Medication options

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clubdeac

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  1. Attending Physician
So what are your guys' "go to" meds for axial spine pain? I have a ton of these patients that I want to keep off opiates. They often have multiple comorbidities making NSAIDs a poor choice. With opiates and NSAIDs off the table, what else do we have? Cymbalta?- Optimistically maybe 30% of my patients get better with this drug. Gabapentin/Lyrica? - haven't had much luck with these for axial pain. Muscle relaxants? Does anyone see any benefit from these. TCAs? - too many s.e. I dunno... I think I'm just becoming a little disillusioned regarding our med options
 
Age: 18-44
Age: 44-65
Age: 65+
 
So what are your guys' "go to" meds for axial spine pain? I have a ton of these patients that I want to keep off opiates. They often have multiple comorbidities making NSAIDs a poor choice. With opiates and NSAIDs off the table, what else do we have? Cymbalta?- Optimistically maybe 30% of my patients get better with this drug. Gabapentin/Lyrica? - haven't had much luck with these for axial pain. Muscle relaxants? Does anyone see any benefit from these. TCAs? - too many s.e. I dunno... I think I'm just becoming a little disillusioned regarding our med options
For axial pain, I use a lot of Tramadol. Rarely T#3. Although they both have narcotic activity, I like the fact that they have a max dose. I only use muscle relaxants when the pt tells me they have been very in the past. My pts usually are just sedated with these.

Tramadol has been a great drug for a lot of my pts especially with intermittent pain. I guess some people use lidocaine patches but I don't.
 
For axial pain, I use a lot of Tramadol. Rarely T#3. Although they both have narcotic activity, I like the fact that they have a max dose. I only use muscle relaxants when the pt tells me they have been very in the past. My pts usually are just sedated with these.

Tramadol has been a great drug for a lot of my pts especially with intermittent pain. I guess some people use lidocaine patches but I don't.

Nice.

There has been a lot of talk lately though of the downsides of tramadol...

Why Health Canada must reclassify tramadol as an opioid

Curious to hear what people on this forum think of tramadol?
 
Opiatish. 1 5000th mu binding of morphine. Metabolite is still weaker than codeine. Mechanism of action more likely serotonin norepinephrine. I use it regularly and even high-risk patients. It is not a conventional opiate. I had seen two cases of abuse of Tramadol and 14 years of practice both of these patients had prior abuse two other medications. And this was before the screening and scrutiny began. I also write for a lot of muscle relaxers as long as it's not Soma or a benzo. I call these opiate sparing agents. They may cause mild sedation some Heathen work on relaxing muscles.
 
it is an opioid, and it still does have risks. it is indubitably safer than the pure mu agonists and methadone.

