MCAT vs LSAT

[YankeesfanZF5]

So I was just wondering if any of you fellow pre meds have thought about going to law school? Maybe get a JD/MPH? I think that would be a good back up plan but I think maybe a bio major may set me back on that? Did any of my fellow premeds end up at law school? How tough is the lsat in comparison to mcat? I heard law school is easier to get into than medical school? Im sure it depends on the university of course. Any pre reqs for law?

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[WedgeDawg]

@Law2Doc is probably the only user here qualified to answer this question.

The only thing I can really add is that in law admissions, your GPA+LSAT makes up a bigger chunk of the overall pie than GPA+MCAT does in med admissions.

 

[flyingeagle]

From what my pre-law friends have told me, there are no pre-req courses for law school, so you'd be fine for that. Obviously, though, knowing about the legal system would help for interviews and such. And yes, usually acceptance rates are higher for law school, but the catch is that your law school ranking is very important in determining what kind of law you can practice (unlike for medical school because going to any US MD school makes you all set, whereas I heard you should aim for a top 15 law school). I also agree with what @WedgeDawg said. I would double check everything I have said though.

 

[YankeesfanZF5]

@Law2Doc is probably the only user here qualified to answer this question.

The only thing I can really add is that in law admissions, your GPA+LSAT makes up a bigger chunk of the overall pie than GPA+MCAT does in med admissions.

I heard they do not interview or anything so you just have to have good test score and gpa and your in? Less hoops then med school admissions.

 

[WedgeDawg]

I heard they do not interview or anything so you just have to have good test score and gpa and your in? Less hoops then med school admissions.

This I do not know as law school fell completely off my radar around 8th grade.

 

[flyingeagle]

So I was just wondering if any of you fellow pre meds have thought about going to law school? Maybe get a JD/MPH?

I always told my friends as a joke that I would get an MD/JD so that I can practice medicine and then represent myself in court should any lawsuits arise.

EDIT: just realized this is actually a thing that exists lol

 

[GrapesofRath]

1) A bio major will not set back any plans of going to med school, law school, getting a JD/MPH etc
2) Alot of the time a JD/MD sounds alot more glamorous and better on paper than it is in reality(another subject L2D has addressed many times if you go through his post history).
3) There arent many I know of who have used law as a "backup" in case medicine didnt work out.
4) I've taken both the LSAT and MCAT. The LSAT honestly wasnt of much greater difficulty than the SAT from my experience. The MCAT is a far harder test.
5) There are huge varieties and ranges of law schools. Some at the bottom arent that much more competitive than Caribbean MD schools. Yes in general law school is easier to get into than med school(not that should be any driving force behind a decision of such career paths). A 3.7 is the MD median GPA and the average GPA at lower tier schools. 3.7 is around the average GPA of top law schools and on average a pre-law will be majoring in and taking far easier classes than your average pre-med. In a large number of cases, if you are good enough to get into an MD program, you would have had a good shot at being capable of being a competitive T14 law candidate. The fields have different levels of people and the competition is different.
6) The pre-req for law school is a bachelors degree in most cases.

Alot of these law questions would be addressed better in general on sites devoted to law and law school admission, not SDN.

 

[WedgeDawg]

1) A bio major will not set back any plans of going to med school, law school, getting a JD/MPH etc
2) Alot of the time a JD/MD sounds alot more glamorous and better on paper than it is in reality(another subject L2D has addressed many times if you go through his post history).
3) There arent many I know of who have used law as a "backup" in case medicine didnt work out.
4) I've taken both the LSAT and MCAT. The LSAT honestly wasnt of much greater difficulty than the SAT from my experience. The MCAT is a far harder test.
5) There are huge varieties and ranges of law schools. Some at the bottom arent that much more competitive than Caribbean MD schools. Yes in general law school is easier to get into than med school(not that should be any driving force behind a decision of such career paths). A 3.7 is the MD median GPA and the average GPA at lower tier schools. 3.7 is around the average GPA of top law schools and on average a pre-law will be majoring in and taking far easier classes than your average pre-med. In a large number of cases, if you are good enough to get into an MD program, you would have had a good shot at being capable of being a competitive T14 law candidate. The fields have different levels of people and the competition is different.
6) The pre-req for law school is a bachelors degree in most cases.

Alot of these law questions would be addressed better in general on sites devoted to law and law school admission, not SDN.

I didn't know you took the LSAT!

 

[Lawpy]

@Law2Doc is probably the only user here qualified to answer this question.

