Is it better to have a really good MCAT score and a so-so GPA (like a 3.5) or a really good GPA (4.0) and a so-so MCAT score, if you're at a pretty average college (like ranked 60 something on the list of top 100 colleges)?
MCAT vs. GPA- which is more important?
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kpcrew
Having a high gpa is important but the MCAT is graded with a scaled score and helps balance out the variation in grading at different institutions. A 3.8 at Cornell is probably not the same thing as a 3.8 at Harvard and major/rigor of classes taken plays a role as well.
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Public U ftw.
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kpcrew
Students at schools like Princeton, Boston University and Cornell are known for having lower GPAs. Harvard and Brown have a reputation for grade inflation.
no problem
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I agree. If your MCAT "matches up" with your GPA, then I would probably consider the GPA more important since that's 4 years of work.
But if you have a 4.0 with a 25 mcat, clearly something fishy is going on and I don't think you will have an easy time in your applications explaining why you either cheated your way through, had such grade inflation, or just can't perform on standard tests (In which case good luck on the steps).
Or a 3.0 with a 40Mcat, I think someone would take you.
I think when there are discrepancies in your application the MCAT, which is really the great equalizer, will take precedence as a true judge of what you know.
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one of these schools is not like the other..
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To answer the OP's question in one word: yes.
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LOL it would be pretty funny if the OP went to Boston University
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kpcrew
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Why? Did she not want to take the MCAT again and maybe change up her preparation? I would kill for that GPA. She might also be in a rush to go to medical school, which is the case with two people I know that want to go to a carib school next year.
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from what I have experienced, a high mcat definately trumps a high gpa. It is the great equalizer. mcat's play a bigger role in the decision because students are required to take shelf exams during clerkship. mcat's are a predictot of a students ability to pass these exams.
I guess I have a ridiculously high MCAT and a so-so GPA, it really didn't do as much for me as you would think. Basically, med schools want to see both high GPA and MCAT scores and the one you don't have is the one that is more important.
Personally, I have never met a dumb person with a high MCAT score but I see lots of dumb people with high GPAs, so I value the MCAT more. But I am not on an admissions committee.
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235009
high GPAs are a dime a dozen but a 35+ on the MCAT is (relatively) rare and much more valuable. if you look through the MSAR almost all the schools have more or less the same GPA range but there is a huge difference in MCAT scores
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I definitely agree here.
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kpcrew
I have a 37. Boom myth busted.
But yea, it's pretty true.
1) Take an easy major
2) Get a 4.0
3) ???
4) Matriculate at med school
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There are plenty of stellar students from top undergrad schools in DO/Caribbean schools. Not everyone can withstand the whole process again. Especially those who are used to being top of his/her class, I guess.
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lols
True, but medicine is not like string theory. You don't need to be a genius to be doctor. A hard-working person with 70 percentile IQ is more likely to be a good doctor than a genius with bad work ethics, jmho.
The MCAT is a weed-out test. It's not uncommon to see sub-30 MCATs and 230+ step I scores. I know intelligent people who struggle with the test.
Medicine is more about work ethic IMO. The material is frankly not that difficult.
Medicine is more about work ethic IMO. The material is frankly not that difficult.
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This is because most schools aren't all that rigorous. MCAT helps compensate somewhat, but no test is perfect (there are also smart people that don't break 30).
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Thank you! Especially those of us that are graduating in three years and have no time to study for the mcat.🙄
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i think a high MCAT does more to make up for a low GPA than the other way around (i had a 3.3 and a 38Q and i had great luck this cycle)
i've noticed this among my friends, and i feel like i see this trend repeated on SDN, though we would really have to do a survey or collect some data to be sure.
I really think that GPA should be weighted more relative to the MCAT than it is (even though this would screw me pretty good). Four years of hard work vs. one test?
Just my $0.02
i've noticed this among my friends, and i feel like i see this trend repeated on SDN, though we would really have to do a survey or collect some data to be sure.
I really think that GPA should be weighted more relative to the MCAT than it is (even though this would screw me pretty good). Four years of hard work vs. one test?
Just my $0.02
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deleted413795
Both things are given considerable weight. I think it depends on why the OP is asking. I would say it is worth sacrificing class study time for MCAT study time since one B or C most likely hurts you less than a poor MCAT score.