Tramadol deaths in Northern Ireland: a review of cases from 1996 to 2012. - PubMed - NCBI
See comment in PubMed Commons below
J Forensic Leg Med. 2014 Mar;23:32-6. doi: 10.1016/j.jflm.2014.01.006. Epub 2014 Jan 28.
Tramadol deaths in Northern Ireland: a review of cases from 1996 to 2012.
Randall C1, Crane J2.
Author information
1
State Pathologist's Department, Institute of Forensic Medicine, Grosvenor Road, Belfast BT12 6BS, Northern Ireland, UK. Electronic address: [email protected].
2
State Pathologist's Department, Institute of Forensic Medicine, Grosvenor Road, Belfast BT12 6BS, Northern Ireland, UK.
Abstract
In the UK tramadol is a frequently prescribed opioid analgesic which is becoming increasingly popular as a drug of misuse. Its use varies worldwide and in the last decade it has been upgraded to a controlled substance in several countries, due to an increased number of deaths associated with its use. A review of all deaths associated with tramadol in Northern Ireland was performed and this highlighted 127 cases from 1996 to the end of 2012. A 10% increase in deaths due to tramadol was noted. In 2001 tramadol deaths represented 9% of all drug misuse deaths rising to 40% in 2011. The majority of the deaths occurred in males (62%), with a median age of 41 years, living in the Belfast city area (36%). Tramadol fatalities were found in combination with other drugs/medicines (49%), alcohol (36%) or alone (23%). Most of those who died did not reach hospital, with only 2% presenting with multi-organ or acute liver failure. In just over half of the deaths tramadol had not been prescribed by a medical practitioner (53%). Depression, addiction and seizures were recognised risk factors. An increase in awareness of tramadol toxicity is needed amongst the public and doctors
Comparison of fatal poisonings by prescription opioids. - PubMed - NCBI
See comment in PubMed Commons below
Forensic Sci Int. 2012 Oct 10;222(1-3):327-31. doi: 10.1016/j.forsciint.2012.07.011. Epub 2012 Aug 10.
Comparison of fatal poisonings by prescription opioids.
Häkkinen M1, Launiainen T, Vuori E, Ojanperä I.
Author information
1
University of Helsinki, Hjelt Institute, Department of Forensic Medicine, PO Box 40 (Kytösuontie 11), FI-00014 Helsinki, Finland. [email protected]
Abstract
There is a rising trend of fatal poisonings due to medicinal opioids in several countries. The present study evaluates the drug and alcohol findings as well as the cause and manner of death in opioid-related post-mortem cases in Finland from 2000 to 2008. During this period, fatal poisonings by prescription opioids (buprenorphine, codeine, dextropropoxyphene, fentanyl, methadone, oxycodone, tramadol) increased as a share of all drug poisonings from 9.5% to 32.4%, being 22.3% over the whole period. A detailed study including the most prevalent opioids was carried out for the age group of 14-44 years, which is the most susceptible age for drug abuse in Finland. Poisonings by the weak opioids, codeine and tramadol, were found to be associated with large, often suicidal overdoses resulting in high drug concentrations in blood. Methadone poisonings were associated with accidental overdoses with the drug concentration in blood remaining within a therapeutic range. The manner of death was accidental in 43%, 55% and 94% of cases in codeine, tramadol and methadone poisonings, respectively. The median concentration of codeine and the median codeine/morphine concentration ratio were higher in codeine poisonings (1.4 and 22.5 mg/l, respectively) than in other causes of death (0.09 and 5.9 mg/l, respectively). The median concentrations of tramadol and O-desmethyltramadol were higher in tramadol poisonings (5.3 and 0.8 mg/l, respectively) than in other causes of death (0.6 and 0.2 mg/l, respectively). In methadone poisonings, the median concentration of methadone (0.35 mg/l) was not different from that in other causes of death (0.30 mg/l). Sedative drugs and/or alcohol were very frequently found in fatal poisonings involving these prescription opioids.

these 2 articles suggest that overdose from tramadol can occur, but polypharmacy and psychiatric illness (ie suicide attempt) were "frequently found".


getting back to the thread - pls address why we have to prescribe a pill for pain. if you are disillusioned by our pill options, then maybe not prescribing just another pill is the right answer?
 
it is an opioid, and it still does have risks. it is indubitably safer than the pure mu agonists and methadone.

Tramadol deaths in Northern Ireland: a review of cases from 1996 to 2012. - PubMed - NCBI

Comparison of fatal poisonings by prescription opioids. - PubMed - NCBI


these 2 articles suggest that overdose from tramadol can occur, but polypharmacy and psychiatric illness (ie suicide attempt) were "frequently found".


getting back to the thread - pls address why we have to prescribe a pill for pain. if you are disillusioned by our pill options, then maybe not prescribing just another pill is the right answer?

I like these articles and your comments are spot on. I am pretty sure if someone took 50 Ultram at a time, they would have seizures, but not stop breathing.
 
So what are your guys' "go to" meds for axial spine pain? I have a ton of these patients that I want to keep off opiates. They often have multiple comorbidities making NSAIDs a poor choice. With opiates and NSAIDs off the table, what else do we have? Cymbalta?- Optimistically maybe 30% of my patients get better with this drug. Gabapentin/Lyrica? - haven't had much luck with these for axial pain. Muscle relaxants? Does anyone see any benefit from these. TCAs? - too many s.e. I dunno... I think I'm just becoming a little disillusioned regarding our med options

Tylenol solves all problems
 
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