The only thing I can really add is that in law admissions, your GPA+LSAT makes up a bigger chunk of the overall pie than GPA+MCAT does in med admissions.

Iirc i think @gyngyn took the LSAT eons ago as well. I could be completely off tho

1) A bio major will not set back any plans of going to med school, law school, getting a JD/MPH etc
2) Alot of the time a JD/MD sounds alot more glamorous and better on paper than it is in reality(another subject L2D has addressed many times if you go through his post history).
3) There arent many I know of who have used law as a "backup" in case medicine didnt work out.
4) I've taken both the LSAT and MCAT. The LSAT honestly wasnt of much greater difficulty than the SAT from my experience. The MCAT is a far harder test.
5) There are huge varieties and ranges of law schools. Some at the bottom arent that much more competitive than Caribbean MD schools. Yes in general law school is easier to get into than med school(not that should be any driving force behind a decision of such career paths). A 3.7 is the MD median GPA and the average GPA at lower tier schools. 3.7 is around the average GPA of top law schools and on average a pre-law will be majoring in and taking far easier classes than your average pre-med. In a large number of cases, if you are good enough to get into an MD program, you would have had a good shot at being capable of being a competitive T14 law candidate. The fields have different levels of people and the competition is different.
6) The pre-req for law school is a bachelors degree in most cases.

Alot of these law questions would be addressed better in general on sites devoted to law and law school admission, not SDN.

I didn't know you took the LSAT!

Im more curious on what standardized exam did Grapes NOT take 😛

 

[dsxmchn]

I heard they do not interview or anything so you just have to have good test score and gpa and your in? Less hoops then med school admissions.

Yeah, no interviews. It's much more like applying to college than medical school

 

[GrapesofRath]

Iirc i think @gyngyn took the LSAT eons ago as well. I could be completely off tho

Im more curious on what standardized exam did Grapes NOT take 😛

I didn't know you took the LSAT!

Haha just the DAT and LSAT outside of the MCAT. I never considered law; me taking the LSAT was just a by product of being around 6 pre-law roomates junior year and caving in and taking it just for s***'s without any real prep just to see what it was like. I never took anything about the LSAT or the thought of me ever considering becoming a lawyer seriously. As for the DAT, I was pre-dental for the first couple years of college initially and took the DAT then but just couldnt see myself in that field and switched over.

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

Haha just the DAT and LSAT outside of the MCAT. I never considered law; me taking the LSAT was just a by product of being around 6 pre-law roomates junior year and caving in and taking it just for s***'s without any real prep just to see what it was like. I never took anything about the LSAT or the thought of me ever considering becoming a lawyer seriously. As for the DAT, I was pre-dental for the first couple years of college initially and took the DAT then but just couldnt see myself in that field and switched over.

DAT vs MCAT?

 

[deleted731525]

So I was just wondering if any of you fellow pre meds have thought about going to law school? Maybe get a JD/MPH? I think that would be a good back up plan but I think maybe a bio major may set me back on that? Did any of my fellow premeds end up at law school? How tough is the lsat in comparison to mcat? I heard law school is easier to get into than medical school? Im sure it depends on the university of course. Any pre reqs for law?

I have taken both the MCAT and the LSAT. This will be an unpopular opinion here but I believe the LSAT is slightly harder. The MCAT is more knowledge based than the LSAT but once you have that knowledge the critical thinking required is more shallow imo. I got a 131 on the CARs without studying at all for it. I didn't come close to doing that well on any section in the LSAT. In the end my percentile scores were the same for both tests but I studied more for the LSAT. As with most things though this is more dependant on the individual. As for law school admissions in general it is so much easier than med school. It is 95 percent gpa and LSAT and much more predictable as a result.

 

[ZPakEffect]

I scored a 177 (99.7 %tile) on the LSAT and a 39 (99.5 %tile) on the MCAT.

I think whether the LSAT or the MCAT is harder depends on whether you are mathematically-inclined or a verbally-inclined. However, the LSAT is much easier to prepare for because there is no substantive content that you need to be familiar with. It is also probably easier to score a higher percentile on the LSAT because the MCAT has a stronger pool of takers.

 

[deleted731525]

I think that it is probably harder to get a "decent"(30/508) score on the MCAT than it is on the lsat because it is content based. However I think it is harder to get a great score on the lsat, because I think thee main challenge in the MCAT is the broadness of the content. However that content isnt very deep and while it requires critical thinking it doesnt require as much as the LSAT. I feel like the MCAT is a test where grinding is more likely to lead to a top score than the lsat. I dont think you can grind the logic games section, while you can use strategies and practice to improve it is one of those things you are either good at or you arent. So overall I feel like the content based nature of the MCAT is a double edged sword. You need to be familiar with a lot of topics to get a decent score, but that is also the major battle, something imo that is easier to work on than what the lsat tests.

