread has not given you a real reason to worry about the friendliness or compassion of most of your future colleagues. Giving critical yet necessary feedback (sometimes by pointing out how ridiculous someone is being with humor) is part of the culture. Just don't do what he's doing, be open to negative feedback and genuinely interested in constantly improving yourself for the rest of your life, and you should be fine.

 

[MedicalDoge]

You're right. Most of the responses were helpful. I'm more disappointed in comments like this.....



It's sad to see a comment like this receive so much support here (over 11 likes). It makes me scared that this is the mentality of my future colleagues. I expect more empathy and compassion (especially with all the volunteering, talk of helping people, blah, blah).

Maybe I'm just really naive.

I think the flaw in your logic is couched in your statement. I love helping people who cry when you serve them a meal, who are eternally grateful that you helped them find housing or put a roof over their head, or who come in needing healthcare; serving these types of people is an honor beyond words.

Narcissists who think they are too good for the Mayo Clinic?? For better or worse, their severe first world problems get NONE of my sympathy, and even earn my ire.

I will say, I usually go by the philosophy of not saying anything unless it is both true and kind. I apologize for deviating from this on this thread. I will no longer come back to this because this is probably a troll anyway and the post makes my eyes bleed

 

[UGtoMed]

Wow. People here are really hateful. I understand the OP asked a rather foolish question, but if we were all judged on our dumbest comments none of us would fare much better. To wish failure on him/her is not beneficial to the situation and doesn't really help you, them or anyone. I was always taught "If you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all".

In fact I'm rather terrified that most of you all will become future physicians, taking care of patients who will say the dumbest stuff to you. I hope you will afford them more kindness and guidance when that happens.

To OP. I understand your frustration. You think you're competitive for "more prestigious"institutions and you're disappointed at your results. At the same time, I want to warn you that you are not thinking clearly. Mayo is a very prestigious and highly ranked institution (as of this year "Top 6"). They have one of the best hospitals in the world. You will receive outstanding training.

My advice to you is attend Mayo and do the best you can. You can always do residency or fellowship at the places you listed.

Thank you. As you can imagine, I worked really hard to get to this point. And I am grateful that I got Mayo. What I am trying to understand is the reason for not even receiving an interview from those other institutions. I wanted to know if I was late applying to those colleges towards the middle/end of October and if that was the reason for not getting the interviews.

 

[DBC03]

Thank you. As you can imagine, I worked really hard to get to this point. And I am grateful that I got Mayo. What I am trying to understand is the reason for not even receiving an interview from those other institutions. I wanted to know if I was late applying to those colleges towards the middle/end of October.

OP - the problem at this point is that why you did not receive an II to the other institutions is neither here nor there. If you give up an acceptance to Mayo to try applying again, there is almost no chance of getting interviews at those places. It is possible that a late application could have been part of the problem, but it’s more likely that there are a lot of amazing applicants to those schools and you somehow did not get chosen for an interview. There are late applicants who get interviews, and there are a lot of amazing candidates don’t get interviews. One problem with this thread is that some of us have seen amazing people get waitlisted at Mayo when it was their top choice. One person had 20 interviews to top schools - including the ones you did not hear from. Hearing of someone who got off the waitlist, but wants to start the application process over again leaves a bad taste in our mouths. I understand the desire to go to a different school. At this point you’ll have to move forward with your current options.


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[GonnaB3MDm8]

Seriously guys? OP is clearly a troll, and a good one at that.

 

[DSM_302.0]

Seriously guys? OP is clearly a troll, and a good one at that.

Agreed. Seems strange someone would be deciding between two schools on May 5th. That decision should have been made five days prior.

 

[Dr. Meliodas]

Agreed. Seems strange someone would be deciding between two schools on May 5th. That decision should have been made five days prior.

Not if they were accepted off the wait list this past week. Schools are required to give you 5 days after the April 30th deadline to make a decision.

 

[DSM_302.0]

Not if they were accepted off the wait list this past week. Schools are required to give you 5 days after the April 30th deadline to make a decision.

Of course that's possible, but the post didn't seem to indicate that a choice had been made and then a new waitlist offer came thru; this smells of a troll post imho.

 

[DBC03]

I thought the first post kind of indicated getting off the waitlist, but could be wrong.


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