Medical missions

[T-Cell]

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Hey guys, in the past I have heard that doing medical missions in college is looked upon unfavorably by adcoms because they look like vacations and because some might think they are unethical if you are performing procedures you are not really qualified to do. Is this still the consensus?

I have heard that some medical schools have mentioned this on their twitter, does anyone know which ones?

 

[PREDOCSIMP]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/medical-missions.5192/
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/medical-missions.59717/
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/medical-missions.216330/

 

[gyngyn]

Though common, they are neither necessary nor helpful to most applications.
To the degree that they impede the development of indigenous resources or take jobs from locals, they are harmful to those they purport to serve.

 

[HybridEarth]

My guess is they only really benefit applicants that demonstrate a clear mission to serve in global health. Aside from that perspective, I don't know why someone would invest so much to go on one instead of serving those in need in America, in their own communities.

 

[PREDOCSIMP]

My guess is they only really benefit applicants that demonstrate a clear mission to serve in global health. Aside from that perspective, I don't know why someone would invest so much to go on one instead of serving those in need in America, in their own communities.

Some people just want to get away from their own communities.

 

[HybridEarth]

Some people just want to get away from their own communities.

Understandable, if you have the $$$

 

[T-Cell]

Though common, they are neither necessary nor helpful to most applications.
To the degree that they impede the development of indigenous resources or take jobs from locals, they are harmful to those they purport to serve.

Thank you very much.

I'm trying to get information for myself and some friends on what to highlight for our application. Would wound debridement be considered unethical?

 

[gyngyn]

Thank you very much.

I'm trying to get information for myself and some friends on what to highlight for our application. Would wound debridement be considered unethical?

To perform invasive medical procedures that would not be within your purview in the US is frowned upon.
There are exceptions, such as in emergencies under direct supervision.

 

[PREDOCSIMP]

To perform invasive medical procedures that would not be within your purview in the US is frowned upon.
There are exceptions, such as in emergencies under direct supervision.

But come on, who would pass the chance to play doctor.

 

[T-Cell]

To perform invasive medical procedures that would not be within your purview in the US is frowned upon.
There are exceptions, such as in emergencies under direct supervision.

I figured as much, just needed confirmation. Thank you for taking the time to answer.

 

[tea guzzling traveler]

One of the major things with medical missions is length. If you are in the place for a week, then it really serves very little purpose. If you are there for multiple months, say 2 or more, then it becomes more of a substantive experience. Also, it's very important to have experiences with the US healthcare system in addition to abroad experiences.

A few ethical issues that you want to be careful of:
voluntourism: do it because
savior complex: come into it with a humble attitude, you are not saving Africa by being there
procedures you're not qualified for: (don't do them)
taking away people's jobs: (as @gyngyn alluded to), so if you can be a volunteer without taking away an existing job or contributing in a significant way, go for it. If not, I would personally feel sketchy about it.


If you are not doing the above, and it is a substantive experience, then I would say go for it.

Note: I had to grapple with a lot of these issues as I also have a global health focus. Do your research thoroughly before going, but it can be an incredible experience 🙂

 

[Angel252]

My guess is they only really benefit applicants that demonstrate a clear mission to serve in global health. Aside from that perspective, I don't know why someone would invest so much to go on one instead of serving those in need in America, in their own communities.

Although some missions are very comfortable, others are not. I have been to mission trips throughout all my life (late elementary and now end of college). There is need here in the US, but it is nothing compared to the need in other countries. Also, some mission trips are not expensive. Unless you want to travel to South Africa and other far locations.

 

[ZedsDed]

But come on, who would pass the chance to play doctor.

Sarcasm?

 

[PREDOCSIMP]

Sarcasm?

Honestly, I can't remember if I was joking or not. But, I thought foreign countries were less strict on who can practice medicine .

 

[Goro]

Yes.

We call them "medical tourism.