 

[GrapesofRath]

DAT vs MCAT?

If the LSAT is like the SAT the DAT is like the ACT. DAT was largely just fact recollection in every sense; in many ways just like the ACT. The SAT and LSAT are at least like the MCAT in style in terms of emphasizing logic and reasoning, they just arent as difficult or abstract.

 

[deleted731525]

nvm, had a stroke

 

[gyngyn]

Iirc i think @gyngyn took the LSAT eons ago as well. I could be completely off tho

Eons, yes. I took the LSAT in 1977. I don't think prep courses existed for it. I found it delightful and had an equally delightful outcome. The MCAT on the other hand, was a lot of work.
The GRE was pretty simple.

 

[mimelim]

In contrast, I took both in 2003 and found the LSAT to be more challenging.

 

[7331poas]

1) A bio major will not set back any plans of going to med school, law school, getting a JD/MPH etc
2) Alot of the time a JD/MD sounds alot more glamorous and better on paper than it is in reality(another subject L2D has addressed many times if you go through his post history).
3) There arent many I know of who have used law as a "backup" in case medicine didnt work out.
4) I've taken both the LSAT and MCAT. The LSAT honestly wasnt of much greater difficulty than the SAT from my experience. The MCAT is a far harder test.
5) There are huge varieties and ranges of law schools. Some at the bottom arent that much more competitive than Caribbean MD schools. Yes in general law school is easier to get into than med school(not that should be any driving force behind a decision of such career paths). A 3.7 is the MD median GPA and the average GPA at lower tier schools. 3.7 is around the average GPA of top law schools and on average a pre-law will be majoring in and taking far easier classes than your average pre-med. In a large number of cases, if you are good enough to get into an MD program, you would have had a good shot at being capable of being a competitive T14 law candidate. The fields have different levels of people and the competition is different.
6) The pre-req for law school is a bachelors degree in most cases.

Alot of these law questions would be addressed better in general on sites devoted to law and law school admission, not SDN.

Pretty sure the Median GPA is way higher at top law schools than top med schools.

I think Yale is at a 4.0 median when I checked last time.

 

[deleted731525]

In contrast, I took both in 2003 and found the LSAT to be more challenging.

Out of curiosity was the MCAT on a computer back then? I was thinking about one reason why I found the lsat harder. The lsat wasnt on a computer and the text was smaller so I found it easier to subconsciously skip over small words like "not" that completely change the meaning of a passage. I didnt have that problem with the mcat.

Pretty sure the Median GPA is way higher at top law schools than top med schools.

I think Yale is at a 4.0 median when I checked last time.

Yea but you dont need to take science courses for law school. Not to say that non science is necessarily easier but at a lot of private colleges it is really easy to game the system to a high GPA if you are only taking non-science courses as they tend to be less likely to be on strict curves. And I say that as a non science major who attended a private college.

 

[GrapesofRath]

I scored a 177 (99.7 %tile) on the LSAT and a 39 (99.5 %tile) on the MCAT.

I think whether the LSAT or the MCAT is harder depends on whether you are mathematically-inclined or a verbally-inclined. However, the LSAT is much easier to prepare for because there is no substantive content that you need to be familiar with. It is also probably easier to score a higher percentile on the LSAT because the MCAT has a stronger pool of takers.

Yeah I think the latter is important to remember. The quality of the test taking pool is just higher for the MCAT and that's how you are scored; relative to how you do to other people. You might find getting 80% questions on the MCAT to be easier than 80% of the questions correct on the LSAT: but on the MCAT that might only be enough for say a 31 hypothetically(80th percentile) vs for the LSAT that might be enough for a 95th percentile score.

Also worth noting the MCAT has undergone alot more changes than the LSAT in recent years which most agree have made it more difficult. The MCAT from say 2002 is a far different ball game than the MCAT in 2016. All those old AAMC versions like 3-6 are old adminstered questions from the late 1990s and early 2000s; you can see it's a far different ball game than what the MCAT is like today.

 

[GrapesofRath]

Pretty sure the Median GPA is way higher at top law schools than top med schools.

I think Yale is at a 4.0 median when I checked last time.

