Medical Schools that score below the national average for Step 1 scores

[Stagg737]

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So 4-5 Caribbean Schools allow almost all the mainland schools to say they are "above average"? Isn't this published somewhere by USLME??

USMLE publishes pass rates, not averages. I could rattle off a few MD schools that are below average though.

Is one answer to this question is "All DO schools"?

You might be surprised at how well some DO schools do on USMLE. They might not be at the average, but there are a few that are only a few points off.

 

[nycement1]

On my interview day they said that half of the class scores higher than 250. They take Step 1 at the end of third year.

Yes, a few schools have moved to taking step 1 after third year. In my opinion, this makes a lot of the pathology, physiology & pharmacology much easier to remember because you have seen it in real life, and remember the situation. Also, you have seen the different complications as well. The only downside of this would probably be the finer details, in subjects like biochemistry & micro.

 

[seminoma]

USMLE publishes pass rates, not averages. I could rattle off a few MD schools that are below average though.



You might be surprised at how well some DO schools do on USMLE. They might not be at the average, but there are a few that are only a few points off.

I'd be interested in any (official) data points you have.

 

[seminoma]

Yes, a few schools have moved to taking step 1 after third year. In my opinion, this makes a lot of the pathology, physiology & pharmacology much easier to remember because you have seen it in real life, and remember the situation. Also, you have seen the different complications as well. The only downside of this would probably be the finer details, in subjects like biochemistry & micro.

Another downside is not knowing the most important aspect of your residency application until 1-2 months before ERAS needs to be submitted. I know not everyone knows what they're going to apply for until late in MS3, but at this point I can't imagine waiting another 7-9 months to find out if I'm even reasonably competitive for my future chosen field.


Plus, what happens to the people who fail? At other programs they just start MS3 later and make-up missed time during fall/winter break so they can apply and graduate on time.

 

[WedgeDawg]

Another downside is not knowing the most important aspect of your residency application until 1-2 months before ERAS needs to be submitted. I know not everyone knows what they're going to apply for until late in MS3, but at this point I can't imagine waiting another 7-9 months to find out if I'm even reasonably competitive for my future chosen field.


Plus, what happens to the people who fail? At other programs they just start MS3 later and make-up missed time during fall/winter break so they can apply and graduate on time.

My school takes Step 1 after our clinical year, but we have a 1.5 preclinical curriculum, so you take it 2.5 years into your schooling (generally in february). If you need to retake, you do so in april I believe.

 

[seminoma]

My school takes Step 1 after our clinical year, but we have a 1.5 preclinical curriculum, so you take it 2.5 years into your schooling (generally in february). If you need to retake, you do so in april I believe.

What do people usually do after taking step 1? Research and/or clinical electives? I really like the idea of a 1.5yr preclinical and wish I had been competitive enough to get accepted to one of those schools.

 

[WedgeDawg]

What do people usually do after taking step 1? Research and/or clinical electives? I really like the idea of a 1.5yr preclinical and wish I had been competitive enough to get accepted to one of those schools.

SubIs, research/public health/global health/medical education/etc project, electives/selectives, residency interviews, basically anything you want.

 

[seminoma]

SubIs, research/public health/global health/medical education/etc project, electives/selectives, residency interviews, basically anything you want.

Not to keep derailing this thread, but do people typically take 2CK shortly after they take Step 1?

 

[WedgeDawg]

Not to keep derailing this thread, but do people typically take 2CK shortly after they take Step 1?

That, I have no idea, sorry!

 

[Satire5Texul]

Step 1, from my understanding, is due to individual motivation, standardized test taking ability, and effort/dedication put into studying than school-related factors. Most (but not all) top schools (meaning those with the highest MCAT scores) have medians of 235-245. However, this is likely because they recruit the strongest test-takers who are then likely to do well on yet another standardized test. If you took a student from Harvard who got a 255, go back in time, and throw him in at Penn State instead, he'll probably still score around 250-260 (or whatever the CI is for step 1 scores).

Step is an individual effort. There is already too much of a reliance on test scores but they want people who can pass the boards. Also there aren't any better ways to stratify applicants

forgive me if I am wrong, but Isnt this a similar recipe and description for the MCAT as well ?
So much about the MCAT is an individual effort on the test-taker.