Hey guys, in the past I have heard that doing medical missions in college is looked upon unfavorably by adcoms because they look like vacations and because some might think they are unethical if you are performing procedures you are not really qualified to do. Is this still the consensus?

I have heard that some medical schools have mentioned this on their twitter, does anyone know which ones?

 

[nontradalex]

The medical mission would be more credible if it were in a war torn country in need of any kind of medical assistance.
Doubt any organization recruits American premeds for that though.

 

[ZedsDed]

Honestly, I can't remember if I was joking or not. But, I thought foreign countries were less strict on who can practice medicine .

I certainly hope that most premeds would hesitate "practicing" on a helpless patient.

 

[Banco]

1 week long ones are not really going to add much to your application; what can you really do in 1 week only?

But if it is for a sustained period of time and you perhaps have some real connection to the country then it would be easier to sell it.

 

[Mr. Beefy Lion]

I certainly hope that most premeds would hesitate "practicing" on a helpless patient.

This. It almost reminds me of those stories you hear about a premed hospital volunteer walking around the hospital in a white coat.

 

[Oh_Gee]

To perform invasive medical procedures that would not be within your purview in the US is frowned upon.
There are exceptions, such as in emergencies under direct supervision.

So taking vitals is fine? Like blood pressure

 

[gyngyn]

So taking vitals is fine? Like blood pressure

Acceptablity is defined by the circumstances surrounding the "mission."
A BP can be taken by the patient herself with instruction. Interpretation and management is where a learned intermediary is required.

 

[Oh_Gee]

Acceptablity is defined by the circumstances surrounding the "mission."
A BP can be taken by the patient herself with instruction. Interpretation and management is where a learned intermediary is required.

mission is providing primary care so volunteers (aka pre-meds) take vitals/history so the qualified medical staff (aka MD, NP) can do their thang. is that within "ok"?

 

[Cotterpin]

I knew a guy who went on one of these trips. When he came back he told me he had gotten a lot of experience and he was going to start doctoring all his friends. I was getting over a cold at the time and he tried to ask me all these questions about it and was just like, "No. Stop right there."

 

[gyngyn]

mission is providing primary care so volunteers (aka pre-meds) take vitals/history so the qualified medical staff (aka MD, NP) can do their thang. is that within "ok"?

If the bigger questions have been answered (am I displacing people who could be making a living? Is this venture a welcome part of the local medical community? Is there follow-up for the people we see? Does my presence help or hinder sustainable care?), taking a BP is acceptable behavior if you have been trained to do so.

 

[piii]

What about veterinary work? I spent a week working at a dog shelter in Asia, basically cleaning/shaving pre-op animals, helping monitor post-op animals, restraining the animals, and helping organize/clean the clinic. I didn't have to pay and it was a very respectable organization run by international veterinarians. Do think this will come off unethical? I was in the OR during surgeries but I never performed a procedure or anything. I was a veterinary surgical technician in a research lab for 6 years.

 

[CARCOSA]

Do Adcoms look at location and actually read what you did during your time in said country? I went to India to use my water purification undergraduate research in the field, specifically teaching villages and orphanages.... and it was far from a vacation.

@gyngyn

 

[Planes2Doc]

Here is my take on medical missions: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...oseph-kony-and-why-you-shouldnt-do-it.994079/

If you want something to make you look good on your application, then do something here. It will save you time and money. If you want to experience an exotic place, then just go on an actual vacation. You will have more fun doing things on your own terms. And believe it or not, you will likely help the local population (if you care, that is) by going on a vacation since you will infuse money into the local economy. It will do more than a nearly worthless pre-med paying most of their money to some company taking advantage of pre-meds and other people trying to pad applications.

 

[ZedsDed]

Do Adcoms look at location and actually read what you did during your time in said country? I went to India to use my water purification undergraduate research in the field, specifically teaching villages and orphanages.... and it was far from a vacation.