Youre talking about say a 3.91 vs a 3.95 type of difference. Largely irrelevant. And amongst US MD schools the average GPAs dont vary much: Harvard's is pretty damn close to WVU's. Not the same for some bottom tier law school vs Yale.

And as others have said, on average pre-meds are taking way way more science courses than the average pre-law student. We can quibble about how "non science majors can also be very difficult" but on average if you take a look at the majors of a matriculating class in a med school vs a matriculating class in a law school, most people would generally agree the majors of MS1s on average involved harder courses than a first year law matriculant class's UG majors would.

 

[7331poas]

Youre talking about say a 3.91 vs a 3.95 type of difference. Largely irrelevant. And amongst US MD schools the average GPAs dont vary much: Harvard's is pretty damn close to WVU's. Not the same for some bottom tier law school vs Yale.

And as others have said, on average pre-meds are taking way way more science courses than the average pre-law student. We can quibble about how "non science majors can also be very difficult" but on average if you take a look at the majors of a matriculating class in a med school vs a matriculating class in a law school, most people would generally agree the majors of MS1s on average involved harder courses than a first year law matriculant class's UG majors would.

I mean, most people matriculating into medical school are bio majors. I guess I sound like an ass but thats not exactly the hardest science (which are all probably easier than engineering).

Top law students come from all types of disciplines. If you take a peek at Yale's website you will see that they have people from nearly every hard science just like a medical school might.

 

[GrapesofRath]

I mean, most people matriculating into medical school are bio majors. I guess I sound like an ass but thats not exactly the hardest science (which are all probably easier than engineering).

Top law students come from all types of disciplines. If you take a peek at Yale's website you will see that they have people from nearly every hard science just like a medical school might.

https://www.law.yale.edu/admissions/profiles-statistics/entering-class-profile
Here's the class profile I found I didnt see anything about majors in it(you might have another source you were referring to)

It's not about representation it's about which are in greater proportions. Let's be frank, there will always be exceptions but by and large the majority of pre-law majors are not science majors at any school. The majority of successful pre-meds were science majors in UG. Whatever you think of a bio major, compare it to poli-sci, literature etc. On average, pre-meds are taking more difficult courses in college than pre-laws, not sure anybody would disagree with that.

Also we are talking about Yale, the holy grail of law schools here. WE keep talking about Yale like it's representative of a typical law school and student; that's even more egregious than thinking a Harvard MD/PhD is typical of the average medical school matriculant.

171 is above the median at many T14 law schools; at Yale it's the 25th percentile. AT most law schools the 75th percentile is in the low 160s(165 tops). There's a huge huge range in the quality of law schools you dont quite see with MD programs.

 

[Nietzschelover]

In general I would agree that it's harder for most reasonably bright students to get As in the hard sciences and demanding engineering curricula. That said, often the very type of students who can ace the hard sciences might have more difficulty pulling straight As in upper level humanities courses (English lit, philosophy, etc). That's why, generally speaking, I would rank a 3.9 philosophy major who also managed a 3.9 in the pre-med pre-reqs ahead of almost everyone else. Put another way, I would bet that Harvard med and Harvard law students are very, very similar with a lot of overlap in interests and abilities.

 

[Mansamusa]

Pretty sure the Median GPA is way higher at top law schools than top med schools.

I think Yale is at a 4.0 median when I checked last time.

Not necessarily. http://www.law.northwestern.edu/admissions/profile/jdprofile.html Northwestern is another T14 and 25% of the class had below a 3.56 and they accept ~1,000 out of 4,000 applicants

 

[GrapesofRath]

In general I would agree that it's harder for most reasonably bright students to get As in the hard sciences and demanding engineering curricula. That said, often the very type of students who can ace the hard sciences might have more difficulty pulling straight As in upper level humanities courses (English lit, philosophy, etc). That's why, generally speaking, I would rank a 3.9 philosophy major who also managed a 3.9 in the pre-med pre-reqs ahead of almost everyone else. Put another way, I would bet that Harvard med and Harvard law students are very, very similar with a lot of overlap in interests and abilities.

The only thing Ill say to this is it works both ways; a large number of people with 3.9's who were philosophy majors wouldnt ace pre-med pre-reqs. I get what your saying that those who ace science classes might pull more B's in english lit but I think the opposite is what you have to consider as well.Me personally, I think your liberal arts or philosophy major with a 3.9 on average is going to have more problems pulling a 3.9 in med school pre-reqs than someone with a 3.9 in med school pre-reqs would pulling those grades in english lit. It kinda works both ways per se.