Doesn't the wide take on medical curriculum, different teaching styles, different program styles directly influence the Step 1 scores ?

It seems Step 1 data is a luxury that schools have no pressure to post because the majority of us are all desperate to go to any program and happy to do so like someone already mentioned. Similar to how matriculating rates from undergrad to medical school is usually seen with students of highly selective schools, and further convoluted by deans recommendations in pursuing applications in some schools. Much like some medical schools ask you take their pre-step1 tests before attempting the actual test.

 

[FutureFACS]

Hmm I am willing to wager about half of all medical schools are below the national average, give or take.

 

[studentdocftw]

I see what you did there...

 

[FutureFACS]

.

 

[Psai]

forgive me if I am wrong, but Isnt this a similar recipe and description for the MCAT as well ?
So much about the MCAT is an individual effort on the test-taker.

Doesn't the wide take on medical curriculum, different teaching styles, different program styles directly influence the Step 1 scores ?

It seems Step 1 data is a luxury that schools have no pressure to post because the majority of us are all desperate to go to any program and happy to do so like someone already mentioned. Similar to how matriculating rates from undergrad to medical school is usually seen with students of highly selective schools, and further convoluted by deans recommendations in pursuing applications in some schools. Much like some medical schools ask you take their pre-step1 tests before attempting the actual test.

Doubt it. My school's scores are very different class to class. Same exact curriculum

 

[seminoma]

forgive me if I am wrong, but Isnt this a similar recipe and description for the MCAT as well ?
So much about the MCAT is an individual effort on the test-taker.

Doesn't the wide take on medical curriculum, different teaching styles, different program styles directly influence the Step 1 scores ?

It seems Step 1 data is a luxury that schools have no pressure to post because the majority of us are all desperate to go to any program and happy to do so like someone already mentioned. Similar to how matriculating rates from undergrad to medical school is usually seen with students of highly selective schools, and further convoluted by deans recommendations in pursuing applications in some schools. Much like some medical schools ask you take their pre-step1 tests before attempting the actual test.

The effect a given curriculum has on an individual student's step 1 score is determined primarily by how much that student buys into the school's curriculum. For example if you go to a P/F school and completely ignore all of your lecture materials, instead focusing on board prep stuff you can still easily pass all your classes. I'm not saying that strategy would necessarily result in a higher step 1 score than someone who followed along with the school's lectures, but the outcome would certainly be minimally influenced by that school's curriculum.

My school's curriculum has a lot of room for improvement, but one thing it does well is give student's lots of time for self study. We have <15 hours of lecture per week (though there are required activities on top of lecture) and the amount of tested minutiae is no worse than hat I've heard from friends at other schools. So does my school "teach to step 1"? Absolutely not. But it does give the students ample time to study for step 1 if they want.

 

[aztlannation]

So where is the list?

 

[ChrisMack390]

My understanding is that some schools that would pretty objectively be considered the "best" schools (Harvard, Yale, Duke...) do not actually have fantastic USMLE scores. Their students don't really need a crush the boards because they are going to end up with publications and great LORs and everything that will get them into good residencies anyway.

 

[gyngyn]

Not to keep derailing this thread, but do people typically take 2CK shortly after they take Step 1?

No, Step two CK is usually taken before December of the 4th year.

 

[gyngyn]

Yes, a few schools have moved to taking step 1 after third year. In my opinion, this makes a lot of the pathology, physiology & pharmacology much easier to remember because you have seen it in real life, and remember the situation. Also, you have seen the different complications as well. The only downside of this would probably be the finer details, in subjects like biochemistry & micro.

The biggest problem is you don't know what specialties you are not a candidate for until it's time to apply...

 

[methodical]

Florida International is fairly new, basically a no-name school with a weird curriculum and relatively low average MCAT (30.87 as per interview) but their average step scores (237) were the best in the state of Florida, beating out places like UMiami (230) and UF (231 I think). I think some of the new schools with weird curriculums actually end up teaching pretty well because they got to design a system from the ground up where more established schools have been using the same potentially outdated style for years.

"Teaching towards step" has a negative stigma but it beats straddling the national average or even dipping below

 

[pyrrion89]

Honestly a big part of choosing a med school is:
(1) How well do they teach to Step I
(2) How much dedicated time do you get to study for Step I

Red flag would be a school whose Step I is a lot lower than you'd expect for their MCAT.