However, a great MCAT does not make up for a mediocre GPA. So, 3.7 or higher GPA and a 35+ MCAT should do just fine. Make it work, people.
However, a great MCAT does not make up for a mediocre GPA. So, 3.7 or higher GPA and a 35+ MCAT should do just fine. Make it work, people.
Yes. Being smart is a necessary but insufficient requirement for high MCAT.
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I would kill for a 40+. Essentially, like others have mentioned, and high GPA and a very low MCAT can be suspect. I personally know two people that cheated their way through undergrad and had high GPA's. But when it came time to take the GRE's and MCAT's, they both failed miserably. My GPA is way to low for med school right now, but I'm hoping after this year with all A's, I will be competitive.
From what I've studied, I'd say: sGPA- 3.5+, cGPA- 3.5+, MCAT- 35+ is very competitive, at the lowest means.
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The reason for administering the MCAT, or any standardized test, is that it is just that--standardized. Like a poster said above me, the MCAT is the equalizer. Many students have 4.0 GPA's or similar, but they all come from different undergraduate institutions, had different curricula, had different professors, had different majors, and had different grading schemes, so no 4.0 GPA is truly the same. If adcoms were to base their decisions on GPA's alone, it would be like comparing apples and oranges. If we lived in world where everyone attended one standardized nation-wide institution, with one curriculum, one grading scheme, one general "pre-med" track, and each course taught by the same professors (via internet streaming, for example), then I would venture to say the need for a standardized test like the MCAT would be diminished.
I agree that a high MCAT does validate a high GPA. There are many reasons why a student would get a low/average MCAT score, but there's usually only one reason why someone would get a high MCAT score.
I agree that a high MCAT does validate a high GPA. There are many reasons why a student would get a low/average MCAT score, but there's usually only one reason why someone would get a high MCAT score.
Statistically 1 in 4^144 (5*10^86 according to Excel) monkeys would get 45, but no monkey will pay $240 for a raffle ticket with that kind of chance.
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I would say that if you're scoring high on the MCAT then most of the time it's indicative of a strong work ethic. Unless anybody here thinks it's easy to score high without at least a month of serious studying.
I got a 36S on the MCAT. I also studied 5 hours a day, 4 days a week over 2 months for it. I don't know of anybody who just showed up and got 35+ on the MCAT, and I know a lot of very intelligent people.
GPA can also be pretty easily skewed. I had a pretty bad (3.00) Freshman year, and followed the last 3 up with around a 3.75 GPA. If you didn't look at it year by year however, you'd see I have a 3.55 GPA, which is well below average at most medical schools. Getting a B in first semester general chemistry shouldn't count for much if you come back and get an A both semesters of OChem, but it does.
I got a 36S on the MCAT. I also studied 5 hours a day, 4 days a week over 2 months for it. I don't know of anybody who just showed up and got 35+ on the MCAT, and I know a lot of very intelligent people.
GPA can also be pretty easily skewed. I had a pretty bad (3.00) Freshman year, and followed the last 3 up with around a 3.75 GPA. If you didn't look at it year by year however, you'd see I have a 3.55 GPA, which is well below average at most medical schools. Getting a B in first semester general chemistry shouldn't count for much if you come back and get an A both semesters of OChem, but it does.
I put in approx 100 hours over 2.5 wks. That's about 5-6 hrs per day. I managed a 33Q. I think the MCAT is pretty stupid.
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Cramming within 2.5 weeks is kind of crazy, when you consider all the material on the exam. 33Q is a great score for only 2.5 weeks.
That's why the MCAT is stupid. If you can think pretty well you will do ok. There's no way i would done this for some of the more challenging classes in college e.g. Organic Chemistry. I was very good at O. Chem but 2.5 wks of review wouldn't have done much for me.
PS: If I studied an additional month, I doubt I would've scored past a 37 or 38. And I honestly thought I made a 14-15 on BS and was a bit shocked to just score a 12. Extra review wouldn't have helped me. Overall, I'm very happy with my score. Hopefully I get more interviews
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That's why the MCAT is stupid. If you can think pretty well you will do ok. There's no way i would done this for some of the more challenging classes in college e.g. Organic Chemistry. I was very good at O. Chem but 2.5 wks of review wouldn't have done much for me.