With law school it's kind of tricky and the example someone brought up with Yale is kind of misleading. That is a school full of people with numerous accolades that have nothing to do with GPAs and LSATs. Even amongst T14 law schools they are in the strong minority. Amongst most T14 law schools, big stats carry you even without anything close to those accolades that youll see Yale students have. Yale is truly the exceptionally rare law school where stats alone wont cut it; 1/4 of the class has a 177+ LSAT(you could probably say the same thing about Harvard or Stanford as well). You need to bring something else to the table, kind of like med school admission. So at Yale, or Harvard or Stanford yes, what you are saying is probably true; there is lots of overlap between Harvard law students and Harvard med students in capabilities. But for the rest of the T14 law schools? IMO no way. Even amongst your NYU's, Northwesterns and other T14 law schools of the world, theyll jump on those with big stats and not much else very frequently. I personally dont think youll see nearly the diverse interests and abilities at Penn law as you would at say Penn med school as an example.

 

[bc65]

I took the LSAT a long time ago. I did way better on the LSAT despite doing absolutely no preparation at all. However, the current LSAT has a Logical Reasoning section now that I would need to prep for, and most people seem to find that section the most challenging. The other sections are essentially reading comprehension. If you didn't excel on the MCAT verbal section you will likely not do well on the LSAT.

Obviously, though, knowing about the legal system would help for interviews and such

Actually, there are no interviews for law school, or, perhaps I should say, few if any schools have interviews as part of the admissions process. ( Although Harvard has a brief phone conversation prior to extending an admission offer ).

With law school it's kind of tricky and the example someone brought up with Yale is kind of misleading. That is a school full of people with numerous accolades that have nothing to do with GPAs and LSATs. Even amongst T14 law schools they are in the strong minority. Amongst most T14 law schools, big stats carry you even without anything close to those accolades that youll see Yale students have. Yale is truly the exceptionally rare law school where stats alone wont cut it; 1/4 of the class has a 177+ LSAT(you could probably say the same thing about Harvard or Stanford as well). You need to bring something else to the table, kind of like med school admission. So at Yale, or Harvard or Stanford yes, what you are saying is probably true; there is lots of overlap between Harvard law students and Harvard med students in capabilities. But for the rest of the T14 law schools? IMO no way. Even amongst your NYU's, Northwesterns and other T14 law schools of the world, theyll jump on those with big stats and not much else very frequently. I personally dont think youll see nearly the diverse interests and abilities at Penn law as you would at say Penn med school as an example.

This might be true to some extent, but even at Yale, and H and S, admissions seem to track the GPA and LSAT scores pretty closely, so I'm not sure the extra-curriculars make that much of a difference even for those schools.

But yes, Yale is the undisputed #1 school, year after year, with H and S competing for the 2 & 3 spots, and Columbia and NYU taking up 4 & 5, respectively. Yale also has a much smaller class size than Harvard and Stanford, making it even more competitive.

Not necessarily. http://www.law.northwestern.edu/admissions/profile/jdprofile.html Northwestern is another T14 and 25% of the class had below a 3.56 and they accept ~1,000 out of 4,000 applicants

Northwestern is a special case. They are very big on accepting students with a lot of work experience, so their statistics tend to make them outliers.

 

[Mansamusa]

Northwestern is a special case. They are very big on accepting students with a lot of work experience, so their statistics tend to make them outliers.

Columbia has basically the same gpa profile. I just know that my law school friends told me that with my 3.45-3.5 gpa from our top undergrad that as long as I got a good LSAT, I would have a really good chance of getting into a T14 school. Whereas my gpa gives me approximately 0% chance of getting into a top med school.

 

[GrapesofRath]

I took the LSAT a long time ago. I did way better on the LSAT despite doing absolutely no preparation at all. However, the current LSAT has a Logical Reasoning section now that I would need to prep for, and most people seem to find that section the most challenging. The other sections are essentially reading comprehension. If you didn't excel on the MCAT verbal section you will likely not do well on the LSAT.

This might be true to some extent, but even at Yale, and H and S, admissions seem to track the GPA and LSAT scores pretty closely, so I'm not sure the extra-curriculars make that much of a difference even for those schools.

But yes, Yale is the undisputed #1 school, year after year, with H and S competing for the 2 & 3 spots, and Columbia and NYU taking up 4 & 5, respectively. Yale also has a much smaller class size than Harvard and Stanford, making it even more competitive.