@gyngyn

AdComs have no way of verifying what premeds do in unsupervised locations in the third world. That is, unless they're dumb enough to post selfies with sick and dying brown people on Facebook. I know a guy who did this who was asked about it at interviews. Unsurprisingly, AdCom members found the violation of patient rights distasteful, and he didn't get into most schools, despite having great stats.

 

[Pusheen]

AdComs have no way of verifying what premeds do in unsupervised locations in the third world. That is, unless they're dumb enough to post selfies with sick and dying brown people on Facebook. I know a guy who did this who was asked about it at interviews. Unsurprisingly, AdCom members found the violation of patient rights distasteful, and he didn't get into most schools, despite having great stats.

You're not anybody till you've posted a selfie with a native child.

 

[Pusheen]

Just as food for thought..I've lived most of my life in a country that received a variety of mission trips.
While people have done good things, it is often humiliating for the recipients to have to get help from the US, usually from people who don't speak the language, understand the culture, or really know what they're doing. I've seen orphanages turn down missions groups for this reason. If you really want to do something in a foreign country, move there long term and learn the language and culture. Don't come in a 30 person group of obnoxious college students with your hand santizer in one hand and your iPhone in the other.

 

[tea guzzling traveler]

Just as food for thought..I've lived most of my life in a country that received a variety of mission trips.
While people have done good things, it is often humiliating for the recipients to have to get help from the US, usually from people who don't speak the language, understand the culture, or really know what they're doing. I've seen orphanages turn down missions groups for this reason. If you really want to do something in a foreign country, move there long term and learn the language and culture. Don't come in a 30 person group of obnoxious college students with your hand santizer in one hand and your iPhone in the other.

Agreed, especially with orphanages. To flit in and out of someones life like that is somewhat irresponsible by my book.

I would differentiate that with teaching, and even more with research and work in a professional setting.

With orphanage volunteering, you quickly will just make the local kids jaded, which is part of the reason I particularly avoided that. However, with research, teaching or work, you are providing a service, one that is less based on the relationships formed with people, and more based on the output that you produce. Again, if you do this for a week or two, the impact that you have will be negligible, but if done responsibly, I don't really see the problem with a longer term global health involvement.

 

[Pusheen]

Agreed, especially with orphanages. To flit in and out of someones life like that is somewhat irresponsible by my book.

I would differentiate that with teaching, and even more with research and work in a professional setting.

With orphanage volunteering, you quickly will just make the local kids jaded, which is part of the reason I particularly avoided that. However, with research, teaching or work, you are providing a service, one that is less based on the relationships formed with people, and more based on the output that you produce. Again, if you do this for a week or two, the impact that you have will be negligible, but if done responsibly, I don't really see the problem with a longer term global health involvement.

Yes, I can see the value in research or teaching, if it is something that is truly needed and wanted by the recipient country. 99.9% of premeds and other people who go on mission trips aren't anywhere near being able to do that. They want to 'love on the orphans' and pass out meds.

 

[Lucca]

Here is my take on medical missions: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...oseph-kony-and-why-you-shouldnt-do-it.994079/

If you want something to make you look good on your application, then do something here. It will save you time and money. If you want to experience an exotic place, then just go on an actual vacation. You will have more fun doing things on your own terms. And believe it or not, you will likely help the local population (if you care, that is) by going on a vacation since you will infuse money into the local economy. It will do more than a nearly worthless pre-med paying most of their money to some company taking advantage of pre-meds and other people trying to pad applications.

I agree strongly with Plane2Doc's opinion. Furthermore, I think it is perfectly reasonable to save medical mission trips for later in your career when you have the experience and training to go somewhere where you can really take care of patients that would not be otherwise taken care of and, perhaps just as importantly, provide training for local professionals to do so as well. Partners in Health has done a fantastic job of this around the world, in my opinion.

Meanwhile in the United States, there are plenty of understaffed free clinics. If you don't believe me, look for opportunities with clinics who take care of a lot of HIV patients (cities generally).