PS: If I studied an additional month, I doubt I would've scored past a 37 or 38. And I honestly thought I made a 14-15 on BS and was a bit shocked to just score a 12. Extra review wouldn't have helped me. Overall, I'm very happy with my score. Hopefully I get more interviews
Well, a 33Q is a respectable score, and I think you would have done even better with another month of studying. Good luck with the interviews!!
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this is a great point! i wasn't thinking about it like that, but you're absolutely right. for instance, i have friends that went to GA Tech where a 3.0 is a great GPA. i'm sure we can all think of similar examples
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High MCAT over high GPA hands down. But I don't think MCAT score is necessarily equivalent to your potential as a physician. Some people are just better test taker than others and some people can think more like MCAT makers than others.
Anyway, does anyone have a link to the correlation btwn MCAT scores and step scores?
Anyway, does anyone have a link to the correlation btwn MCAT scores and step scores?
👍 I agree, usually it's only the people who study and know things that are good test takers. What does knowing stuff have to do with being a doctor? Your ability to wisely discern easy classes, soft professors, and major in subjects like 'psychology', THESE will make you a great doctor.
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Haha. I love the "I'm a bad test taker" line.
Daniel tosh has a hilarious joke on this.
"Don't you love it when people in school are like, 'I'm a bad test taker.' You mean you're stupid. Oh, you struggle with that part where we find out what you know? I can totally relate see, because I'm a brilliant painter minus my god awful brushstrokes. Oh, how the masterpiece is crystal in my head but once the paint hits canvas I develop Parkinson's"
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wow-- do med school normalize GPAs against a school's average before comparing them against each other? if not, this would seem like a college that doesnt inflate its students' GPAs is putting them at a disadvantage...
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Exactly. Assuming JHU means you attend Hopkins undergrad, I do not see why you would want GPA weighted more. Many bright people from your school would get the shaft. Hopkins is harder than 99% of schools out there, and your 3.3 at Hopkins actually isn't that bad. You simply cannot equate a 3.3 at Hopkins undergrad to a 3.3 at most schools. Places like Hopkins, Tech, MIT, Cornell, Vanderbilt, Penn, WUSTL, etc. have many bright students with GPA < 3.5 and MCAT >30. These students would most likely have thrived (GPA-wise) at most places.
It does, unfortunately.This is one reason why places like Harvard and Yale inflate. Not only to attract students there with the promise of an "easy" 3.5+, but also the fact that if graded properly, there would be HS valedictorians with a 2.9/34 due to crazy competition.
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for a bunch of people who publish research and are considered some of the most brilliant thinkers in the scientific method, you'd think that they would have come up with some sort of system to statistically eliminate the variations of gpa between schools based on both a school's average gpa and competitiveness. i mean, i do it all the time in research and insurance companies have it down pretty pat... why cant a bunch of research oriented med school committees do it? maybe i'm just frustrated, but it doesnt seem that rigorous, yet prestigious schools are given much of a break in terms of GPA im thinking moneyball here-- using statistics to identify candidates other "teams" or schools are not taking...
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Indeed. I can't really say if any schools have such a system, but I do seem to remember Lizzy M suggesting that at her school some places are given more weight. A hypothetical example being that at Hopkins, applicants have the same average MCAT as those at Harvard, but a GPA 0.3 lower. The average GPA of those Hopkins applicants would then be taken into account, and evaluated from a proper perspective. I go to a top 20 that has no inflation, or arguably deflation in the sciences, and the average accepted applicant here has a lower GPA than the average accepted national applicant. Perhaps this reflects some leeway given in terms of GPA. I haven't had much success this cycle with a low-ish GPA/decent MCAT, so I'm not entirely sure how much thought is really put into these things. Most likely, they will overlook a low-GPA from a rigorous school if you have a better than "decent" MCAT score, i.e. 34+.
And they all get 90k+ salary offers by 2nd semester of junior year...
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What if you have a high GPA, high MCAT, and NO work ethic? It happens...
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yea, but that's if you want to go into engineering/similar field that gtech is known for. but for those unfortunate enough to discover their calling elsewhere, such as in medicine, the system can be very unforgiving. i have a friend who goes there; she has a good mcat (35), but she thinks her lowish gpa (3.3) puts her at a huge disadvantage for the "premier schools"
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