The thing at Yale is they have people with top stats AND EC accomplishments. When you have such a small class and are that caliber a school, top stats alone wont cut it. So yes, top stats are mandatory there, but just like with top med schools if all you are presenting is a 3.8+ GPA and 95th+ percentile test scores youll get thrown in the rejected pile pretty fast.

You can take a look at Yales class profile yourself to see some of the experiences they have. Note how many people take several years off before matriculating; they are doing some rather noteworthy things in that time to stand out

https://www.law.yale.edu/admissions/profiles-statistics/entering-class-profile

 

[bc65]

Columbia has basically the same gpa profile. I just know that my law school friends told me that with my 3.45-3.5 gpa from our top undergrad that as long as I got a good LSAT, I would have a really good chance of getting into a T14 school. Whereas my gpa gives me approximately 0% chance of getting into a top med school.

Last I checked, that's almost correct. I think you need closer to a 3.6 for Columbia , but yes, that gpa is close enough for a top 5 law school, but marginal for med school. However, you would still need a 95 + percentile LSAT

 

[Mansamusa]

The thing at Yale is they have people with top stats AND EC accomplishments. When you have such a small class and are that caliber a school, top stats alone wont cut it. So yes, top stats are mandatory there, but just like with top med schools if all you are presenting is a 3.8+ GPA and 95th+ percentile test scores youll get thrown in the rejected pile pretty fast.

You can take a look at Yales class profile yourself to see some of the experiences they have. Note how many people take several years off before matriculating; they are doing some rather noteworthy things in that time to stand out

https://www.law.yale.edu/admissions/profiles-statistics/entering-class-profile

How do you get a 4.28 in college?

 

[GrapesofRath]

How do you get a 4.28 in college?

They must give different weight to A+'s. Or maybe they just take whatever grade is on your schools transcript and dont recalculate anything like AAMAS does; ie if your school makes a 4.3 an A+ law schools dont change it or touch it.

 

[bc65]

The thing at Yale is they have people with top stats AND EC accomplishments. When you have such a small class and are that caliber a school, top stats alone wont cut it. So yes, top stats are mandatory there, but just like with top med schools if all you are presenting is a 3.8+ GPA and 95th+ percentile test scores youll get thrown in the rejected pile pretty fast.

You can take a look at Yales class profile yourself to see some of the experiences they have. Note how many people take several years off before matriculating; they are doing some rather noteworthy things in that time to stand out

https://www.law.yale.edu/admissions/profiles-statistics/entering-class-profile

Yes, but I was referring to the websites that track applicants by gpa and lsat. You dont see many with the good numbers being rejected, even from Yale , suggesting that ECs aren't that important. But maybe I'm mistaken. It's been a while since I checked. . But Yale law is definitely in a class by itself.

 

[Nietzschelover]

The only thing Ill say to this is it works both ways; a large number of people with 3.9's who were philosophy majors wouldnt ace pre-med pre-reqs. I get what your saying that those who ace science classes might pull more B's in english lit but I think the opposite is what you have to consider as well.Me personally, I think your liberal arts or philosophy major with a 3.9 on average is going to have more problems pulling a 3.9 in med school pre-reqs than someone with a 3.9 in med school pre-reqs would pulling those grades in english lit. It kinda works both ways per se.

With law school it's kind of tricky and the example someone brought up with Yale is kind of misleading. That is a school full of people with numerous accolades that have nothing to do with GPAs and LSATs. Even amongst T14 law schools they are in the strong minority. Amongst most T14 law schools, big stats carry you even without anything close to those accolades that youll see Yale students have. Yale is truly the exceptionally rare law school where stats alone wont cut it; 1/4 of the class has a 177+ LSAT(you could probably say the same thing about Harvard or Stanford as well). You need to bring something else to the table, kind of like med school admission. So at Yale, or Harvard or Stanford yes, what you are saying is probably true; there is lots of overlap between Harvard law students and Harvard med students in capabilities. But for the rest of the T14 law schools? IMO no way. Even amongst your NYU's, Northwesterns and other T14 law schools of the world, theyll jump on those with big stats and not much else very frequently. I personally dont think youll see nearly the diverse interests and abilities at Penn law as you would at say Penn med school as an example.

Agreed. I also agree with you about B+/A- philosophy majors (in general) but I would quibble a little that 4.0 philosophy majors wouldn't ace pre-med re-reqs. I think many in that category would. But where I think we really agree is that the folks who can ace both simultaneously are the true, rare superstars....the Dr. K types (the neurosurgeon who died).